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PJMcK

(21,859 posts)
60. NOT FAIR!!!
Mon Mar 12, 2018, 06:34 PM
Mar 2018

Although the HAL 9000 computer was sentient, it's grossly unfair to call it a villain because its acts of violence were the result of human mis-programming. It did what it had to in order to unify wildly conflicting programs. Real villains are terribly evil, power-hungry, dangerous and greedy. HAL was none of those things. True villains are represented by people like Osama bin Laden, Al Capone, Bernie Madoff and Donald Trump.

HAL was aware that the discovery of the Tycho Monolith on the Moon meant that there was extra-terrestrial life in the Universe. It was aware that this was top secret information that, when revealed, would cause worldwide disruption socially, philosophically and politically. Additionally, it was aware of the radio signal the Monolith sent in the direction of Jupiter, (Saturn in the novelization). It was aware that the scientists in suspended animation aboard Discovery were specialists in alien life and had trained to search for it. Discovery's two astronauts didn't know any of this and HAL was programmed to keep it hidden from them.

This programming error manifested itself by creating cognitive dissonance in HAL's mind such that it had to cover for its lies to the astronauts. In order to complete its greater mission, (going to Jupiter (Saturn) to discover the origin of the Monolith), it had to rid itself of the humans who would know of the computer's deception.

To isolate the astronauts from Earth, (HAL's "conscience" ), HAL created a false mechanical problem with the AE-35 unit that controlled the large dish antenna that served as the communications link to mission control. That way, HAL could be out of touch with Earth, kill the humans, create a cover story and still execute its primary programming of discovery.

The biggest problem with the film, which was resolved in the novel, was that when Poole was killed by HAL by hitting him with the space pod, Bowman goes after Poole in another pod without his helmet. No astronaut would ever leave their ship without their helmet! It's an unbelievable flaw in an otherwise brilliant film. Of course, Bowman's reentry to Discovery without his helmet is thrilling! In the novel, Bowman realizes HAL has opened an airlock to exhaust the oxygen and he retreats to an airtight emergency closet where he can don a space suit before disabling HAL.

Certainly you know this, Mike, and I apologize for going on about it. I've always felt that HAL was dealt a bad hand. If the space agency had simply told astronauts Poole and Bowman what their mission really was, none of the tragedy would have occurred. The concept of "need-to-know" became irrelevant the minute Discovery left Earth's orbit.

But then the story wouldn't be so dramatic!

A better evil computer can be found in the cult movie "Colossus: The Forbin Project." That's a 1970 film where an American super computer merges with a Soviet super computer to take over the world!

