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stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
43. I disagree completely. This is a debate I have had a few times with people.
Wed Sep 18, 2013, 11:44 AM
Sep 2013

Particularly when I bring up the topic of the hypothetical, as yet not-created (but from what I understand is under attempted development) artificial placenta.

Consider that if you could take a fetus as young as one month out of a woman's body and place it into this artificial placenta and it could be successfully brought to term, should a woman still have a right to abort the fetus instead?

There are competing rights here that become more clear when you consider an artificial placenta. As long as the fetus is completely dependent on a woman to live, giving her no choice but carry or terminate, the woman's rights to carry or terminate completely trumps those of the fetus or the father. That doesn't mean the fetus or father have no rights, it just means hers are overwhelmingly superior in that situation.

If you could take the fetus out of the woman's body at one month and put it into this hypothetical artificial placenta and it could be brought to term, that changes the dynamic of those rights. Similarly, once a fetus is viable, that also changes the dynamic of those rights, albeit differently.

The question I encourage you to ask is, exactly what rights are we talking about? To my way of thinking, in what we are talking about, the rights in question are:

Woman:
1. Control over her body
2. Right to decide whether to reproduce or not to reproduce

Fetus
1. Right to exist and continue to live

Father:
1. Right to decide whether to reproduce or not to reproduce.

I am concerned about a woman having control over her body and her rights whether or not to reproduce. As long as a fetus is nothing more than a parasite, the woman's rights, particularly control over her body, are clearly supreme. If the fetus is viable, it now has rights similar in importance to her rights in question. If you could take the fetus out of the woman's body as early as one month, not only would it then have important rights equal to hers but the fathers right to reproduce or not to reproduce also starts to approach hers in importance.

At viability, even with machinery the rights of the fetus to exist and the rights of the father start coming into play IMHO.

