U.S.-led forces show evidence of Iran weapons in Iraq(and it begins)

[maddezmom]

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - U.S.-led coalition forces in Iraq on Sunday presented what officials said was "a growing body" of evidence of Iranian weapons being used to kill coalition soldiers.

A senior defense official from the U.S.-led Multi-National Force in Baghdad, told a briefing that 170 coalition forces had been killed by roadside bombs known as explosively formed penetrators (EFPs) that he said were manufactured in Iran and smuggled into Iraq.

http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=topNews&storyid=2007-02-11T135808Z_01_YAT147565_RTRUKOC_0_US-IRAQ-IRAN-WEAPONS.xml

U.S. officer: Iran sends Iraq bomb parts


BAGHDAD, Iraq - The U.S. military has detected a significant increase in the number of sophisticated roadside bombs in Iraq and believes that orders to send components for them came from the "highest levels" of the Iranian government, a senior intelligence officer said Sunday.

~snip~

The officer said American intelligence analysts believe the EFPs are manufactured in Iran and smuggled into Iraq on orders from the top of the Iranian government. He did not elaborate.

U.S. officials have alleged for years that weapons were entering the country from Iran but had stopped short of alleging involvement by top Iranian leaders.

That appeared aimed at avoiding the embarrassment suffered when evidence of Iraqi unconventional weapons presented by Secretary Colin Powell at the United Nations in 2003 proved to be wrong.

more:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070211/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_iran

[Eugene]

1. This "evidence" against Iran is pretty flimsy.

From the original AP article:

He said the dates of manufacture on weapons found so far indicate they were made
after fall of Saddam Hussein — mostly in 2006. He said the "machining" on the
components was traceable to Iran but did not elaborate.

From the Reuters article:

"The weapons had characteristics unique to being manufactured in Iran ...
Iran is the only country in the region that produces these weapons," the
defence official said.

This is their evidence?
The syling is Iranian. That's it?

[saigon68]

30. Its a big run up to bombing the Crap out of Iran

Just as soon as the toothless rustics approve

[LynnTheDem]

2. Another embarrassment for America when this too is proved to be

total bullshit.

[Marie26]

3. Who is this "senior intelligence official"?

He's certainly been busy leaking this false information to a ton of reporters. You'd think reporters would have realized by now how they are being used to further the neocon agenda, but apparantly not.

[Eugene]

4. That briefing was surreal. Anonymous officials briefing a room full of reporters.

From the BBC report...

US accuses Iran over Iraq bombs

-snip-

Senior defence officials told reporters in Baghdad that the bombs were being used
to deadly effect, killing more than 170 US troops since June 2004.

-snip-

The US officials, speaking off camera on condition of anonymity, said that EFPs
had also injured more than 620 US personnel since June 2004.

-snip-

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6351257.stm

[Marie26]

62. They've done that a lot lately

The Bush Ad. seems to have a new thing for doing anonymous press conferences - the briefing on the surge was done the same way. I don't think they want us to know who is actually creating these plans. Plus, if they're not named, they can't be subpoenaed to testify under oath at a hearing about the lies they're spreading. And those annoying bloggers can't make the connections to the crew who lied us into the last war. The media should just refuse to report this propaganda unless the "senior Administration official" is willing to attach his name to the statements. There needs to be some accountability here.

[Up2Late]

15. It's probably someone who works for AEI...

...that's where most of the B.S. "intelligence" and "plans" are coming from these days.:mad:

[SOS]

54. According to Paul Krugman

in his article today (2/12/07) the mystery official is PNACer Abram Shulsky.
One of the OSP guys who faked the Iraq intel.
No wonder they wanted this neocon BS artist to remain anonymous.
No one in their right mind would believe a word he says.

[Marie26]

61. Shameless

*groan* They're doing the exact same thing, aren't they? This was a neocon press conference, moved to Iraq & dressed up as a military press conference to give it that illusion of authenticity. It looks like the top general in Iraq, Gen. Pace, didn't even know about this conference. Did Krugman say if Shulsky specifically gave the conference, or was it one of his minions? This article has a lot more about Shulsky & the Iran Directorate - it is the same thing as Feith & the old OSP - a cabal devoted to spreading propaganda & false intelligence. They've just suffled the neocons to a new office & given them a new war to start.

"Pentagon confirms Iran Directorate"

Military and non-military intelligence sources have also raised worries over what some describe to as “the Iran group” and others as “the Iran working group” and still others as a “cabal” operating out of the Pentagon. A recent article by Laura Rozen for the Los Angeles Times revealed the Pentagon has created yet another Office of Special Plans-type body called the Directorate for Iran, or the Iranian Directorate. ...

