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Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
2. The anti-Corbyn types probably could have persuaded Corbyn to go...
Mon Mar 20, 2017, 09:33 PM
Mar 2017

if only they had made THESE guarantees in exchange for his leaving:

1) That there WOULD be a Left candidate on the subsequent leadership ballot.


2) That all the suspensions and expulsions imposed on Labour supporters and members by the party's extreme right-wing Iain MacNicol, would be reversed and all those barred from voting in the leadership contest in 2016 would be allowed to vote in the subsequent leadership contest.

Instead, they offered him nothing at all besides a meaningless and intentionally humiliating new job as "party president"-a position in which he would have no say in policy, would be able to do nothing to defend his supporters from attack and probable expulsion, and would be expected to offer unquestioning public support to whatever the next leader did, no matter how offensive and right-wing that leader's actions are certain to be.


Without those guarantees, we all know that the PLP wouldn't allow anyone to the left of Yvette Cooper on the leadership ballot-in fact, that the anti-Corbynites might not allow anyone but a single right-wing candidate-and then act as though they had the right to EXPECT everyone to unite behind whoever THAT leader was in exactly the way they all refused to ever give Jeremy a chance.


Can you at least agree with me that it was never reasonable for the PLP to expect Jeremy Corbyn to agree to anything remotely like that?

Remember, the PLP are the folks whose response to the 2015 defeat, a defeat in which the the poor were blameless, was to push for the party to stop fighting benefit cuts-it hadn't even fought MOST of the cuts under Ed-and to start voting for more and more cuts AND for the cruel and completely unjustified benefits sanctions policies Cameron and Osborne had imposed. The PLP STILL doesn't understand that it was their insistence on doing that, on reducing Labour to being nothing but the party of slightly smaller cuts, that caused the Corbyn phenomenon to happen. And they STILL don't understand that, if they drag Labour back to that set of ideas, the party will no longer have any reason to exist.

A Labour Party permanently committed to austerity, military intervention in the Arab/Muslim world, and the preservation of Thatcher's union laws couldn't be different than the Tories on any major issues at all. It couldn't ever do anything compassionate or solidaristic or humane. No one anywhere in the UK would ever vote for such a party. What would be the point?

Why would anyone ever vote for a party like that?

I understand that you are a Remain supporter...if I lived in the UK, I'd have voted Remain. But it's time to stop acting as if Corbyn could single-handedly have won a Remain victory. He made many speeches for the Remain cause. But there was never the possibility that the actions of one man could have overcome the horrible campaign the Remain side conducted.

All I will say here... T_i_B Mar 2017 #1
The anti-Corbyn types probably could have persuaded Corbyn to go... Ken Burch Mar 2017 #2
It's not all about Corbyn at this point. It's barely even about Labour any more. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #3
There are valid points in what you've said. Ken Burch Mar 2017 #4
There's not much point having a leader if he/she doesn't lead. n/t Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #5
No one the PLP would accept would lead-all they care about is putting a "moderate" in. Ken Burch Mar 2017 #6
And too many of the Corbynites care only about kicking the moderates out T_i_B Mar 2017 #7
The "moderates" could stop all of that if they just stopped scheming against the current leader. Ken Burch Mar 2017 #12
Wrong. T_i_B Mar 2017 #13
Would you agree with what I suggested above... Ken Burch Mar 2017 #17
No T_i_B Mar 2017 #18
Care to say why my theories are garbage? Ken Burch Mar 2017 #20
Dude - read what I've written above. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #9
I don't want to talk about Corbyn or anti-Corbyn either....but the anti-people "Labour" MPs Ken Burch Mar 2017 #14
"The best approach was to fight to save multicultural Britain in a post-Brexit world." Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #30
In the here and now, there was never any chance that ANY Tory MPs would defy May on Article 50. Ken Burch Mar 2017 #32
Nonsense. There are Tory MPs who are opposed, Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #33
Thanks Denzil T_i_B Mar 2017 #8
If Corbyn hasn't disappointed me on the Scottish issue, Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #10
I actually feel sorry for Kezia Dugdale T_i_B Mar 2017 #11
Why is she even still leading Holyrood Labour after a third-place finish? Ken Burch Mar 2017 #15
Who else is there in Scottish Labour? T_i_B Mar 2017 #16
Is it a requirement that the Scottish Labour leader be a sitting MSP? Ken Burch Mar 2017 #19
Party leaders should always be elected officials T_i_B Mar 2017 #21
That creates a dilemma: Ken Burch Mar 2017 #22
Labour's rivals would love that proposal T_i_B Mar 2017 #23
Why on earth is it so important to you that Scottish Labour survives? Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #27
Only because Labour needs to make a comeback in Scotland... Ken Burch Mar 2017 #28
I've had to knock this myth down before. Sorry, your first argument is just nonsense. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #29
I respect your opinions. Ken Burch Mar 2017 #31
I could make some guesses where you might have read stuff like that. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #34
I appreciate the additional information. Ken Burch Mar 2017 #35
That's a shame. One would hope for better. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #36
Her deputy, Alex Rowley, would be in improvement in all sorts of ways. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #24
OK, we have a point of agreement, finally. Denzil_DC Mar 2017 #25
This message was self-deleted by its author Warpy Mar 2017 #26
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