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Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
278. Like I said,I did NOT call out feminists and I don't see why you make it about you.
Tue Feb 12, 2013, 11:53 AM
Feb 2013

One poster did, maybe two.

But I didn't see you jump in and say anything in my defense either.

Was that passivity in the face of an attack?

Eve Ensler on the passivity of men [View all] babylonsister Feb 2013 OP
Let me be the first to rec this libtodeath Feb 2013 #1
This message was self-deleted by its author freshwest Feb 2013 #2
lol. i didnt wonder about men until i had two sons and learned seabeyond Feb 2013 #3
This message was self-deleted by its author freshwest Feb 2013 #6
Odd, I have a daughter and two granddaughters Fumesucker Feb 2013 #8
all you have to do is look at societal conditioning and the difference we treat male and female seabeyond Feb 2013 #10
Our culture is awash to the gunwales with female sexuality and hypersexuality Fumesucker Feb 2013 #14
womens sexuality is only used to promote and give to, entertain and validate mens sexuality seabeyond Feb 2013 #15
If a man shows one iota of vulnerability in our culture he's dead meat walking Fumesucker Feb 2013 #16
again, something we do not condition our boys with. then on the other hand, seabeyond Feb 2013 #17
I learned that lesson early on in high school. uriel1972 Feb 2013 #19
Took me to 40 Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #223
i have never asked for a "white knight". i do expect commen decency and that is not gender seabeyond Feb 2013 #227
+1 HiPointDem Feb 2013 #26
For that, you get another heart. Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #314
Odd you bring this up. timdog44 Feb 2013 #12
I don't believe that for a sec. Even if a study says it. I'm over 50; I've pretty much got a handle Honeycombe8 Feb 2013 #22
Don't worry the feminists Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #194
Dear Eve: Don't assume that the majority of Men are not outraged by the action of rape... BlueJazz Feb 2013 #4
Do they express that rage to other men marions ghost Feb 2013 #96
I've talked to men about what a lousy deal that women have had to endure.. BlueJazz Feb 2013 #110
I think men need to do more than actually discuss. They need to take action. Luminous Animal Feb 2013 #126
We have similar friends... marions ghost Feb 2013 #305
what a very insightful and worth the read post... seabeyond Feb 2013 #309
thanks seabeyond marions ghost Feb 2013 #311
thank you. but the best? they get to shed the conditioning and stereotypes given to men, seabeyond Feb 2013 #315
I believe your words are true and just but... BlueJazz Feb 2013 #329
i think it is a possibility if a man really wants to see. absolutely. i think even more so seabeyond Feb 2013 #354
Yes, they/you are out there--and the more marions ghost Feb 2013 #380
I tend to hang around with good people...those that it's hard to say an unkind word about or.. BlueJazz Feb 2013 #398
I totally agree with her, but I'm not impressed by her 'awareness' raising methods, which seem ancianita Feb 2013 #5
I don't think it's really about "good men" vs "bad men".... YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #7
but even better, you can completely see it from a mans view and i think seabeyond Feb 2013 #9
Likewise, thanks for your post. YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #62
And yet... lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #69
It's asking men to have empathy and solidarity.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #85
*crickets* bettyellen Feb 2013 #433
Thank you for trying to understand. smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #493
On what basis is she assuming men aren't angry about rape and humiliation of women? Bucky Feb 2013 #11
Ironic sidenote: I'm a bad man and a horrid human being and I'm *still* anti-rape Bucky Feb 2013 #13
On the basis that they get all dismissive, pissy and make it bettyellen Feb 2013 #28
+10000000000000000000000000000000 redqueen Feb 2013 #117
Well said. Many posts in this thread perfectly illustrate the factuality of your post. nt Zorra Feb 2013 #288
If someone doesn't want good men to start from a defensive stance, then Hosnon Feb 2013 #369
When they completely refuse to discuss the topic.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #373
They probably refuse to discuss the topic because it began with an implicit attack. Hosnon Feb 2013 #374
So they come only to derail it. Trolling, basically. bettyellen Feb 2013 #377
It's only an attack if you're guilty of what someone is talking about justiceischeap Feb 2013 #414
True- quite a few of the men here have explained their non support due to bitterness.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #421
I love Eve Ensler and I think she is making a valid point. Kath1 Feb 2013 #18
Men as protectors... Bonobo Feb 2013 #20
Historically, most men protected only what they perceive as their own.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #33
i am thinking rape as a tool in war. the other side "protecting" while raping and vice versa. seabeyond Feb 2013 #34
Gotcha. We're evil. nt Bonobo Feb 2013 #35
really? that is how you reduce the conversation. dont buy what you say, seabeyond Feb 2013 #37
Come on now, you can't whine about how hard you all have it... bettyellen Feb 2013 #38