Lt. Col. Barry E. Venable, a spokesman for the Pentagon, confirmed the creation of the directorate for Iran in both a phone conversation and an email message. ... Venable also confirmed that the new directorate falls under the policy side -- more specifically -- under the new number three at the Pentagon, Eric Edelman. Edelman, Undersecretary of Defense for Policy, holds the same position that Douglas Feith held when he ran OSP at the Pentagon in the lead-up to the Iraq war.

Moreover, sources say that the Iranian Directorate is staffed with many of the same people, including OSP’s former director Abram Shulsky, and receives expert analysis from such controversial figures as Project for the New American Century member Reuel Marc Gerecht, who by all accounts was a failure as a CIA field officer. It also includes military personnel such as Ladan Archin, who appears to be serving in the Larry Franklin analyst role among a sea of think-tank operatives and neoconservative war hawks.

When asked specifically about Shulsky, Venable described his involvement as follows: “Mr. Shulsky continues in his position as Senior Advisor to the USD (P), focusing on Mid-East regional issues and the (global war on terror).” Ledeen says that he is not involved with the new Iran operation out of the Pentagon.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Pentagon_confirms_Iranian_directorate_as_intelligence_0615.html

[seafan]

5. RPG-29's, Katyusha rockets, EFP's, C4 batch numbers *from Iran* were discredited. See this link:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=165667&mesg_id=168010

[fedsron2us]

6. Juan Cole has some interesting analysis on this subject

All the evidence suggests that the vast majority of US casualties in Iraq are caused by Sunni militia who are very, very unlikely to be receiving arms from Iran. The only area where the US forces comes into regular conflict with Shiite militia is Baghdad, and even there Sunni insurgents are also very active.

http://www.juancole.com/

It seems that Bush's 'surge' of US troops into the Iraqi capital has been designed from the beginning to generate a conflict with Iraq's Shia militia that can be used as part of the pretext for an attack on Iran.

[maddezmom]

7. good link, I find the numbers used a bit crass in this article

I mean seriously, how many have the US bombs killed. :eyes:

Iranian bombs have killed 170 Iraq coalition troops: US
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070211/wl_mideast_afp/iraqunrestusiran_070211145138;_ylt=AqN7neT7XkCqQ1rvIkDMcqiQOrgF

[rodeodance]

8. U.S.-led forces show evidence of Iranian arms in Iraq (Clever to announce

this by US troops and IN Bagdad vs the WH in DC.



http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070211/ts_nm/iraq_dc;_ylt=AsQ7AJ308.QCGzcKMlgkJz_MWM0F

U.S.-led forces show evidence of Iranian arms in Iraq

By Ibon Villelabeitia 1 hour, 2 minutes ago

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - U.S.-led forces in Iraq presented on Sunday what officials said was "a growing body" of evidence of Iranian weapons being used to kill their soldiers, as U.S. anger at Tehran's alleged involvement in the war rises.


A senior defense official from the U.S.-led Multinational Force in Baghdad told a briefing that 170 coalition forces had been killed by Iranian-made roadside bombs known as explosively formed penetrators (EFPs) that he said were smuggled into Iraq.

Officials showed journalists fragments of what they said were Iranian-manufactured weapons, including one part of an EFP -- which is strong enough to penetrate the armor of an Abrams tank -- and tail fins from 81 mm and 60 mm mortar bombs.

"The weapons had characteristics unique to being manufactured in
Iran ... Iran is the only country in the region that produces these weapons," the senior defense official said in Baghdad, briefing reporters on condition of anonymity.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

9. "Briefing reporters on condition of anonymity" nuff said

[ohio2007]

22. "undisclosed" sources is another link

that should trip the bs detector

[ShortnFiery]

10. That trash deserves a ONE star Yahoo Rating. n/t

[rodeodance]

11. nbc said ealier this briefing was 'off camera"

[rodeodance]

12. gosh, the WH sure is being jumpy about being accused of crying wolf:

....The main justification given for the invasion was that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, but the weapons were never found and Washington later blamed faulty intelligence.

Given the criticism that still dogs Bush over the handling of that intelligence, U.S. officials have stepped more carefully in preparing their dossier to support their claims that Iran is interfering in Iraq.

Officials do not want to be accused of either overstating the case against Iran or presenting information that appears poorly sourced.

