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MineralMan

(146,286 posts)
Thu Feb 14, 2019, 11:43 AM Feb 2019

Why Train Travel in the United States Makes No Sense [View all]

I travel from St. Paul, MN to the Los Angeles, CA area several times a year. My 94-year-old-parents live there, and that means that I never know when I'm going to need to go.

By air, flying the next day after I know I need to go, the trip costs an average of about $500, round-trip, if someone picks me up at LAX. The flight takes 3.5 hours. Add a couple of hours to that to get to the airport and get through security with plenty of time to spare, and I am in LA in less than six hours.

By contrast, I could take Amtrak from St. Paul to Los Angeles. There's a train leaving at 10 AM on most days. A round trip costs about $500, depending on the day of the week. But...and here's the kicker...the minimum time needed on that train is roughly 72 hours, each way. That means that each trip involved six days on the train.

How does that make any sense at all? Typically, when I go to see my parents, I spend four days there. My preferred flight to LAX arrives at about noon, so that's one of those days. The return flight leaves LAX at about 1 PM, which I also count as a day with my parents. So, I'm gone just four days.

If I went by train, the entire trip would take 10 days of my time, with six of those sitting on a train.

Who can do that? Not me. Worse, the train trip costs the same as the trip by air.

This country is too large for train travel between many major cities to make any sense at all. It might work on the East Coast, I suppose, or even within a state, but those are driveable distances, so i would just get in my car.

Is the answer high-speed rail? Not really. My St. Paul to Los Angeles trip would still take too long to make sense.