Make up your mind. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #71
There's a middle road. But you need to respect and care about women bettyellen Feb 2013 #75
The middle of the road is paved with squashed skunks. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #77
You're smarter than this B&W either/ or mindset... bettyellen Feb 2013 #94
Men are also more prone to be *victims* of serious physical violence. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #346
Yes! Why don't men stop hurting everyone? bettyellen Feb 2013 #347
It's a fixable problem. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #349
One in three or four is seriously fucked up.... Which is why we're bettyellen Feb 2013 #378
According to the DOJ, .84 people per thousand (aged 12 and over) are raped each year. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #402
And 99% of the rapists are men.... So kind of premature to bettyellen Feb 2013 #410
Define "serious issue". lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #418
Not doing it, sorry. bettyellen Feb 2013 #419
it might help BainsBane Feb 2013 #471
that is ludicrous BainsBane Feb 2013 #413
Strong words. Weak evidence. n/t lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #416
I provided evidence BainsBane Feb 2013 #434
"Nursing hostility? Nope. I married once and well. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #437
well, I was trying to understand your issues BainsBane Feb 2013 #449
Back up a step. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #453
some things are obvious, Jack BainsBane Feb 2013 #455
Obvious? lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #458
tell you what BainsBane Feb 2013 #460
Could you recommend a few? n/t lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #461
where do you live? BainsBane Feb 2013 #462
If I had my preferred MD's sorted by geography lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #464
wow, your responses to straight forward questions BainsBane Feb 2013 #465
Run away or I shall taunt you some more. n/t lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #467
you underestimate me BainsBane Feb 2013 #468
Hurt feelings lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #469
there is an easy solution BainsBane Feb 2013 #472
Oh, I get it now BainsBane Feb 2013 #466
actual crime stats BainsBane Feb 2013 #415
So, by "lie" you mean "truth". Apology accepted. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #417
and men are the perpetrators BainsBane Feb 2013 #430
No. I blame criminals for violence against men and women. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #436
exactly BainsBane Feb 2013 #450
I get the logic. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #454
where did I say men should be punished? BainsBane Feb 2013 #456
The repetitive, redundant omnipresent observation that most criminals are men depends on the premise lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #457
actally I provided statistical evidence BainsBane Feb 2013 #459
I didn't say that. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #463
You still have no evidence BainsBane Feb 2013 #473
Let's clear something up. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #474
find one example BainsBane Feb 2013 #478
Juvenile insults like "take your posts to a shrink" or "That is delusional"? muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #476
you clearly misunderstood BainsBane Feb 2013 #477
What does "Using your tenure as a juror to insult fellow members" mean? muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #479
You used that experience as a juror BainsBane Feb 2013 #480
At least you accept I have not insulted you in any way. muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #481
This is the best response in this thread Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #173
actually, there is a rebirth to the feminist movement with our young of both genders. so your seabeyond Feb 2013 #177
There is no re-birth and only delusional Feminists believe Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #190
like there is any expectation of you being knowledge about the subject, having invested a single seabeyond Feb 2013 #204
Angry men have checked out and so have the passive men Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #213
your post is beyond silly.... find that harmony dude, feels good, truly. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #219
Dude = passive aggressive attack like saying "chick" or "babe". Bonobo Feb 2013 #229
no, it does not. dude/dudette. in your movies. hey dude.... calif time. seabeyond Feb 2013 #233
Dude is a friendly term. Mock outrage. bettyellen Feb 2013 #247
Would these be examples of how you use it in a "friendly way"? Bonobo Feb 2013 #252
As a passive male I refuse to help Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #232
dont want your help. really. if you do not have it in you, who the fuck cares. BUT... do not seabeyond Feb 2013 #234
We don't need an invitation to help. Bonobo Feb 2013 #237
Because we have seen and heard men being passive and not helping? bettyellen Feb 2013 #254
Let's try a test. Bonobo Feb 2013 #257
The OP states she's over "the passivity" of men bettyellen Feb 2013 #355
