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proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
1. Rebuttal in reverse chronology to the stupendously oversimplistic platitudes on that locked thread.
Tue Jun 26, 2012, 12:11 AM
Jun 2012
RE: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002856231


http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2008/03/julie-gerberding-admits-on-cnn-that.html

March 31, 2008

Julie Gerberding Admits on CNN that Vaccines can Trigger Autism



This weekend Julie Gerberding, the head of the CDC, appeared on Dr. Sanjay Gupta's show, House Call, and explained that vaccines can trigger autism in a vulnerable subset of children. This is the claim that parents like me have been making since at least the 80's, and have been dismissed and even mocked for making it.

But no one in the mainstream media seems to have noticed. Not even CNN. Not even Dr. Gupta who was sitting right in front of her.

<...>


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20015982-10391695.html

September 9, 2010 2:14 PM
Family to Receive $1.5M+ in First-Ever Vaccine-Autism Court Award
By Sharyl Attkisson


The first court award in a vaccine-autism claim is a big one.

<...>

Hannah was described as normal, happy and precocious in her first 18 months.

Then, in July 2000, she was vaccinated against nine diseases in one doctor's visit: measles, mumps, rubella, polio, varicella, diphtheria, pertussis, tetanus, and Haemophilus influenzae.

Afterward, her health declined rapidly. She developed high fevers, stopped eating, didn't respond when spoken to, began showing signs of autism, and began having screaming fits. In 2002, Hannah's parents filed an autism claim in federal vaccine court. Five years later, the government settled the case before trial and had it sealed. It's taken more than two years for both sides to agree on how much Hannah will be compensated for her injuries.

In acknowledging Hannah's injuries, the government said vaccines aggravated an unknown mitochondrial disorder Hannah had which didn't "cause" her autism, but "resulted" in it. It's unknown how many other children have similar undiagnosed mitochondrial disorder. All other autism "test cases" have been defeated at trial. Approximately 4,800 are awaiting disposition in federal vaccine court.

<...>





http://www.ageofautism.com/2011/07/james-murdoch-is-still-supported-by-glaxosmithkline.html

James Murdoch is still supported by GlaxoSmithKline
By John Stone


James Murdoch, the beleagured News Corporation executive, has received a ringing endorsement from MMR manufacturer, GlaxoSmithKline according to Reuters news agency on Friday. GSK who appointed him to their board in February 2009 insist Murdoch has made “a strong contribution” to the group and received share payments worth $158,000 in 2010. Murdoch was appointed to the board of the pharmaceutical manufacturer with a brief to “review…external issues that might have the potential for serious impact upon the group's business and reputation."

Within a fortnight of his appointment News International had published at least 5 articles attacking MMR researcher Andrew Wakefield’s integrity (one , two , three , four and five ).

The accusations, while flawed, were devastating to Wakefield’s reputation. According to the Sunday Times and its journalist, Brian Deer, Wakefield was singly guilty of fabricating the data in the Lancet paper of 1998 although none of his 12 co-authors have ever repudiated it and one of them, histopathologist, Susan Davies subsequently wrote to British Medical Journal rebutting Deer’s interpretation of her evidence before the General Medical Council. Deer’s allegations were also based on his own inexpert interpretation of GP records which were never available to the authors of the paper. The allegations which were re-cycled by British Medical Journal were rebutted by Wakefield in his book Callous Disregard, and frequently in articles published on Age of Autism (AofA The Big Lie , AofA Time To Revisit Deer's Claims , AofA Part 2 Time To Revisit Deer's Claims ). In contrast to normal academic journal policy BMJ have adopted a legalistic defence of its allegations and (more here). Furthermore, they were forced to admit under pressure that they had undisclosed conflicts with MMR manufacturers Merck and GSK.

The Sunday Times campaign against Wakefield began in 2003 when section editor Paul Nuki approached Deer saying that he needed "something big" on "MMR" . Nuki was the son of Prof George Nuki who sat on the Committee on Safety on Medicines when MMR/Pluserix were first introduced in the late 1980s. Shortly afterwards Deer interviewed parent litigants under a false name. Unknown to Sunday Times readers Deer also pursued his own official complaints against Wakefield and colleagues and came to an arrangement with General Medical Council lawyers that he would not be named in the case, leaving him free to continue reporting as if an independent journalist . Deer’s obtaining and use of confidential data remains to be investigated.

