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FDR had an impossible dilemma, not to apologize or excuse his choices. no_hypocrisy Jul 2016 #1
That's fine bravenak Jul 2016 #2
exactly. the problem is not that people may like him JI7 Jul 2016 #3
Yep. That's exactly it. bravenak Jul 2016 #4
+1! BlueMTexpat Jul 2016 #37
No, no. Igel Jul 2016 #62
I haven't seen anyone here BlueMTexpat Jul 2016 #80
Excellent point. greatauntoftriplets Jul 2016 #45
+2! BlueCaliDem Jul 2016 #101
LBJ on the other hand, defied the white racists in his civil rights . . . brush Jul 2016 #7
I agree. bravenak Jul 2016 #9
The Dixiecrat's were a separate party AgingAmerican Jul 2016 #12
Do some research. The dixiecrats weren't a separate party. brush Jul 2016 #19
The southern rights party sabbat hunter Jul 2016 #227
During the civil rights era of the '50s up to the mid-'60s can we agree that they were part of . . . brush Jul 2016 #240
Remember, though that LBJ came almost 20 years after FDR oberliner Jul 2016 #41
The dixiecrats still wielded a lot of power. People finally decided to stand up to the racism brush Jul 2016 #76
It's appreciated. no_hypocrisy Jul 2016 #39
But today's world view of FDR blends his positive approach to banking and depression repair floriduck Jul 2016 #102
It was WWII that gave America's economic improvements. eom fleabiscuit Jul 2016 #151
Then in your opinion, what was FDR's greatest accomplishment as President? floriduck Jul 2016 #192
Marrying the right woman. nt fleabiscuit Jul 2016 #217
In case you're a Democrat, please don't respond to any of my posts as I will not respond. floriduck Jul 2016 #219
I think you phrased that perfectly. eom fleabiscuit Jul 2016 #223
It's sort of like President Obama not getting single payer treestar Jul 2016 #48
you post the interesting stuff just when i need to be getting to bed. m-lekktor Jul 2016 #5
I should post earlier, but I always get too busy bravenak Jul 2016 #6
considering where I live compared to you m-lekktor Jul 2016 #8
Wow: the PTB must be really scared for them to smear FDR's policies like this. Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #10
The status quo is most certainly NOT WORSE for Black Americans. bravenak Jul 2016 #11
mass incarceration, lower life expectancy, voting rights abridged, poverty, ... Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #13
Lynchings, Jim Crow, beatings, segregation, miscegenation laws, race riots, chain gangs... bravenak Jul 2016 #15
Really? leftinportland Jul 2016 #20
They make perfect sense bravenak Jul 2016 #21
They amount to: I like being slapped in the face because no-one is kicking me in the teeth Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #25
Cause somehow intimating there was no mass incarcerations etc under FDR is totally logical!? uponit7771 Jul 2016 #35
No: but when the status quo includes de facto debtors' prisons, the good parts of history Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #50
Makes perfect sense to this Black Man AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #30
Nah, they make perfect sense to those who have empathy and a sense of introspection uponit7771 Jul 2016 #34
Of course not melman Jul 2016 #111
She is making perfect sense awoke_in_2003 Jul 2016 #130
it makes perfect sense. stonecutter357 Jul 2016 #253
Nobody wants those things back. alarimer Jul 2016 #53
I want affirmative action written into ANY New New Deal. bravenak Jul 2016 #88
What would your response be to those who might say... Ken Burch Jul 2016 #241
I would say bullshit bravenak Jul 2016 #246
OK. n/t. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #247
Things you mention were not policies or consequences of the New Deal jack_krass Jul 2016 #98
They existed and were not addressed bravenak Jul 2016 #99
Didn't Blacks have mass incarcerations, lower life expectancy, etc under FDR? AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #27
Perhaps we can focus on the point here: Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #57
Perhaps You should focus on the point here: AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #158
The new deal had nothing to do with racial equality. Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #189
This message is STILL not getting through to you guys. No one is saying that we shouldn't Squinch Jul 2016 #61
This! mcar Jul 2016 #74
"The refusal to acknowledge the fact of this is the reason BS lost" awoke_in_2003 Jul 2016 #131