Yes passive men are the problem, so are the aggressive men Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #243
we are not talking about you. again, no expectation. we are talking about the men that get it, seabeyond Feb 2013 #251
Infamy? WTF. funnier than dragging Beyonce into this. LOL bettyellen Feb 2013 #422
God, you are so juvenile. smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #494
It's absurdly reductionist. Anyone who can't see any choice but bettyellen Feb 2013 #182
What a disgusting and untrue statement. RiffRandell Feb 2013 #411
I really appreciate your post. Bonobo Feb 2013 #412
Says the man who posits we should be grateful for .... bettyellen Feb 2013 #431
Hmmm, lemme check... Bonobo Feb 2013 #435
Sure you did- got very upset I wasn't grateful for men's bettyellen Feb 2013 #438
Even one quote showing that would be nice. Bonobo Feb 2013 #440
The men who school us on tone have a problem accepting how whiney they come off. bettyellen Feb 2013 #441
Congrats! You have taken wackiness to a whole new level. Bonobo Feb 2013 #442
And you are stuck clinging to the notion that bettyellen Feb 2013 #444
So then you're saying that Ms Hensler's advice should be ignored. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #447
Damned if you do, damed if you don't... Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #451
all the talk about failed relationships and anger at random women is "reasonable discussion"? bettyellen Feb 2013 #483
That "talk" is your's or someone else's, not mine. Miss-post? Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #485
no, I was replying to your claim that men who lack the capability for empathy and support are bettyellen Feb 2013 #486
You still don't make sense. I made no claims of the nature you describe or conjure. Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #487
could you clarify this about what "new narrative" might be- if not asking for support and empathy... bettyellen Feb 2013 #488
Men are now expected to take an activist role when once they were expected to remain in the b.g. Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #489
if having common decency is "being an activist" (huh?) is way too much for ask then the good man bettyellen Feb 2013 #490
I've always believed if your values are strong enough... Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #491
Shrill, LOL. Smirks? You have quite the thin skin, and fevered imagination... but I knew that after bettyellen Feb 2013 #492
Guffaws not withstanding, do you want the T? Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #496
as I said before, empathy and support. your post is complete gibberish that has nothing to do with bettyellen Feb 2013 #482
I should have prefaced this with historically .... bettyellen Feb 2013 #424
I don't disagree bettyellen but life is more complicated. Threedifferentones Feb 2013 #423
It's not "more complicated", it's much simpler. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #425
I agree.. It was a sloppy post but in essence the roots of what he asks bettyellen Feb 2013 #428
I read an article by a feminist suggesting the same thing Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #189
Prepare yourself Bonobo Feb 2013 #193
You make assumptions Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #202
You mistook my intent. Bonobo Feb 2013 #206
I see now, thank you Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #208
No problem at all. nt Bonobo Feb 2013 #215
It's great that you are now aware a shitty role was handed to you... bettyellen Feb 2013 #291
Where are we? theKed Feb 2013 #21
The friend zone. Where good guys go to die. nt EastKYLiberal Feb 2013 #23
how dare a woman seabeyond Feb 2013 #27
I thought only HS boys skulked around girls they do not want to be friends with ..... bettyellen Feb 2013 #30
You have got to be kidding me. redqueen Feb 2013 #118
ohhh, redqueen. say it sister. that is a very concise, clear way to explain it. seabeyond Feb 2013 #121
This thread is unbelievable. ismnotwasm Feb 2013 #141
unbelievable in a number of ways. damn it is not so tough, seabeyond Feb 2013 #144
That's not really what "friend zoned" means.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #136
What do you think it means? redqueen Feb 2013 #245
No, you already 'splained it for us cavemen.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #249
Aw, pobrecito. redqueen Feb 2013 #261
"Also, tv sitcom meme? WTF are you talking about?" ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #275
LOL, it says a lot that a bad joke from a bad sitcom would be flogged to death for decades redqueen Feb 2013 #282
LOL indeed ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #293
Oh, but they most definitely are misogynist fucks! redqueen Feb 2013 #296
I'm sort of confused as to who's taking this seriously? ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #303
lol... "dropped some knowledge"... yeah, thanks for Googling it redqueen Feb 2013 #307
I'm sorry ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #365
"Oh shit, now I've done it." redqueen Feb 2013 #376
It's okay.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #379
Your behavior here is cruel and arrogant. GaYellowDawg Feb 2013 #333
I've had countless discussions about this issue... (the 'joke that no one takes seriously) according redqueen Feb 2013 #335
Hm. GaYellowDawg Feb 2013 #339