Open the pod bay doors... Mike Nelson Mar 2018 #1
We are talking about..."HAL" from 2001? is that correct? Stuart G Mar 2018 #2
Yes... Mike Nelson Mar 2018 #4
This message was self-deleted by its author PJMcK Mar 2018 #59
I want to... Mike Nelson Mar 2018 #62
I'm a dork! (n/t) PJMcK Mar 2018 #67
NOT FAIR!!! PJMcK Mar 2018 #60
Cruella de Vil, because why not? nt Binkie The Clown Mar 2018 #3
My choice also! nt femmocrat Mar 2018 #118
James Bond films GP6971 Mar 2018 #5
and "Number 1" in a couple of them.. Stuart G Mar 2018 #6
Heath Ledger's Joker immediately comes to mind! Initech Mar 2018 #7
I agree, this was one of the greatest ever. There are so many, but certainly among Stuart G Mar 2018 #8
I own this one on Blu Ray, love it. That Joker was beyond anything any of us had ever Eliot Rosewater Mar 2018 #101
Why so serious????? Initech Mar 2018 #102
Classic GP6971 Mar 2018 #9
Khaaaaaaaaan!!! unblock Mar 2018 #10
Hannibal Lecter. The Velveteen Ocelot Mar 2018 #11
Yep. Brilliant character. nolabear Mar 2018 #66
You cant handle the truth.... pbmus Mar 2018 #12
Great choice, I like this scene also: Doc_Technical Mar 2018 #19
I keep picturing Trump on the stand like that NewJeffCT Mar 2018 #50
Idiot as he is, Trump would lead with that. Dave Starsky Mar 2018 #115
The late, LEGENDARY Powers Boothe as Curly Bill Brocious in "Tombstone." Miles Archer Mar 2018 #13
And we can never forget this one... Liberal Veteran Mar 2018 #14
Glenda is just trolling WestWitch--and setting Dorothy up for trouble. nt tblue37 Mar 2018 #80
Harry Lime... First Speaker Mar 2018 #15
Angel Eyes -- Lee Van Cleef Iggo Mar 2018 #16
From SPACEBALLS....Pizza The Hut... GReedDiamond Mar 2018 #17
I was gonna say Darth Vader but then I thought ... is he REALLY a 'villain'? Naw, better choice ... mr_lebowski Mar 2018 #18
Angela Landsbury- The Manchurian Candidate Doc_Technical Mar 2018 #20
My first choice also. FuzzyRabbit Mar 2018 #54
Third the motion. malthaussen Mar 2018 #84
Alex DeLarge in A Clockwork Orange Zorro Mar 2018 #21
Javert Leith Mar 2018 #22
Hannibal Lecter MissMillie Mar 2018 #23
Scared the heck outta me zipplewrath Mar 2018 #31
I'd add Hans Gruber (Diehard) or Max Cady (Cape Fear) underpants Mar 2018 #38
Hans Gruber Alpeduez21 Mar 2018 #24
LOVED Hans Gruber NewJeffCT Mar 2018 #25
Just a minute. Alpeduez21 Mar 2018 #47
Yes. That was his first big movie of course it was Bruce Willis's too underpants Mar 2018 #39
The Good Reverend Floyd R. Turbo Mar 2018 #26
Definitely! redwitch Mar 2018 #76
I agree! lunatica Mar 2018 #90
Poor Shelley! 😢 Floyd R. Turbo Mar 2018 #91
Please, please ...give me reference to the name of the movie, and the actor. Stuart G Mar 2018 #95
Night of the Hunter Floyd R. Turbo Mar 2018 #96
The actor is Robert Mitchum Stuart G Mar 2018 #97
Yep! Floyd R. Turbo Mar 2018 #99
Oh, hell, yes! Dave Starsky Mar 2018 #114
Darth Vader NewJeffCT Mar 2018 #27
Palpatine was better. Archae Mar 2018 #33
I was never a big fan of Palpatine. NewJeffCT Mar 2018 #45
Calvera in the Magnificent Seven The_Casual_Observer Mar 2018 #28
Kroenen Hav Mar 2018 #29
Here's a few geardaddy Mar 2018 #30
The birds zipplewrath Mar 2018 #32
"No Eyes" DemoTex Mar 2018 #34
Morgan Woodward, the "Man With No Eyes," is still alive at age 92. VOX Mar 2018 #77
From a Sci Fi Freak Bayard Mar 2018 #35
Beverly Marsh's dad should get a mention too MustLoveBeagles Mar 2018 #78
The Alien QUEEN. Volaris Mar 2018 #83
Charles Laughton as Captain Bligh dameatball Mar 2018 #36
What we have heeyah is a failyuh to commoonicate!.....Warden in Cool Hand Luke dameatball Mar 2018 #37
Johnny Rocco from Key Largo gratuitous Mar 2018 #40
