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Gothmog

(143,999 posts)
204. Go ahead and ignore history
Thu Sep 17, 2015, 08:48 AM
Sep 2015

I volunteered in 1972 and remember that campaign. The anti-war passion back then is very similar to the Sanders supporters' passion on income inequality. Passion alone is not sufficient to win a race and 1972 is a great example.

As for conservatives voting for Obama, I remember Limbaugh's operation chaos plan was to encourage republicans to vote for Hillary Clinton to delay President Obama from being the nominee. By the time the Super Tuesday primaries, Obama was scaring the GOP with his fund raising machine. Remember, President Obama drastically outspent McCain in 2008 and had the passion on his side.

Again, I both study and understand the history.

Kicked and recommended. nt Bonobo Sep 2015 #1
Forget the liberal label. It's corporatists vs populists. n/t Skwmom Sep 2015 #2
Well yes and no Armstead Sep 2015 #4
There are Conservative Populists, Moderate Populists, Liberal Populists, Progressive Populists Skwmom Sep 2015 #11
I think the OP is correct about the split in the party. The DLC/Third Way takeover sabrina 1 Sep 2015 #17
What sabrina said. n/t SusanaMontana41 Sep 2015 #174
You are absolutely right. Aerows Sep 2015 #110
Here's another truism: DIVIDE TO CONQUER. Hortensis Sep 2015 #122
Here's the thing Aerows Sep 2015 #127
This mood you describe is precious and so hard purchased. I just hope Hortensis Sep 2015 #130
"he's not a thousandth so full of himself as some of the people here" Aerows Sep 2015 #133
You need to understand that many with interest newly awakened to the Hortensis Sep 2015 #139
"You need to understand" Aerows Sep 2015 #142
"You need to understand"? How condescending. SusanaMontana41 Sep 2015 #175
We cannot be afraid of invisible people who may or may not artislife Sep 2015 #168
Your posts are full of attacks on your fellow DUers, express and implied, DUers who had not yet merrily Sep 2015 #188
No, they're full of explanations of what "United We Stand" means Hortensis Sep 2015 #270
I was not the only one to notice your insults. Get a clue. merrily Sep 2015 #271
I'd be laughing. SusanaMontana41 Sep 2015 #283
. merrily Sep 2015 #284
You guys sure know how to party. SusanaMontana41 Sep 2015 #287
Are you kidding? Get over here. merrily Sep 2015 #288
We'll need to discuss that, a little further down the road. SusanaMontana41 Sep 2015 #290
You Talk Marty McGraw Sep 2015 #177
Marty, Bernie IS new to the role he plays now. To a very real degree, Hortensis Sep 2015 #272
He is not the leader of a nascent movement. He's a traditional Democrat. merrily Sep 2015 #187
Traditional Democrats were not the ones who initiated the division. The DLCers/New Democrats did. merrily Sep 2015 #186
Truth is, we need a different term. Liberal does have a component of laissez faire corporatism, merrily Sep 2015 #185
Personally I like progressive populist Armstead Sep 2015 #231
Progressive populist is les ambiguous than either term alone, I think. merrily Sep 2015 #234
Well yeah but....I thin k a lot of people have no idea of what traditional Democrat is anymore Armstead Sep 2015 #237
Okay, you've convinced me. I'm going back to we need a new term. merrily Sep 2015 #241
How about iDem? Armstead Sep 2015 #243
I have no idea what that means (so it's probably perfect). merrily Sep 2015 #244
iPhine,iPad,iPod....everything today is iThis Armstead Sep 2015 #245
Okay, so as in internet Dems. Wouldn't that be covered by Netroots? merrily Sep 2015 #246
P.S. You don't have to "try" to be cool. You ARE cool. merrily Sep 2015 #247
Merrily, liberal is also 1 of 2 or 3 basic personality types. You could reject it because Hortensis Sep 2015 #275
K&R! n/t Catherina Sep 2015 #3
very true ibegurpard Sep 2015 #5
Pick a side there is NO middle ground! YabaDabaNoDinoNo Sep 2015 #6
The middle is where you find yellow stripes and roadkill. Scuba Sep 2015 #20
+1 a whole bunch! Enthusiast Sep 2015 #113
++ fadedrose Sep 2015 #129
... Erich Bloodaxe BSN Sep 2015 #151
Until now, traditional Democrats have been the road kill. merrily Sep 2015 #189
IMO, very ridiculous. Where do you think 50 million Democrats are standing? Hortensis Sep 2015 #125
Wow. Condescend much? You think we don't know about forging alliances or about Bernie? merrily Sep 2015 #190
Right on. You're either corporate or you're not. SusanaMontana41 Sep 2015 #173
