Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

pat_k

(9,313 posts)
47. Follow the lead of every other developed nation.
Tue Mar 14, 2017, 07:41 PM
Mar 2017

Ultimately, any health care system that relies on "free market forces" to keep costs in check is doomed.

As discussed in an exchange above, health care is simply not a commodity responsive to the "free market." Nobody decides "how much" health care they need. Everybody needs a basic level of preventative care. Some get sick. Some have accidents. When they do, they need the health care they need. Period. "Buying" health care is not like buying a car. (Or, as I like to put it, no healthy person wakes up one morning and thinks, "I want to start injecting myself with Enbrel. I know it's expensive, but I'm worth it!&quot

Health care, like education, is one of those things that we need to figure out as a nation. We aren't dong the best job on public education, but at least it is a given that you cannot have a functional democratic government unless everyone has equal access to a basic level of education. Health care is just as fundamental, if not MORE. Education is of little use if you are dead.

We agree in principle on the need for public education, but we are still struggling with the many questions ("what is a basic level of education?" "What's a fair salaries for teachers?" and so on.) Sooner or later I think we may "get it" that paying for education primarily through local property tax is not working, and that we need to have a "broader base" if we want to ensure any level of consistency. But that is another topic.

Anyway, I firmly believe that we will reach a consensus that health care, like education, is something we must provide for ourselves through our tax dollars. We would reach that consensus a hell of a lot sooner if the Democratic Party establishment made a concerted effort to make the case. When we do finally "get it" -- that it violates the principles on which this nation was founded NOT to have a national, public, health care system, it won't necessarily be all sweetness and light. We'll struggle with all sorts of questions for a long time. "What are fair prices to pay physicians? Do we subsidize physician's education? What preventative services should be built in to help keep people as healthy as possible (and thereby save money)? What about research for drugs? Should we subsidize research at public institutions to "compete" with private pharma? What level of profit for private pharm are we willing to subsidize with our public dollars?" Fortunately, there are lots of models "out there" that we can follow. We are not starting from scratch. We can design a system that takes the best from those that already exist.

The other posts on public v. private (11, 15, 19)

But if we did do that then how would the CEO's be able to get their obscene pay packages? dhol82 Mar 2017 #1
But But But......That's........SO-SHUL-ISMMMMMM!!! (Cue Ominous Music: DUN DUN DUNNNNNNN!!!) ChoppinBroccoli Mar 2017 #2
Yes PatSeg Mar 2017 #22
And the throngs of people who work in the private medical insurance industry? Orsino Mar 2017 #3
The Demand For Treatment Doesn't Go Away; The Mechanism For Payment Just Changes ChoppinBroccoli Mar 2017 #4
We already know from multiple American examples that single-payer works... Orsino Mar 2017 #13
A Dem bill fix that adds "public option." pat_k Mar 2017 #17
Sounds good to me. Orsino Mar 2017 #18
Oh, Now I See ChoppinBroccoli Mar 2017 #23
well, actually a lot of single payers' costs go way down precisely because ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #25
Yes we DO need a single payer plan IMO mvd Mar 2017 #38
Or introduce a Dem "replacement" bill that adds public option. pat_k Mar 2017 #6
It won't happen...better to spend time defending the ACA ... Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #10
And that is the thinking that makes it impossible to EVER generate the political will. pat_k Mar 2017 #14
Exactly right ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #26
Dems can introduce a "replacement" bill of their own. pat_k Mar 2017 #5
How would Medicare for all work? yeoman6987 Mar 2017 #7
Here's Conyer's latest version pat_k Mar 2017 #8
Thanks. Tax top 5 percent wage earners yeoman6987 Mar 2017 #12
To be fair I should say that the Democrats didn't have the votes. Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #9
They should still be out there making the case. pat_k Mar 2017 #20
They should be out there saving the ACA...trying to do anything else plays into Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #21
"ACA sucks" v. "No it doesn't" is a losing argument. pat_k Mar 2017 #24
No, in the real world...that is how the GOP gets the aca repealed.... Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #31
Who said "attack it"? pat_k Mar 2017 #39
Of course it can be improved and the should be our Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #40
My suggestion is version with public option pat_k Mar 2017 #45
yeah, yeah ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #28
consider Lieberman whom I dislike...was primaried Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #33
Who's attacking the ACA? ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #36
We can't replace it...we must support it and improve it if given the chance...but that Demsrule86 Mar 2017 #44
Intro competing bill w/public option now, and.. pat_k Mar 2017 #46
Privatization guarantees nothing except government-funded corruption Orrex Mar 2017 #11
It can never work for health care because health care isn't a "commodity"... pat_k Mar 2017 #15
That is 100% absolute and perfect truth Orrex Mar 2017 #19
That would be another huge benefit of single payer ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #29
Preach it! (nt) Orrex Mar 2017 #32
some things are best done by the private sector, others by the public sector. unblock Mar 2017 #37
Follow the lead of every other developed nation. pat_k Mar 2017 #47
Are economy is so strong we actually can afford the waste of subsidizing insurance for everyone Johonny Mar 2017 #16
It's not really about price, it's about social control ck4829 Mar 2017 #27
I've come to believe that as well ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #30
God damn that's a cold-blooded assessment Orrex Mar 2017 #34
Message auto-removed Name removed Mar 2017 #35
OMG!!!!!11 COMMUNISM!1!!!1!! QC Mar 2017 #41
Think of the poor insurance company CEOs without their umpteen million dollar salaries! raccoon Mar 2017 #42
But then how could the rich profit... discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2017 #43
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Medicare for all is so mu...»Reply #47