(Additional reporting by Ross Colvin in Baghdad and Edmund Blair in Tehran)

[Demeter]

13. I Wouldn't Hang a Dog on This Evidence

And it seems they tried that already, too.

[maddezmom]

14. CNN's Michael Ware reports about the weapons

U.S. military offers what it says is evidence of Iranian involvement in Iraq
BAGHDAD (CNN) -- The U.S. military Sunday presented evidence that it says shows an elite Iranian force under the command of Iran's supreme leader is behind bombings that have killed at least 170 U.S. forces in Iraq.

General contentions of Iranian involvement in Iraq have been made in the past year by U.S. officials, but there haven't been many details issued.

CNN's Michael Ware attended Sunday's briefing by a senior defense official, a senior defense analyst and an explosives expert, all of whom asked to remain unnamed.

The officials focused on EFPs, explosively formed penetrators, as evidence that Iran is involved in arming Iraqi insurgents. EFPs can punch through heavily armored vehicles.

The U.S. military officials said EFPs are manufactured in such a specific way that they can be traced to Iran. Also, the U.S. military says 81-mm mortar shells used in deadly attacks in Iraq can also be directly traced to Iran.

more: http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/02/11/sunday/index.html

[ewagner]

16. Stupid on the entry level

The government of Iran is supporting the Shiia in Iraq...NOT the Sunni...a large percentage of American Deaths come from Sunni IEDs and attacks, not SHIIA...we're supporting the Shiia...

[maddezmom]

17. Rueters: The senior defence analyst said there was no "smoking gun" linking Tehran &Iraqi militants

in other words, just take our word for it again/ :eyes:

http://mobile.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/YAT158550.htm

[rodeodance]

18. cnn: U.S. ties Iranian leader to bombs killing U.S. troops

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/02/11/iraq.main/index.html

U.S. ties Iranian leader to bombs killing U.S. troops

POSTED: 1900 GMT (0300 HKT), February 11, 2007
Story Highlights
• NEW: U.S. shows evidence it says proves Iran behind deadly bombings
• NEW: Security sweeps planned this week to close 10 Baghdad neighborhoods
• 23 people wounded by mortar attacks in Mosul
• Suicide bombing at police building near Tikrit kills 12

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- The U.S. military Sunday presented evidence it says shows an elite Iranian force under the command of Iran's supreme leader is behind bombings that have killed at least 170 U.S. troops in Iraq.

U.S. officials have made general statements in the past year about Iranian involvement in Iraq, but haven't provided many details.

The charges came at a Baghdad briefing by a senior defense official, a senior defense analyst and an explosives expert, all of whom asked to remain unnamed.

The officials focused on EFPs, or explosively formed penetrators, as evidence that Iran is involved in arming Iraqi insurgents. EFPs can punch through heavily armored vehicles.

[HuffleClaw]

19. heheheheheheheheeeee

suuuuuuuuuure

only the kool-aid drinkers will fall for that.

[TheWatcher]

20. "only the kool-aid drinkers will fall for that."

And yet wasn't that the same thing we all so smugly said before they invaded Iraq on such flimsy evidence?

Now, nearly 4 years later, 3000 dead Soldiers later, hundreds of thousands of Iraqi Civilian Deaths later, they are about to do it AGAIN.

This country needs to STOP these people.

They need to be removed by any legal and peaceful means necessary.

Or, a couple of years from now, we will be smugly saying the same things again before they Invade Syria. Or any other country on their agenda.

Oh wait, with all the draconian legislation and shredding of the Constitution they have done, perhaps we won't even be allowed to do that.

They need to go.

It's almost too late.

[ohio2007]

21. No smoking gun.

evidence isn't reliable unless they have someone in Iran come forward. That won't happen.

[oblivious]

23. NO SMOKING GUN. Those are the key words aren't they. In a separate heading for emphasis.

[IDemo]

24. Now it's the "machining process" they claim is traceable to Iran

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17097658/

‘Machining process’ laid to Iran

Three senior military officials who explained the display said the “machining process” used in the construction of the deadly bombs had been traced to Iran.

<snip>

“We know more than we can show,” said one of the senior officials, when pressed for tangible evidence that the EFPs were made in Iran.

************************************************************

“We know more than we can show, now on with Operation Democracy Czar!"

[mc jazz]

25. as an engineer

it's not that hard to machine this type of thing, any metal worker worth his salt can machine and cast it, it's not rocket science at all they make it sound like the technology could only come from a super high tech, i.e. government factory. This is crude and simple and any old workshop could produce formed charges with some R&D and left over shells

[oblivious]

28. "The explosives also can be made from plastic and tin cans"

EXCLUSIVE: Iraq Weapons -- Made in Iran?

