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davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
60. Hmm
Tue May 27, 2014, 05:54 PM
May 2014

I used to frequent a forum where the gender war was huge. There were no real moderators, there were no true rules or regulations - which is ultimately why it was shut down, but it exposed a raw, dark side of humanity that most rarely have the chance to see. In the relative anonymity of the internet, people were more or less unafraid to say how they really felt or what they really thought, even when it was extremely disturbing.

I am familiar with what MRA is referring to - but what is PUA?

In any event, most men who went through puberty without having sex (the vast, overwhelming majority of us) probably (at some point) felt something similar to what this shooter felt. Not nearly at the same level in regards to rage, narcissism, and self pity - but some level of resentment towards those we found desirable who perhaps did not find us so. I can't really (no man I have ever known could) put it into words in a way that makes sense, that does not sound despicable, twisted, or somehow very disgusting. So I won't really try.

Were it not for the standards and expectations of society - and the fear of imprisonment, young men in puberty would be walking around humping rocks, trees, doors - anything available. It is a desire, an urge that most simply do not understand, because our society (particularly in conservative christian communities) tends to be very hush hush about sex and certain urges. It tends to keep it hidden in the closet, so to speak. Oh yes, we have media, porn, movies and television and magazines galore... but the human to human element tends to be rather lacking, if that makes any sense. I don't mean that kids in puberty should be running around having sex (though this happens plenty) but that in an enlightened society, they would understand it much better.

A whole lot of the problems with our society (IMO) result from the fact that we are not more open about sexuality. Then of course, there's also the guilt inspired by religion which creates all kinds of other issues.

None of this though, could ever begin to excuse the crimes this man committed. When we look at the oppression of women from a historical - and even often a modern point of view, it is at times rather shocking that any of them at all want anything at all to do with men. This Isla Vista shooter is a rather ugly example of why. The danger, the perversion, the twisted mind that somehow felt as if he were entitled to things he did not earn or deserve. It wasn't about having a girlfriend, it was about "Woe is me, they do not see my greatness as I do! They do see me as the supreme being of the universe as I do! Well then, I'll just have to prove myself superior in a blaze of glory!"

This was an arrogant, self pitying coward who was well on his way towards solipsism. I do not mourn his loss, but I do grieve for the families of those he killed.

I don't know what the solution is to men like these - or even if there is one. I will say though... that I feel that Christianity is largely at fault for the way it views sex and paints women as objects, suggests to men that they are "superior", or, "masterful". Often I feel that the bible is not the work of some supreme being, or divinely inspired human being - but the fantasy writings of the most severe misogynists in history. A whole lot of historical and religious texts are very similar.

