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JackRiddler

(24,979 posts)
47. The propaganda ministries? "Of the world"?
Sun Jun 15, 2014, 11:20 PM
Jun 2014

All of the world's "intelligence communities" agreed? Really?

Saddam wanted to pretend he had some nasty gear? That's a real surprise -- you'd think he had a legitimate fear that some insane country on the other side of the globe would come and bomb Iraq. If only he'd had some nukes and delivery systems, the foreign aggression might have been deterred, and the half-million or more people murdered in the war and its aftermaths might still be alive.

Problem is, the actual inspectors on the ground, the most credible ones, made clear that Iraq didn't have this machinery. (And again, if Iraq did, that was no justification for an aggressive invasion!)

Every state that can afford it maintains big agencies (or several) that specialize in lies, propaganda, deception, covert warfare, surveillance of their own populations, political policing, espionage, collaboration with criminal elements and the breaking of laws (their own and those of other countries). You can call these self-perpetuating criminal cultures "intelligence communities," if you like. Anything that comes out of them is going to be self-interested. Sometimes it's in their self-interest to be truthful.

No "conspiracy" (a concept you injected here) is required to expect that some of them might not want to directly contradict their American counterparts (like the NATO partners), or might want to see the Americans invade Iraq (like Saudi and Israel did, for example). Nevertheless, I'll take what Schroeder and Chirac did a lot more seriously than what their spook shops said.

As for the FBI, it is a political police. Like any political police, it extracts the confessions it desires. And what does it matter if Saddam genuinely believes he was successful in fooling the other countries. That doesn't mean they believed it.

Again, if the US and UK had believed their own bullshit, they might have hesitated before striking. They struck KNOWING the target would be helpless.

Anyway, if Democrats had not voted to authorize the aggression, we presumably wouldn't be having this discussion, because you wouldn't need to come up with excuses.

Sunni vs. Shia. Just on a very big scale, now with even worse wackadoodles TwilightGardener Jun 2014 #1
Expansion of Sunni vs. Shia proxy war JCMach1 Jun 2014 #3
Hello, the U.S. caused this... JackRiddler Jun 2014 #5
Iraq was a mistake of tragic proportions, trying to destabilize Syria also a mistake. TwilightGardener Jun 2014 #6
It was not a mistake. It was a crime. JackRiddler Jun 2014 #9
It was a crime by Bush/Cheney, a mistake by those in Congress. I don't believe TwilightGardener Jun 2014 #11
sorry but those in Congress need to do their homework when they're starting a war wordpix Jun 2014 #13
They bear blame for being stupid and too lazy or politically motivated TwilightGardener Jun 2014 #16
The problem with pointing a finger is three more still are pointing back at you nolabels Jun 2014 #22
If they didn't know... JackRiddler Jun 2014 #19
Right no one lied to them the same way they lied to us right? They wouldn't lie to them would they? VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #26
The thing is, a lot of us here knew from the start that it was a lie Art_from_Ark Jun 2014 #41
It was pretty obvious from the get-go villager Jun 2014 #53
Congress was complicit.... mike_c Jun 2014 #29
+1 btrflykng9 Jun 2014 #56
"the US" doesn't bear the responsibility---BushCo and the oil cos. that perpetrated the war do! wordpix Jun 2014 #12
The U.S. government... JackRiddler Jun 2014 #18
They voted for the AUMF which by the way was meant to let the inspectors continue their work... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #27
Incredible inversion of reality! JackRiddler Jun 2014 #33
That is YOUR interpretation.....IT DID in fact require that the weapons inspectors continue.... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #35
History has not and will never forgive the collaborators JackRiddler Jun 2014 #38
Excellent post - thank you! Nihil Jun 2014 #43
Include anybody in Congress who voted to authorize it. They all have access to the same intelligence 24601 Jun 2014 #23
No they don't you are entirely wrong about that.... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #28
No, I'm right. Intelligence products distributed to Congress are available to all members who will 24601 Jun 2014 #31
Then why is an Intelligence committee necessary if they all are privy to ALL the same Presidential VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #32
I had access! JackRiddler Jun 2014 #36
If you used the access you had, then you know that the intelligence communities world-wide reached 24601 Jun 2014 #45
The propaganda ministries? "Of the world"? JackRiddler Jun 2014 #47
I didn't have access, and I knew BushCo was lying. HooptieWagon Jun 2014 #52
I won't argue that Democrats didn't know that Iraq was well contained Old and In the Way Jun 2014 #54
Got rid of Saddam ... GeorgeGist Jun 2014 #2
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2014 #4
Shrubs $900 million embassy in Bagdad doesnt have a chance benld74 Jun 2014 #7
Well, we looted and destroyed their antiquity...beautiful buildings and art work. nt kelliekat44 Jun 2014 #21
Any chance the US can stay out of this one? IronLionZion Jun 2014 #8
The U.S. is up to its eyeballs in this one. JackRiddler Jun 2014 #10
When the vandals are at the gate ... JustABozoOnThisBus Jun 2014 #42
Perhaps we'll nuke it from orbit, just to be sure. Kennah Jun 2014 #46
The war drums are beating and Im afraid we probably headed back there.. DCBob Jun 2014 #14
if the one or two bank robber had kept their mouth shut..they could have come to USA and join the 1% Leme Jun 2014 #15
thinking some, maybe not enough money for being in the 1% Leme Jun 2014 #17
Sorta like the US military and its mercernary contractors did when they invaded, eh? nt kelliekat44 Jun 2014 #20
but ... but ... superdem1984 Jun 2014 #24
This thread isn't about al Qaeda n/t arcane1 Jun 2014 #30
the worlds richest terrorist group is the Bush crime family. olddad56 Jun 2014 #25
Kurds took control of $1.06 Trillion worth of proven oil reserves in Kirkuk KeepItReal Jun 2014 #34
Remember, the ORIGINAL name for the IRAQ war was,,, benld74 Jun 2014 #37
This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Jun 2014 #39
Riyadh sends them a lot more money than what they took. roamer65 Jun 2014 #40
they will loot everything in their path on an epic scale. who the heck funded them? it needs to be Sunlei Jun 2014 #44
Saudis, Qataris, Kuwaitis, and good old USA JCMach1 Jun 2014 #49
I wonder how much of that amount is from U.S. Blue_Tires Jun 2014 #48
And, thank you, W, for creating this mess in the first place. MBS Jun 2014 #50
Blowback is a bitch, thanks Bush. Exultant Democracy Jun 2014 #51
Shit just got real-er. JNelson6563 Jun 2014 #55
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