Bernie Sanders Released His Tax Returns. He's Part of the 1%.

[WeekiWater]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/15/us/politics/bernie-sanders-taxes.amp.html

[Tiggeroshii]

1. cool!

[Merlot]

58. Cool indeed!

Not sure why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

[bloom]

77. Probably because he said how immoral income inequality is

what with the 1%ers and those living in poverty.

[Merlot]

103. You can have money and still believe income inequality is wrong.

[LanternWaste]

107. You can also have a chili bacon cheese burger and still believe eating meat is wrong.

[bloom]

149. lol n/t

[Amimnoch]

111. Funny he never seems to take that position.

Isn't that the very root of his purity test that you can't accept donations? Because that evil money corrupts?

He can be part of the 1% and not be affected, but other candidates can't accept legal donations because that corrupts?

As I always suspected.. a huge hypocrite and empty suit.

[NurseJackie]

2. No wonder he doesn't say "millionaires and billionaires" any more.

He's Part of the 1%.

No wonder he doesn't say "millionaires and billionaires" any more.

[George II]

7. Check out pages 6, 9, and 10 in the 2016 return.

[thesquanderer]

10. Can you give me the Barr summary version?

I don't want to even SEE another tax form today. What's important on pgs 6/9/10 of 16?

[George II]

14. The returns were presumably (we've been told by the Sanders) prepared using Turbotax...

...which is what I've been using since the early 2000s myself.

It appears that two of the entries on page six are not the original entries - they're a different font and larger than all the others.

Pages 9 and 10 are scans of printed pages, not the pdf pages as prepared by Turbotax.

Again, I have been using Turbotax for almost 20 years, when saving the final return Turbotax generates a pdf file of all the forms.

[BlueFlorida]

19. Doctored? nt

[George II]

22. Well, not all the entries are the same size and font and they have decimals....

...which are truncated by Turbotax, and two of the pages are not the original pages generated by the software.

I don't know why, but 2016 would be the most scrutinized of all the years.

[BlueFlorida]

23. It looks like they didn't know how to create more than one schedule C

on Turbotax ... so they did the second one manually.

The numbers have been carried forward to 1040 accurately but they must have had to override the calculation from the recording artist Sched C.

[George II]

28. Turbotax automatically asks the user to enter a second schedule C. It it was done manually....

....many of the totals elsewhere in the return would be incorrect. That's the beauty of Turbotax, it doesn't the thinking for the user and asks at the end of each category "do you want to enter another business" (Schedule C is the business expense or loss schedule)

[BlueFlorida]

31. I use another software

so I am not familiar with TT.

[sheshe2]

29. Do you have another link.

NY Times is a paywall.

Thanks, George.

[BlueFlorida]

33. here

https://berniesanders.com/tax-returns/

[sheshe2]

39. Thank you.

[George II]

44. Try this:

https://berniesanders.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Sanders-IRS-Filing-2016.pdf

[sheshe2]

47. Thanks.

[Power 2 the People]

32. LOL. What's next,Bernie on the grassy knoll with Jimmy Hoffa in his trunk?

George what happened to your vow that you were going to no longer deal in innuendo and Bernie Sanders conspiracy theories? Why are you always casting aspersions on the leading Democratic contender? It's nonsense like this that probably contributed to some Bernie supporters choosing not to vote for our nominee last year against Trump. Please don't repeat the same mistake twice.

[George II]

46. Can you explain the inconsistencies in some of the pages?

[Power 2 the People]

48. No. I won't entertain your ridiculous conspiracy theories.

[BlueFlorida]

65. There is no conspiracy

There are different fonts and pages scanned differently. It is logical to point that out.

[Power 2 the People]

73. No.It is petty and purposely conspiratorial to point that out.

Downright shameful to do that to a Democratic nominee on a Democratic board.

[BlueFlorida]

74. It is a detailed examination which is never petty

Nothing is ever too small in vetting.

[ehrnst]

125. More name calling and attacking strawmen.

When someone loses their temper and runs out of rational responses, they tend to reflexively go to the usual fallacious responses.

