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Gun Control & RKBA

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petronius

(26,602 posts)
Sat Jan 11, 2014, 06:53 PM Jan 2014

"Guns on Campus: A Chilling Effect" by Kenneth M. Mash (NEA, Thought & Action) [View all]

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In Keyishian v. Board of Regents of the University of the State of New York (1967), the U.S. Supreme Court asserted that the college “classroom is peculiarly the ‘marketplace of ideas,’” and it has pointed to the necessity of training leaders to consider a variety of perspectives.1 The common expectation of the college experience is one where faculty will challenge students’ beliefs and students will challenge each other. We expect that engaging tough conversations about deeply held beliefs can result in intellectual growth. But this is the type of activity that often also results in emotional responses and high tempers. Successfully navigating these stormy waters can be a challenge, and not everyone allows those conversations and challenges to take place because of the risks. Throw in the possibility that some-one is armed with a deadly weapon, and one might reasonably ask whether it is worth the potential risk to themselves or to other students.

Creating a true marketplace of ideas free from offensive language, as any professor can attest, is a challenge. There are even disagreements about the conditions that will best lead to an atmosphere that is conducive to open and honest discussion. Whatever our perspectives, there can be no doubt that, at minimum, there should not be any fear on the part of the students or faculty that they could be subject to violence or the threat of violence brought about by the use of a deadly weapon. Many have written on the overall topic of safety with regard to allowing guns on college campuses. However, not much has been said about how allowing the possession of deadly weapons can create a “chilling effect” on academic discussions. The Supreme Court has frequently used the notion of a “chilling effect” to strike down laws that potentially punish speech and that potentially keep people from expressing their views out of fear that they will have to litigate to protect their free speech rights. To the degree that allowing people to carry weapons on campus stifles open discussion, limits the marketplace of ideas, and hinders training students about engaging difficult ideas that challenge their core values, it also creates a “chilling effect.”

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http://www.nea.org/assets/docs/HE/TA2013Mash.pdf

http://www.nea.org/home/1821.htm

Prof. Mash argues that allowing legal CCW on campus would create fear and stifle discussion, but I think the argument is based on erroneous assumptions about how CCW holders behave. If students would be inspired to whip out a gun during a heated academic discussion, why are CCW holders not doing that as a matter of course in other arenas? By the same token, almost every student in the classroom is armed with a fist - and the psychological barrier to throwing a punch has got to be lower than pulling a trigger - yet classroom discussion sessions rarely seem to escalate into brawls...
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So, based on your argument, guns in class make it a safer environment for learning and discussion? Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #1
My argument is that there is no compelling reason to treat university spaces petronius Jan 2014 #2
In principle, I agree with you Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #17
I don't agree that there is anything incendiary or disruptive about a petronius Jan 2014 #23
Really? You don;t see it? Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #29
Not convoluted at all - as I said in the OP, concerns about CCW on campus petronius Jan 2014 #36
I appreciate your thoughtful reply Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #42
No but makes for a safer environment for going across campus in the middle of the night. gejohnston Jan 2014 #4
I always love it when men use female vulnerability to justify carrying guns around. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #18
mostly because they are buying guns in greater numbers gejohnston Jan 2014 #21
Trying to convince everybody who carried concealed that they have a mental defect... krispos42 Jan 2014 #28
Not a mental defect, but a behavioral disorder. And not everyone. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #30
I think I will decide ..... oldhippie Jan 2014 #31
Did I say I would decide? I thought not. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #33
You decided that a classroom ..... oldhippie Jan 2014 #34
Prefaced by "I think" Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #37
Uh, a decision is an opinion oldhippie Jan 2014 #39
If it's not scary for you, then it isn't for me. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #40
The hippie time was a long time ago ...... oldhippie Jan 2014 #41
Virtually every hippy I knew/know had a gun or knew how to use one. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #43
Right. LOL Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #44
The world is a big place; almost as big as your mind. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #45
The problem with "certain times and in certain places" krispos42 Jan 2014 #35
Depends on the individual and threat assessment. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #38
Won't make a difference. This prof is speculating Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #46
You equate classrooms with pool halls, restaurants and feed lots? Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #49
But wait! There's more! Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #50
Absolutely. Straw Man Jan 2014 #51
Of course, I think it ridiculous to carry in any of those places. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #53
I know that you do. Straw Man Jan 2014 #54
CC puts innocent bystanders at risk pscot Jan 2014 #3
How so? gejohnston Jan 2014 #5
People with guns are a danger to themselves and everyone around them. pscot Jan 2014 #6
depending on where you are Duckhunter935 Jan 2014 #7
Now why don't I find that reassuring? pscot Jan 2014 #10
do you understand the definition of vigilante? gejohnston Jan 2014 #11
Read your history, dude pscot Jan 2014 #12
I know history quite well. gejohnston Jan 2014 #13
Read your dictionary, dude. Straw Man Jan 2014 #14
With that attitude I hope you don't live in NYC clffrdjk Jan 2014 #8
Or LA Duckhunter935 Jan 2014 #9
Did you forget what the CC stands for? Jenoch Jan 2014 #15
"Gun Chi", we've had a few folks here who claimed they could "just tell" DonP Jan 2014 #19
"One of them has been banned, ..." Jenoch Jan 2014 #22
It is the same one who claimed a bicycle tire was a acceptable defensive item. oneshooter Jan 2014 #25
I enjoy a good debate, but that one Jenoch Jan 2014 #26
There's gotta be an app for that. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #47
I had both a shotgun and a rifle in my college dorm room, Jenoch Jan 2014 #16
I agree with your hypothosis on Mash's erroneous assumptions. ManiacJoe Jan 2014 #20
Very well said. Bazinga Jan 2014 #24
In my experience... krispos42 Jan 2014 #27
Why do they discount Virginia Tech and NIU? DonP Jan 2014 #32
Alcohol Free Dorms HockeyMom Jan 2014 #52
Try to pay attention to the subject under discussion DonP Jan 2014 #55
Not "feel" but BE and LIVE around guns HockeyMom Jan 2014 #56
So, you know a lot of 21+ year olds that still live in dorms huh? DonP Jan 2014 #57
You start college at 18 HockeyMom Jan 2014 #58
You really don't know Jack Shit about this do you? DonP Jan 2014 #59
There's a BIG difference between... Bazinga Jan 2014 #60
My experience at UF (C.'70): Upper division courses met in the Rathskeller. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #48
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