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JackRiddler

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Member since: 2002
Number of posts: 24,979

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One would have to boorish not to understand the difference

in the attitude to women expressed by ladies night, as opposed to a rule made up on the spot expressing the sentiment, "No Fat Chicks On the Dance Platform." One is promotional and friendly and disparages no one. The other is a backwards, macho disparagement of paying patrons. Beyond the personal insult and hurfulness, the bouncers' behaviors promote a very fucked-up standard of "beauty" that many do not share. The difference is elementary and one must wonder what your dog-in-the-fight is to bring up such an inapplicable comparison. The lady and her friends have every right to bad-mouth this bar as publicly and effectively as they can muster, and I hope the bar gets a richly deserved reputation for misogyny and goes out of business. I can even hope that hearing about this moves some people to reexamine their own fucked-up attitudes and behaviors toward women as well as overweight people, but judging by this thread (and experience) that's a snowball in hell. Boors don't usually decide to learn manners and respect for others.

Bullshit. Sociopathy is systemic.

Sociopathy drives more like 10-15 percent of the general population, 30-40 percent of everyone in authority at hierarchical entities like corporations and government, and a majority among Wall Street traders and decision-makers -- because on Wall Street the explicit rules themselves are sociopathic and if you're not a sociopath, you're a loser. Careerism encourages sociopathy. The economic imperative to accumulate by any means while externalizing the costs is inherently sociopathic. Authoritarianism encourages sociopathy among leaders and their coterie. Secret authority practically guarantees it among spooks. Enemy images (the economic competition, the alleged foreign threat, "crime" provide moral justification. Most of the reigning institutions generate sociopathy. Most of the presidents have been laughably obvious individual sociopaths; in the post-Kennedy period all of them have delivered caricature performances of individual sociopathy except for Carter and so far Obama (who appears to be very disciplined so it's probably not individually the case).

Once again, you are misrepresenting what I clearly wrote.

Greeks are the best-educated national group in the world.

Greece has resources.

Greece can become sovereign and independent.

Sovereignty begins with control over the issuance and also the devaluation if necessary of the currency. Countries in Greece's dilemma have often been able to deal with the crisis by way of devaluation. That option must be returned to Greece.

One aspect of achieving sovereignty is the importance of immediately becoming food self-sufficient - something that Greece no longer has, but can still restore. This will involve repopulating the many underpopulated villages and the many farmlands that have lain fallow for years.

You're the one who interprets this one aspect of what I said, meaning the revival of this vital sector, as meaning all Greeks must become shepherds and fishermen. (The latter is unlikely, given the global disaster of the fisheries which is most acute in the Mediterranean.)

Yours is a typical metropolitan, consumerist, globalist attitude.

Insofar as many Greeks share it, that's too bad for them.

Because right now the choices are between hardship under conditions of vassalage and generations of debt slavery, which your incredible ideology characterizes as a solution (for whom? your friends at Goldman Sachs and Deutsche Bank?) and hardship as a sovereign nation that can remake itself.

Greeks voted against your austerity plan, sorry, fail.

Your condescending pretense that Greeks are childish and longing for the days of 10 years ago is wearing thin, and highly insulting to the Greek people. As the vote shows, Greeks are voting against the bogus "American Dream" system, and this trend will continue as they awaken to the new realities -- and make the choice between vassalage to the European Illusion version of American Dream, or sovereignty. Easy choices are done.

Your characterization is typically wrong. I provided an answer.

Readers can read it again here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=117754

The rhetoric with which you caricature and misrepresent my answer is as irrelevant as your ideological bent is obvious.

Yes, the answer is for Greece to regain sovereignty and independence and move on to a path of development that puts ecological and human realities above maximizing the number of electronic gadgets in circulation.

As opposed to the tech worship and eternal-growth globalist bullshit that you seem to support, although you know it is an illusion since you also support the austerity and debt slavery that make this idea of "lifestyle" impossible for the vast majority in the long run. (Not to mention the wasteful war and empire that you have also supported on this board in other posts.)

You're right about one thing - like almost all nations, Greece is in a childlike state, believing in the bullshit that the (impossible) universalization of the "American dream" is the best that life can offer. Greece can be among the first nations to finally awaken from that lie and grow up.

There is no alternative to years of hardship, but there is a choice.

Greece faces years of hardship. The question is whether these will be a few years as a sovereign free people in a hard struggle, or generations as impoverished debt slaves and vassals to an unaccountable, unelected euro bureaucracy that serves no one other than the banksters. Neither Europeans nor Greeks have the right to enslave unborn generations with decades of debt repayments and no alternative path to development. A sovereign nation needs the ability to issue and also to devalue its currency, that is how countries get out of these messes. The interests of Franco-German corporations cannot trump those of the nation's own people. Greece needs to suspend all debt payments, introduce its own sovereign currency with capital controls (as was the case in living memory, back in the 1960s and 1970s), nationalize the key industries starting with banking (not agriculture), and institute a crash jobs program to get people back into the villages and achieve food self-sufficiency. Greece needs to start using the sun for energy. Greece should also agitate along with the rest of the EU periphery for EU reform and an end to the regime of banksterism and austerity. They should leave the euro, not the EU. Greece and the other nations targeted in the EU debt war can become leaders to a different path, real internationalists, not globalists. They can break with neoliberalism. The people need to be ready to organize themselves, as was the case in Argentina for years. There will be upheavals and inflation, and then growth. And if they do this, the next few years will see the biggest tourist influx in history. Nowadays, with Argentina offering growth again, it has also seen the return of foreign investment.

And your "life is unfair" speech is relevant how?

Getting back to the facts of the case: A patron of a bar wants to do the same thing allowed to other patrons of the bar, and is barred from doing so by foolish staff, due to prejudice against her type. He's wrong. Morally and logically it's an open and shut case, and if she wants to fight it out in public, good for her. Your tired-wise observations can be countered by the equally prevalent fact that people have always struggled against the phenomena you are observing, and caused changes in attitudes and behaviors. So again, good for her for not accepting some "natural" state of human behavior if it's wrong. That refusal is the root of what we call civilization.

So you're for slicing up little kittens, are you? Really?!

Your attack question bears no relation to my post, and merely changes the subject.

I said: The German government is not offering any money to Greece, as you are claiming here. The net flow will be from German taxpayers to German (among other) bondholders. Greece is merely a transit point for this flow. None of the German taxpayers' money will stay in Greece. The net flow from Greece as well will be to the bondholders.

You avoided addressing this correction of your false terms and false characterization of the situation ("Germany" "giving" to "Greece" by switching to an unrelated talking point.

Now to handle that, an odious debt usually takes two to accumulate. The corrupt Greek government -- officials of which received many bribes and favors from German corporations, as well as others -- conspired with the bankers to create much of this debt, yes. They haven't been able to plunder the world, but they have helped plunder their own people. This is why the grand-racket parties of ND and PASOK are now collapsing.

Otherwise, Greece should have never ceded its sovereignty to the European Central Bank, which is the main cause of the crisis.
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