Deep breaths.

[Power 2 the People]

127. Trolling

Again, not a strategy of one secure in their position.

Desperate, even.

[ehrnst]

129. Copy and paste fallacies.

A sure sign one has lost their temper.

[Power 2 the People]

131. No. Just trying to be polite to a person who is obviously trolling.

[ehrnst]

134. And what is it you're doing right now, again?

[UniteFightBack]

72. It's a question, not a 'conspiracy theory'....

[Power 2 the People]

75. It's intended to cast doubt on the documents.

It's shameful for this type of childish nonsense to be posted by Democrats on DU.

[ehrnst]

122. And now we have namecalling.

Again, not a strategy of one secure in their position.

Desperate, even.

[Power 2 the People]

126. Trolling

Again, not a strategy of one secure in their position.

Desperate, even.

[ehrnst]

128. Nailed it, didn't I?

[Power 2 the People]

130. In a self revelatory way you did ehrnst.

[ehrnst]

132. I really think that Bernie will be OK even if you don't

try to smack down every single post on this thread.

[Power 2 the People]

135. I think I'll be okay if you weren't so obsessed with finding every Bernie thread and negatively

commenting. I will not take your trolling bait. Have a nice day Ehrnsty!!

[ehrnst]

136. "Obsessed"

Pot, meet kettle.

[ehrnst]

121. Attacking a strawman.

Also not the tactic of someone secure in their position on something.

[ehrnst]

133. More namecalling.

Not very effective namecalling either.

[ehrnst]

120. "Appeal to extremes" fallacy

Description: Erroneously attempting to make a reasonable argument into an absurd one, by taking the argument to the extremes.

https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/30/Appeal-to-Extremes



Also, a fallacy used by someone not exactly secure in their position.

[thesquanderer]

11. And "good on him" for wanting to raise taxes on himself. (n/t)

[zipplewrath]

82. He'd need more than that

millionaires need alot of millions to be in the 1%. Alot of people nearing retirement will have assets in the $1 million range. Add in a house and some other assets and you're there. Not sure exactly where he is, probably inside of 10%, possibly inside 5%. I'm dubious he's in the 1%.

[Nanjeanne]

3. And as he said in his statement, he is very fortunate and will continue to fight for higher

taxes on the wealthy.

[WeekiWater]

5. I don't doubt that for one second.

[msongs]

4. his wealth is not an issue IMO. he's way behind what the obamas were worth in the white house nt

[WeekiWater]

6. I agree with you about his wealth.

Obama has nothing to do with my thoughts in that area. As a reference point or standard.

[George II]

8. It's always someone else, isn't it?

[whathehell]

63. Not to mention the Clintons.

[Bluepinky]

95. Good point, the Clintons were in the 1% long before Bernie was.

[whathehell]

98. They most definitely were .

and yet, somehow this seems to have bothered those now obsessed with Bernie's imcome, not one bit. Funny, how that works, isn't it?

[Blue_Tires]

110. Regardless, he decided to make Hillary's wealth an issue in '16

while hiding his...

[Amimnoch]

112. THANK YOU! EXACTLY THIS!

HE made it an issue.

HE attacks because other candidates accept LEGAL campaign donations from LEGAL sources, and intimates that they are corrupt because of that money,

BUT HE can be in the 1%, hiding it for as long as he could, all while doing publicity stunts in coach on select flights..

Fake.. fraud.. hypocrite.. empty suit.

ANY Democratic Party Candidate BUT BS or Bust imo.

[Lochloosa]

9. And I'm not.

[WeekiWater]

13. I don't have an issue with either.

Which of our candidates can pull that for a speech?

[WeekiWater]

20. And what is your issue with it?

Biden has value. That said, I don’t even think he is a millionaire. You also insinuated multiple speeches.

[WeekiWater]

40. Again, what is your issue with it?

You seem to shy away from that. I’m pretty sure Biden’s net worth is under a million.

The Broward Center for the Performing Arts. Major issues there.

