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JackRiddler

(24,979 posts)
34. Interesting view. I have a different one.
Sun Mar 8, 2015, 11:34 PM
Mar 2015

Your version is not impossible.

What I see right now, however, is this:

1) The Donbass fighters won a military victory against Kiev's forces.

2) They are not proxies (as in "invented by Moscow&quot but an indigenous resistance of Russian-speaking Ukrainians that gets support from Russians privately, and from the Moscow government. Just like NATO supports Kiev and supported the coup last year. The difference being that the war has caused one million mainly Russian-speaking Ukrainians to flee into Russia, where their presence gets Russian-Russians angry about the situation, and where they are doubtless working to gain support.

3) Defining #2 correctly does not mean one supports or opposes any of these sides.*

4) Kiev was pressured at least as much as Putin to effect a ceasefire, since they were losing ground and hoping to make up for it by escalation and conscription.

5) Breedlove, Nuland and Kiev are trying to undermine it with fabrications about a Russian state military "invasion," and have been fabricating similar stories for many months without the appearance of proof (as if an actual "invasion" could be hidden).

6) The German government doesn't like #5 and is using Der Spiegel to expose their views on it openly.

7) The German strategy would seem wise for Kiev instead of trying their hand at conscription and escalation.

8) I hope we can agree that the ceasefire must hold!

* Personally, I'd have been for Maidan if it hadn't been hijacked by nationalists bent on starting a fight with Russian-speaking Ukrainians. Nazis provide soldateska for the Kiev side, but Russian-Russian extremists do the same for the Donbass side. I can't imagine I'd want to run into either paramilitary as a civilian, such formations tend to be barbaric. The Kiev official army, meanwhile, has engaged in some horrific shelling of civilian areas, a lot more of it than the other side.

General Breedlove is Victoria Nuland's willing war hawk lackey...together they incompetently advised Kiev.... Fred Sanders Mar 2015 #1
Enabled, more like. JackRiddler Mar 2015 #2
Poroshenko is no Bibi, speech wise or Prophecy-wise. Otherwise cut from the same cheap cloth. Enabled is accurate. Fred Sanders Mar 2015 #3
Poroshenko is a gate keeper for the Oligarchs. He's there when they need him! sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #6
Another one ? ... Poroshenko: Ukraine's Battle with Russia Is 'America's War Too' jakeXT Mar 2015 #15
One part of Obama's Selma speech that was very troubling malaise Mar 2015 #19
Germany is one of the few reporting the truth in Ukraine Oilwellian Mar 2015 #4
The Guardian has a good grip on the situation, far removed from the hysterical American media. Fred Sanders Mar 2015 #5
The Guardian is a mixed bag. They allow some guest articles that are good but their newthinking Mar 2015 #13
The neocons are still running the war machine here. Which is why we are getting nothing but the same sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #7
The Russians and Germans understand the meaning of war malaise Mar 2015 #20
Merkel is right. sadoldgirl Mar 2015 #8
Maybe this is a "good cop, bad cop" situation. BillZBubb Mar 2015 #9
Who's being questioned? JackRiddler Mar 2015 #10
Putin is being pressured. BillZBubb Mar 2015 #31
Apparently not. JackRiddler Mar 2015 #32
You've got it backwards. BillZBubb Mar 2015 #33
Interesting view. I have a different one. JackRiddler Mar 2015 #34
Germany is the largest importer of natural gas from Russia. I would suggest this inluences CentralMass Mar 2015 #11
I would suggest memories of WW2 ... MattSh Mar 2015 #14
Really ? In what way ? Does it remind them of their own behavior? CentralMass Mar 2015 #18
I could be both...it could include more HereSince1628 Mar 2015 #21
War in the Ukraine has produced refugees. JackRiddler Mar 2015 #24
The U.S. is the largest producer of war gear in the world. JackRiddler Mar 2015 #30
Uh, yep. Comrade Grumpy Mar 2015 #12
When they reopened the Oktoberfest bombing investigation before Hebdo, jakeXT Mar 2015 #16
U.S. plan to train Ukraine national guard 'on hold' jakeXT Mar 2015 #17
Time to leave NATO there is no upside for the US and we make the organization more unstable. TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #22
Where are the World War III supporters? JackRiddler Mar 2015 #23
Funny, because appeasement among other things led to the last world war. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #26
If you mean appeasement by the likes of Henry Ford... JackRiddler Mar 2015 #27
Yes, I would agree. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #28
Okay thanks... JackRiddler Mar 2015 #29
So should the rest of Europe and America. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #25
Russia's supposed interests in war. JackRiddler Mar 2015 #35
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