<...>

John Stone is UK Editor for Age of Autism.
Posted by Age of Autism at July 17, 2011 at 6:22 PM in Dr. Andrew Wakefield, John Stone, Vaccine Safety


http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2011/07/revisiting-james-murdoch-brian-deer.html

Revisiting James Murdoch, Brian Deer, The Sunday Times, GlaxoSmithKline and the Attack on Andrew Wakefield
July 19, 2011






http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/06/autism-and-what-the-experts-are-saying-part-one-nprs-tom-ashbrook-interviews-geri-dawson-and-max-wiz.html#comments

Autism and What the Experts are Saying, Part One: NPR's Tom Ashbrook Interviews Geri Dawson and Max Wiznitzer
By Anne Dachel
June 04, 2012 at 5:45 AM


Lengthy transcripts and commentary.
Also see comment: Posted by: cmo | June 04, 2012 at 11:52 AM




http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/06/autism-and-what-the-experts-are-saying-part-two-.html

Autism and What the Experts are Saying, Part Two: Dawson, Zahorodny, and Amaral
By Anne Dachel
June 04, 2012 at 5:45 AM


If you’re like me, you’re sick to death of reporters telling you that all the science shows no link between vaccines and autism. Members of the press don’t hesitate to remind the public on a daily basis that only misguided parents believe vaccinations can cause autism. It’s usually a one sentence dismissal in a news report--more evidence that no one really wants to look into a controversy that could implicate the government and the medical community in an unprecedented health care scandal.

There are some huge chinks in the armor of the no link claim, however. I’m referring to the public acknowledgement by some top medical experts that yes, vaccinations do sometimes cause children to become autistic.

There are more and more independent doctors out there saying there is a link, but I’m talking about doctors who are often cited in news stories denying any causal relationship, yet who will also admit that, yes, sometimes vaccines are responsible.

<...>

In April, 2011, Dr. David Amaral, Director of Research in the Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences, UC Davis MIND Institute, was interviewed for PBS by Robert MacNeil.

He was asked if vaccines can cause autism and he said this:
“I think it's pretty clear that, in general, vaccines are not the culprit. There has been enough epidemiological evidence showing that if you look at children that receive the standard childhood vaccines that, if anything, those children are at slightly less risk of having autism than children that aren't immunized.

“And so, you know, I think it probably is a waste of effort at this time to try and understand vaccines as a major culprit for, or a major cause of, autism. It's not to say, however, that there isn't a small subset of children who may be particularly vulnerable to vaccines.

“And in their case, having the vaccines, or particular vaccines, particularly in certain kinds of situations -- if the child was ill, if the child had a precondition, like a mitochondrial defect. Vaccinations for those children actually may be the environmental factor that tipped them over the edge of autism. And I think it is incredibly important, still, to try and figure out what, if any, vulnerabilities, in a small subset of children, might make them at risk for having certain vaccinations."
It’s shocking to listen to well-credentialed experts deny any link at the same time they also casually talk about the possibility vaccines are a factors in autism. That was never supposed to happen. Dawson’s “very small minority of individuals," Zahorondny’s “some small number of children,” and Amaral’s “small subset of children” might include my child. And how big is “small”? And where is the proof that the vulnerable group of children is “small”? There isn’t a single study that has looked at the children who regressed into autism following routine vaccinations.

It was the late Dr. Bernadine Healy, former head of the National Institutes of Health, who was on CBS News in 2008 calling for such a study. She said,
“This is the time when we do have the opportunity to understand whether or not there are susceptible children … that makes them more susceptible to vaccines plural, to one particular vaccine, or to components of a vaccine, like mercury. …We have to take another look at that hypothesis, not deny it….”
CBS reporter, Sharyl Attkisson:
“Do you think the government was too quick to dismiss out of hand that there was this possibility of a link between vaccines and autism?”
Healy:
“I think the government or certain health officials in the government have been too quick to dismiss the concerns of these families without studying the population that got sick. I haven’t seen major studies that focus on 300 kids who got autistic symptoms within a period of a few weeks of a vaccine. I think that public health officials have been too quick to dismiss the hypothesis as irrational without sufficient studies of causation.”