[TexasTowelie]

24. Then again,

when those books are bought in bulk and then resold at those speeches it is very similar to being paid for a speech. Corporate entities and the author profit.

[hedda_foil]

146. And you have actual evidence of your.snarky implication?

Let us see it because this looks an awful lot like trolling.

[TexasTowelie]

150. I'm not your research assistant.

I'm stating something that is obvious and I'm not obligated to provide links. Have a good day.

[TexasTowelie]

15. There is already commentary that those are not full tax returns.

Link to tweet

[Cha]

17. Oh JHC.. not this shyte again.

[WeekiWater]

18. They will need to be looked at.

They were just released. I won’t be taking the analysis of @thatgirlfromohio. I will be reading the analysis of others tomorrow. I feel no need to immediately react.

[Cha]

21. Also, as expected, not big on charitable giving.

Link to tweet

[R B Garr]

34. LOL, so this is why he said they had to cross the t's and

dot the i’s. He made it obvious they were making some changes. There is no need to make changes to completed tax returns, unless...

Great find, TexasTowelie! I actually fully expected this development.

[BlueFlorida]

37. That figures

If these are all, why did it take so long?

These could have been put up in hours.

[mcar]

91. So they picked through the Turbo Tax returns?

We run 2 businesses from our home, one a non profit. We use Turbo Tax. Downloading a full return takes minutes. Selectively editing would take a good deal longer.

[hedda_foil]

147. And who is this tweeter and what makes her a reliable source?

Come on, TT, you know that's not a DU worthy cite. You're better than that. Much better.

[hedda_foil]

155. I've never stalked anyone in 19 years here and I'm not starting now.

I love everything you've posted on other issues and I'm totally gobsmacked you'd be tossing slurs around from some out of nowhere tweeter. You're too smart for that.

[TexasTowelie]

156. I'm sorry if you don't like the source.

However, there are other sources that have questions about the returns, like where Jane's $200K severance from Burlington College is shown. The income levels in 2011 and 2012 don't appear to be enough to cover both her severance and his Senate salary.

[BlueFlorida]

25. What I find interesting is

that they have no Schedule B filed. Even an ordinary person has some interest income from savings accounts and dividends from investments.

How come they have neither with their level of wealth?

[Blue_true]

81. That was the i dotting and t crossing.

Bernie does not want to show the dividends from Amazon and Walmart stock. Because on that schedule, you HAVE to list where the dividend came from.

[BlueFlorida]

83. +1000 nt

[bernie59]

99. Hi did in 2017

About $180 interest from a credit union and no dividends. Could it be that he stays out of the stock market due to conflict of interest reasons?

[BlueFlorida]

100. So suddenly he got no interest in 2018?

He spent all his savings?

[bernie59]

105. I doubt if he is cheating on his taxes trying to hide $200 of interest income.

He's part of the 1% don't you know

[BlueFlorida]

109. No .. the whole thing is not about tax cheating

but potentially inauthentic returns released which are not the same as the real ones he filed.

[bernie59]

114. So he released fake returns but left out certain pages

and inserted other curiosities to throw detractors off the scent? Smart guy! /s

[BlueFlorida]

115. There will be more stuff coming out

1. One form has numbers in dollars and cents. Turbotax rounds off the cents into whole dollars.
2. Several forms only have Jane Sanders' name and social security number at the top which suggests a separate return. Joint returns have BOTH names on every page at the top.

[Autumn]

26. Still not as wealthy as many of our elected Democrats. nt

[still_one]

50. That's true, but I have no problem with anyone making money anyway, as long as it was done

legitimately, and by all indication it was all proper

That is a non-issue in my view, and that he has released the returns, makes this a non-issue also

It is time for Trump to release his. Those returns I believe will have some suspicious entries, which is probably why they will never see the light of day

[Autumn]

66. I don't have a problem with it either. I bought all of Bill and Hillary's books, except the last one

and I bought both of Bernie's. I doubt we will see Trumps, he's going to fight that all the way. I think he will resign first.