I think middle ground exists, but the middle is not where DLC types say it is. merrily Sep 2015 #191
Agreed. K&R LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #7
Recommended. Additionally, I think there's an honesty divide Ron Green Sep 2015 #8
You hit on an important point Armstead Sep 2015 #10
A question for the bubble-dwellers ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #21
1. Because of her Wall Street donors. Admiral Loinpresser Sep 2015 #27
You actually addressed the questions as you see it ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #78
JUmping in for a second Armstead Sep 2015 #86
Refreshing! Admiral Loinpresser Sep 2015 #111
As a mother of a 20 year old, I can azmom Sep 2015 #138
Okay, so like Armstead, you see corporate mergers as being the problem? ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #141
Can't say I agree with all that. RichVRichV Sep 2015 #153
+1 and a 1000 Marty McGraw Sep 2015 #178
We're going to have to agree to disagree ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #248
Much of that is untrue. RichVRichV Sep 2015 #268
It is very very true ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #277
Not quite. RichVRichV Sep 2015 #278
Here is the crux of the issue ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #285
Now you're confusing the NLRB. RichVRichV Sep 2015 #286
Great post Gothmog Sep 2015 #28
They're not narrow slots -- Just the opposite Armstead Sep 2015 #39
You are very very wrong in your assessment Gothmog Sep 2015 #73
Many others seem to disagree with you. Armstead Sep 2015 #77
You are welcomed to your opinions no matter how wrong you are Gothmog Sep 2015 #83
I appeciate your work...seriously Armstead Sep 2015 #84
The bulk of the party fits into your category of corporate democrats Gothmog Sep 2015 #107
I can debunk the $17 trillion claim in under two minutes. RichVRichV Sep 2015 #156
Do you really believe this? Gothmog Sep 2015 #167
Don't Mess with Texas artislife Sep 2015 #169
Do you want to compare how many delegats Texas has compared to Iowa and NH? Gothmog Sep 2015 #258
I saw the delegate count artislife Sep 2015 #261
I spent a ton of time last cycle helping people get ids Gothmog Sep 2015 #264
They're not my numbers. RichVRichV Sep 2015 #172
Rember Berniacs Marty McGraw Sep 2015 #179
Do you know how many delegates Texas has to the DNC? Gothmog Sep 2015 #259
Your pedantic claim that only you live "in the real world" is tiresome bullshit LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #219
How many campaigns have you worked on? Gothmog Sep 2015 #257
One, thank you very much. And I reiterate, your claim is pedantic, tiresome, condescending bullshit LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #262
Time will tell Gothmog Sep 2015 #263
In the primary, it will be uphill for Sanders LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #267
None of those things are the reasons why McGovern lost that election. And, this ain't 1972. merrily Sep 2015 #192
Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it Gothmog Sep 2015 #194
Yes. So stop ignoring the real reasons why McGovern lost and the real differences between 1972 and merrily Sep 2015 #196
McGovern was the candidate selected by Nixon Gothmog Sep 2015 #199
I no longer attempt substantive replies to in the face of insulting, arrogant posts. merrily Sep 2015 #201
Go ahead and ignore history Gothmog Sep 2015 #204
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=601007 merrily Sep 2015 #208
I disagree mostly with yout premise Armstead Sep 2015 #236
Most people who are looking at the polls believe that Clinton will be the nominee Gothmog Sep 2015 #255
FWIW malokvale77 Sep 2015 #223
Thanks, malokvale77. I never have a problem with anyone's disagreement on issues, even if merrily Sep 2015 #225
Yes: See 2010 and 2014 for the effects of running candidates unwilling to take LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #220
I would disagree that a majority of the party doesn't share this view dflprincess Sep 2015 #163
So the nationwide polls are all wrong? Gothmog Sep 2015 #166
Nationwide polls? They show that, given a real choice, Americans are more liberal than the 3rd way merrily Sep 2015 #193
Apologies for the OT, but I want to make sure you see this. merrily Sep 2015 #209
Thanks - great ideas. dflprincess Sep 2015 #280
