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Raine1967

(11,614 posts)
87. Blue_In_AK I wrote this on Friday: (I've no first-hand recollection of the assassination/ambivalent)
Sun Nov 24, 2013, 03:05 PM
Nov 2013

(And I want to preface this that with these words, I mean no disrespect at all to anyone who believes standard line or believes other theories. It was not shared on DU, but rather on my blog. I am ambivalent. It's not that I don't care.

I think this is one of the most thoughtful polls I have seen on DU. As someone who loves history, social and political movements, I care abut this issue -- so having said that, I would like to share what I wrote here.)

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Living in a Post JFK World

A President was murdered 50 years ago today. I wasn't born yet. I grew up hearing great stories about this man President John F. Kennedy. I grew up around schools, libraries, and airports named after a much beloved President that had been killed one afternoon in Dallas Texas. I was taught about Camelot. I grew up seeing plates of Mr. Kennedy next to his wife. I grew up seeing things like this:




Images of President Kennedy were everywhere. He was the man who put us on the moon. He was exotic because he was Catholic. Everyone loved this man, I was told.

Yet, There was something else. I also grew up hearing about plots to kill the president; conspiracies were mentioned in hushed tones by the adults in my life. Words like communist, the Soviets, Castro, mafia, Hoover were mentioned in a way that I knew these were things not to be talked about. This was grown-up conversation, and it was private. Talk of what happened to the president was not encouraged. He had been assassinated, and what we may have heard as children was not to be discussed outside the home, if even that. We were children, we didn't need to know. It happened before I and my siblings were born. I have always lived in a post-JFK world. It was inferred that it was disrespectful to speak ill of a dead president. Still, the adults whispered about it. They whispered of affairs and Marilyn Monroe. They whispered because if they said it aloud, people might laugh at them... think that they were crazy. They whispered because it was considered too out there, too fringe.

As I grew up, these conspiracy theories became mainstream. With the onslaught of 24/7 news channels and my ability to go out in the world and read, I learned that the things I heard whispered quietly as a child had somehow became okay to discuss publicly, even the stranger theories about this man's murder, and subsequently, the murder of his brother, Robert. I've read the theories. Here on this blog there is ongoing debate. To me, he was a president that was killed before I was born. I have always lived in a post-JFK world. I never really identified with the red scare or the iron curtain. It was before my time. And, to be honest, I can say that I don't identify with those who were alive when President Kennedy was assassinated. Believing the Warren Commission or not is just not a priority for me. He was killed and the psyche of our nation was forever changed, so the historians say. I believe that, I saw it change again September of 2001. A new generation would now question: was it Mihop or Lihop?

I have always lived in a world where there are conspiracies everywhere. Perhaps it's because I live in a post-JFK world. What does it matter what I believe? Would it change anything? 50 years people have been claiming to know what happened, and 50 years things that were once considered fringe have now became the norm, Are we a better nation for it? Personally, I say no. Personally, I think my generation has suffered for it. This is what happens when the fringe is allowed to become normal.

A half-century later, few people are laughing. After Kennedy’s death in Dallas, the notion of conspiracy moved permanently into the political mainstream. The assassination and its unknown motive became a benchmark conundrum for anyone with even a faint interest in public life. Americans of all stripes found it difficult to accept that such a monumental tragedy could be the random act of one man. Theories, ranging from the Warren Commission’s Report’s official finding that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone to speculation about additional shooters and Oswald being connected to the Mafia, CIA or other shadowy operatives, became part of American life.

The mainstreaming of conspiracy changed the political process in the U.S. by suggesting that candidates might win elections by running against government. The rhetoric of the Tea Party and the recent congressional attempts to bring down the administration of President Barack Obama at all costs are the legacy of JFK’s assassination.


Perhaps this is the remnant of a cold war paranoia that still lingers in our society today. Perhaps we are all crazy ourselves, and in our collective search for our truth, we have prevented ourselves from really seeing. That makes us suffer as a nation.

In the mean time, 50 years ago today, we had a great man taken away from the nation, his family and the world. Everyone I know that was alive and of a certain age can tell you exactly where they were when they learned of his tragic fate. One can only hypothesize what would have happened had he not been gunned down in Dallas on November 22, 1963. 50 years later, people are still doing just that.