...They are a very nasty piece of business, capable of penetrating U.S. troops' strongest armor...



Anatomy of a Bomb

The explosives also can be made from plastic and tin cans, and the rear is sealed with a back plate or concrete.
(ABC News)

http://abcnews.go.com/International/IraqCoverage/story?id=1692347&page=1

[mc jazz]

36. god is that all they are?

Little more than an old fashioned cannon really
that is one scary picture to think a few of them can take out million dollar tanks

[slackmaster]

57. It's called a shaped charge

Not a cannon, rather a cylinder of high explosive with a conical indentation, lined with metal (e.g. copper) in one end.

The charge is detonated from the end away from the indentation. When the shock wave reaches the indentation, it begins to blast a jet of hot gas at hypersonic speed in the direction of the blast wave. Google "Munro effect".

All of the dimensions are important, including the offset from the target; but it's not hard to make one that works. US Army's Improvised Munitions handbook has detailed instructions.

[kiwilover]

26. Next War

In the early morning hours of some soon to be day Irainian army personnel will cross the boarder into Iraq and destroy a radio station. The full might of the United States military will cross into Iran to save the Democratic government of Iraq. ONWARD CHRISTIAN SOLDIERS1!!!!!!!!!! PNAC is running out of time to do their dirty work.

[USA No. 1]

27. As if the debacle in Iraq wasn't enough....

This is bullshit. I am growing impatient with John Conyers. Get the ball moving on impeachment asap. This adminstration needs to go before they get us all killed.

[killbotfactory]

29. this is such bullshit

They go from "improvised explosive devices" to complex machined "shaped charges", practically overnight! Wow!

[MsMagnificent]

31. US accuses highest levels in Iran of supplying deadly weapons to Iraqi insurgents

http://www.guardian.co.uk/iran/story/0,,2010948,00.html

The Bush administration stepped up pressure on Iran yesterday by producing what it claimed was intelligence that Tehran was behind roadside bombs used by insurgents against US forces in Iraq. It also said the decision to send the arms had been made at "the highest levels".

The US move came as diplomatic discussions in Munich to revive negotiations over the Iranian nuclear crisis and ward off the chances of American air strikes broke up in failure. Washington officials have been debating whether to release the intelligence, expecting scepticism after having lost credibility by publishing misleading claims about weapons of mass destruction in the run-up to the war in Iraq. After more than a fortnight of procrastination and revision of a 200-page US classified military intelligence document, military officials briefed journalists in Baghdad on the contents yesterday.

The briefers claimed the deadliest of the roadside bombs being used in Iraq were from Iran: the machine-tooling was so sophisticated that the only place it could have been done in that part of the region was Iran. They said that mortars found in Iraq were also from Iran.
The US claimed that Iranians arrested at Irbil in northern Iraq last month included a member of the Quds brigade, a secretive organisation directed by the Iranian leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, and part of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard.
News agencies based in Baghdad said the briefers, a defence official, an explosives expert and a defence analyst, had told them that between June 2004 and last week more than 170 Americans had been killed by the sophisticated bombs, referred to by the military as "explosively formed projectiles". Those weapons are capable of destroying an Abrams tank.

Iran will dismiss the claims, saying it is hardly surprising there are Iranian weapons in Iraq given that the two countries fought between 1980 and 1988, and that Tehran had armed militia groups fighting Saddam Hussein.


~snip~

Similar to the Yahoo.com story except for the U.S. now going after the "highest levels" of the Iranian government

[burrowowl]

32. World accuses U$ of A of

warmongering! And most dangerous threat to WORLD!

[Straight Shooter]

33. How many troops have been killed because the U.S. failed to secure ordnance in Iraq?

Anyone remember that outrage, that Iraqis were hauling off ordnance because Rumsfeld didn't see fit to make sure the ordnance caches were guarded and secure. That same ordnance is likely being used in all the IED's that are killing and maiming our troops.

Will 5 million people die because the bush administration claims without actual proof that 170 of our troops have died because of Iranian interference?

Will this be bush's legacy, killing more people on earth than anyone else in history?

[Jack Rabbit]

34. Bush Regime Weather Report: It's raining

We'd better check and see. It may be just something else they want us to believe.

[pinniped]

35. This means the USSR should've attacked us during their war in Afghanistan....

for supplying their enemies with Stingers.

