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defacto7

Profile Information

Name: Defacto7
Gender: Do not display
Hometown: Portland, OR
Home country: not sure anymore
Current location: depends on which proxy I'm using
Member since: Wed Aug 1, 2012, 12:44 AM
Number of posts: 11,969

About Me

Humanist, Classical musician, Linux hack, Liberal, Cosmology enthusiast, Refuse resurrectionist, Living with you in purgatory

Journal Archives

That's probably true in certain sense

that "We're actually living in one of the most peaceful times in global history.". But I think that depends a lot on a person's definition of peaceful. Peaceful by what means? could make a difference in perspective. Peaceful for whom also makes a difference. Stable peace is different from peace at a point in time. What properties are present that make peace a permanent fixture rather than an period of exception. Time is a strange word when talking about human history and it's nonsensical when comparing it to global history where we are not even a blip. Perspectives are important to survival now that there is a reasoning animal on the planet.

Humans have had their negative influence

on the earth in the last 5000 years for sure. Now there are more of us, we have advanced toys and we have less anonymity. But we still have the same reptilian survival needs turned greed, the same need to protect the clan turned nationalism, and a sense to sacrifice the weaker for the powerful turned politics. Those elements are not conducive to advancing humanity. I think we're devolving and we are now deep in that process. Whether that process can change directions or slow down all depends on our choices before our sociopathic side pulls us to the point of no return. In the end, there will be no end time, because the earth will always be the ultimate winner.

Air in Utah...

On Saturday, I was driving here in Salt Lake City to take my son to an appointment and found myself in the middle of a mass that was converging on the Capitol. It was a protest against the bad air quality in Utah and the policies and corporations that have allowed it. We joined. I have always been strong on air quality since I've lived here because it is so unusually bad here and I think most of it is unnecessary.

When we drove home, I noticed 4 people walking together from the protest holding signs that said things like, "Stop the pollution" and "fight for air quality". All four got into 4 different vehicles, 2 were over-sized gas guzzling pickup trucks.. you know the ones that are never used for work but just get driven around for show. The other 2 were RV 4 wheel drive tanks... 4 people, 4 vehicles, none of which could possibly get better than 15 MPG and probably less.

I'm kind of sick of hypocritical attitudes where people think standing for a cause means other people have to change but it doesn't mean they themselves actually have to change their own lifestyle. If we are going to make a point that can change industrial practices, cause governments and the public to change their wasteful and selfish habits that choke the inhabitants of this planet... then it starts here and now, this minute... with us, ourselves, me.

On a side note... tomorrow, I'm going to plan and install an air quality cam on the roof of a building I have access to and point it at the beautiful Wasatch range that I could not even see today because of the horrific air quality. I don't know if I can get it running tomorrow or not but when it is running, I'll drop a link on DU so you can see it as it happens. Information is good.

BTW, I drive a VW... rated 42Mpg but I'm getting 50 on the highway, diesel, hoping to use old fry oil soon. I just put my Hybrid Honda to eternal rest last month but removed the hybrid battery to add to my solar panel storage. We walk, We have bicycles.

I appreciate your explanation.

But I still have to separate the human responsibility for mankind element from the "having a good job and money" element. I see no correlation between the two. Studies about productivity and job satisfaction comparisons don't deal with how we treat the less advantaged among us or moral responsibility, they deal with personal wants, satisfaction and goals. Actually more recent studies show that goal orientation is far more productive in the workplace than money, but that is a digression from my point. People don't forget a child in a wheelchair because of their job satisfaction, they overlook the disadvantaged among us because of irresponsibility and lack of compassion. Mistakes happen, but some mistakes take on the mantle of pure selfishness and it costs us out integrity. The most moneyed and job secure make those same mistakes every day.

You say "they get what they pay for with low wages"

So it's about money instead of human kindness, responsibility and the things that money can NEVER buy?

That... is really the saddest comment on the nature of humanity I have heard in a while.

Gees... the world has gone to hell

stupid completely gone to hell.

There's no affection left on the planet... it's either stand behind bulletproof glass or it's sex. There's nothing left of human caring. Defend , defend, defend, sue, sue, sue, fear, fear, shoot, shoot... Sometimes I see humanity's end looming just because we have lost the ability to care lost in a blur of fear. Damn the infinitesimally small bunch of perverts that have started it, damn the lawyers who have promoted it, damn the money that feeds it, and double damn the stupid that has taken over humanity.