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I honestly don't know what to believe. There are so many stories out there that it's hard to make sense.

Once again, thank you for this poll, I'm glad it was bumped and that I didn't miss it.

Raine

(edited to change my post title)
Remember, we were alive -- even as kids -- to see the subsequent assassinations villager Nov 2013 #1
Yes. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #2
+1, and amen! villager Nov 2013 #3
Awesome post. I'd rather reply to it here, than in the other thread. scarletwoman Nov 2013 #8
...we'll never know the truth now..... RobertEarl Nov 2013 #25
Indeed. We needed a fair and open trial for Oswald. scarletwoman Nov 2013 #28
I've never for one moment believed Oswald acted alone spiderpig Nov 2013 #31
Touche! Carolina Nov 2013 #69
Bingo! spiderpig Nov 2013 #85
Once is happenstance, twice is coincidence but three times is enemy action Mr Bond -Auric Goldfinger Fumesucker Nov 2013 #6
Ha, my favorite Bond film. :) Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #7
"No Mr. Bond - I expect you to die" spiderpig Nov 2013 #32
And we were also alive to ohheckyeah Nov 2013 #33
I suspect that a majority of people who aren't old enough to remember... Spider Jerusalem Nov 2013 #4
They don't seem to be weighing in much, though. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #5
surprising that there are so few young people responding hfojvt Nov 2013 #9
That's why I separated the "older folk" into two categories, Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #11
I was pre-school but I still remember hearing about Kennedy's assassination Art_from_Ark Nov 2013 #64
It's not exactly relevant to us, is my stand Scootaloo Nov 2013 #78
Yeah that category treestar Nov 2013 #96
It isn't "dubious." It is FACT. duffyduff Nov 2013 #19
I also knew it was total crap before the Oliver Stone movie. GoneFishin Nov 2013 #34
Exactly. Most people who were around then who were old enough are dead. duffyduff Nov 2013 #18
I cannot imagine anyone 9 yrs old that day Awknid Nov 2013 #83
No. The public has viewed it through a lens of conspiracy for precisely 50 years and one day. nt DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2013 #51
Whether Stone made the film or not, the public discourse has not been presented but authentically ancianita Nov 2013 #99
Greatest Page for you, my dear Blue, and your important poll! CaliforniaPeggy Nov 2013 #10
I was only 7 years old when Ruby murdered Oswald live on tv. I saw it, and that is why . . . Major Hogwash Nov 2013 #12
I was a bit older than you, almost nine years old. duffyduff Nov 2013 #17
My family never talked about politics. Major Hogwash Nov 2013 #26
My parents argued all the time about politics, mostly because my dad wanted to duffyduff Nov 2013 #36
Amen oswaldactedalone Nov 2013 #59
RELEASE ALL THE EVIDENCE! citizenbfk Nov 2013 #13
This week brought a new convert to the Conspiracy Theory fold. TalkingDog Nov 2013 #14
Mel and Norma Gabler did it. I knew it. n/t duffyduff Nov 2013 #16
A little levity. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #21
Not true. I was around then. I don't believe any conspiracy at all. duffyduff Nov 2013 #15
I think DU is very representative Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #20
DU is very representative, and some people feel better when they invent their facts. nt Ace Acme Nov 2013 #22
I don't see it as inventing facts. Curmudgeoness Nov 2013 #27
My father said that Edgar hoover had JFK killed Rosa Luxemburg Nov 2013 #23
Interesting theory. NaturalHigh Nov 2013 #24
I was 20 living in south Texas at the time zeemike Nov 2013 #29
Great Poll, Blue !!! - K & R !!! WillyT Nov 2013 #30
Kick, I'd like to see more young votes! Agschmid Nov 2013 #35
Added my youngish vote. ScreamingMeemie Nov 2013 #37
Thanks! Agschmid Nov 2013 #40
Yes, please, more young people Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #38
For me it is. Agschmid Nov 2013 #39
Which I might agree with except for all the weirdness in Oswald's background Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #41