Thank you. redqueen Feb 2013 #345
I think you were more right the first time hfojvt Feb 2013 #352
That isn't assuming jack shit about single men. redqueen Feb 2013 #382
"Lonely people who feel cheated? That's entitlement. No one is owed a romantic relationship." ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #383
I've never met a woman who felt cheated by not having a relationship. redqueen Feb 2013 #384
you use the word cheated hfojvt Feb 2013 #439
A great post ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #367
Memes don't always keep the same meaning that sufrommich Feb 2013 #330
People also don't know how to use the word "momentarily" correctly ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #366
ROFL...perfect! I thought the "nice guy / friend zone" thing was by now so universally mocked alcibiades_mystery Feb 2013 #196
You would think so, right? At least here... redqueen Feb 2013 #248
I didn't realize it was up to men to save all the women. Sirveri Feb 2013 #24
Veiled hostility and resentment.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #29
+1 obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #31
WTF kind of response does he expect- explicit permission to look the other way? bettyellen Feb 2013 #32
Oh, so women are strong enough to protect themselves? Sirveri Feb 2013 #66
It's irrelevant what women are CitizenPatriot Feb 2013 #123
If you don't want to listen and hear, then don't. seabeyond Feb 2013 #145
I've noticed that people who say they don't care CitizenPatriot Feb 2013 #262
yes. i do not often come into these threads any more. i got sucked in. seabeyond Feb 2013 #269
I get sucked in all of the time, too CitizenPatriot Feb 2013 #274
+1 Gormy Cuss Feb 2013 #316
You really believe on these pathetic stereotypes? bettyellen Feb 2013 #124
I resent the notion that women can't accomplish anything without men. Sirveri Feb 2013 #138
It's a given we have accomplished a ton with, historically bettyellen Feb 2013 #165
+1. Men are going to have to start having a conversation with other men to address their feelings. WCLinolVir Feb 2013 #185
8 months preg, amarillo texas, at an auction house with a hundred people. seabeyond Feb 2013 #197
At least one man here acknowledged he learned his old school sex role from Dad... bettyellen Feb 2013 #341
No... FightForMichigan Feb 2013 #184
exactly. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #212
The surest way to make women capable of "fighting their own battles" burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #230
amazingly excellent post.... thank you. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #235
Very well said, but those angry at women will avoid responding bettyellen Feb 2013 #343
You have totally missed the point Dash87 Feb 2013 #107
+1 Elegantly put Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #199
This message was self-deleted by its author Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #25
well, speaking for myself, Eve hfojvt Feb 2013 #36
Is every single post from men here going to be self centered? bettyellen Feb 2013 #39
I know hfojvt Feb 2013 #41
If you're not getting any its because this whiney piss poor attitude bettyellen Feb 2013 #42
"getting any". Bonobo Feb 2013 #45
Oh please, you're the one suggesting we owe men some sort of debt for bettyellen Feb 2013 #68
So the truth comes out Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #191
It is called accidentally revealing yourself. nt Bonobo Feb 2013 #198
bah hahahahah. you bad feminist, you have RUINED our society. now, where do we hear this talk? seabeyond Feb 2013 #222
You're not making any sense. bettyellen Feb 2013 #371
we could make this about you? hfojvt Feb 2013 #46
Why would I react as if this was about me? I'm not so self centered or paranoid. bettyellen Feb 2013 #73
I sincerely hope that you get some help to deal with these issues. WCLinolVir Feb 2013 #168
that's a very sexist comment datasuspect Feb 2013 #280
I was responding to a post bemoaning not getting any.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #284
Self-centered in the sense that we're telling you that the OP is wrong about us. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #48
Yes, is it, when the OP is about crticizing men. MicaelS Feb 2013 #65
Push back with sad stories about how random women weren't kind to you? Seriously? bettyellen Feb 2013 #167
i dunno. i am thinking a woman being raped would be at least level playing field with angst. seabeyond Feb 2013 #178
It's really odd that some guys feel these anecdotes mean anything. bettyellen Feb 2013 #183
That's what happens when you tell a person what they think... MellowDem Feb 2013 #115
The original post is a whine about Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #224
it is called common decency not gender specific. let go of the white knight and you are a step seabeyond Feb 2013 #231
Common decency went out the window Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #250
how easily SOME men can chuck oh, common decency, standing up for fellow man, ect... seabeyond Feb 2013 #255
So you're not in favor of common decency but harbor illusions bettyellen Feb 2013 #258
Ms Henslers' quote is a demand for chivalry. nt lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #405
I dont see it as... actslikeacarrot Feb 2013 #313
