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Response to Yavin4 (Original post)

Fri Aug 24, 2018, 05:51 AM

62. The problem with pardons for those at the top is it makes it harder to reform the system

It's not just about "the Trumps getting the punishment they deserve"; we need to reform the election and governmental system to make it much harder for criminals to get inside it (Senator Warren's current bill would be a good start), and to deter those that will try in the future.

If the Trump family were to get away without conviction, it's harder to convict those below them. And it's harder to kick out the grifters and ideological maniacs. Pence, Zinke, Ross, DeVos, Wheeler and Mnuchin are all dangers to the USA and world, either because of their crimes, or their unwavering devotion to Christian dominionism, ruining the environment, or enriching the 1% at the expense of all others.

If Trump agreed to resign without impeachment, I think I would take that for practical reasons - getting the Senate to convict him in the impeachment process is going to be tough. That would run the risk of Pence pardoning him, but if that happened, rather than "the country in general" or "us" offering the pardon in exchange for his resignation, then it's still easier to say "we have to reform". The pardon becomes Pence's decision, and you can make it an albatross to tie round his neck.

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LineReply The problem with pardons for those at the top is it makes it harder to reform the system
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