[still_one]

94. I wish trump would resign

[BlueFlorida]

68. But he had the hypocritical attacks at Hillary Clinton

for being wealthy -- as though she couldn't possibly solve poor people's problems.

Now, when he was asked about the same thing, he had a Marie Antoinette like answer.

[Autumn]

80. His money from his books came in 2016. After the election. nt

[BlueFlorida]

139. Thank you for proving my point.

As long as he was not a millionaire it was ok for him to attack them.
Now that he is one, no more.

[Autumn]

145. You had a point? I missed it. Oh well. nt

[BlueFlorida]

138. You know that corporations cannot donate to federal candidates

right?

Hillary got 0 corporate contributions. That was a false smear.

As to getting paid for speeches -- it is an honest way to make a living. She was definitely not promoting a financial crisis by giving speeches. That was also an unfair attack.

It is interesting to see an Elizabeth Warren (who endorsed and campaigned for Hillary Clinton) supporter defending Bernie's unfair attacks that damaged Hillary Clinton.

[BlueFlorida]

142. That is not the corporations donating nt

[still_one]

27. His taxable income for 2018 is 520K. Mostly from book sales

[doc03]

30. I see nothing wrong with anyone being in the 1% as long as they made

their money honestly.

[at140]

102. +1000

[prodigitalson]

35. Im afraid the dynamics of GOP primaries in 18

will be replicated in 20 in our primary.

a huge field will produce only Biden or Sanders.

[LakeArenal]

55. Fine by me.

[prodigitalson]

70. lol well, yeah

I'll enthusiastically support either one.

[workinclasszero]

41. Other 1%er democratic people....

FDR... President Obama.... Michelle Obama.... Hillary Clinton....Bill Clinton, etc.

Is that supposed to prove something OP?

Bernie also promised to raise the taxes of the rich not sparing himself!

[WeekiWater]

43. "Is that supposed to prove something OP? "

It’s the headline of the article.

It was also well know before the release of taxes.

“Not sparing himself!” That’s funny.

[R B Garr]

62. None of the Democrats you are targeting have hypocritical

double standards of maligning others over their personal wealth, implying some type of corruption occurred in exchange for money. It’s amazing that this has to be repeated since it’s such a basic concept that has been unique to Bernie for years.

That is why Bernie’s wealth is harming his message. CNN just had a brutal segment on this. Prepare to see a lot more along that line.

[LenaBaby61]

76. "That is why Bernie's wealth is harming his message. CNN just had a brutal segment on this."

What I hate is that most in the corporate media are going to try to take it to Sanders, call him a hypocrite. Yet, we have The IRS is still auditing my taxes-in-chief in the White House willing to take it to the Supreme Court where some of his stooges are to stop his taxes from being released.

Yet, you see some in the corporate media laughing and saying "Oh, hahaha, that's just tRump" when someone brings up the fact that he's still saying he's being audited

[UniteFightBack]

78. You can't say you are anti capitalist and you are Democratic Socialist but yet you say I wrote a

book for the MARKET..that people WANTED....so they BOUGHT IT..and I made MONEY.



https://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/video/bernie-sanders-is-not-a-capitalist-542522435717

[Mike Nelson]

42. Don't mind that's he's...

… wealthy. The publisher thinks he worth the money and pays him the rights for his books. The buyers want to read about Bernie and willingly pay the price. That's the way it works.

[WeekiWater]

52. No doubt about it.

The basics of capitalism.

[Mike Nelson]

92. You got it...

[lunamagica]

96. Capitalism as its best

[uponit7771]

45. Did Sanders release the full returns with schedules?

[WeekiWater]

49. I'm waiting until tomorrow to read the analysis.

Don’t like to wade into these things too quickly. It’s the nice thing about the internet. I can be patient and still only have to wait until my morning cup of coffee to see if it’s on the up and up.