I certainly felt this schism back in 2008 when Edwards left the race then... cascadiance Sep 2015 #75
Edwards....um, that was kind of an embarassing chapter Armstead Sep 2015 #79
As did many of us, who liked that he was speaking more on many of the inequality issues directly... cascadiance Sep 2015 #134
Edwards, who was a third way legislator, was a slick talking snake oil salesman. JMO merrily Sep 2015 #198
A schism has been in the Party since Lincoln. FDR, HST, JFK and LBJ all dealt with it. merrily Sep 2015 #195
The problem we have is that we must draw the line somewhere. If Clinton wins the WH rhett o rick Sep 2015 #118
and I will say Marty McGraw Sep 2015 #180
A country that cares about its PEOPLE. merrily Sep 2015 #200
Despise? No.... daleanime Sep 2015 #31
The name-calling betrays your emotionalism ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #61
Huh? You're not a 'Proud Member of the Reality Based Community'? daleanime Sep 2015 #71
name calling? Armstead Sep 2015 #87
Not to put too fine a point on it... ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #93
You're probably right but it works both ways Armstead Sep 2015 #99
........ daleanime Sep 2015 #128
At best, I think you're oversimplifying ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #132
We're never going to agree but... Armstead Sep 2015 #150
I thought that exchange was pretty civil treestar Sep 2015 #273
So many fallacies, so little time hueymahl Sep 2015 #164
"because Hillary Clinton is very much a liberal" LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #221
Sorry, I don't think Conservative Democrat is right at all. Compare earlier posts in the Bernie merrily Sep 2015 #203
Who started what and went way overboard with it is a matter of perception. merrily Sep 2015 #202
I liked "bubble dwellers" Fairgo Sep 2015 #96
Like drinking champagne inside a geodesic dome! Cheers! merrily Sep 2015 #205
Heee! nt artislife Sep 2015 #254
name calling? didn't you post up thread that liberals are actually communists who are Doctor_J Sep 2015 #152
Their name calling of us doesn't count, only our criticism of a professional politician on issues merrily Sep 2015 #211
What do your insults "betray" then? merrily Sep 2015 #217
You're doing exactky what I was referring to Armstead Sep 2015 #35
Oh, let me add the Kafka-esque accusations ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #56
You're right. "Thanks for playing" is not serious Armstead Sep 2015 #58
You should google my tagline ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #66
I'm not sure of which perjorative you are referring to in the OP Armstead Sep 2015 #68
"Pro-Business" is a Liberal capitalist. "Corporatist" is a Conservative capitalist. ieoeja Sep 2015 #76
So where did you get the idea that Secretary Clinton is a "Conservative Capitalist" ? ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #82
Would you prefer Third-Wing or Neoliberal (both terms she has called herself)? ieoeja Sep 2015 #95
I prefer to look at voting records... ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #102
Let me guess: She voted with her caucus most or all of the time. Big whoop. merrily Sep 2015 #212
You're to the right of Clinton, who'd a guessed that? LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #222
Terrible post. Ron Green Sep 2015 #80
Sounds like you're calling us communists. senz Sep 2015 #85
People who can't distinguish between Hillary/Obama on one side... ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #98
So why is the ACA healthcare a modern version of conservative GOP Romneycare? Armstead Sep 2015 #105
Excellent question. I'll let Newt Gingrich answer that one: ConservativeDemocrat Sep 2015 #143
But Hillary campaigned for a mandate in 2008 dreamnightwind Sep 2015 #265
Romneycare was modeled on Billarycare, which was modeled on Heritage Foundationcare, which was merrily Sep 2015 #206
You obviously don't know what a communist is. senz Sep 2015 #162
Pssst. Posting arrogant insults does not make them true. merrily Sep 2015 #213
You are absolutely correct. bvar22 Sep 2015 #135
old-fashioned communists passiveporcupine Sep 2015 #144
Whose game, I wonder? merrily Sep 2015 #214
Nobody here is an "old-fashioned communist", buddy. Ken Burch Sep 2015 #171
Amen. Corporatism is not DirkGently Sep 2015 #104
so spot on -- it's about leveling the playing field so everyone can compete. nashville_brook Sep 2015 #233