What is sad is that even now, as we make the platform and plans for the future, we have to Squinch Jul 2016 #132
Some just refuse awoke_in_2003 Jul 2016 #133
There is no other explanation. And to do that, to see this from someone else's eyes, doesn't Squinch Jul 2016 #134
It migh cost them awoke_in_2003 Jul 2016 #136
That day happened for me in the eighties. Felt like the earth had opened up under me and there Squinch Jul 2016 #138
I always thought I was republican awoke_in_2003 Jul 2016 #140
I was always Independent, and politics was only part of it. I had a lot of bad information in Squinch Jul 2016 #141
You either didn't look or never cared about Sen. Sanders' racial justice platform. KeepItReal Jul 2016 #135
I'm not rehashing the primary, so all I will say is that, no, it was long after hers had been Squinch Jul 2016 #137
Post removed Post removed Jul 2016 #156
She was way earlier that that on racial justice bravenak Jul 2016 #159
"the likely presidential candidate". Your post ain't about the actual campaign. KeepItReal Jul 2016 #164
It absolutely is. Hillary will stand up for our right against Trump, and she started back in 2014 bravenak Jul 2016 #165
Well, there were the Japanese internment camps too.... Adrahil Jul 2016 #43
This isn't the powers that be, this is Bravenak. And stating the truth is not smearing FDR's Squinch Jul 2016 #58
I'll agree with you on that summary. Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #187
The OP is saying the New Deal had glaring and large problems. It is saying that nostalgia Squinch Jul 2016 #194
And the OP is wrong to do so: the TIME of the New Deal had glaring problems. Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #197
And the present TIME has glaring problems, hence the desire from people of color and women to put Squinch Jul 2016 #199
That spin is repulsively disingenuous. I object to vilification of economic reform - and somehow Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #218
Oh, for fuck's sake. You are shadow boxing! It doesn't matter what I say, or what anyone else Squinch Jul 2016 #220
Certainly you are being mean now: Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #244
I must admit my first reaction to this post was "OK, now it's time to begin distancing Clinton Gene Debs Jul 2016 #143
Yes, it's pretty disgusting. Betty Karlson Jul 2016 #188
OTOH, Eleanor Roosevelt stood up to the racist policy of the Daughters of the No Vested Interest Jul 2016 #14
Yes She DID. She was the best of the two. bravenak Jul 2016 #16
We're talking about FDR. AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #28
Interestingly, if FDR hadn't stood for economic fairness and cprise Jul 2016 #38
Appeals for racial equality were STILL absurd to most people in the decades that followed. AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #166
In case they missed it Haveadream Jul 2016 #242
Moving the goal posts = Slippery argument cprise Jul 2016 #264
Thank you, bravenak! This is important to share.. n/t pnwmom Jul 2016 #17
Very important right now. bravenak Jul 2016 #18
So LBJ is a bigger "hero" than FDR now? nikto Jul 2016 #22
Many seem to ignore the flaws bravenak Jul 2016 #23
It's easy to so focus on the bad that the good becomes invisible. Igel Jul 2016 #67
There is a lot of truth in your post, though perhaps not in the way you intended. BzaDem Jul 2016 #40
A good response to another one of these left wing revisionsist threads cutting down progressive Monk06 Jul 2016 #180
I guess it's indicative of just how far Conservatives/GOP/Reagan have, successfully moved ... nikto Jul 2016 #250
This leap you are all making is interesting. Bravenak is pointing out a flaw that must be Squinch Jul 2016 #64
Yes, thank you Squinch, precisely. sheshe2 Jul 2016 #110
Issues of Women and People of Color, and Economics...are separate? nikto Jul 2016 #252
Oh, Jesus, Mary and Joseph... Squinch Jul 2016 #258
Yeah, if only the Democratic Party can get rid of those old, dead ideas from the 30s thru the 70s nikto Jul 2016 #259
W. Wilson, The AF of L, and Business Unions killed off the Progressives by the 20s. jtuck004 Jul 2016 #24
I'm glad you enjoyed it. bravenak Jul 2016 #100
This message was self-deleted by its author rjsquirrel Jul 2016 #26
Anybody nostalgic for Clintonism... Chan790 Jul 2016 #44
This message was self-deleted by its author rjsquirrel Jul 2016 #47