Plentyoffish (pof.com) works for a LOT of people. factsarenotfair May 2014 #1
That's were I found my fiance /nt Drale May 2014 #126
Nice! Congratulations! factsarenotfair May 2014 #135
Right you are shenmue May 2014 #2
I don't get how they think we are going to give them sex upaloopa May 2014 #3
The one that's always mystified me... winter is coming May 2014 #97
"they can't see that there is more to the definition of beauty than a pretty face and a nice body" redqueen May 2014 #4
I remember vividly the first time my daughter told me she needed a new dress NickB79 May 2014 #12
Good luck. You'll need it. redqueen May 2014 #14
Thank you! nt NickB79 May 2014 #20
I think it happens long before puberty now. YarnAddict May 2014 #27
Sadly, you are right redqueen May 2014 #58
I only had sons YarnAddict May 2014 #59
Sexual harassment starts in grade school as well. redqueen May 2014 #63
As much as I would have loved going prom dress shopping YarnAddict May 2014 #65
Probably didn't help that his Father had a hobby of taking nudie pics n2doc May 2014 #13
Indeed it wouldn't. redqueen May 2014 #16
Absolutely right. Which is why we have four year olds worried about "getting fat" as if the Number23 May 2014 #98
It truly is. I also find it sickening that the very concept is mocked and ridiculed redqueen May 2014 #106
You're not wrong. dawg May 2014 #5
I'm also not convinced he meets the legal definition of insanity. MohRokTah May 2014 #6
Yes, but committing mass murder is not exactly an indicator of stability... immoderate May 2014 #30
You can't know that. One report says he was hearing voices. Depending on what he was hearing, pnwmom May 2014 #43
That was based on anonymous source to radar online. LisaL May 2014 #56
That's your opinion. But what is fact is that he was being prescribed an anti-psychotic, pnwmom May 2014 #62
That medication has multiple uses, which you know full well. LisaL May 2014 #75
As you know, he was never actually diagnosed pnwmom May 2014 #89
Actually, that same radar online has some of the divorce documents. LisaL May 2014 #90
Men and women regret different things. Laelth May 2014 #7
"The researchers posit that these differences are evolutionary". Posit=assume as a fact uppityperson May 2014 #25
Part of the problem is that YarnAddict May 2014 #8
Yes that is exactly it. He never wrote about approaching a woman and actually being turned down and seaglass May 2014 #29
My son and I both read the manifesto YarnAddict May 2014 #33
The manifesto reminded me of woolldog May 2014 #102
I think that the verb "get" was part of the shooter's problem. Orsino May 2014 #9
I've not watched the video, but getting a girlfriend isn't as easy for some people... Silent3 May 2014 #10
Not necessarily. He may well have, probably did, turn anyone off immediately. Schema Thing May 2014 #11
Exactly what I was going to say. It would be quite easy to repel everyone you meet stevenleser May 2014 #18
He assumed every woman he saw was fucking the man next to her- and that POV shows bettyellen May 2014 #23
"This Roger guy emits warning signals like a rotating radar antenna": MineralMan Hekate May 2014 #46
Mental illness, a gun and easy targets. Rex May 2014 #15
do NOT frickin' apologize for venting. hopemountain May 2014 #17
Based on his so-called manifesto deutsey May 2014 #19
He didn't want a girlfriend. Brickbat May 2014 #21
I read a lot of his manifesto LordGlenconner May 2014 #22
Got some bad news for ya, buddy Proud Public Servant May 2014 #24
"The problem is men, period" AgingAmerican May 2014 #28
Oh so very, incredibly well said. redqueen May 2014 #31
True. But a strong daughter will be better able to handle the shit that gets thrown at her. pnwmom May 2014 #45
Great post. Squinch May 2014 #48
well, I can see where your daughter gets her brilliance from! renate May 2014 #125
Thank you (and squinch and redqueen above you) for your kind words (NT) Proud Public Servant May 2014 #131
"To imagine that you can fix the problem by raising the "right" kind of daughter . . ." Lex May 2014 #133
I love you. libnnc May 2014 #138
I don't think so. herding cats May 2014 #26
A woman couldn't expect men to simply come up to her because she's there treestar May 2014 #66
He wasn't exactly what I would call an approachable person in the first place herding cats May 2014 #80
I'm not so sure. I understand and agree with your point, but The Velveteen Ocelot May 2014 #32
yes, failing to attract people is a vicious cycle paulkienitz May 2014 #38
But those guys don't go out and shoot people. The Velveteen Ocelot May 2014 #42
A lot of women also never find success in love Tsiyu May 2014 #72
I think you'll find that group is like 80% men paulkienitz May 2014 #108
I think your figure is 80% in mens' heads and not reality Tsiyu May 2014 #136
I've also been taking my first look at PUA/MRA/MGTOW "red pill" ideas paulkienitz May 2014 #34
You might find this of "interest". stone space May 2014 #49
can vent but thats a bunch of BS PatrynXX May 2014 #35
Vent? Half-Century Man May 2014 #36
he could not 'get' a girlfriend because he could not be a boyfriend nt geek tragedy May 2014 #37
What I found disgusting... Helen Borg May 2014 #39