Bernie wants controlled capitalism d_legendary1 Sep 2015 #38
I've a sorta similar version chknltl Sep 2015 #108
+1 You nailed it. Enthusiast Sep 2015 #117
IMO Most people don't have to know where the money is going d_legendary1 Sep 2015 #140
Huge +1! Enthusiast Sep 2015 #116
+1 a whole bunch! Enthusiast Sep 2015 #114
Yes, that is it. The collision course was set and now is coming to fruition, mmonk Sep 2015 #9
Which is where I feel Obama had his biggest failure.... daleanime Sep 2015 #18
I tend to agree with that unfortunately Armstead Sep 2015 #46
It's a matter of perspective Scootaloo Sep 2015 #60
Damn fine perspective Scootaloo Aerows Sep 2015 #136
An opinion that I share. Enthusiast Sep 2015 #119
Yes, you are correct. I still remember the cat food commission mmonk Sep 2015 #184
Sorry, I'm not following. Who do you mean by "we?" Democratic politicians or Democratic voters? merrily Sep 2015 #215
I mean all of us... daleanime Sep 2015 #226
Thanks. Agreement is tricky. merrily Sep 2015 #227
Ok, this is going to sound woo... artislife Sep 2015 #12
Not really woo Armstead Sep 2015 #13
The bit I have never understood, TheJames Sep 2015 #33
Like the old saying goes: Armstead Sep 2015 #43
Truth. Enthusiast Sep 2015 #121
Yes! JDPriestly Sep 2015 #69
Great post, artislife! Scootaloo Sep 2015 #63
Not woo. Your post could have been about me. Of course I have not a spec of woo. Enthusiast Sep 2015 #120
Not one spec! artislife Sep 2015 #170
Yes, we can't keep going down the rabbit hole without fighting back. mmonk Sep 2015 #182
War has risks, well, winning a war requires taking risks, though, of course, one merrily Sep 2015 #218
great summary restorefreedom Sep 2015 #14
Huge K&R me b zola Sep 2015 #15
HUGE K & R !!! - THANK YOU !!! WillyT Sep 2015 #16
American's now know that Wall St. isn't interested in solving economic and societal problems. jalan48 Sep 2015 #19
My message from the corporate democrats: fbc Sep 2015 #22
I disagree. First of all, the large majority of Dems like both Hillary and Bernie. DanTex Sep 2015 #23
I often wonder ... staggerleem Sep 2015 #40
A few on both sides Armstead Sep 2015 #81
Thanks for injecting some reality into DU fantasy land workinclasszero Sep 2015 #42
You missed the point Armstead Sep 2015 #48
Thank goodness for the Agora Fairgo Sep 2015 #115
Two Points Armstead Sep 2015 #47
Sure, but your opinion is only held by a tiny minority of Dems. DanTex Sep 2015 #49
Neither you or I have talked to everyone in the country Armstead Sep 2015 #53
They have polls for that. DanTex Sep 2015 #57
I'd give Obama high marks too Armstead Sep 2015 #59
So what's the problem with Hillary then? She's basically the same place policy-wise. DanTex Sep 2015 #64
She's all over the place Armstead Sep 2015 #65
Those are labels, not policies. As far as gay marriage, again she's the same as Obama, DanTex Sep 2015 #67
It is a pretty brroad casting of the support of Hillary to say it is all "corporate" Cosmocat Sep 2015 #70
Please read my OP again Armstead Sep 2015 #74
Eh Cosmocat Sep 2015 #91
PS Bill Clinton ran as a populist but governed as a moderate Republican Armstead Sep 2015 #50
Open your mouth Aerows Sep 2015 #137
HRC - Is A DLCer & Obligated To Oligarchs, Corporations And Banks - A Favorite Friend Of The 1% cantbeserious Sep 2015 #24
"Profits over People" "Public Risk and Private Gain"... dougolat Sep 2015 #25
Nice! daleanime Sep 2015 #32
...+1 840high Sep 2015 #72
Thanks for an awesome post shireen Sep 2015 #26
Yes- I agree. Kick and rec. NRaleighLiberal Sep 2015 #29
I keep thinking of Aristotle's cycle of regimes. Ed Suspicious Sep 2015 #30
I agree, and I would like to say that I think that Bernie is not talking about a socialist revolutio JDPriestly Sep 2015 #34
Things will never be better for the 99% workinclasszero Sep 2015 #92
My husband says people are for Bernie because they are against corpotate crime. JDPriestly Sep 2015 #36
Huge +1! Enthusiast Sep 2015 #124
Nah, this schism has been around, openly since 2008. apnu Sep 2015 #37
The only thing I disagree with you on.... Armstead Sep 2015 #41
Yes, you are correct which is why I said "openly" apnu Sep 2015 #51
I never thought Obama was not part of the establishment Warren Stupidity Sep 2015 #145
Eagerly K & R'd! Le Taz Hot Sep 2015 #44
Thank you. Well thought out. GoneOffShore Sep 2015 #45
A good and thoughtful post. PatrickforO Sep 2015 #52