+1,000,000,000 Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #281
Why don't the men in this thread get this? gollygee Feb 2013 #40
Why don't the women on this thread get it? hfojvt Feb 2013 #43
it was the women that pushed and pushed to make prison rape jokes NOT acceptable on du, by men seabeyond Feb 2013 #49
Here, let me help YOU get this. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #52
I wouldn't be at all offended by that gollygee Feb 2013 #54
my reply. DAMN STRAIGHT AND YOU GOT IT. seabeyond Feb 2013 #55
Both you and gollygee don't understand "Bill's" point. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #56
i do not agree. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #57
I also disagree. nt gollygee Feb 2013 #59
Well then maybe it would be appropriate to ask Eve which kind of guys she's not yelling at. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #60
You're really overthinking this FightForMichigan Feb 2013 #200
But that's not what she said. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #297
She's over the passivity. Noun verb noun. bettyellen Feb 2013 #359
Not at all. I'm not stupid enough to mistake a critique on our culture bettyellen Feb 2013 #70
I disagree. n/t lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #72
+1 Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #74
+10000 noiretextatique Feb 2013 #80
I would say most men take it personally. Not some. redqueen Feb 2013 #119
I think most are too smart to take it personally but.., bettyellen Feb 2013 #125
Yeah, maybe the ones who don't take it personally are just more likely to keep their mouths shut. redqueen Feb 2013 #127
More than a few have an axe to grind because some random woman bettyellen Feb 2013 #130
Loss of entitlement does explain a lot of it. redqueen Feb 2013 #132
backlash. this is what this decade is all about. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #146
Equating irritation with obnoxious OP with Republican's movement against reproductive rights? Bonobo Feb 2013 #149
you interpret it so narrowly as " OP with Republican's movement against"? fine. seabeyond Feb 2013 #151
You said backlash. You said of the last decade. Bonobo Feb 2013 #152
i am certainly saying that we have men on the democratic board that have sexist/misogynist seabeyond Feb 2013 #154
Backlash is what the past 3 decades have been all about n/t Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #155
i think the 70'a and 80's. part of 90's were progressively moving forward. i think mid 90's seabeyond Feb 2013 #160
I don't know Seabeyond... Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #164
i do see a lot of change. hate and anger that was not there in the past. feelings of not needed, seabeyond Feb 2013 #180
I think the hatred and anger Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #192
we disagree. i think with independence and freedoms and choice, came the anger like we hadnt seen. seabeyond Feb 2013 #226
We agree on that... Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #241
I took "men" in the OP to mean "men who aren't speaking out," Dash87 Feb 2013 #109
That was the intent of the quote in the OP. However, some on this thread are taking it all the way.. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #221
yes... we have some men taking it to mean ALL men, regardless how many times people tell them seabeyond Feb 2013 #238
Ms Ensler is the only one able to explain what she meant. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #292
no. it was buzz clik that said it. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #306
"people" aren't in a position to "tell us otherwise". Only Ms Ensler. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #321
then correct buzz. he called out women saying SOME women were saying ALL men. that is wrong. SOME seabeyond Feb 2013 #322
No, the OP and Ms Ensler are the ones saying all (good) men. n/t lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #323
, some on this thread are taking it all the way..... to mean all men. seabeyond Feb 2013 #326
That's what the OP says. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #327
No, you're misinterpreting Ensler...if you were familiar with her work, you'd know that. bettyellen Feb 2013 #338
I'll never be familiar enough with *anyone* to substitute my own words for theirs. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #342
She clearly says she's over "the passivity" and not any or "all men" bettyellen Feb 2013 #348
Yes it could. On a more pragmatic level, imagine how much more productive this thread would have Hosnon Feb 2013 #372
It would still have been derailed by the whining over their poor relations bettyellen Feb 2013 #375
Yes, but think of how much popcorn they've sold. joeunderdog Feb 2013 #390
Comparison fail FightForMichigan Feb 2013 #187
Interestingly, some women on this thread are using the same argument. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #214
Then why aren't YOU driven to madness and action? lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #294
+1!!! Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #209
Your offense, maybe FightForMichigan Feb 2013 #265
Who thinks they speak for everyone? What a bizarre comment. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #336
Well said n/t Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #287