it's the woman's decision Skittles Sep 2013 #1
YES INDEED bettyellen Sep 2013 #4
Only the woman can make this decision newfie11 Sep 2013 #11
Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #25
Of course it's okay for the woman to do just that. Sheldon Cooper Sep 2013 #26
Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2013 #28
She didn't tell you how to feel. smokey nj Sep 2013 #33
You'll no doubt be astonished to learn that I am in fact a woman. Sheldon Cooper Sep 2013 #34
No, that's not the end of the story. The OP also asks whether society pnwmom Sep 2013 #36
Correct Ohio Joe Sep 2013 #50
agreed 100% steve2470 Sep 2013 #72
Four words...HER CHOICE....NOT MINE. shraby Sep 2013 #2
easy bettyellen Sep 2013 #3
It's the woman's choice. Lugnut Sep 2013 #5
I agree. I am 100% pro choice. n/t RebelOne Sep 2013 #55
Interesting questions. Summer Hathaway Sep 2013 #6
What "government class" would that be? Taught by "the government" or about how government works? Hekate Sep 2013 #7
Me too. djean111 Sep 2013 #9
no sh** Skittles Sep 2013 #12
Perhaps I'm not paranoid enough to know what you're asking... Gov101 Sep 2013 #38
I hope you check back for the answers you've provoked. It's not "paranoia": we get trolls Hekate Sep 2013 #45
Answers: petronius Sep 2013 #8
If your're not the one who is pregnant, SheilaT Sep 2013 #10
love your response blueamy66 Sep 2013 #17
I'm not getting it. Mushroom Sep 2013 #13
How complete strangers deal with unwanted pregnancies is none of my concern. Frankly, smokey nj Sep 2013 #14
If this is for a class assignment deutsey Sep 2013 #15
A, B and C blueamy66 Sep 2013 #16
I read your profile and journal, and I wanted to say I am sorry LiberalLoner Sep 2013 #18
I can think of some big limitations for A Nevernose Sep 2013 #19
If the state can prevent a woman from determining what to do (or not to do) with her pregnancy Proud Liberal Dem Sep 2013 #20
+1 and because social pressures exist to push women away from LiberalLoner Sep 2013 #22
Right Proud Liberal Dem Sep 2013 #24
+1! LiberalLoner Sep 2013 #41
Once the child is born she has rights too me b zola Sep 2013 #48
I agree with this, certainly! I was the product of an affair outside the marriage and LiberalLoner Sep 2013 #51
. LWolf Sep 2013 #21
The individual woman decides. That's it. MineralMan Sep 2013 #23
First, you gather the men folk all together ... JoePhilly Sep 2013 #27
As a woman myself... one who has had unintended pregnancies..... ejpoeta Sep 2013 #29
I agree with that. Woman's choice and only woman's choice until viability. (Edited to answer quests) stevenleser Sep 2013 #31
I think you should consider carefully the enlightenment Sep 2013 #39
I disagree completely. This is a debate I have had a few times with people. stevenleser Sep 2013 #43
You're right. We disagree. enlightenment Sep 2013 #46
Yes, we disagree. I don't think the appeals courts will agree with your interpretations. stevenleser Sep 2013 #47
Good thing I never said they would. enlightenment Sep 2013 #58
I agree to a point LostOne4Ever Sep 2013 #57
It would be very interesting to see what would happen regarding you last point which is right on. stevenleser Sep 2013 #60
Steven, the artificial placenta takes us to an interesting excursion into bioethics... Hekate Sep 2013 #64
At work so I will have to read this later to give it the attention it deserves... nt stevenleser Sep 2013 #66
You're the only one here besides me who answered the second question. pnwmom Sep 2013 #42
Yep, a few more after us did since then... stevenleser Sep 2013 #44
Question, do you know of any doctors who perform abortions on viable fetuses... Hippo_Tron Sep 2013 #75
I am not saying it happens. I am saying that until the fetus can survive outside the womb, ejpoeta Sep 2013 #86
None, no, no Major Nikon Sep 2013 #30
It's a woman's choice. That's all. Autumn Sep 2013 #32
Answers: JaneyVee Sep 2013 #35
Woman's choice, between her and doctor. Lars39 Sep 2013 #37
I find the term "reproductive politics" REPULSIVE, not stale. Avalux Sep 2013 #40
Three answers. lapislzi Sep 2013 #49
^ ^ Agree with this ^ ^ but would add: Arugula Latte Sep 2013 #52
P.S.: Men who oppose a woman's right to abortion can simply go fuck themselves. Arugula Latte Sep 2013 #53
What you said, x 2 lapislzi Sep 2013 #54
Three related questions LostOne4Ever Sep 2013 #56
100% the woman's decision. Blue_In_AK Sep 2013 #59
Wow--I haven't seen a double post since DU2!!! MADem Sep 2013 #61
Not your uterus? Not your business. MADem Sep 2013 #62
I believe there should be ZERO restrictions on abortion. None. Nada. PeaceNikki Sep 2013 #63
Blackmun got it right. lumberjack_jeff Sep 2013 #65
Morality? Raffi Ella Sep 2013 #67
Frankly, none of that is relevant. Gov101 Sep 2013 #68
And you're their teacher and allowed the morality question, got it. Raffi Ella Sep 2013 #70
Funny how your comments are replete with moral assumptions. I assume you realize this? Gov101 Sep 2013 #80
lol. Raffi Ella Sep 2013 #82
On both boards I responded to accusations that the questions were biased, for opposite reasons. Gov101 Sep 2013 #83
^^^^^^^^^^!!!!!!! Precisely Sep 2013 #69
Thanks for the support~ Raffi Ella Sep 2013 #77
So well put Precisely Sep 2013 #79
It's the woman's private decision and not for anyone to limit or to judge. n/t cynatnite Sep 2013 #71
WOW...since we tried to have a conversation with you in previous posts of yours and... Tikki Sep 2013 #73
Thanks for letting us know that Hekate Sep 2013 #84
none, yes, and no elehhhhna Sep 2013 #74
When said woman will be expelled from her Christian college if she gets pregnant. Been there done jwirr Sep 2013 #76
happy that students are seriously discussing this handmade34 Sep 2013 #78
As long as I'm not paying for anything, its not my business marshall Sep 2013 #81
Bodily Autonomy Lancero Sep 2013 #85
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