<...>


http://www.cryshame.co.uk/

PARENTS RESPOND TO LANDMARK MMR JUDGMENT IN ITALY

16 6 2012

Rebuttal in reverse chronology to the stupendously oversimplistic platitudes on that locked thread. proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #1
Age of Autism? FFS... SidDithers Jun 2012 #2
Actually CNN, CBS, NPR in Boston, WNYC, and PBS are the sources for interviews with - proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #3
Sorry, this is a stupendous pile of steaming horseshit Spider Jerusalem Jun 2012 #7
Find a source from 2012. Hint: does not exist, the field has evolved. proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #11
I urge you to please spend some time reading this 2012 HARVARD HEALTH PUBLICATION. proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #15
Are you a scientologist? snooper2 Jun 2012 #45
Good one. (eom) proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #53
They must have had some evidence presented in Italian court? Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #16
While I can't answer to the rest of your "debunking" 1monster Jun 2012 #36
There has never been any evidence Sgent Jun 2012 #65
Watch CNN'S interview with former CDC Chief Julie Gerberding on March 31, 2008 (post #1) . proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #74
I think the transcript is sufficient, but for a copy of the video, instructions follow. proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #76
Dupe. Deleted. n/t Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #80
You are wrong about the presence of thimerosol in vaccines. Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #81
well said and posters who pile on Tumbulu Jun 2012 #69
The MMR vaccine has never had thimerosal. Spider Jerusalem Jun 2012 #77
Thimerosal is still contained in some childhood vaccines Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #82
"use of inaccurate facts to shut down discussion"? Spider Jerusalem Jun 2012 #84
"thimerosal was totally removed from all childhood vaccines in 2001" Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #87
TL:DR, but the MMR vaccine (which is specifically at issue here).. Spider Jerusalem Jun 2012 #111
I did not bring up thimerosal. Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #112
The original post to which I was responding DID. Spider Jerusalem Jun 2012 #113
If you want to go that direction, Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #114
I thought they stopped using mercury a long time ago ryan_cats Jun 2012 #98
The original paper alleging a link between vaccines and autism is a proven fraud cpwm17 Jun 2012 #21
False. This is in the weeds for me, but if you are seriously interested, examine these with care. proverbialwisdom Jul 2012 #129
This message was self-deleted by its author Luminous Animal Jun 2012 #4
Unlocking. Luminous Animal Jun 2012 #5
Truthfully, posts #6 and #8 are in the weeds for me, but not for the AoA contributors, the majority proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #9
You bet I have a personal stake SunsetDreams Jun 2012 #38
Truthfully, this subject makes me unspeakably sad and I will be stepping away for awhile. (eom) proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #63
AoA as a source? obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #54
Post #3 describes the news aggregating function by AoA from mainstream sources. proverbialwisdom Jun 2012 #71
Good. This Italian court ruling is not a conspiracy theory. n/t lumberjack_jeff Jun 2012 #29
British Medical Journal: Science rules MMR didn't trigger autism Spider Jerusalem Jun 2012 #6
Manufacturing a controversy about the MMR vaccine SunsetDreams Jun 2012 #8
You mention Japan: their vaccines have NEVER contained mercury compounds Lydia Leftcoast Jun 2012 #20
Changing diagnoses can only explain about half of the increased prevalence. lumberjack_jeff Jun 2012 #32
Research being done SunsetDreams Jun 2012 #64
Of course its environmental toxins Drale Jun 2012 #126
I have to wonder if it's something that corporations make a lot of money off of Lydia Leftcoast Jun 2012 #128
So one locked thread over anti-vaccine bullshit wasn't enough? GarroHorus Jun 2012 #10
why did you alert on a news story from the Independent, that was a fast reaction too Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #17
I have a special contempt for conspiracy theorists. n/t GarroHorus Jun 2012 #19
Pushing the antivac bullshit is killing people. Warren Stupidity Jun 2012 #33
Post removed Post removed Jun 2012 #52
I have special contempt for anti-vaxxer woo-woo. backscatter712 Jun 2012 #12
I had mumps, measles, and chickenpox as a kid GarroHorus Jun 2012 #13
+1 Chorophyll Jun 2012 #14
Amen! I had measles and chicken pox in the same year, and the secondary infections Lydia Leftcoast Jun 2012 #18
Because Vaccines have been useful in the past, we are all to now blindly believe Big Pharma Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #22
Did you see my post about Japan? Lydia Leftcoast Jun 2012 #23
Maybe there is something else in it causing the problem. How can we fix it if we live in denial? Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #26
just keep all your anti-vac friends away from my newborn granddaughter. n/t progressivebydesign Jun 2012 #37
Try a netti pot. tridim Jun 2012 #28
That's interesting, but remember, the Japanese as a nation eat a lot of fish... 1monster Jun 2012 #39
Every assertion about vaccines has been debunked GarroHorus Jun 2012 #24
Who has an interest in lying? Big Pharma or parents of children who have been harmed? Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #25
Anti-Vaccine people are out to kill everybody. GarroHorus Jun 2012 #31
There are ingredients in vaccines causing autism, denail is a republican tactic Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #34