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So, for that reason, are you opposed to the "Green New Deal"? True Dough Feb 2019 #1
High Speed Rail is just one aspect of that. MineralMan Feb 2019 #4
I didn't think that. I asked a question True Dough Feb 2019 #33
Well, if the plan is to seriously curtail air travel.... Adrahil Feb 2019 #53
I would definitely take a high speed train coast to coast and delisen Feb 2019 #90
Agree! I would take high speed rail in a minute. lkinwi Feb 2019 #104
Well sure, GWC58 Feb 2019 #159
I worked for 17 years as a brakeman / conductor MicaelS Feb 2019 #9
Paris to Marseille - just under 500 miles - 3 hours with two stops GoneOffShore Feb 2019 #153
I've done that trip several times. Voltaire2 Feb 2019 #157
So what? MicaelS Feb 2019 #170
Touchy - I was merely pointing out the that it's pratical for longer distances than you said. GoneOffShore Feb 2019 #182
How do you plan to deal with aquiring the land? MicaelS Feb 2019 #191
The right of way exists. No need to declare eminent domain. GoneOffShore Feb 2019 #199
What ROW? MicaelS Feb 2019 #200
It's been managed in Europe and China. GoneOffShore Feb 2019 #204
This is a critique of ownership and operations, not engineering. apnu Feb 2019 #189
You cannot mix high-speed passenger trains... MicaelS Feb 2019 #190
You got that out of MM's post? Hekate Feb 2019 #99
Allow me to repeat my response to him (slightly revised for pronoun use) True Dough Feb 2019 #106
Agree with you exboyfil Feb 2019 #2
Regional train travel makes much more sense than cross country MANative Feb 2019 #3
Within the Central Atlantic Region, MineralMan Feb 2019 #7
You're right that I often do hop in the car, especially to Boston MANative Feb 2019 #16
And yet it's cheaper to fly from IAD or DCA to JFK than to take the train Recursion Feb 2019 #113
i've always lived in the NYC metro area crazycatlady Feb 2019 #15
Metro-North every damn day MANative Feb 2019 #21
This Ferrets are Cool Feb 2019 #161
Just wondering onlyadream Feb 2019 #162
I've never taken the Bolt bus, so I can't help on that MANative Feb 2019 #164
The idea is to replace current railroads with high speed technology linking cities. hedda_foil Feb 2019 #5
but but they want to compare their dream trip around the world and talk about how rail won't help TeamPooka Feb 2019 #10
Perhaps. Assuming that there is enough traffic between two cities MineralMan Feb 2019 #11
Chicago to Miami fwvinson Feb 2019 #65
Yeah, maybe. MineralMan Feb 2019 #72
Too long exboyfil Feb 2019 #128
+1 violetpastille Feb 2019 #24
East of the Mississippi, different story BeyondGeography Feb 2019 #6
So it's all about you? GeorgeGist Feb 2019 #8
Depends on the day and the airline. MineralMan Feb 2019 #13
It is always about the individual. It is individual people who travel. MineralMan Feb 2019 #19
True, but if you were not in a hurry, doesn't that include three meals/day for each of those days? hlthe2b Feb 2019 #12
I don't know. I haven't been on a train in years. MineralMan Feb 2019 #14
sure but costwise, if 18 meals are included plus bed, that isn't such a bad price for a long trip hlthe2b Feb 2019 #31
The price I quoted is for a coach seat on the train. MineralMan Feb 2019 #34
No. Amtrak will sell you food. They do not give you food. Maru Kitteh Feb 2019 #45
Pretzels? MineralMan Feb 2019 #55
Hence the "technically" lol. Pretzels Maru Kitteh Feb 2019 #59
Sure. Pretzels are food. MineralMan Feb 2019 #73
Food is free if you have a sleeper wryter2000 Feb 2019 #85
The food is free for people with sleeper cars wryter2000 Feb 2019 #84
I did Oakland to Denver this past summer wryter2000 Feb 2019 #80
Sounds like a nice trip... I hope you don't mind my asking details.... hlthe2b Feb 2019 #97
I did it one way wryter2000 Feb 2019 #102
Train travel can be great for trips less than a few hundred miles. tinrobot Feb 2019 #17
I think the highest and best use of trains/high speed rail ewagner Feb 2019 #83
Agree, HSR would benefit metro areas radius777 Feb 2019 #151
So explain to me why ocean liners exist? N/T flotsam Feb 2019 #18
Well, only a few exist, really. Most travel by ship is on cruise lines. MineralMan Feb 2019 #20
Speaking of cruises Rorey Feb 2019 #47
I've never been tempted by a cruise, really. MineralMan Feb 2019 #52
Additionally Rorey Feb 2019 #60
My wife and I have been on exactly one cruise. DFW Feb 2019 #146
My daughter went on a cruise exboyfil Feb 2019 #129
Inexpensive accommodations Rorey Feb 2019 #138
So you're saying flotsam Feb 2019 #50
Sure. For people who enjoy that, it's great. MineralMan Feb 2019 #54
There is only one ocean liner in regular service - the Queen Mary 2 hack89 Feb 2019 #96
Depends on how you parse the term flotsam Feb 2019 #107
They're not provinding A to B transportation BannonsLiver Feb 2019 #111
Has nothing to do with size hack89 Feb 2019 #112
Well there's this: flotsam Feb 2019 #122
And there is this hack89 Feb 2019 #130
This message was self-deleted by its author flotsam Feb 2019 #118
A high speed rail line from St. Paul to Milwaukee, though? gratuitous Feb 2019 #22
That's a 5 hour drive, max. MineralMan Feb 2019 #25
Have you driven Portland to Seattle? gratuitous Feb 2019 #35
Not for many years. MineralMan Feb 2019 #38