This thread is a testament to the quote being "rhetorically counterproductive". nt. Hosnon Feb 2013 #370
I am serious about this: consider the quality of the men with whom you associate. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #78
Why are you assuming this is about men with whom I associate? gollygee Feb 2013 #82
"or expect a cookie" Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #86
It feels like men are saying gollygee Feb 2013 #91
Associate with? Please, I have briefly socialized and worked with dozens of assholes who say and bettyellen Feb 2013 #84
In the context of the post to which I replied: Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #87
So "not giving you a cookie" = fuck off? LOL bettyellen Feb 2013 #89
Thank you for being predictable. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #90
"Even where problems do not exist" gollygee Feb 2013 #92
first he says it is so prevalent he would have little time to do anything else. now there is no seabeyond Feb 2013 #148
Yes, Buzz said he sees no sexism ever, then he does, now it's "no problem"... bettyellen Feb 2013 #172
ah, well we had a really stupid rape joke pass muster with jury just last night. seabeyond Feb 2013 #181
Pathetic dodge, even more predictable... bettyellen Feb 2013 #93
We finally hit the bottom line. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #97
In a million years you wouldn't have the nerve to demand bettyellen Feb 2013 #100
Out of the park, once again. redqueen Feb 2013 #120
There is soooo much WTF in this thread! bettyellen Feb 2013 #122
The coddling has gone on for a very, very long time. redqueen Feb 2013 #129
And there goes the sexist "coddling" statement again. Bonobo Feb 2013 #140
Boom. Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #134
Over 40 yrs., and the same approach. But the power & glory of righteousness... Eleanors38 Feb 2013 #452
Post removed Post removed Feb 2013 #207
That's a broad brush, but I agree that SOME are like that. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #216
Some... where? Do you mean feminists here in DU? nt redqueen Feb 2013 #279
Some here at DU. Some on this thread. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #337
"Feminists view all men as the enemy... the sooner some men grasp this the sooner the movement dies" redqueen Feb 2013 #276
Talk about the emperors new clothes! WCLinolVir Feb 2013 #228
you finally acknowledge you hear this shit all the fuckin time and if you bothered you would have seabeyond Feb 2013 #147
Somebody on this thread said it doesn't happen? Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #153
There seems to be an assumption that all men hear (or particpate in) rape jokes. Not true. DisgustipatedinCA Feb 2013 #81
Why when you hear the word "men" does it mean "all men" to you? gollygee Feb 2013 #83
Great post. About a week ago, I was having lunch with a group and one guy was saying how raccoon Feb 2013 #157
Thank YOU! smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #495
I stopped a rape. Bonobo Feb 2013 #44
no. you used war as an example of male "protective" to their death. rape used as a tool of war seabeyond Feb 2013 #51
Me too, and I've admonished bosses for racist remarks, but I would never bettyellen Feb 2013 #88
Betty, look again at the title of the OP. Bonobo Feb 2013 #98
Because its not about you? And it's not exclusively about rape or bettyellen Feb 2013 #105
Here's what I think. Bonobo Feb 2013 #106
Again Bo- lets make this ALL about your bruised ego. bettyellen Feb 2013 #128
Post removed Post removed Feb 2013 #225
because many men get it and know it is not at them personally. because when we were asked the same seabeyond Feb 2013 #150
SOME men protect women as much as they can. Some others are the ones women need to be protected FROM raccoon Feb 2013 #159
There is no useful purpose served by telling the members of the other gender what they think. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #47
Crime rates in general have gone down gollygee Feb 2013 #50
or, redefinition of rape allowed rates to go down and police force across the nation downgrading seabeyond Feb 2013 #53
Do you have any evidence that rape trends are not going down? lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #58
yes. i have showed documentation so fuckin may times. seabeyond Feb 2013 #63
You've misunderstood. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #67
No, you haven't. Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #99
bullshit. what a fuckin game you play, always. all it was were articles from newspapers across the seabeyond Feb 2013 #102
It's not a game. You're alleging that there is a widespread law enforcement conspiracy Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #104
yes, game. articles. that is all it was, articles. and you play games. here are links.... seabeyond Feb 2013 #108
From your first link: Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #112
Police departments go to great lengths to look good on the UCR, the FBI’...federal funding is determ seabeyond Feb 2013 #113
So your assertion is that the stats are manipulated *more than* they were 30 years ago. Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #135
"Adjusted crime rates" has to do with a change in data collection methodology Jackpine Radical Feb 2013 #61