Full debunked conspiracy theory nonsense GarroHorus Jun 2012 #35
your jury results (from juror #2) Kali Jun 2012 #43
. GarroHorus Jun 2012 #44
I was juror #3. Still trying to sufrommich Jun 2012 #47
hosts are really limited in what they can lock Kali Jun 2012 #61
delusion is another repuke trait Kali Jun 2012 #42
Wrongo obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #58
Jenny McCarthy and Andrew Wakefield and AoA obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #55
I'm sure Big Pharma makes much more on vaccines Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #68
Hey, pal, it's all good! florida evans Jun 2012 #51
Why is "trusty" in scare quotes? obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #60
What precisely is preventing you from becoming infected with/by various diseases? LanternWaste Jun 2012 #66
That will have to be answered SunsetDreams Jun 2012 #67
Probably not the first time, either...nt SidDithers Jun 2012 #72
Herd immunity. Warren Stupidity Jun 2012 #78
As someone who's liver is shot. ForgoTheConsequence Jun 2012 #27
Ah jeez proud2BlibKansan Jun 2012 #30
The Italian Court got it wrong. hedgehog Jun 2012 #40
Giuliano Mignini must have been on vacation obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #56
For those going "Huh?" hedgehog Jun 2012 #59
+1 obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #62
It's amazing how some on the Left proudly claim to be MicaelS Jun 2012 #41
Just because somebody says they are left of center or a liberal doesn't mean they are smart.. snooper2 Jun 2012 #48
Nice graphic, where did you get that? n/t MicaelS Jun 2012 #49
Just did a google image search for ( political circle ) snooper2 Jun 2012 #50
Jenny McCarthy Body Count... SidDithers Jun 2012 #46
Excellent illustration. backscatter712 Jun 2012 #79
I blame the existence of this thread on MTV obamanut2012 Jun 2012 #57
I blame groupthink on a massive brainwashing effort by the corporate media manufacturing consent Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #70
It is true that without vaccines there would be fewer children with autism. 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #73
why are the rates rising so fast? Have the pro toxic vaccines people been to a public school lately? Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #85
Many parents *think* they've witnessed the beginnings immediately after receiving vaccines. Posteritatis Jun 2012 #86
It wasn't classified as it's own disorder until the 1960s 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #88
I attended school then, have you been to a school now? Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #91
It's bogus conspiracy theory neo-Luddite bullshit GarroHorus Jun 2012 #92
And unfortunately they aren't going to be the ones who suffer 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #94
your reaction proves you have no argument Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #122
Your thread proves you are a conspiracy theorist GarroHorus Jun 2012 #123
This is the very definition of an anecdotal argument 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #93
Rise in Autism proven by statistics. The rebuttle 'they didn't diagnose it' is a joke Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #96
"Rise in Autism proven by statistics" 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #103
With the millions of kids getting vaccinated every year some will be diagnosed with autism cpwm17 Jun 2012 #99
I'm sure there were people who got vaccinated, stepped outside the doctors office 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #104
Courts, even in Italy, do not conduct MineralMan Jun 2012 #75
*facepalm* sakabatou Jun 2012 #83
If we demand that the anti-evolutionists use reasoned, scientific thought processes to refute... randome Jun 2012 #89
Do anecdotes count in place of evidence? 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #90
Actually, anecdotes SHOULD count. If they numbered in the thousands, maybe. randome Jun 2012 #100
Ok but are we taking in to account cup size? 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #105
I demand a scientific explanation for the rise in Autism- 'didn't diagnose it' is not scientific Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #97
Global warming is on the rise. Obesity is on the rise. The price of grape jelly is on the rise. randome Jun 2012 #101
Don't give them ideas 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #107
you might be on to something- Study Finds High-Fructose Corn Syrup Contains Mercury Ghost of Huey Long Jun 2012 #124
Groan . . . 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #125
Can you acknowledge the fact that it was not defined as a disorder 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #106
What we have to look forward to due to the idiot anti-vaxxers GarroHorus Jun 2012 #95
Ugh. I feel strange saying 'Thanks' for these photos. randome Jun 2012 #102
Don't understand the hostility to making sure vaccines are safe CleanLucre Jun 2012 #108
That's not really the issue 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #110
The reality is that there are still some things we don't know Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #115
From your articles: 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #116
You indicated we know how vaccines work. Ms. Toad Jun 2012 #119
This is the same country charging seismologists with manslaughter for not predicting an earthquake NickB79 Jun 2012 #109
Please stop calling the parents idiots! tova Jun 2012 #117
Egg allergies are the single most common food allergy for infants/toddlers. They are not a factor Godhumor Jun 2012 #118
Reaction to shots tova Jun 2012 #120
There are guidelines for who should not get them Godhumor Jun 2012 #121
Jesus mother fucking christ pscot Jun 2012 #127
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