I think you are right -- because part of the US ability to protect Israel has been the respect (Reply #93)

In the discussion thread: U.S. declines to veto U.N. Security Council resolution for Israel to stop Jewish settlement activity [View all]

Response to moondust (Reply #48)

Sat Dec 24, 2016, 02:29 PM

karynnj (59,305 posts)

93. I think you are right -- because part of the US ability to protect Israel has been the respect

that European governments have for Obama and Kerry. That respect has enabled the Obama administration to soften many reactions against things that Israel has done.

Netanyahu might find that Trump will be more problematic as he actually supports those to Netanyahu's right - like Bennett. In addition, I do not think that Trump will be acknowledged as the leader that Obama really is among our most important allies. (I think the US media itself is influenced by the constant RW derision and through laziness, they ignore that Obama/Kerry really did pull together a historic coalition and were essential to getting nearly 200 nation's to sign on to the climate accord. )

Reading and analysis in Haartez of the UN agreement - http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141647865 - this was a defeat for Netanyahu. He points out that while the US abstained, the rest of the security council voted for this. In particular, he says of Russia,

"The allegedly close relations between Netanyahu and Putin fall short when it comes to Russian interests and UN votes. Russia is one of the main supporters of the Palestinians over the last 50 years. During those years and today as well Russia has been voting against Israel in every possible international forum. It is possible that things will change in the future, but at least at this stage a Russian veto on a UNSC resolution concerning the Israeli-Palestinian conflict belongs to the realm of science fiction and not diplomacy."
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.761049

The reality is that the US has been a restraining force on countries like France - and even the UK and Germany - from publicly criticizing Israel or allowing full blown boycotts. This is out of respect for Obama and Kerry who asked for the space to try to work with Israel.

The scary thing for Israel - and the US itself - is that Trump may in a very short time eliminate the US as a respected leader.