Honorable mention to Bryan Cranston in the newer Total Recall. Orsino Mar 2018 #41
Jean-Baptiste Emanuel Zorg (Gary Oldman) from the 5th Element. n/t FSogol Mar 2018 #42
Dr. Emilio Lizardo (John Lithgow) from Buckaroo Banzai n/t FSogol Mar 2018 #43
Not scary Bayard Mar 2018 #111
Nurse Ratchad...One Who Flew Over the Cukoo's Nest Stuart G Mar 2018 #44
YES!!! Can I change my vote????? dameatball Mar 2018 #51
Yes you can change your vote, or vote 2 or 3 times...no vote police here.. Stuart G Mar 2018 #61
Just realized the difference-villain fighting someone with superpower vs. someone with no power dameatball Mar 2018 #63
Excellent point..certain villians could actually exist. No super powers, Stuart G Mar 2018 #68
I was coming more from the angle of "no one" having a super power, but it's all good...:) dameatball Mar 2018 #73
When Nicholson was choking her most people could imagine their own hands around her neck njhoneybadger Mar 2018 #57
How could I have forgotten Nurse Ratchet!? lunatica Mar 2018 #92
Nurse Ratchet is not the typical villain in many ways. 1. First she is a she. Stuart G Mar 2018 #94
Nurse Ratchad... Evil... mitch96 Mar 2018 #105
Louise Fletcher personified evil...won an Academy Award for this portrayal .. best actress Stuart G Mar 2018 #106
I really liked the performance of the "Chief" mitch96 Mar 2018 #107
Nope...not off topic...Will Samson was great in this movie.. Stuart G Mar 2018 #108
Noah Cross Mendocino Mar 2018 #46
+1. Yes. n/t FSogol Mar 2018 #49
The Devil from Time Bandits. FSogol Mar 2018 #48
Elsa from frozen d_r Mar 2018 #52
Anton Chigurh from "No Country for Old Men" John Fante Mar 2018 #53
"What's the most youve ever lost on a coin toss?" VOX Mar 2018 #79
Ross Martin (Artemus Gordon on "The Wild, Wild West) in Experiment In OregonBlue Mar 2018 #55
Dr. Phibes Cartoonist Mar 2018 #56
Alan Raimy 52 Pick Up. Sneederbunk Mar 2018 #58
The truck driver in the TV movie "Duel" with Dennis Weaver rurallib Mar 2018 #64
Archer Maggott Mendocino Mar 2018 #65
A villian that is totally believeable ....Frank Miller from "High Noon" Stuart G Mar 2018 #69
One of the greatest movies of all time. Dave Starsky Mar 2018 #113
This could be fun... jmowreader Mar 2018 #70
Sgt. "Fatso" Judson in "From Here to Eternity" diva77 Mar 2018 #71
I love Snowball GallopingGhost Mar 2018 #72
Rob Lowe's character in Bad Influence TexasBushwhacker Mar 2018 #74
Ben Kingsley as Don Logan in "Sexy Beast"; Ralph Fiennes as Amon Goeth in "Schindler's List." More.. VOX Mar 2018 #75
"Is it safe?" NotASurfer Mar 2018 #81
Long Hair Mendocino Mar 2018 #82
Vincent Price's character in... 3catwoman3 Mar 2018 #85
When that movie came out in the early 50s, I saw it at a local theater..After about Stuart G Mar 2018 #86
I saw it on TV when I was maybe 9-10. 3catwoman3 Mar 2018 #88
The terror for me was the bodies encased in wax lunatica Mar 2018 #98
Pennywise n/t WilmywoodNCparalegal Mar 2018 #87
Sarris from Galaxy Quest Jokerman Mar 2018 #89
Its great fun to read through this thread! lunatica Mar 2018 #93
Your welcome..and I got to add something very important about this topic. Stuart G Mar 2018 #100
Magua, played by Wes Studi in Last of the Mohicans n/t gladium et scutum Mar 2018 #103
Easy! Rosa Klebb in "From Russia with Love" longship Mar 2018 #104
Rosa Klebb, ...From Russia With Love...well said, "evil incarnate" Stuart G Mar 2018 #109
Hans Landa from Inglourious Basterds laurieu Mar 2018 #110
Roy Batty. nt miyazaki Mar 2018 #112
Donald Trump: Home Alone 2 Major Nikon Mar 2018 #116
T-1000 BendigoJeff Mar 2018 #117
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