"Sometimes it's been subtle and duplicitous, hidden behind nice innocuous words. " RufusTFirefly Sep 2015 #54
Excellent points. Enthusiast Sep 2015 #126
The corporate Democrats have done very well HassleCat Sep 2015 #55
Doesn't matter...When GOP is in power they get what they want. When the GOP is out of power... Armstead Sep 2015 #62
Wow! Well said! emsimon33 Sep 2015 #88
Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Sep 2015 #89
K&R. You nailed it. CharlotteVale Sep 2015 #90
I used to refer to this schism as "East VS West" Capn Sunshine Sep 2015 #94
Hillary hatched her own discontent by supporting a shitastic set of policies LondonReign2 Sep 2015 #224
The British musician, gay rights activist and journalist Tom Robinson hifiguy Sep 2015 #97
Or Iris DeMent -- Wasteland of the Free Armstead Sep 2015 #100
Bernie has never said "socialist revolution". DrBulldog Sep 2015 #101
I'm not the one who thinks that Armstead Sep 2015 #103
Great post!! ut oh Sep 2015 #106
I disagree. Populists are not liberal and Populists are not Democratic or strongly democratic,. Todays_Illusion Sep 2015 #109
Populism itself is a fairly neutral term -- like all othrs open to interpretation Armstead Sep 2015 #148
Important distinction. Paka Sep 2015 #165
Wah? you don't use a dictionary? Todays_Illusion Sep 2015 #289
K&R! Obviously this post should have hundreds of recommendations! Enthusiast Sep 2015 #112
Excellent post, great thread... Duppers Sep 2015 #123
Actually it's been since zentrum Sep 2015 #131
You're right...Democrats are still running from the 1960's Armstead Sep 2015 #146
Agreed. zentrum Sep 2015 #157
As a DU Dem Lefter here's what I say: KoKo Sep 2015 #147
The DLC/Third Way/Centrist faction cost us the House and the Senate and left Obama holding the bag! Major Hogwash Sep 2015 #149
I agree with you, we want a liberal not some fake liberal calling themselves populist. Todays_Illusion Sep 2015 #158
There is more than a schism, I think. sadoldgirl Sep 2015 #154
Kicked... Keep The Truth Coming! n/t ChiciB1 Sep 2015 #155
This sums it up.... Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2015 #159
What If? colsohlibgal Sep 2015 #160
I just see two parties PatrynXX Sep 2015 #161
Thom Hartmann cited this thread and you by name, Armstead. senz Sep 2015 #176
Thanks for letting me know. Alas I didn't hear my 15 seonds of fame Armstead Sep 2015 #228
I think I found it. senz Sep 2015 #249
Thanks for the link to Thom's broadcast... KoKo Sep 2015 #250
No problem. I hadn't known about this website either. senz Sep 2015 #252
He leads off with it. Right after the news, 6:45 minutes in. senz Sep 2015 #251
Thom Hartmann follows DU. senz Sep 2015 #253
There's a poster that uses Thom's name in the Video & Multimedia Forum KoKo Sep 2015 #256
Interesting. But people do post under famous names senz Sep 2015 #260
It's not the Gorilla.... KoKo Sep 2015 #266
Either way, KoKo is a wonderful name. senz Sep 2015 #269
Thanks a lot. I heard it. Armstead Sep 2015 #281
Glad you did. You're famous now! senz Sep 2015 #282
The DLC took over because Democrats were tired of losing elections Recursion Sep 2015 #181
That's called throwing out the baby wirh the bathwater Armstead Sep 2015 #230
Maybe so, but this is why the DLC was formed, and it delivered Recursion Sep 2015 #239
2 points Armstead Sep 2015 #242
Congress has been lost more since the DLC than before the DLC. merrily Sep 2015 #235
Conservative dems were our only two pick-ups in 2014 Recursion Sep 2015 #238
I see 2010 and 2014 as routs? Sorry, that is not exactly a subjective assessment. merrily Sep 2015 #240
Thank you for making me think of that "unfettered capitalism" thing... MrMickeysMom Sep 2015 #183
Hillary and Bernie voted the same 94% of the time. SonderWoman Sep 2015 #197
I haven't forgotten how much I had before the Democratic Party went Third Way or what my vote was mmonk Sep 2015 #207
That statement is highly misleading and intended to be so. And you've misstated it anyway. merrily Sep 2015 #216
As usual, you missed the point Armstead Sep 2015 #232
All they care about is money. raouldukelives Sep 2015 #210
First Rule Of Third-Way Club MoveIt Sep 2015 #229
Maybe they just disagree with how to deal with the economy treestar Sep 2015 #274
Your faith in the good intentions of the oligarchs is touching Armstead Sep 2015 #279
Thank you oldandhappy Sep 2015 #276
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