Unless you leave before the sun comes up, as my wife and I did when we lived north of Seattle. Garrett78 Feb 2019 #86
Chicago To StL ProfessorGAC Feb 2019 #41
My wife and I took the train from Chicago to Bloomington-Normal MineralMan Feb 2019 #49
On That Drive, You Drove Just Passed Our Town! ProfessorGAC Feb 2019 #94
I thought it was interesting what parts of towns the train MineralMan Feb 2019 #168
We're A Small Town ProfessorGAC Feb 2019 #175
They finally banned the train from using its horn MineralMan Feb 2019 #177
I have friends in small rail towns in Oregon KitSileya Feb 2019 #194
Here in St. Paul, MN, the RR right-of-way is a highway for MineralMan Feb 2019 #195
Not sure if you have travelled there over many years tritsofme Feb 2019 #148
I haven't been to Normal for quite a long time. My wife's MineralMan Feb 2019 #167
I hadn't been there since around the same time until this past year. tritsofme Feb 2019 #188
Rail service doesn't mean from every city to every other city. brooklynite Feb 2019 #23
OK. My question is whether there is enough traffic MineralMan Feb 2019 #27
COnsider that a flight NYC-CHI is about 2 hours... brooklynite Feb 2019 #40
Stopping at every town is my issue as well Thew Feb 2019 #117
That's fine until Peak Oil actually hits LongtimeAZDem Feb 2019 #26
Correct, if speed to arrive is the only concern. mobeau69 Feb 2019 #28
Leisure travel, I think, is not the goal for HSR, frankly. MineralMan Feb 2019 #29
To many, like me, it would be a welcome benefit none-the-less. mobeau69 Feb 2019 #43
Canada would disagree flotsam Feb 2019 #56
Wouldn't work for me. Destinations are my thing, not the journey. MineralMan Feb 2019 #57
Oh flotsam Feb 2019 #62
I didn't suggest that in any way. MineralMan Feb 2019 #63
I would dispute "many" brooklynite Feb 2019 #48
Two stories here. Actually, three. PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #141
High speed where it makes sense, I don't recall proposals saying it was all or nothing 😉 MLAA Feb 2019 #30
High speed rail would work JustAnotherGen Feb 2019 #32
I think in some areas high-speed rail could be a viable option. WeekiWater Feb 2019 #36
Amtrak from Boston to NYC or DC is fast, cheap, and comfortable. Croney Feb 2019 #37
Sounds like a good road trip...especially in February! MineralMan Feb 2019 #74
Acela is great (Philly to Boston) MH1 Feb 2019 #132
Amtrak in the northeast corridor is great! smirkymonkey Feb 2019 #205
Yes! All this, plus you feel like you're living history as the sights go whizzing by. Croney Feb 2019 #206
:) smirkymonkey Feb 2019 #207
- Bigredhunk Feb 2019 #39
From MN to CA, with current infrastructure, of course it doesn't make sense. DanTex Feb 2019 #42
Lots of flights making that trip every day. MineralMan Feb 2019 #75
I'm sure there are, but like I said, it's not a heavily traveled route, comparatively speaking. DanTex Feb 2019 #91
The Europeans figured it out long ago. DFW Feb 2019 #150
The only problem with the Dallas-Houston trip is that once I get to Dallas, I still need a car theboss Feb 2019 #108
After the traffic during my last trip to L.A. DFW Feb 2019 #147
When I used to travel to dc a lot JustAnotherGen Feb 2019 #137
Non stop train service from Chicago to NY would never happen Kaleva Feb 2019 #165
Beijing - Shanghai is a comparable distance, and currently is 4.5 hours by train. DanTex Feb 2019 #178
Yep, and high-speed rail would lessen the time but not the price. brush Feb 2019 #44
It's because we're not investing in the infrastructure. backscatter712 Feb 2019 #46
Well, that's part of the problem. MineralMan Feb 2019 #78
I respectfully disagree. Comparison to Europe or China don't work. GulfCoast66 Feb 2019 #93
We used to have lots of rail. backscatter712 Feb 2019 #100
It also went away for a reason. theboss Feb 2019 #109
Of course we had lots of rail. Before air travel and interstates GulfCoast66 Feb 2019 #127
I admit I would like a route from Indy to Chicago. Adrahil Feb 2019 #51
Many years ago, I took a trip from Syracuse, NY to Indianapolis MineralMan Feb 2019 #61
i think wording in op is too strong Midnightwalk Feb 2019 #58
It made sense to connect Pittsburgh to Cincinnati the train that Kasich derailed in terms of Demsrule86 Feb 2019 #64
How many passengers a day do you think that train would MineralMan Feb 2019 #70
I grew up outside Pittsburgh. I've been in Cincinnati once in my life theboss Feb 2019 #110
We will never know. You are confusing long term trail with commuter rails which is what Cincy to Demsrule86 Feb 2019 #208
Eliminating one option because it doesn't serve all purposes makes no sense. Hortensis Feb 2019 #66
Mileage St Paul to Los Angeles is 1930 miles flotsam Feb 2019 #67
Carbon Footprint of travel from Minneapolis to LA jalan48 Feb 2019 #68
Not that simple to compare those two things Major Nikon Feb 2019 #155
Good info. I think the idea would be to build mass, train transit between major population areas. jalan48 Feb 2019 #156
The fact that one very long trip takes too long is a poor reason to denounce trains caraher Feb 2019 #69
Good post...and you need a heart! Sancho Feb 2019 #160
Talking today, I would agree generally; though passenger rail is both justifiable and viable even KPN Feb 2019 #71
