"Security assurances" as presented in your post is a bit vague. (Reply #40)

In the discussion thread: Most Americans Don't Want War With Russia. Where Are Progressives? [View all]

Sun Jan 30, 2022, 10:51 PM

Jedi Guy (2,752 posts)

40. "Security assurances" as presented in your post is a bit vague.

Your links are referring to the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances from December 1994, I believe. Here's what assurances were provided:

1. Respect Belarusian, Kazakh and Ukrainian independence and sovereignty in the existing borders.
2. Refrain from the threat or the use of force against Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine.
3. Refrain from using economic pressure on Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine to influence their politics.
4. Seek immediate Security Council action to provide assistance to Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine if they "should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used".
5. Refrain from the use of nuclear arms against Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine.
6. Consult with one another if questions arise regarding those commitments.

The security assurance was to "seek immediate Security Council action," which is a joke since Russia has a permanent seat and can unilaterally veto anything proposed by the Security Council. Russia was in breach of the agreement in 2014, and nothing happened. It's an agreement without an enforcement mechanism.

It clearly doesn't say that the US, NATO, or anyone else agreed to respond to a breach with military force or a declaration of war. I also note that you didn't bother to respond to any of my other points.

PS: I'm not sure why you felt the need to include the snarky "rich first page on a Google search" remark. I stated "as far as I'm aware" and I was at work at the time and didn't have time to put together a post with annotated sources. Furthermore, nothing in my reply to you was snarky. In any case, in future responses to your posts, I shall endeavor to set aside the time to do so.

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Replies to this discussion thread

63 replies	Author	Time	Post
Most Americans Don't Want War With Russia. Where Are Progressives? [View all]	Klaralven	Jan 2022	OP
We made a treaty w NATO partners.	Chin music	Jan 2022	#1
This is where I am as well	Bettie	Jan 2022	#2
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#4
The US has no treaty obligation with respect to Ukraine	Klaralven	Jan 2022	#6
So, you think it would be cool to allow	Bettie	Jan 2022	#7
Most former Warsaw Pact members are now members of NATO, so they are covered by treaty.	Klaralven	Jan 2022	#9
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#10
That's the point I was planning to make	Bettie	Jan 2022	#12
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#14
Ukraine is not a NATO member	Klaralven	Jan 2022	#15
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#16
I don't know what you mean	muriel_volestrangler	Jan 2022	#34
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#35
You need to express yourself better	muriel_volestrangler	Jan 2022	#36
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#46
Ukraine is 'NATO allied' and should be a NATO member	radius777	Jan 2022	#43
But they're not n/t	Polybius	Jan 2022	#49
No war period.	Demsrule86	Jan 2022	#32
It's what I've been thinking as well, Chin music. At some point Uncle Sam's word ...	Hekate	Jan 2022	#26
Re: staring down the jaws of the Russian Bear...	Jedi Guy	Jan 2022	#38
Putin is attacking the EU the way he's attacking the US: with propaganda and cyber-weapons	Hekate	Jan 2022	#39
"Security assurances" as presented in your post is a bit vague.	Jedi Guy	Jan 2022	#40
Didn't mean to be snarky about my search; just indicating there's a lot--and a lot I needed reminding	Hekate	Jan 2022	#41
We have no treaty with Ukraine.	former9thward	Jan 2022	#31
Ukraine isn't in NATO	Polybius	Jan 2022	#48
To defend the West and democracy,	radius777	Jan 2022	#53
Screw that	Polybius	Jan 2022	#54
It's not about nation building like Iraq was, which was a war of choice.	radius777	Feb 2022	#62
The Ukraine isn't in NATO	iemanja	Jan 2022	#55
Yep, this is apples and oranges.	GoCubsGo	Feb 2022	#59
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Feb 2022	#61
America is a one party system when it comes to war.	Magoo48	Jan 2022	#3
Russia is already at war with us.	Irish_Dem	Jan 2022	#5
We were the Ukraine when Trump was President.	Texaswitchy	Jan 2022	#8
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#11
Calling it "the Ukraine" is Soviet speak -- stop that, please.	W_HAMILTON	Jan 2022	#30
Ok	Texaswitchy	Jan 2022	#37
Progressives trust Biden's leadership on Russia	wellst0nev0ter	Jan 2022	#13
Curious article, the author seems to be taking issue w/ progs taking stances that 80+% of DU agrees	Celerity	Jan 2022	#17
We now have a President with other tools ....	albacore	Jan 2022	#18
Yep.	Texaswitchy	Jan 2022	#20
Good points	Hekate	Jan 2022	#27
+1	crickets	Jan 2022	#29
Anybody who wants to play the Ghandian role and lay in front of Russian tanks has my support.	tirebiter	Jan 2022	#19
I have cousins distant but still family in Czech Republic.	Texaswitchy	Jan 2022	#22
How are they doing now?	Klaralven	Jan 2022	#23
Ok.	Texaswitchy	Jan 2022	#25
All the best to them	Hekate	Jan 2022	#28
I'm certainly not on the Russian side...	albacore	Jan 2022	#33
There isn't going to be war with Russia	iemanja	Jan 2022	#21
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#24
Media Issue. They're fake not-pushing for War with Russia.	haele	Jan 2022	#42
This message was self-deleted by its author	Chin music	Jan 2022	#45
"war" is a Strawman	amaico	Jan 2022	#44
This should be handled by the European Union and we need to	Emile	Jan 2022	#47
NOBODY IS ARGUING WE SHOULD BE ATTACKING RUSSIA.	Tommy Carcetti	Jan 2022	#50
Thank you! nt	GoCubsGo	Feb 2022	#60
I wasn't aware we were going to war with Russia...	brooklynite	Jan 2022	#51
It's a Strawman poll	amaico	Jan 2022	#52
Some folks posted elsewhere here on DU ...	electric_blue68	Feb 2022	#56
This message was self-deleted by its author	Roisin Ni Fiachra	Feb 2022	#57
Putin is working to destabilize Ukraine from within first.	Roisin Ni Fiachra	Feb 2022	#58
+1. Putin is waging information warfare across the globe.	radius777	Feb 2022	#63

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