OT- with krispos indulgence

Thanks to all, from both sides, who participated in my GD thread. http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4415244

Though locked by the hosts, I do not disagree with their explanation and reasoning. The input I received will help me get a good start on my project for the school.

Children, guns, education... looking for input

In advance of the 20/20 report tomorrow night I have been asked by a local school about options for gun safety education for children (I contract with the school as a security/safety consultant). I informed them that essentially the only program out there is the NRA's Eddie Eagle. While not rejecting it absolutely, the admin is hesitant to use NRA material as it could be seen as having a bias- the program may be mandatory, opt-in or opt-out, TBD but they want high participation with the support of parents.

So to wishing a politically neutral, safety oriented program, they have asked me to develop a proposal and plan for teaching the children. I of course said no problem, but my background is in adult education. I am trying to drop all of my pre-conceived notions and ideas and create the best program possible.

My question is, what would you all here on DU like a gun safety course for children to include?

-School is pre-K to 8th grade, so it may require several variants to account for age.
-It would be preferred to mesh with the current school day so taught in a 20 or 60 minute block, multiple blocks may be available but a single session is ideal.
-Student body is racially and ethnically diverse, living mostly in a middle class first tier suburb.

Thanks in advance for any/all input

Another DGU

(Sorry for the length)

So there I was...
I made an emergency run with my 9yro to Walgreens for TP and chocolate- our house was out of both of these critical items. It was after dark so we drove, though typically would have walked.

While exiting my girl did her usual stop at the Red Box to check out the new videos; I noticed a man entering the far end of the parking lot carrying a plastic bag and walking unsteadily. She didn't find any must-see title so we headed towards the truck.

The man changed his direction 45 degrees towards us. Unusual since we were parked away from the door. At that point I handed the bag of chocolate to my little one and told her to get in front- rare treat for her- and lock the door. I am almost to the truck and in between the gentleman and my daughter but he is closer than I like.

I ask loudly “Can I help you” when he is close to 20' away. He stops while I take a couple more steps to keep distance.

He replies “Gimme thirty dollars”, no please or other nicety about it.

This is not good IMO, “Excuse me”. At the same time I step another pace away. Shift the large TP package to cover my right hip and my hand slides my shirt to uncover my pistol.

He repeats “Gimme thirty dollars” now sounding angry. My impression is he is drunk and/or high. I am looking around to see if anyone else, goo, bad or other in near. The only people are rather far and I would have to circle the entire vehicle to reach my door.

I answer loudly, trying to attract attention “I don't have money”. As retreat is unwise we enter a staring contest. At least a couple folks are starting to pay attention but they are out of his line of sight so not immediately helpful.

I do not know if he is evaluating me or just trying to form a coherent thought- “Gimme money”

I tell him “You want to be leaving now.” To this point he has not seen that I am armed as I have kept the TP blocking his view, but my hand is free at mine side. He considers me for a moment the turns away with some curses.


Aftermath- I take my daughter home and call 911 while returning to the store. They tell me he came in but left right away. I find a follow him, while talking to 911, keeping two blocks away. I assure them I have absolutely no desire to confront or detain him. In about 5 minute a patrol car arrives and I head home.

The man ends up being booked on possession and weapon charges since he had meth and a large knife. The DA elects to not press robbery charges based on our encounter as he did not display the knife or attempt any force. It gets classed as aggressive pan handling. A plea deal has him serving 5 years on the possession and other outstanding charges.


So why do I consider this a DGU? Well, I don't. The only ones who knew I was armed were myself and my daughter. With awareness and action I was able to keep a tactical distance between us. The TP allowed me to conceal my weapon while keeping it ready and also would have provided some defense if he had a knife (as I later learned he did). In the end, the gun was a non-factor.
What would I have done differently if unarmed? Nothing. I would still have kept him at a distance and faced with a choice between unwise retreat and standing, I would have still stood. Without a gun I would still have attempted to locate, but not approach and let PD handle him.

I would like to think I am not atypical of most carriers.
-Being armed did not embolden me, though I do not deny it did provide a comfort having a good means of defense.
-I had no desire to commit murder from the gun urging me on as some maintain; though I would have had a decent self defense claim.
-Why did I have a gun on a run to the corner store? Because I always carry, wherever legal. To paraphrase, Crime Happens
-Why not show the gun? Outside of the issue of brandishing, which would make me the bad guy, my read it would as easily escalate the situation as encourage him to back off

So I am I making a tall manure pile? Believe what you want- the Walgreens is located at 1180 Arcade St, St Paul, MN; the Pioneer Press website has a city crime map http://stpaulcrime.twincities.com/. There is nothing listed at Walgreens as no charges were filed but you can find a possession on the 800 block of Cook Ave, in June 2013.

Cornyn introduces concealed-carry reciprocity bill

Who says you can't...

Owner of Fayetteville adult boutique shot during robbery