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133 replies	Author	Time	Post
U.S. declines to veto U.N. Security Council resolution for Israel to stop Jewish settlement activity [View all]	BumRushDaShow	Dec 2016	OP
U.N. Resolution Condemning Israeli Settlements Is Approved; U.S. Abstains.	elleng	Dec 2016	#1
Samantha Powers is giving an incredibly good speech explaining the US position	karynnj	Dec 2016	#2
Watching...	YvonneCa	Dec 2016	#4
I agree and Kerry's Saban talk made a very strong case against the settlements	karynnj	Dec 2016	#7
I saw the Saban talk. Kerry was very...	YvonneCa	Dec 2016	#10
At one point Fabius, who was the French Foreign Minister, wanted to make a resolution	karynnj	Dec 2016	#20
I agree on Trump. I'm still finding...	YvonneCa	Dec 2016	#27
Like you, it is hard to accept that Trump reality	karynnj	Dec 2016	#36
Don-the-Con's head will explode... anxiously awaiting the next tweet-storm	groundloop	Dec 2016	#3
Trump doensn't know ANYTHING about ANY issue....	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#12
So easy to grow that spine when you've got nothing else to lose eh?	LiberalLovinLug	Dec 2016	#5
As Jonathan Alter noted, this resolution simply calls on Isreal to keep the promises it made.	SunSeeker	Dec 2016	#6
Good news.	greatauntoftriplets	Dec 2016	#8
I bet we get out of the UN	yeoman6987	Dec 2016	#16
A lot of Republicans do.	greatauntoftriplets	Dec 2016	#40
I don't think we'll get out. But I can see a 50% funding cut. n/t	Calista241	Dec 2016	#131
Good point	yeoman6987	Dec 2016	#132
I'm not in love with the UN	Rustyeye77	Dec 2016	#133
I am deeply disappointed with President Obama.	tritsofme	Dec 2016	#9
How is it a "betrayal" to ask them to do what they said they'd do?	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#13
Asking them to not violate human rights laws is so cruel	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#18
Thought the Betrayal Was Netenyahu Walking Away from 2 State Solution	TomCADem	Dec 2016	#19
Interesting point.	elmac	Dec 2016	#43
The Palestinians refuse to negotiate	Mosby	Dec 2016	#84
How can Russia condemn Israel's occupation while annexing the Ukraine?	oberliner	Dec 2016	#111
How Can Republicans Complain About the Deficit or Hillary's Alleged Conflicts...	TomCADem	Dec 2016	#117
Indeed lots of UN member states are run by hypocrites and liars	oberliner	Dec 2016	#118
Please find a copy of Samantha Power's excellent speech	karynnj	Dec 2016	#22
Oh I read it, and still don't agree with her attempt to justify this.	tritsofme	Dec 2016	#26
Salon - Sheldon Adelson runs Israel: Benjamin Netanyahu, GOP	TomCADem	Dec 2016	#33
It is ridiculous that you say that Trump baited him into it	karynnj	Dec 2016	#41
All of the growth is within existing settlements	Mosby	Dec 2016	#83
Not true at all - even Netanyahu does not claim that	karynnj	Dec 2016	#86
She doesn't say that the growth was outside the blocks, just that it's been accelerating.	Mosby	Dec 2016	#89
Travesty? it is a great thing	Grey Lemercier	Dec 2016	#67
Uh..	hibbing	Dec 2016	#24
Totally. We should exterminate those nuisance Palestinians wanting a place to live hassle free. nt	Lucky Luciano	Dec 2016	#42
I take it you support the single state solution?	Crunchy Frog	Dec 2016	#47
Nonsense.	J_William_Ryan	Dec 2016	#51
I am deeply proud of President Obama.	Grey Lemercier	Dec 2016	#63
I'm disappointed too. Obama should have shut off all military aid to them too.	Lil Missy	Dec 2016	#126
Hours ago: Fatah (ruling Palestinian party) celebrates terrorist attacks	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#11
"They don't want to coexist with people who desire their death."	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#14
Go look at the polling of people in the Palestinian territories. Madness is widespread	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#29
I agree with Carter on this.	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#49
Can you expound?	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#53
One word: Apartheid	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#59
Carter: "Israel is a wonderful democracy with equal treatment of all citizens whether Arab or Jew"	oberliner	Dec 2016	#61
Hmm?	Alittleliberal	Dec 2016	#127
Funny thing about reading that quote while skimming the titles	Lokilooney	Dec 2016	#55
The government of Israel has used fear to remain hard core right wing for far too long.	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#62
Israel is much more liberal than the US	Mosby	Dec 2016	#85
Maybe you should check out what's going on in the occupied territories....	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#88
That map is fake, your peddling in propaganda.	Mosby	Dec 2016	#90
LOL!!! You honestly believe Israel is SHRINKING?	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#92
Yes, it's history.	Mosby	Dec 2016	#94
That's pre-Israel.	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#99
How about when Israel gave up the Sinai to Egypt	oberliner	Dec 2016	#107
Spoils of war? Seriously?	Spitfire of ATJ	Dec 2016	#123
A few questions for you about those maps	oberliner	Dec 2016	#109
I'll answer since Spitfire is being quiet.	appal_jack	Dec 2016	#122
Israelis should stay on their own fucking land if they	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#17
The Jewish Quarter of Jerusalem should be off-limits to Israelis?	oberliner	Dec 2016	#23
West Bank should be off-limits to the IDF. nt	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#25