Coming soon, al-Qaeda in Iran.

Impeach these fuckers already.

[ckramer]

37. Iranian bombs have killed 170 Iraq coalition troops: US

Sophisticated Iranian-built bombs smuggled into Iraq have killed at least 170 US and allied soldiers since June 2004 and wounded 620 more, senior US defence officials have said.

The allegation, made Sunday at a background briefing in Baghdad's fortified Green Zone, comes as Washington steps up its criticism of Iran and will feed a fierce debate over relations with the Islamic republic.

"Iran is involved in supplying explosively formed projectiles or EFPs and other material to Iraqi extremist groups," a senior official from the US-led multinational coalition told journalists.

Three coalition officials met reporters to point the finger at the Al-Qods Force of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps, part of Tehran's elite forces accused of links with foreign militants.

"The Qods Force arms extremists and insurgents to carry out terrorist attacks and guerrilla warfare," he said. "The Qods Force provides advice, training and weapons to proxy forces in Iraq."


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070211/wl_mideast_afp/iraqunrestusiran

So looks like bombing Iran will start soon...

[grytpype]

38. What a bunch of made up bullshit.

How those people work is amazing. They are very opportunistic.

When they want to do something, they will use whatever happens as their excuse to do what they want.

9/11 was the excuse to attack Iraq.

Now they want to attack Iran, and the failure in Iraq presents itself as an excuse for doing that.

God save us.

[ShortnFiery]

39. How many of our USA Cluster Bombs have killed Lebanese Children?

It goes both ways. As far as "the arms trade" it's The United States of America than makes the MOST and HIGH POWERED Killing machines and armaments in the World.

The USA is second to none in supplying all types of equipment meant to KILL OTHER HUMAN BEINGS!

We are the freaking Nazis of the World's Arms Trade thanks to our MIGHTY Military Industrial Complex.

The hypocrisy of these blood soaked accusers is breath-taking. :wow:

[ckramer]

40. You could forget about 2008 election if World War III occurred this year

Bush could gvie himeself another 4 year term again at end of 2008 if there was an active war going on.

[doublethink]

41. Why is something supposedly manufactured in Iran ........

identified in ENGLISH? :shrug: Just asking? I didn't buy the Iraq 'dossier' and this one is just as stupid. Peace.

[kenny blankenship]

45. Here's another thing: the assumption that Iran has to be behind the armor piercing IEDs

It's just bullshit. Because most people trust the gov't and don't know any better, the Bushlerites will cobble together some "evidence" to goad Ma and Pa Kettle into a "get-Iran!" lather and it doesn't have to be good. In this case it's the assumption put forward without explanation that if the insurgents are using armor penetrating IEDs they have to be getting them from Iran. The assumption is false.

In 1989 the head of Deutschebank, Alfred Herrhausen, was assassinated in his armored Mercedes by a copper projectile "EFP" improvised bomb. A German Marxist-Leninist group was responsible. The armor plating inside the door of his Mercedes was punched in by the copper "formed" projectile and that armor plate cut his leg so deeply he bled to death. An ordinary explosive charge of the same size (it was disguised as a kid's bookbag on a bike hitched to a streetlamp) would have destroyed the resale value of his Mercedes tank but he would have survived. This was a TINY terrorist group who pulled off this attack--they were nothing like the thousands of insurgents using the EFPs now, who're fighting a war day in day out, with financial backing and technical support from sources all over the Persian Gulf region, such as we face in Iraq.


The "technology" is not advanced. The technology is not a secret. You don't have to be a nation state to put together something practical that works on this principle.

In fact, WE probably taught OBL's radical Islamist friends all about this and other nasty tricks in Afghanistan. Now that "Al Quaeda" is operating in Iraq and focused on Iraq, we can expect to have every trick that we taught them to be used against us. Nothing stops them from learning stuff on their own too. And, really, does it seem more likely that Iran is arming Sunni radicals & ex-Baathists with such devices, when Shia and Sunni are killing each other far more frequently in Iraq than they are killing us, or is it more likely that our old allies in the mujahedeen (Al Quaeda) are building these for the Sunnis, +/or teaching them how to do it?


And besides the whole thing pointless by now and uninteresting. IRAQ IS LOST. WE WILL NOT WIN. Whining about the Iranians not "playing fair" , or how this other country or that other country is really to blame for the wreckage of our invasion of Iraq--which is hands down the stupidest mistake in American foreign policy history--isn't going to change the fact that Iraq is lost to us.

