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In reply to the discussion: Defending GMOs on grounds that they are not poisonous is like defending manufacturers who exploit [View all]NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)16. "intelligence and skillful means"
http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogsscientificamericancomscience-sushi20110718mythbusting-101-organic-farming-conventional-agriculture/
"Intelligence and skillful means" turns out to actually mean very, very aggressive use of very, very dangerous pesticides. Glyphosate is used in much smaller amounts because--shock--the crops are genetically-engineered to require less of it to fight pests. Organic food manufacturers, on the other hand, have to dump stuff like Rotenone--and apparently synthetic pesticides as well--on their fields to achieve the same pest control.
Oh, and do "intelligence skillful means" include literally using horse and cow shit as fertilizer--thus dramatically increasing the risk of feces-borne illnesses like E. coli--rather than using artificial fertilizers not made up of feces and irradiation to do the same?
The sad truth is, factory farming is factory farming, whether its organic or conventional. Many large organic farms use pesticides liberally. They're organic by certification, but you'd never know it if you saw their farming practices. As Michael Pollan, best-selling book author and organic supporter, said in an interview with Organic Gardening,
What makes organic farming different, then? It's not the use of pesticides, it's the origin of the pesticides used. Organic pesticides are those that are derived from natural sources and processed lightly if at all before use. This is different than the current pesticides used by conventional agriculture, which are generally synthetic. It has been assumed for years that pesticides that occur naturally (in certain plants, for example) are somehow better for us and the environment than those that have been created by man. As more research is done into their toxicity, however, this simply isn't true, either. Many natural pesticides have been found to be potential - or serious - health risks.2
Take the example of Rotenone. Rotenone was widely used in the US as an organic pesticide for decades 3. Because it is natural in origin, occurring in the roots and stems of a small number of subtropical plants, it was considered "safe" as well as "organic". However, research has shown that rotenone is highly dangerous because it kills by attacking mitochondria, the energy powerhouses of all living cells. Research found that exposure to rotenone caused Parkinson's Disease-like symptoms in rats 4, and had the potential to kill many species, including humans. Rotenone's use as a pesticide has already been discontinued in the US as of 2005 due to health concerns***, but shockingly, it's still poured into our waters every year by fisheries management officials as a piscicide to remove unwanted fish species.
The point I'm driving home here is that just because something is natural doesn't make it non-toxic or safe. Many bacteria, fungi and plants produce poisons, toxins and chemicals that you definitely wouldn't want sprayed on your food.
Just last year, nearly half of the pesticides that are currently approved for use by organic farmers in Europe failed to pass the European Union's safety evaluation that is required by law 5. Among the chemicals failing the test was rotenone, as it had yet to be banned in Europe. Furthermore, just over 1% of organic foodstuffs produced in 2007 and tested by the European Food Safety Authority were found to contain pesticide levels above the legal maximum levels - and these are of pesticides that are not organic 6. Similarly, when Consumer Reports purchased a thousand pounds of tomatoes, peaches, green bell peppers, and apples in five cities and tested them for more than 300 synthetic pesticides, they found traces of them in 25% of the organically-labeled foods, but between all of the organic and non-organic foods tested, only one sample of each exceeded the federal limits8.
What makes organic farming different, then? It's not the use of pesticides, it's the origin of the pesticides used. Organic pesticides are those that are derived from natural sources and processed lightly if at all before use. This is different than the current pesticides used by conventional agriculture, which are generally synthetic. It has been assumed for years that pesticides that occur naturally (in certain plants, for example) are somehow better for us and the environment than those that have been created by man. As more research is done into their toxicity, however, this simply isn't true, either. Many natural pesticides have been found to be potential - or serious - health risks.2
Take the example of Rotenone. Rotenone was widely used in the US as an organic pesticide for decades 3. Because it is natural in origin, occurring in the roots and stems of a small number of subtropical plants, it was considered "safe" as well as "organic". However, research has shown that rotenone is highly dangerous because it kills by attacking mitochondria, the energy powerhouses of all living cells. Research found that exposure to rotenone caused Parkinson's Disease-like symptoms in rats 4, and had the potential to kill many species, including humans. Rotenone's use as a pesticide has already been discontinued in the US as of 2005 due to health concerns***, but shockingly, it's still poured into our waters every year by fisheries management officials as a piscicide to remove unwanted fish species.