Not arguing with that	oberliner	Dec 2016	#28
Israel controls the whole city and is unwilling to let	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#30
And before that, it was controlled by Jordan and Jews were expelled	oberliner	Dec 2016	#34
We can debate Geneva Initiative, but we don't have tanks nt	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#39
Political pressure can sometimes be more powerful than tanks	oberliner	Dec 2016	#44
you know	MFM008	Dec 2016	#31
Seems like killing Muslims is a bigger F you to the Islamic world	oberliner	Dec 2016	#35
It's about far more than the Jewish Quarter of the old city	muriel_volestrangler	Dec 2016	#76
The Jewish Quarter is of great significance	oberliner	Dec 2016	#77
It's not the Israelis who have a problem coexisting	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#32
Pay no attention to that armed occupation and de facto apartheid	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#38
Arabs are 20.7% of Israelis citizens	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#54
The West Bank is a de facto apartheid state.	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#60
Yes, the West Bank is basically an open air prison of non-voters	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#101
Exactly the rationale of the Afrikaaners.	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#103
Oh, so you think you've figured it out? Then explain Germany and France.	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#106
Vast majority of European Muslims aren't radicalized.	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#112
Neither are the vast majority of Palestinian Muslims	oberliner	Dec 2016	#113
I must start with an apology here, since I didn't address your comments about Afrikaners	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#115
Not content to endorse apartheid redux in Palestine,	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#120
Great post	Rustyeye77	Dec 2016	#46
Because their ultimate goal isn't peace	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#56
So you honestly believe Arabs want to kill Jews?	Violet_Crumble	Dec 2016	#65
How about this ugly bigotry	Mosby	Dec 2016	#87
It has little to do with belief	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#95
What are the respective faiths of Bosnians and Serbs?	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#125
So, your take is that Islam itself is the real enemy that	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#66
No. There are several peaceful sects of Islam	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#96
Sunnis are 85-90% of all Muslims. 10-15% are Shia.	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#98
The Sunnis could fix the problem fairly easily	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#102
Gelleresque. nt	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#104
Hiteresque.	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#108
Rancid bigotry towards all Muslims won't make Jews any safer nt	geek tragedy	Dec 2016	#110
So this justifies ethnic cleansing of occupied territories?	TomCADem	Dec 2016	#82
Definitely not. nt	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#97
Sharia? Uh, Israel has Sharia courts	Violet_Crumble	Dec 2016	#69
The majority are opposed	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#72
"Americans are not genocidal or supportive of terrorism. "	BumRushDaShow	Dec 2016	#73
Oh look, articles from the distant past and Trump	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#81
trump supporters will claim they aren't racist also	JI7	Dec 2016	#116
At the risk of minimizing racism and intolerance	LittleBlue	Dec 2016	#119
many of them think it's ok to kill innocent black people as seen by the white juries that refuse to	JI7	Dec 2016	#128
Sorry but having the power to enforce any racism/bigotry IS terrorism	BumRushDaShow	Dec 2016	#130
Oh look	BumRushDaShow	Dec 2016	#129
over 40 percent did vote for trump	JI7	Dec 2016	#100
Long time no see	oberliner	Dec 2016	#80
Let's take a look at the Pew study (2013)	Mosby	Dec 2016	#91
How does that make sense?	TheHak	Dec 2016	#105
Antisemitism has nothing to do with semites	oberliner	Dec 2016	#114
My only disappointment	philosslayer	Dec 2016	#15
this	Grey Lemercier	Dec 2016	#68
We should appreciate the last eight years because it will be a	still_one	Dec 2016	#21
Very much appreciate the last 8 years, stillone..	Cha	Dec 2016	#50
The deep, deep irony	ymetca	Dec 2016	#37
Yes, the Israeli lobby + evilgelicals	elmac	Dec 2016	#45
Bibi may have screwed himself	moondust	Dec 2016	#48
I think you are right -- because part of the US ability to protect Israel has been the respect	karynnj	Dec 2016	#93
The situation	moondust	Dec 2016	#121
Thank you President Obama!	pandora nm	Dec 2016	#52
Life imitates art	question everything	Dec 2016	#57
I hear the Orange Hair Brain isn't pleased.	Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin	Dec 2016	#58
Great news!! Thank you President Obama! 36 years too late but still, a win is a win.	Grey Lemercier	Dec 2016	#64
Russia voted for this	oberliner	Dec 2016	#70
kick	Dawson Leery	Dec 2016	#71
Good. n/t	Little Tich	Dec 2016	#74
Bravo. n/t	MBS	Dec 2016	#75
Trump sees West Bank as opportunity	B C Butler	Dec 2016	#78
Thanks Obama! Every little bit helps!	harun	Dec 2016	#79
Interesting development, possibly a rapid rebuke?	ucrdem	Dec 2016	#124

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