FDR: Best President White America ever had AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #29
It was wonderful for them. They say so all the time. bravenak Jul 2016 #87
Thank you for pointing out FDR's dilemma ananda Jul 2016 #31
And out of homes, mortgages, and decent public schools JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #33
I stopped hoping heaven05 Jul 2016 #93
I'm kicking this- bravenak JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #32
Oh yeah! I have major trust issues. bravenak Jul 2016 #86
There is a very important lesson in WHY that was the case. BzaDem Jul 2016 #36
^^^ THIS ^^^ BumRushDaShow Jul 2016 #51
Some great points. FDR did much, more than any other president in many ways, but there is much he pampango Jul 2016 #73
While FDR was far from perfect... Chan790 Jul 2016 #42
FDR has a Democratic majority at least treestar Jul 2016 #52
Inexplicable to you? ismnotwasm Jul 2016 #56
I think it's something he wants the black community to explain to him... Squinch Jul 2016 #78
"I don't get it." BumRushDaShow Jul 2016 #70
With all due respect, the OP makes no sense Albertoo Jul 2016 #46
^^^ THIS ^^^^ alittlelark Jul 2016 #146
That's nice bravenak Jul 2016 #149
^^^ THIS ^^^^ is Bullshit!!! Product of his time?! AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #167
Exaxtly bravenak Jul 2016 #172
A person in charge cannot change society with a magic wand Albertoo Jul 2016 #236
It was said somewhere that the US would be the most progressive treestar Jul 2016 #49
I agree with that. bravenak Jul 2016 #90
+ infinity etherealtruth Jul 2016 #121
K&R ismnotwasm Jul 2016 #54
So because progressive politics against inequality were racist in the past My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #55
What are you talking about? No one said anything remotely like this. Squinch Jul 2016 #59
That's how it reads to me My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #63
Then you need to read it again. Squinch Jul 2016 #65
I'm perfectly able to read and understand My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #66
Try this: Squinch Jul 2016 #68
Today's democratic party My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #69
I don't know what that means. BS and his followers insisted throughout the primary that Squinch Jul 2016 #72
What is the EXPLICIT plan My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #75
. Squinch Jul 2016 #77
And other people believe My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #84
That's the thing ... Those "other people" ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #91
There is nothing status quo about reducing inequality. My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #92
Why is it asking too much to apply affirmative action to any new deal type legislation? bravenak Jul 2016 #97
You know the answer to those questions. 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #104
Damn. Same answer as back in those wonderful days of nostalgia. NO! bravenak Jul 2016 #105
Both democratic candidates supported affirmative action My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #108
The difference in the approaches are remarkable bravenak Jul 2016 #109
I prefer broad, universal changes over My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #112
I prefer targeted relief to those who need it most bravenak Jul 2016 #113
To say that people who disagree with your preferred methods My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #116
Except I never actually called anyone racist this entire thread. bravenak Jul 2016 #117
No, no one's racist except FDR My Good Babushka Jul 2016 #123
That's nice. I have no idea how this discussion got to this point. bravenak Jul 2016 #125
I do JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #209
Right? bravenak Jul 2016 #211
There is EVERYTHING status quo about ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #103
No. Increasing minimum wage, universal healthcare and expanding college in NO WAY address Squinch Jul 2016 #128
I don't think many people even know what Americas "economic programs" are in America. Sunlei Jul 2016 #126
Actually, that isn't true. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #225
No interest whatsoever in rehashing this. The point is that the language needs to be explicitly Squinch Jul 2016 #228
I agree that it should be. Always have. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #231