[still_one]

53. As far as I can see they are pretty complete. I just looked at the 2018 and 2016 returns though,

and I am not sure if there were some worksheets that were left out or not, but as far as I am concerned this no longer should be an issue

[Blue_true]

86. Someone posted that Schedule B, the Dividends and Interest Schedule was missing.

That part of the tax return shows the carried interest part of their wealth, along with WHERE that wealth is invested.

[uponit7771]

104. Then this is not all his taxes, he's releasing them piecemeal and no full disclosure. ... damn

[Blue_true]

116. If he didn't include schedule B in the returns then he purposely removed that section.

Maybe that was part of the i dotting and t crossing. Very un-straightforward of him.

I remember when people ripped Hillary apart because of some of the companies that she was invested in, despite that it was very unlikely that she invested the money herself, it was likely done on an annual returns schedule that she worked out with the company that managed her money. It least she released ALL of her returns showing what she was invested in.

[iamthebandfanman]

54. And he has no problem

paying the higher taxes for his income bracket under his plan.

i see people calling him a hypocrite..
was FDR a hypocrite ?

[TCJ70]

57. What are you basing your "funny business" accusation on? N/t

[Cha]

59. Yeah, BS doesn't exactly inspire trust..

He's too Divisive.

[stillcool]

60. not even close...

the perception that the 1% is so inclusive, and so easily attained minimizes the vast amount of wealth the tippity-top few have. I don't think they even know what their monetary wealth is, nor could anyone estimate within a few million. I don't think piles of cash matter as much as owning controlling stock in various industries.

[BlueFlorida]

67. A lot of billionaires

have their money tied up in their companies' stock, which they cannot ever sell at once.

Many new billionaires are cash poor.

Also, their net worth changes minute-bu-minute just as the value of their stock holdings changes.

Why be angry at America's success stories? Many kids dream of becoming Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Mark Zuckerberg. It makes them study hard in STEM. None of them have done anything to attract the hatred that is seen here towards them.

[a kennedy]

61. CAN I SAY I DON'T CARE ABOUT HIS INCOME, OR TAXES.?? I just admire him for what he's trying

to make AMERICAN...health care for all, education that you can get for free or at a good price, a LIVING wage, AND THAT THE TOP 1% pay their fair share. Not real sure i’m Voting for him......but glad he’s going on the enemy network to at least punch through that damn faux ceiling.

[BlueFlorida]

69. hahahahaha

None of those things have a chance in hell to be enacted into law. Those are simply manipulative slogans to make gullible people vote for him.

I see a similarity -- "The wall" comes to mind.

[ehrnst]

119. Even if you don't care about his financial transparency, as a Dem candidate, it matters.

Trump supporters say that they don't care about Trump's tax returns.

It doesn't mean that there's nothing relevant in them to others.

[BlueFlorida]

71. I don't think income from

Old Towne Media, LLC has been reported.

https://vtdigger.org/2016/07/15/sanders-campaign-millions-go-to-mystery-firm/

[a kennedy]

79. Say BlueFlorida.......what's your story??

[melman]

93. Good question

[GemDigger]

84. 1,2 or even 3 mill does not put a person in the 1%. It makes him wealthy and in the upper,

upper middle class but todays 1% are those that earn 25 Mill + a year. I don't disparage him for being a millionaire. It just makes him richer than many of us but nowhere near the rich "elite".

[brooklynite]

124. That would not be true

https://graphics.wsj.com/what-percent/

[bahrbearian]

85. To bad FDR was elected, think of what we could have done by not raising Taxes.

Think about the waste of tax money on the New Deal, it set the Dems back 20 years. Damn you FDR, another 1%er just grifting us.

[BlueFlorida]

87. On 2017 Schedule B

Bernie reports an offshore account but declares he doesn't need to file FinCEN 114 ... which means he had less than $10,000 in foreign bank accounts.

WHY would Bernie need a foreign bank account? Where is it? He didn't have it in 2016 because he didn't file a Schedule B that year.

On the same form, he reports NO DIVIDENDS. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

[NurseJackie]

108. I figured as much. It looks like something fishy is going on here.

[artislife]

88. OH MY GOD

and he didn't do it the normal way of exploiting workers, stealing lands or inheritance.