Thank you! nt gollygee Feb 2013 #95
Which means that MORE rapes would be reported since 1993 under the "adjustment", not fewer. Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #101
Again, crime IN GENERAL has declined gollygee Feb 2013 #143
Absolutely. I believe it's part of that larger trend, too. Warren DeMontague Feb 2013 #286
That is correct. Jackpine Radical Feb 2013 #404
The table is posted without source notes & context. burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #264
. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #290
I think one can only speak to their own experiences Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #64
We must celebrate you or else you'll be a jackass? You know what that means? bettyellen Feb 2013 #76
He didn't say that. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #79
You are right Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #111
This just makes me ill gollygee Feb 2013 #156
lots of "tells" in this post, YET, we are suppose to be empathetic. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #161
lol Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #169
Society puts up the bad boy image, and that seems to be what the women fawn over. seabeyond Feb 2013 #186
huh? Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #211
Hell no Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #163
You see people get raped nightly but you don't do anything about it? gollygee Feb 2013 #166
Don't spend much time in bars I take it Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #171
"Getting in that woman's pants" and "raping" are two different things gollygee Feb 2013 #174
No point Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #179
You're point is some men look the other way because they're resentful that some women make foolish bettyellen Feb 2013 #210
hilarious Lurker Deluxe Feb 2013 #217
You want us to believe you were proxy posting for other men.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #266
"Sit down and shut up" is my default position on threads of this kind. Laelth Feb 2013 #253
This whole thread is full of stomach churning sufrommich Feb 2013 #332
interesting obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #158
and why aren't some women, especially in red states also not outraged. I say this because many of still_one Feb 2013 #103
For the same reason good women are passive nt MellowDem Feb 2013 #114
This message was self-deleted by its author seabeyond Feb 2013 #116
Yeah, it's all women's fault, LOL bettyellen Feb 2013 #131
Who said that? Unless you think the OP is saying it's all men's fault... nt MellowDem Feb 2013 #218
The enormity of the issue of rape is simply not on most men's radar. redqueen Feb 2013 #133
This thread is a paradox ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #137
Look at #20 and the response I got. Bonobo Feb 2013 #139
You nailed it in #203 ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #240
It's hard to think of a better way to alienate people that are already allies. nt Bonobo Feb 2013 #242
The good news is, I still believe it to be a small minority ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #244
allies? like starting a thread about not being able to call your daughter baby? seabeyond Feb 2013 #260
NOWHERE in that OP do I say she was a feminist. Bonobo Feb 2013 #270
thru out the thread, without a challenge of wrong, to be heard. seabeyond Feb 2013 #272
Like I said,I did NOT call out feminists and I don't see why you make it about you. Bonobo Feb 2013 #278
You are being dishonest, sea ProudToBeBlueInRhody Feb 2013 #300
Yes it is indeed Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #256
This message was self-deleted by its author Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #142
There is no benefit to meaningfully engage or commit in any way to a female galileoreloaded Feb 2013 #162
You want no engagement or commitment unless the person is dependent on you? bettyellen Feb 2013 #175
lol. it seems like you are projecting some frustration. galileoreloaded Feb 2013 #188
You said engagement and commitment aren't worth it if the woman is not depending on the man. bettyellen Feb 2013 #236
I am finding it to be that committment only comes when they are dependent on you Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #220
yes some men are saying this, but does not make a lick of sense. if men have checked out, then why seabeyond Feb 2013 #176
whoa! I just said it isn't in a mans best interest to marry. galileoreloaded Feb 2013 #195
LOL, it doesn't matter. Bonobo Feb 2013 #203
The "all men" canard.... Ridiculous. bettyellen Feb 2013 #340
no. that is not all that you said. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #246
I don't give a damn if you "commit to a female" or not. burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #239
No offense, but I hope you never have children. WCLinolVir Feb 2013 #267
hey... leave my almost 18 yr old son alone, lol seabeyond Feb 2013 #271
None taken. 2 very smart and aware sons. galileoreloaded Feb 2013 #392
As a passive male Harmony Blue Feb 2013 #170
nah, that crazy talk cant reinforce the double standard dont ya know. galileoreloaded Feb 2013 #201
I was the same way Harmony Blue Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #205
We are all around you. RC Feb 2013 #259