The point I'm driving home here is that just because something is natural doesn't make it non-toxic or safe. Many bacteria, fungi and plants produce poisons, toxins and chemicals that you definitely wouldn't want sprayed on your food.
Just last year, nearly half of the pesticides that are currently approved for use by organic farmers in Europe failed to pass the European Union's safety evaluation that is required by law 5. Among the chemicals failing the test was rotenone, as it had yet to be banned in Europe. Furthermore, just over 1% of organic foodstuffs produced in 2007 and tested by the European Food Safety Authority were found to contain pesticide levels above the legal maximum levels - and these are of pesticides that are not organic 6. Similarly, when Consumer Reports purchased a thousand pounds of tomatoes, peaches, green bell peppers, and apples in five cities and tested them for more than 300 synthetic pesticides, they found traces of them in 25% of the organically-labeled foods, but between all of the organic and non-organic foods tested, only one sample of each exceeded the federal limits8.
"Intelligence and skillful means" turns out to actually mean very, very aggressive use of very, very dangerous pesticides. Glyphosate is used in much smaller amounts because--shock--the crops are genetically-engineered to require less of it to fight pests. Organic food manufacturers, on the other hand, have to dump stuff like Rotenone--and apparently synthetic pesticides as well--on their fields to achieve the same pest control.
Oh, and do "intelligence skillful means" include literally using horse and cow shit as fertilizer--thus dramatically increasing the risk of feces-borne illnesses like E. coli--rather than using artificial fertilizers not made up of feces and irradiation to do the same?
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Defending GMOs on grounds that they are not poisonous is like defending manufacturers who exploit [View all]
Attorney in Texas
Jul 2016
OP
There are labels that already exist to allow vegans and people who don't want GMOs to decide.
NuclearDem
Jul 2016
#1
It is Monsanto, not organic farmers, who have stigmatized GMOs in my mind.
Attorney in Texas
Jul 2016
#5
Yeah - I paid $1.69 for organic lettuce yesterday in Albuquerque - "I'm going broke"
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#72
How about this reason- sublethal exposure to Glyphosate causes changes in antiobiotic susceptibility
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#169
Actually we've been eating genetically modified food for as long as people have been around
mythology
Jul 2016
#23
None of what you posted is accurate, and posting a video from a debunked scientist isn't...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#69
What does this have to do with glyphosate? See, the conflation of issues, not to mention ignorance..
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#46
This is an interesting video about how mice and squirels avoid GMO corn
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#75
Plus, when the GMO cross pollinates with a crop grown on a neighboring non-GMO farm, the cross-
Attorney in Texas
Jul 2016
#9
You do realize that Monsanto actually pays the farmers as compensation for the contamination...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#42
Schmeiser knowingly kept the seed to replant the next year and violated his current seed contract...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#144
and now " the shit load of herbicides" increases as GMO crops need more and more herbicides
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#97
not true - more pesticides than ever are being used because of SUPERWEEDS!!!!
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#145
Why don't all the non-GMO food producers label their food products "GMO Free"?...
SidDithers
Jul 2016
#7
Monsanto vs. the Milkman (2004): A Maine dairy fights for the right to wear its hormone-free label.
proverbialwisdom
Jul 2016
#12
But what about their business model, I am glad they treat their employees that way.
Rex
Jul 2016
#29
I guess it is all about marketing and ultimately the two big players are Monsanto and Organics.
Rex
Jul 2016
#48
The organic food industry puts out a lot of false information to the public.