He wrote a book and offered it to be bought (or not) by readers.

He's a deplorable.




Harris is one of my top two choices and no, Bernie isn't the other one. Inslee is. But I can easily see ignoring my qualms about his age and pushing Bernie back up. He DOES have more a chance at the moment than Inslee. Sadly, because Inslee is focusing on climate first, which is my number one issue.

[lapucelle]

152. ...

https://www.amazon.com/Bernie-Sanders/e/B01NAJEW2P%3Fref=dbs_a_mng_rwt_scns_share

[BlueFlorida]

89. More suspicious stuff here

On the 2015 tax return, on form 8949, he shows capital gains by selling certain assets. The name of the asset has been redacted.

Why is it redacted? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[ehrnst]

118. That's interesting. (nt)

[Fiendish Thingy]

90. No Fucks Given by me. Nt

[NCLefty]

97. He wasn't until recently.

In any case, if he's paying his taxes fairly, there's literally no problem here. He wants to raise his own taxes, literally the opposite of what Trump wanted (and did).

[at140]

101. Then Bernie is a good money manager

Which is important quality in a president.

[TheFarseer]

106. Anyone who thinks

Acknowledging a system that you have done well in is rigged, needs to be changed and fighting for that change is hypocritical would also believe that white people who marched for civil rights, men who marched for women’s suffrage and straight people who voted for gay marriage are also hypocritical. You would also have to believe FDR was the most hypocritical president in our history. It’s such a fucking dumb argument, I can’t even believe I’m responding.

[Amimnoch]

113. That is not the part that is hypocritical.

His whole position for years now is that money corrupts.

If he hadn't used his attack machine to go after actual Democratic Party candidates because they accept LEGAL donations from LEGAL corporations and LEGAL PAC's for the repeatedly stated opinion that the money corrupts, all while being a 1%er... there wouldn't be an issue.

We don't care, and never did, that the Clintons had a lot of money, and a lot of financial world ties. We believed in their substance of character to do the right thing for the American people, but BS and his surrogates used that as a club attack.

His own words, and actions makes him a very viable target, and worthy of the word hypocrite. Not the fact that he is a 1%er.

[TheFarseer]

117. So if money corrupts

Who is he corrupted by? His supporters aka Progressive American people that bought his book? We should be so lucky that our politicians are in the pocket of the American people. If you have evidence that Goldman Sachs bought the books, them we can talk. Until then, you are just intentionally missing the point.

[hedda_foil]

148. You know, a lot of us weren't at all happy about that. I voted for her but it bothered me.

It bothered me more that the Russotrumpians hacked Podesta's email, the DNc's servers, and on and on, but I'm not happy about those banks, billionaires and PACs having more influence with our candidates than grass roots Dems. And when that kind of money is involved it's inevitable.

[beachbum bob]

140. progressive websites downplaying sander's tax returns and wealth??

why is that?

[BlueWI]

144. It's good that Sanders released his taxes.

And its 99% nothing burger after all the handwringing.

The rest of the Democratic field should follow his lead in sustaining his base, bypassing the punditry when warranted, speaking directly with passion, courting young voters, turning away corporate dollars, and putting people-first issues on the table.

He's sustaining a lot of support through these fundamentals, like it or not.

[AlexSFCA]

153. he should be. If he wasn't, it'd be weird.

The fact that he is advocating for his own tax increase should speaks volumes.

[srobertss]

154. Bernie Sanders guide to accumulating wealth

(I’m borrowing from a riff on the Majority Report, and mine is not nearly as funny, btw)

#1 Move from the Bronx to Vermont because of all the opportunities there

#2 Move from job to job for over a decade

#3 Get elected as a mayor, then slowly move on to the US House and then finally the Senate

#4 Run for president and write a best selling book when you’re a grandfather


Let’s look at intentions here.

Also, there’s a huge difference between policy and personal actions. He’s saying everyone should be taxed fairly. He’s not saying they should not make money.