i am sorry you are not appreciated. sucky feeling i am sure. nt seabeyond Feb 2013 #263
Again. All the conduct you have referred to burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #273
And that isn't just a man thing. polly7 Feb 2013 #308
You get it. RC Feb 2013 #325
Thank You, Thank You, Thank You! Sissyk Feb 2013 #360
"You do not see our actions as expressions of Love" lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #324
Precisely what is wrong with too many RC Feb 2013 #331
Here's one woman who goes by the ACTIONS not the words. I'm sure there are plenty others. nt raccoon Feb 2013 #350
k&DUrec n/t JTFrog Feb 2013 #268
I know good men FightForMichigan Feb 2013 #277
+1. The problem with generalizations like this OP is that only one counterexample proves them wrong. Nye Bevan Feb 2013 #285
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Gormy Cuss Feb 2013 #381
such a very right on, respectful and hopeful post. thank you. seabeyond Feb 2013 #289
With all due respect... lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #295
I really don't think so. FightForMichigan Feb 2013 #298
This is just the post the thread needed burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #299
i even think you can address a wrong without being judgmental. seabeyond Feb 2013 #310
I'm not sure. burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #318
but you are judging the act.... and that does incur the penalty or repercussion. my point is.... seabeyond Feb 2013 #320
Very,very well said. nt sufrommich Feb 2013 #334
+1000 Sissyk Feb 2013 #362
That woman should spend some time on DU, where there are PLENTY of good men Nye Bevan Feb 2013 #283
So long as she avoids any discussions of the most common type of rape. redqueen Feb 2013 #302
Be careful what you wish for, Eve ChairmanAgnostic Feb 2013 #301
Again, the conversation goes back to personal relationships burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #319
Thank you. nt redqueen Feb 2013 #328
but she demanded a more emotional response from men ChairmanAgnostic Feb 2013 #344
It's not just within the context of personal relationships... bettyellen Feb 2013 #351
Bringing an "emotional response" to burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #368
i have 50 shades of questions, ChairmanAgnostic Feb 2013 #386
secretly thrive ... acts within 50 Shades, including stuff that appears to be without consent. RAPE seabeyond Feb 2013 #387
Oh FFS. redqueen Feb 2013 #389
menz are so confused with rape. some girls, at some time, have said no and they really wanted it seabeyond Feb 2013 #391
It's so difficult... Agschmid Feb 2013 #394
Yeah... "mixed signals"... consent is so haaaard to understand... redqueen Feb 2013 #400
Alerted on... Agschmid Feb 2013 #393
it is fuckin' in meta. fuckin' sick shit. sorry. this gets me shaking when we have someone seabeyond Feb 2013 #395
Whether they say it aloud or not the real problem is... Agschmid Feb 2013 #396
"if people on DU think it... imagine the rest of the world." redqueen Feb 2013 #397
Regardless of what a woman purchases for her pleasure, it's never appropriate to assume msanthrope Feb 2013 #401
Humans have the gift of speech which can be used MadrasT Feb 2013 #403
So you haven't read the book and you aren't sure what it actually says yardwork Feb 2013 #409
wow. fishwax Feb 2013 #443
Perhaps they are not "thriving" on the crimes depicted in the book. burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #445
the line is clear: consent BainsBane Feb 2013 #399
Post removed Post removed Feb 2013 #406
I'm thoroughly entertained burnsei sensei Feb 2013 #446
Your misentertained BainsBane Feb 2013 #448
K&R Solly Mack Feb 2013 #304
a thought provoking quote. actslikeacarrot Feb 2013 #312
honest. true. and recognized. my boys and i have had many conversations seabeyond Feb 2013 #317
Respectful question for the women standing behind the quote in the OP... Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #353
Because we're supposed to take it for granted self identifying liberals support us? bettyellen Feb 2013 #356
So your answer is no? Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #357
Because they misread the OP saying she's over men and not the passivity. bettyellen Feb 2013 #358
Thanks, I think you answered my question. n/t Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #361
You're welcome! I think both responses were valid.... bettyellen Feb 2013 #363
Blah blah, so tiresome from women like these. Shallow drivel LittleBlue Feb 2013 #364
And men like these... redqueen Feb 2013 #385
And men like those! LittleBlue Feb 2013 #388
That Delphinus Feb 2013 #407
THAT.... Benton D Struckcheon Feb 2013 #408
And sitting on a fence hurts the crotch! Middle of the road has dead skunks!!! bettyellen Feb 2013 #420
Post removed Post removed Feb 2013 #429
Something's wrong when pol's worry only about losing women's votes DirkGently Feb 2013 #426
what an excellent post, and all in the thinking about it. can i be an ally. support your voice seabeyond Feb 2013 #427
Thank you for getting it bettyellen Feb 2013 #432
Great post! YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #470
Sorry I haven't responded to this yet, but chemos been kicking my ass. Evoman Feb 2013 #475
well said! bettyellen Feb 2013 #484
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