There is no takeaway melman Jul 2016 #118
i admire both fdr and lbj both had flaws but both heroes to me dembotoz Jul 2016 #60
Thanks for this perspective, brave mcar Jul 2016 #71
K&R Gothmog Jul 2016 #79
K&R betsuni Jul 2016 #81
I agree, many Americans never knew or do not care to face their REAL History. Sunlei Jul 2016 #82
but that gets in the way of our chanting usa usa usa on every stupid occasion dembotoz Jul 2016 #83
shallow ignorant people are always unhappy and easy to 'herd' Sunlei Jul 2016 #94
I NEVER get upset at the truth heaven05 Jul 2016 #85
I know thats right bravenak Jul 2016 #89
I totally understand what you are meaning hollowdweller Jul 2016 #95
What I mean is that affirmative action must be the foundation of any new deals or we wont bravenak Jul 2016 #96
And, you know what J Cole says happens on the third time! 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #106
Fuck tha peace signs!! bravenak Jul 2016 #107
I know ... sadly! Why does a segment of the left ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #114
Because they are specialer than we are bravenak Jul 2016 #115
LOL ... specialerest! 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #120
What is it in YOUR thinking that prevents you from seeing that it is possible to pursue all the Squinch Jul 2016 #129
Again, some people don't actually read what you're saying gollygee Jul 2016 #119
I know. They actually read a whole bunch of stuff I did not say instead of what I say. bravenak Jul 2016 #122
K&R johnp3907 Jul 2016 #124
FDR democrats DonCoquixote Jul 2016 #127
I just wanted people to know why trying to use FDR to pull in minorities is failing bravenak Jul 2016 #152
FDR was the man who delivered the Democrats out of 70 years of post Civil War minority status Midwestern Democrat Jul 2016 #139
That has nothing to do with my op bravenak Jul 2016 #150
K&R Starry Messenger Jul 2016 #142
Hope yr having a good trip! bravenak Jul 2016 #174
I have been apologizing for my forefathers all my life when it comes to POC William769 Jul 2016 #144
This is why I love you Bill bravenak Jul 2016 #145
So you'll be refusing that Social Security, I guess. WinkyDink Jul 2016 #147
I Was excluded from the original SS. I thank Johnson for fixing that up for me. bravenak Jul 2016 #148
You were excluded from the original Social Security? Do tell. DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2016 #184
From the Social Security Administration Web Site JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #202
Thanks. I hadn't realized bravenak had reached such an advanced age. DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2016 #215
If you pay in - you have a stake JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #216
Nobody who cites FDR as an example today is defending his appeasement of segregationists, though. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #153
It is accurate anc true because it is history bravenak Jul 2016 #162
You are saying there is no chance that any progressive programs enacted today would exclude people Squinch Jul 2016 #195
That's a really good question JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #203
They are fighting this like we're asking them to give us their right arm. I truly don't get it. Squinch Jul 2016 #204
Yet - they want our money! JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #206
It isn't a problem for me, and I honesly have no idea why you think it would be. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #224
It is the entire purpose of this thread. POC and womed are saying, again, that they want the Squinch Jul 2016 #226
And I fully support this. So would all Sanders supporters, AFAIK. You're right to ask for this. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #229
Read the thread. This, for some reason, is very difficult for some to accept. And was been very Squinch Jul 2016 #230
FDR was a person of his time. Agnosticsherbet Jul 2016 #154
I agree bravenak Jul 2016 #161
I'm sure that elderly AAs appreciate your attack on a major portion of their retirement incomes. eridani Jul 2016 #155
This is an attack on the system not on black people bravenak Jul 2016 #157
You are written into Social Security now, which would not have happened unless it existed. eridani Jul 2016 #160
Has no bearing on the fact that we were intentionally left out by him bravenak Jul 2016 #163