He wanted the beautiful blonde girlfriend as validation The Velveteen Ocelot May 2014 #41
We'll have to wait for an Apple Computer Robot Sex Partner for that. hunter May 2014 #67
Don't be sorry smallcat88 May 2014 #40
Good post. I think you captured what a lot of us are thinking. (nt) Paladin May 2014 #44
You are a gem nt Hekate May 2014 #47
Absolutely true. Feminists argue that he hated women. JDPriestly May 2014 #50
No, he thought there were many gorgeous girls at school, and was unable to meet anyone on his own. bettyellen May 2014 #81
Meanwhile in Nigeria... Common Sense Party May 2014 #51
So true. I've hardly heard anything about the girls since this happened. Louisiana1976 May 2014 #70
If you were actually interested, you'd know they are still in the news. redqueen May 2014 #76
Sigh. I am actually interested, which is why I brought it up. If you would check, you Common Sense Party May 2014 #84
It is a red herring. The nature of the media hasn't suddenly changed. redqueen May 2014 #88
don't derail, it is insulting. start a thread about it yourself! bettyellen May 2014 #85
Insulting to whom? Common Sense Party May 2014 #86
You are engaging in "whataboutery" Maedhros May 2014 #132
Concern troll is concerned. NuclearDem May 2014 #109
And you have a wonderful day as well. Common Sense Party May 2014 #134
I don't know Aladeen2016 May 2014 #52
/\/\/\/\ yes/\/\/\/\ dembotoz May 2014 #69
Precisely.. we have all been rebuffed by the cheerleader/beauty queen types. DCBob May 2014 #53
He wasn't rebuffed per se. LisaL May 2014 #55
For sure this guy was a psycho and a special case.. DCBob May 2014 #61
But he didn't even try to approach these women. LisaL May 2014 #64
I think he might have but in a weird sort of a way.. DCBob May 2014 #71
If you believe his manifesto, he wasn't doing any of that. LisaL May 2014 #74
I didnt read it but I saw some exerpts. DCBob May 2014 #78
I very much doubt it. LisaL May 2014 #54
^^ This. He gives off a lot of "creepy, probably dangerous" vibes. winter is coming May 2014 #96
I read his manifesto Nevernose May 2014 #57
Hmm davidthegnome May 2014 #60
This is sincerely depressing. redqueen May 2014 #68
But evidently it seems to be the narrative now. Rex May 2014 #73
Thanks. redqueen May 2014 #77
someone here confessed they hated feminists because one single woman many years prior had bettyellen May 2014 #79
I feel so tired after fighting this shit, going on 40 years now. MoonRiver May 2014 #82
Not my point. I'm surprised that that's what you took from my post. davidthegnome May 2014 #92
I never resented the boys or men who didn't like me back. redqueen May 2014 #94
And what if a girl makes fun of a guy? The2ndWheel May 2014 #121
This repeated moving of goalposts is annoying. redqueen May 2014 #123
Like I said, especially when you're young The2ndWheel May 2014 #128
I think he's touching a bit on social expectations and how men are judged davidn3600 May 2014 #87
I get what you're saying redqueen May 2014 #93
I think it goes a little beyond that. davidthegnome May 2014 #95
what you have to realize about that kind of resentment, is that you are denying others their bettyellen May 2014 #100
I had much the same experience. redqueen May 2014 #103
Talk about presumptuous. davidthegnome May 2014 #110
This message was self-deleted by its author redqueen May 2014 #111
You call a giggle and "aw that's sweet" cruel? redqueen May 2014 #112
He said gagging, not giggle The2ndWheel May 2014 #120
Mea culpa for misreading that, then. That is indeed cruel. redqueen May 2014 #124
Nobody would've batted an eye? The2ndWheel May 2014 #129
It seems to me the context is getting lost. redqueen May 2014 #130
A man may be judged by those things Dorian Gray May 2014 #117
I've been girlfriend-less since the Bush administration KamaAina May 2014 #83
Have you tried dating-sites? dawg May 2014 #107
Ewwwwwww. KamaAina May 2014 #113
Married and gay. dawg May 2014 #114
Actually, she identifies as bi KamaAina May 2014 #115
He didn't want a girlfriend per se. He wanted a trophy. n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #91
He was as shallow as he was disturbed. His obsession with all things "blonde" was absolutely pitiful Number23 May 2014 #99
Anyone of any age (18+) of any gender can get a girlfriend. Elliot Rodgers problems is he didn't MillennialDem May 2014 #101
The problem is, he never tried to get one because he felt chrisa May 2014 #104
He didn't want a girlfriend. Iggo May 2014 #105
I think that Dorian Gray May 2014 #116
I find it hard to believe the child of a Hollywood director couldn't get a girlfriend hughee99 May 2014 #118
I realize people with normal social skills can't understand how someone can't get a girlfriend. LisaL May 2014 #119
From what I've read about this guy he had a mental disorder, and had only ever approached a woman Erose999 May 2014 #122
Animals can sense when another of their species is not right...and we,too, are animals. Ikonoklast May 2014 #127
He forgot a basic tenet of life: avebury May 2014 #137
A gf would never have saved him miyazaki May 2014 #139
From everything I've seen and read, he probably COULDN'T Taitertots May 2014 #140
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