ZombieHorde
Aug 2016
#135
How do they treat farmers? From what I can tell, the only criticism...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#36
Monsanto treats some employees very badly - gives them cancer and then sues them
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#154
Monsanto can go even lower - court records show Monsanto knew the health effects of PCB
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#167
And monopolies are unethical, in my book. We have rules against such things for good reason.
Rex
Jul 2016
#35
They aren't even close to a monopoly though, they have less than half the marketshare...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#37
The thing is that modern Monsanto is actually quite ethical and bends over backward to be fair...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#51
Don't know if GMOs can stamp out famine, but it doesn't hurt to try...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#61
Which practices? This is the issue, if there are real problematic practices, then list them for...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#53
Its not difficult, as long as its not the same recycled and debunked claims of the past...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#62
An example of this is Golden Rice and Beta Carotene enriched plantains...
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#64
Not the golden rice stuff again - that's been going on for yrs and never came through
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#71
And here you come demonstrating that lack of ethical concern, as long as your percieved side...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#73
Hello! Earth to ZH - Monsanto exposed their workers to Dioxin - how is that ethical?
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#77
So for 40 yrs Monsanto chose not to compensate people with cancer until forced
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#98
The problems you have with GMOs are endemic in all the food industry..
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#34
It isn't even a study, it was a biased meta-analysis that many scientists of the source studies...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#143
And? Even they say they didn't conduct any independent research on this issue...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#212
Demonizing GMOs because of made up bullshit is like being an antivaxxer or a CC denialist.
Dr Hobbitstein
Jul 2016
#41
Considering the BS this poster keeps posting, I don't think their handle is accurate. n/t
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#44
Not saying that, a lot of people have ideological reasons to support one side or another....
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#56
Well I eat both types of food, the organic grown in my garden and of course food from HEB.
Rex
Jul 2016
#63
What practices of Monsanto's do you not like? Can you articulate them?
Humanist_Activist
Jul 2016
#66
How about the practice of giving people cancer from dioxin, pcb's and Roundup
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#81
Roundup doesn't cause cancer, how many times do you need to be told this?
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#90
Roundup does cause cancer - how many times do I have to say this back.
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#107
So do they have every bio-science lab in the world in their back pocket or what?
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#149
GMO's and Roundup = go together like a horse and a carriage, peas and carrots .....
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#111
Putin: Russia Will be World’s Largest Supplier of Healthy Organic Food
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#121
They're both asinine things to do, based in fear and hatred, not facts.
Dr Hobbitstein
Aug 2016
#224
What, stating that a country has draconian laws WRT sexuality and science?
Dr Hobbitstein
Aug 2016
#231
Safety is not putting Roundup on America's food supply and corporations are getting it
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#119
I read an interesting book on the subject, and know some people directly affected by Monsanto.
DFW
Aug 2016
#118
So long as you're not rallying for feel-good legislation with no basis in fact
Dr Hobbitstein
Aug 2016
#225
Monsanto didn't invent Agent Orange, it was invented before Monsanto was even a company...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#151
Correction, Monsanto warned the U.S. government about dioxin contamination in 1952...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#155
Monsanto warned the US government about Agent Oranges harmful effects in 1952...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#183
So when Monsanto became aware that they poisoned an entire town with agent orange
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#156
Certain posters here have yet to produce any substantive arguments for their side.
NuclearDem
Aug 2016
#194
This is a perfect example of the ideological blinders I mention in post 56. n/t
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#166
I would call it bipartisan, mostly, with a slight left leaning slant. n/t
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#165
Why do you hate a woman who has been so successful fighting corporations?
womanofthehills
Aug 2016
#200
"misogynistic"? You mean like your anti-abortion right wing hero, Mercola?
Major Nikon
Aug 2016
#204
Because they display the same lack of critical thinking, reliance on faulty data and ancedotal...
Humanist_Activist
Aug 2016
#234