There was a major correction when agricultural and household labor were covered by Social Security. eridani Jul 2016 #170
I never said mass incarceration was his failt. We have been holding blacks in incarceration bravenak Jul 2016 #171
I agree about the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act eridani Jul 2016 #175
Eisenhower did do that. And also did a bit of pre integration integration bravenak Jul 2016 #179
Everyone is good at lip service to social justice these days eridani Jul 2016 #237
Are you going to stop voting to protest the racism that established women's suffrage? eridani Jul 2016 #238
Like the ACA? treestar Jul 2016 #186
Why are people fighting so hard against the idea of explicitly including people of color and women Squinch Jul 2016 #196
This post has created a great discussion! K&R for that alone! AllTooEasy Jul 2016 #168
Went better than expected bravenak Jul 2016 #173
Can't swim in a pool, can't drive a nice car, can't get a mortgage and this is 2016. Rex Jul 2016 #169
Yes. He addressed class imbalances. The point is that going forward we need to always explicitly Squinch Jul 2016 #221
Good question, I see people claim to be progressives and then turn around and say Rex Jul 2016 #222
So which politician of the era was better for blacks? 1932 to 1945 The Second Stone Jul 2016 #176
Today is better for Blacks bravenak Jul 2016 #178
You're right, he was just a man. A man in a wheelchair The Second Stone Jul 2016 #181
Nobody saved the world. That is deification. bravenak Jul 2016 #182
I disagree with everything you wrote, The Second Stone Jul 2016 #183
That's fine that you disagree bravenak Jul 2016 #185
Great statement JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #205
We have the experience needed to empathize with oppressed people bravenak Jul 2016 #207
They also demand EXPLICIT answers JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #210
I'm still comfused as to why they are fighting the idea of legislating fairness into bravenak Jul 2016 #212
Shhh - don't tell JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #213
I agree with this so hard bravenak Jul 2016 #214
Things are better now...but NOT because New Deal economic policies are gone. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #232
Then why are people on this thread so opposed to writing affirmative action in? bravenak Jul 2016 #233
I haven't seen posts that actually are opposed to it. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #234
There just seems to be so much anger at the very idea that we do not trust bravenak Jul 2016 #235
I think it's anger that you're still attacking a guy whose presidential campaign is basically over. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #239
Fdr is not running for election bravenak Jul 2016 #245
This is a Bernie-bash thread melman Jul 2016 #248
Bull bravenak Jul 2016 #251
I wasn't talking about FDR. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #249
Well said! Cali_Democrat Jul 2016 #177
FWIW, I think you're right to expect/demand that economic justice programs be discrimination-free aikoaiko Jul 2016 #190
Right? What is so hard about this? What you have outlined is all that is being proposed here. Squinch Jul 2016 #198
I think is why many of us who supported Bernie had trouble getting support from African-Americans. Odin2005 Jul 2016 #191
Institutional racism was and is widespread malaise Jul 2016 #193
I can't wait for the follow-up: How the Constitution excluded Black peoples Bad Thoughts Jul 2016 #200
Tear it down? JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #208
I can understand criticizing historical figures in this manner. David__77 Jul 2016 #201
K&R Haveadream Jul 2016 #243
K&R! stonecutter357 Jul 2016 #254
Thanks for the OP Sancho Jul 2016 #255
I see it too bravenak Jul 2016 #256
FDR also took the most important integration steps taken by the federal government since merrily Jul 2016 #257
What's the matter? A History that you do not want to believe? eom fleabiscuit Jul 2016 #260
Um, which part of history are you falsely claiming I don't want to believe and why do I supposedly merrily Jul 2016 #261
If we're going to be 100% truthful the only 2 Presidents in the 20th Century who actually did craigmatic Jul 2016 #262
I'm tired of people overly sentimentalizing the past lovemydog Jul 2016 #263
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»9 Ways FDR's 'New Deal' P...»Reply #45