Exactly. For a 24 year old, he sure had a alsame Nov 2013 #42
I think people tend to forget just how young he was. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #43
I do see some issues with that... Agschmid Nov 2013 #44
Jack Ruby was tied to the mob. The thinking is that he was hired to kill Oswald. Awknid Nov 2013 #86
As someone who was born almost 20 years after JFK's tragic and untimely death RFKHumphreyObama Nov 2013 #45
Giving this a kick before I shut down the ol' laptop. scarletwoman Nov 2013 #46
You're probably right about that. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #47
Yes, they are. scarletwoman Nov 2013 #48
I'm logged in, but can't vote. (why?) I think Oswald was a patsy..... n/t AnotherDreamWeaver Nov 2013 #49
And if I may ask your age group? Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #50
63 and older... (I don't know why I can't vote, and I can't recommend either.) AnotherDreamWeaver Nov 2013 #54
How about: I'm 62 and was there in Dallas and still don't know. El Supremo Nov 2013 #52
You may be right BainsBane Nov 2013 #53
I think the American public has a fascination with murders and crime. ScreamingMeemie Nov 2013 #56
Because it is personal. I was a small boy, that was the day I learned this fact: Dads can die. Bluenorthwest Nov 2013 #70
Great post! Yes, for those of us who were old enough to be aware of the JFK assassination scarletwoman Nov 2013 #71
The subsequent assassinations proved only that the right wing is the violent wing, Benton D Struckcheon Nov 2013 #55
That makes sense. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #57
Hypothesis Android3.14 Nov 2013 #58
Word Nazi? Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #60
Nope. I just love language Android3.14 Nov 2013 #62
Wow, the DU has really been a huge disappointment on this. n-t Logical Nov 2013 #61
How so? Are you really surprised? scarletwoman Nov 2013 #67
I'm actually a little surprised. DanTex Nov 2013 #72
It's not about being "better informed" - DUers are plenty well-informed. scarletwoman Nov 2013 #74
They are clearly not well-informed about the JFK assassination. DanTex Nov 2013 #75
It is what it is. There have been dozens (hundreds?) of posts by DUers over the past week explaining scarletwoman Nov 2013 #79
There is scientifically sound evidence that has been confirmed and reconfirmed many times BootinUp Nov 2013 #76
So, did you vote in the poll? scarletwoman Nov 2013 #81
No I didn't. for the record BootinUp Nov 2013 #82
I.e., given enough time, secrecy & propaganda work? snot Nov 2013 #63
Sunday morning kick - anybody up and online? scarletwoman Nov 2013 #65
Age 56 and not certain; therefore, ambivalent Martin Eden Nov 2013 #66
That makes sense. I think it's an honest choice. (nt) scarletwoman Nov 2013 #68
I agree that makes sense. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #77
oct posted this great link questionseverything Nov 2013 #89
I became convinced of a conspiracy in '68, when they killed ML King & R Kennedy, CrispyQ Nov 2013 #73
I don't have a "theory". And the ballistics studies shown on this blog.... northoftheborder Nov 2013 #80
..... questionseverything Nov 2013 #91
from that link questionseverything Nov 2013 #92
Interesting age breakdown, eh? scarletwoman Nov 2013 #84
Blue_In_AK I wrote this on Friday: (I've no first-hand recollection of the assassination/ambivalent) Raine1967 Nov 2013 #87
Did Jackie Kennedy or Robert Kennedy or any other member IcyPeas Nov 2013 #88
Here is an interesting article from the Boston Globe on Bobby ScreamingMeemie Nov 2013 #93
Jackie.... northoftheborder Nov 2013 #94
I was 15 and in high school 50 years ago. SheilaT Nov 2013 #90
How many of them call themselves a patsy? zeemike Nov 2013 #95
Evening kick. scarletwoman Nov 2013 #97
I'm surprised by that, too. Blue_In_AK Nov 2013 #98
It doesn't surprise me at all BainsBane Nov 2013 #100
By the end of the decade.... ReRe Nov 2013 #101
Overall DU results are similar to national polls: alsame Nov 2013 #102
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