[ShockediSay]

52. Better yet, let US troops redeploy to the Iran-Iraq border

...this way we stop ied's at their supposed source, AND get our troops the hell out of harm's way!

[5X]

42. A press conference with three officials should not be anonymous.

Any and all news organizations were obviously invited to join
in, yet they all keep the officials' identities secret.
Something is rotten in the green zone, if you ask me.

[superconnected]

43. Exactly what they did with iraq.

Edited to say - propaganda wise.

This is why the blood spilled really IS on bush's hands. His propaganda for death is still churning...

[grytpype]

44. Looks like stenography is alive and well in the DC press corps.

Didn't they learn their lesson with Iraq? Bush is a liar, he is surrounded by liars, and they all want war with Iran and will say anything to get it.

[5X]

46. War would be good for ratings and I just got my Nielsen rating book. n/t

edit spelling

[IndianaGreen]

48. A war on Iran will boost ratings

Talk radio and cable "news" channels can fill the airwaves with scary tales about Iran and Iranians. We've been through this before in the run up to Iraq. Same play, almost the same cast.

[daleo]

47. So, how about the other 3000 U.S. dead?

Even if this was true (which I don't necessarily believe), it would still be a small fraction of the total.

[gratuitous]

49. Been happening since June 2004, huh?

But they haven't seen fit to mention it to anyone for 2½ years until (just coincidentally) they need a casus belli for Iran. And if the dungeon master's dice had come up an 8 instead of a 4? We'd be going after Syria. Or maybe Libya.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

50. why the ENGLISH WORDS on the "Iranian" bombs???

because its a f'ing lie.

See for yourself:

Pentagon blames Iran for 170 US deaths
By David Blair, Diplomatic Correspondent
Last Updated: 2:32am GMT 12/02/2007

America today blamed Iran for the deaths of 170 US troops inside Iraq,
accusing Teheran of supplying insurgents with increasingly sophisticated bombs.

[psychopomp]

63. Entire Powerpoint presentation found here (link) :

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/docs/iran-in-iraq/?resultpage=1&

[Marie26]

64. Ah, more Powerpoint presentations

The "surge" plan was unveiled w/a Powerpoint presentation at AEI. Neocons seem to really love Powerpoint. Short, quick bullet points - easy to create, easy to report, no facts needed.

[RiverStone]

51. Remember...Shrub's trying to

start another war with Iran.

Considering all the lies that led us into war, the lies during the current war campaign, and the lies about escalation...

I believe we must be mindful of more BushCo propaganda bullshit - this indeed may be more of the same. :think:

[maddezmom]

53. General misspoke 170 is allegedly coalition forces not just US Military

The response from the Iranian Embassy came as a U.S. military spokesman said one of its generals "misspoke" Sunday when he said the bombings had killed at least 170 U.S. forces in Iraq, changing the figure to include all forces in the coalition.

The spokesman did not give precise breakdown on the coalition fatalities or how the military came up with the overall figure.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/02/12/iraq.main/index.html?section=cnn_latest

[Lilith Velkor]

55. Pay no attention to the tons of plastic explosives the Sunnis snagged in '03

...from right under our noses. Look it up.

[maddezmom]

56. here are a couple links from 10/04

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=930969

[Tight_rope]

58. I don't give a damn if Iran has WMD or not...At this point it's the US that I'm worried about!

We have 2 mad man in the White House with tricky fingers.

[Supersedeas]

59. Joe Dino has seen enough -- it is time for war.

[AzDar]

60. Dubya and Dick just GOTTA get their war on with Iran before they're

forcibly dragged from D.C. ....(a girl can DREAM, right?);)

[ohio2007]

65. a 16 page PDF file of the evidence

http://www.iraqslogger.com/downloads/Iran_in_Iraq__English_.pdf

Found it here reading through IraqSlogger
http://www.iraqslogger.com/index.php/post/1346/Its_Here_All_16_Pages_of_the_USs_Iran_Dossier
The author said the info was provided by "unnamed sources"..........
that statement alone should trip the bs meter alarm

[moondust]

66. Third parties.

Is there any evidence that Iraqi insurgents did not get the Iranian-made explosives from Hezbollah or some other third party?

[ohio2007]

67. 3rd party? you mean like Nader?

Actually, a google search turned up the Nader, an Iranian 44mm anti-tank rocket with a range of 400 meters able to penetrate 30 cm of armor.

but it's not to be confused with this Nader


He can "tank a party"


G'Nite