I suppose in a way

as long as we retain and participate in our memory of our loved ones they are immortal as far as we are concerned. Like the words of Epicurus... "Death does not concern us, because as long as we exist, death is not here. And when it does come, we no longer exist." So to think in terms of our consciousness being the "only and all" we can know and our memories being the substance of our past experience, it's not a far reach to see ourselves and others as eternal... at least for the moments that we live.

I'm no economist.. but,

What makes us feel like the US debt means anything? at all? that is has any effect in the long haul except fear of it? We still have a debt for the Civil War that is unpaid but it has become insignificant due to the expansion of the US economy since then. Our problem is not with our debt to China or anyone else, our problem is a stagnant economy. Turn the economy loose through government program stimulus and the debt becomes a non contender at home or abroad. In that scenario, China needs us more than we need them, same with SA.

The debt is a smoke screen for fear mongering by the GOP which plays into their gutting of the US government and economy for the enrichment of corporations and other power structures... and in some extreme cases, to bring on a BS religious Armageddon.

Well, that's what I see.

Anger at what this country has become is not something to

be ashamed of. I understand your use of the word bigotry; I'm not sure it's the right word but you say what you feel. I feel a lot of anger and resentment toward those who have taken in selfishness and apathy thus basically destroying what America was meant to be from the beginning... free from tyranny, free from religious persecution, free to pursue happiness, and justice for all. That original foundation is crumbling underneath us and the feeling I have from that condition has no words I can express.

All we can do is fight and sometimes we must fight even when we know nothing will return. We just fight because it's right and we fight for our children and the future of humankind.

To believe or not to believe... it's a helluva question for some.

Our group has a small but interesting clientèle of people from across the board who share an interest in searching and sharing their views concerning belief and non-belief. Some of us have come to a conclusion that there is no deity or that we just don't know but we all share a quest for reality thinking. Sometimes we succeed and sometimes we fail but the end result is to learn from each other and form a community of searchers not bound to certain ideological positions that are taken for granted in other groups and forums. When we are able to build that community we also form a place to blow off steam in acceptance and understanding without repercussion. I think that is the reasonable outcome for any safe haven group.

Every once in a while, the Atheist and Agnostic group is visited by users who take positions that are contrary to it's ideals. Their positions are so virulent and accusing it makes me wonder why they are participating at all. They usually aren't trolls so to speak, they may be long term members of DU and also at times hosts of their own groups or even members of MER-T. It's been puzzling me for a while since it makes no sense that they intrude in this group as if they're trying to reform it or the subject. But now, I think I have figured out something, and I'll be the first to admit it's just conjecture on my part and may be bull shit but it's a possible answer to the dilemma of the disrupting nature of those who are compelled to "visit" and only contribute negative undercutting of it's constituents and their subjects.

Characteristics:

1. They claim at some time to be atheist, agnostic or non-believers.
2. Their points are baited with non-factual information about the commenter or the comment.
3. Their points are worded for the most effective disruption of the thread or a person.
4. They at some point resort to clear and outright personal insults based on bias without material reason.
5. They usually defend a religious point of view with a belligerent attitude.
5. They always project their own insults on the commenter; they blame to commenter for their own acts.

I think the issue is with their non-belief and actually, I don't think they are non-believers or agnostics at all. I think they want to be, wish to be, try to be, but they haven't reconciled their own fear of not believing and have a bent on defending any contrary position toward belief and religion in general. It may be they feel that vindicating or defending the beliefs they left or doubt will somehow relieve the guilt of being unable to relinquish those doubts. That would explain the extreme, untruthful and even hateful nature of their hit and run tactics and over the top anger geared to disrupt rather than reasoning together for the goal of understanding and conclusion.

This is a great place to share humor, angst, frustrations, ideas, information or anything that is in the spirit and interest of this group and I hope it does not meet the fate of other highly visible and disruptive groups who have no interest in reasoning with respect but rather cater to the reduction of all decent for the express purpose of decent alone.

I welcome any comments from those who participate in the spirit and good will of the A&A group and it's constituents but those who are bent on undercutting in A&A should just go back to the religion group or wherever it is you find your camaraderie.
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