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Denzil_DC

(7,222 posts)
17. See, for you it's the luxury of being a hypothetical issue.
Wed Jun 21, 2017, 05:36 AM
Jun 2017

It's not for us. It's all too real.

You have little idea of the dynamics at play here. You're craven that standing up for something that's right will deprive your precious "Jeremy" and Labour of their chance to screw up as badly as the Tories if they don't change their current trajectory.

It's not sequential. The very process of Brexit hands theoretically pretty much unlimited power to the Tories via the Great Repeal Act because of Labour's failure to take a stand earlier in the process when the way was cleared for the government to repeal any legislation that Act will embody into UK law without having to consult parliament, let alone hold votes.

As things stand, there's nothing constitutionally standing in the way of a future government (this one technically hasn't taken power yet) stripping away decades of human rights and worker and environmental protection legislation. Part of that is opening up our NHS to increased privatization and greater involvement of (especially US) multinationals.

Labour may hit lucky if we have another election soon, but it's a gamble, no government should have unlimited power like that, and as we've seen recently, political fortunes can turn on a sixpence at the moment. You can't grasp this, and I'm tired of having to explain all this to you over and over again (in this thread alone!). If you read the post at the link I gave you, those 51 Labour Party members have put out a pretty coherent statement of what's at stake, so read it if you're that interested.

And if I was very cynical and independence meant more than anything else to me, I'd be rooting for a Tory majority in the UK - which party was in power when Scotland held the last referendum? But I'm not a Scottish Labour Party politician, so I never root for the Tories.

If you were very cynical, you'd be thanking your lucky stars that Labour didn't win the last election, because Brexit is unworkable, and the party in power while it's being negotiated is likely to pay very dearly electorally, as they'll own the disaster.

Now give it a rest, huh?

I'd have a bit more respect for the arguments there... Ken Burch Jun 2017 #1
Ha, wondered when you'd be along. Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #2
Is there any possible honorable way for Labour to go full-on anti-Brexit at this point? Ken Burch Jun 2017 #3
OK, I'll try to take this para by para. But first your OP line: Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #4
I'm aware that a large group of Labour politicians before Corbyn came along Ken Burch Jun 2017 #5
Do you have any idea the economic mess the UK was in before it joined the EC? Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #6
What was done to Greece is what will be done to ANY left government under the EU. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #7
You mentioned the Attlee example simply because you don't have any answer at all Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #8
There is some pretty good stuff in Labour's platform... T_i_B Jun 2017 #9
Thanks, T_i_B. Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #10
The reason why they can get away with it right now.... T_i_B Jun 2017 #11
"white van man", not "white can man" Ken Burch Jun 2017 #12
Dude, if you're going to pick on an obvious typo Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #13
Sorry, the "can man" thing was meant as a joke Ken Burch Jun 2017 #14
Read this thread here: Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #15
I know the routine. And I'd have voted Remain. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #16
See, for you it's the luxury of being a hypothetical issue. Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #17
This is pretty much the same argument.... T_i_B Jun 2017 #18
Well, the Labour manifesto's carefully worded. Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #19
I'm not "rabid anti-EU". I support them on the parts of what they do that are progressive. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #25
Well, "Jeremy" must be a grave disappointment to you. Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #27
I'm fine with what Corbyn's doing there. I've never been rabidly anti-EU and you know it. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #28
First of all, I do agree that the Remain campaign was very poor; that if it had been better we might LeftishBrit Jun 2017 #29
"I think your feelings about Corbyn are driven by he apparent Labour-Tory cooperation in Scotland." Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #30
OK, I withdraw the word "apparent"...I use that word to mean "essentially proved" Ken Burch Jun 2017 #32
Well, if he stopped telling blatant lies about the SNP's record in government when he comes up here Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #33
You are assuming that the two are separable LeftishBrit Jun 2017 #21
'All it can lead to is lost seats...' LeftishBrit Jun 2017 #22
While I do not defend the EU's treatment of Greece, it was not mainly an ideological assault LeftishBrit Jun 2017 #23
You seem not to have noticed that Denmark now has a right-wing, anti-immigrant government Ken Burch Jun 2017 #26
So the EU's responsible for the choices of the Danish electorate? Denzil_DC Jun 2017 #31
'The EU didn't exist when Labour created the post-war social welfare state' LeftishBrit Jun 2017 #24
Good article! LeftishBrit Jun 2017 #20
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