we take a train every few months to Chicago from downstate, the only way to go...but then thats beachbum bob Feb 2019 #76
Just because you are not interested in going by train, does not mean PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #77
It may not work from St. Paul to LA wryter2000 Feb 2019 #79
Just off the top of my head(opinion). Afromania Feb 2019 #81
My wife and I take the train to Chicago once or twice a year jcgoldie Feb 2019 #82
It makes a hell of a lot of sense on the East Coast Blue_Tires Feb 2019 #87
Is your car environmentally friendly or a climate destroying pollution spewer? delisen Feb 2019 #88
I doubt if this country will invest in high speed rail, frankly. MineralMan Feb 2019 #89
Good for you! I drive a 2005 sedan and mostly keep my mileage delisen Feb 2019 #123
I'm fine with air travel, actually. MineralMan Feb 2019 #124
Good for you. PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #142
Did you know our locomotives burn diesel fuel to drive electric generators to move the wheels.? pwb Feb 2019 #92
Wow, DUers. 94 replies and only 4 Recs. Let me amend that with the 5th Rec. I had a sick Mom, too Hekate Feb 2019 #95
There is usually a reason for that. pwb Feb 2019 #121
How do you Rec a thread? Polybius Feb 2019 #187
Go back to the Original Post, and look at the bottom left below it. An icon that says DU Rec... Hekate Feb 2019 #192
Mom & Dad went from So Cal to live in Salt Lake City. He died a year or so later, but she lived on Hekate Feb 2019 #98
This is an important issue. Aging parents who live far from children. PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #143
I've ridden Amtrak from Santa Barbara to San Diego a number of times & enjoyed it... Hekate Feb 2019 #154
If we had a high speed rail back bone like other countries, it would not be 3 days. karynnj Feb 2019 #101
yes, we need infrastructure in so many areas librechik Feb 2019 #103
But, we don't have that infrastructure. MineralMan Feb 2019 #114
Honestly, water and sewer is the desperately needed infrasctructure project that no one discusses theboss Feb 2019 #173
Yes, indeed. In fact, we had no water in our house yesterday MineralMan Feb 2019 #174
Like most issues, "One Size Fits All" doesn't work for high speed rail. Still In Wisconsin Feb 2019 #105
Who goes from MSP to Milwaukee? MineralMan Feb 2019 #120
For a Brewers-Twins game of course! Still In Wisconsin Feb 2019 #134
It would work in some corridors Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Feb 2019 #115
But I want to go from San Jose to Los Angeles! Retrograde Feb 2019 #116
You can drive it in about six hours. That's just a few hours. MineralMan Feb 2019 #119
My daughter takes Amtrak from Portland to Tacoma all the time. Works great. Pobeka Feb 2019 #125
LA to San Fran, and Chicago to NYC are the 2 highest air traveled routes in the US Arazi Feb 2019 #126
Let me offer another perspective with my parent. TygrBright Feb 2019 #131
I want to be her! Phentex Feb 2019 #133
Bingo! PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #144
If certain people thought like you in the 20th century Mr. Quackers Feb 2019 #135
Eventually air travel isn't going to be economical, either due to not being able... Humanist_Activist Feb 2019 #136
And not just for passengers. meadowlander Feb 2019 #193
I dont know standingtall Feb 2019 #139
I will need to be in New York for a cruise that I booked late September. mnhtnbb Feb 2019 #140
You have the right idea. PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #145
I would love to take a train trip Raine Feb 2019 #149
For one thing, Congress does not adequately fund Amtrak DeminPennswoods Feb 2019 #152
Sorry but that is just bullshit. Voltaire2 Feb 2019 #158
Why not read the OP first before declaring it bullshit? Kaleva Feb 2019 #163
I read it. You identified where it is not a good option Voltaire2 Feb 2019 #166
It will work over short hauls Apollyonus Feb 2019 #169
We met a woman on our train trip who refused to fly. R B Garr Feb 2019 #171
Upgrading Amtrak/Acela on the East Coast NewJeffCT Feb 2019 #172
DC to NY, NY to Boston. Train is the only way to go. empedocles Feb 2019 #176
We've driven CT to DC several times NewJeffCT Feb 2019 #183
Know what you mean. We've driven many dozens of times DC to Waterbury area empedocles Feb 2019 #184
Having a rail system is a matter of National security Drahthaardogs Feb 2019 #179
Tell that to 'con Congress. empedocles Feb 2019 #181
Nope, that is what Interstate highways are for. MicaelS Feb 2019 #196
Nope. Drahthaardogs Feb 2019 #198
We have a perfectly adequate freight rail system to move troops and equipment. hack89 Feb 2019 #197
Wife and I took Amtrak cross country DC to LA/SF - Delightful empedocles Feb 2019 #180
Except there are those of us who won't put up with being Panich52 Feb 2019 #185
I am actually very, VERY surprised Polybius Feb 2019 #186
When I Was Little My Family Used to Take the Train from LA to Detroit & the Trip Took 3 Days dlk Feb 2019 #201
High speed electric buses that go 120 mph and use dedicated lanes adjacent to Anon-C Feb 2019 #202
I take Amtrak several times a year. HeiressofBickworth Feb 2019 #203
I've taken Amtrak from Chicago to Glacier National Park MountCleaners Feb 2019 #209
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