Illegals found to pay $400 million in taxes (in Virginia)

[underpants]

Source: Washington Times

RICHMOND (AP) — Illegal aliens contribute an estimated $400 million to Virginia's economy annually in taxes, according to a study released yesterday by a group hoping to counter some illegal-alien criticism in the legislature.

The Commonwealth Institute for Fiscal Analysis estimates that illegal aliens contribute between $379 million and $453 million a year in income, sales, property and other taxes.

The study recognizes there is no way to calculate exactly how much illegal aliens pay in taxes.



It uses figures from a 2005 Pew Hispanic Center study that estimates there are 250,000 to 300,000 illegal aliens in Virginia. The center estimates that Virginia's at least 109,000 undocumented households earn an average of $27,400 annually, resulting in about $3 billion in income.



Read more: http://washingtontimes.com/article/20080215/METRO/92860618/1004

---

Sorry that is it from the Washington Times-it is the only link less than 12hours old.

[demnan]

1. I'm glad its in the Moony Times

Maybe some of the assholes on my county board will read this. Hey Corey Stewart, shove this up your ass!

[mrreowwr_kittty]

2. Yes, but how much more tax revenue would be generated

If those jobs were held by legal workers, paid decent wages, and had benefits? Just throwing out numbers to show a "net benefit" or "net detriment" is meaningless without a context to compare.

I agree that illegal immigration probably provides a net benefit, at the macro level. But the gains are accruing to the people at the top. Even with the tax revenue you have to consider how much of it is then goint out to provide government services that the employers benefitting from the cheap labor aren't providing.

[joeglow3]

6. You NAILED it

I read a Harvard study that said the AVERAGE American was between 9 and 10% better off with Illegals. However, the breakdown showed the rich MUCH better off that 10% and the poor and working class being WORSE off. Thus, I cannot for the life of me see how someone fighting for the poor and working class can support illegal immigration.

[pingzing58]

16. The statistic is based on taxation. You and I know that we as middle working class Americans

are taxed at greater rates that the Rich (because of trickle down theory) and the poor (they don't make enough to live and be worth taxing - they get tax credits and refunds to keep our economy creeping along). It's not about illegals working in our country it's about equality in taxation. Those who have more should be taxed more. Boston tea party taught us that. Our system of taxation is basically feudal. The rich get richer and protect each other while the working middle class and poor get poorer. We need a change.

[Popol Vuh]

25. So are you saying?

That we hold no economic or moral responsibility for creating an economic situation through our subsidized and other trade policies forcing these people to have to make the terrible decision to leave their homes and family and go to the place where all the wealth is being concentrated?

Just saying...

[mrreowwr_kittty]

27. I don't think we're at odds here

Some of the people promoting the idea that cheap labor (whether legal/illegal/outsourced/insourced) provides a net benefit are the same ones selling the trade policies that create the cheap labor market.

[Popol Vuh]

29. Here, here

It all concentrates the wealth doesn't it?

Migrant workers are but the "symptom" of this. Taking a quote from Martin Luther King Jr "Any man's death diminishes me....injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere", I apply the same philosophy in an economic sense as well.



Peace...

[fascisthunter]

3. Wow... and in the Moonie Times Too (nt)

[FreakinDJ]

4. If its from the Moony Times its.....

Pure Bullshit

They are dependable that way

[underpants]

7. I read this in my local paper (today) but this was the only LBN-ready link I could find

The Commonwealth Institute shares the same phone number and P.O. Box as the Virginia Interfaith Center and Public Policy.

http://vpap.org/lobby/details.cfm?key=INP000342376&orkey=ORP000244428&

[FreakinDJ]

13. Remember the Russia Air Lift

A couple of local churches went over to "Rescue" the faithful from the communist. I think the State Dept. about that time also change the immigration laws to favor Eastern Europeans as well.

The Churches sought a means of loading up the local electit with voters of their shared faith.

The end result wasn't at all that good. They swelled the city with a disproportionate number of Russian immigrants that had trouble adapting to the work force. In fact they had their paperwork for Medical, Welfare, and Political Asylem filled out and completed on the plane ride.

Will the city still ranks in the top 5 nationaly for Car Theft for the entire country

[Robbien]

5. Illegals?

Illegals because they broke the law and drove over the speeding limit?

Illegals because they held up the corner seven eleven?

Illegals because they broke the law and didn't buy a license for their dog or cat?

And all these hundreds of millions of law breakers have only paid four hundred million in taxes? If so, we need to increase taxes.

[Lance_Boyle]

11. deliberately obtuse much?

The phrasing may be unfortunate in light of the oh-so-clever "no human being is illegal" slogan favored by the "we don't need no steenkin' borders" wackjob utopians. Nevertheless, it is an indisputable fact that certain individuals' presence in this country is illegal - they are illegal aliens. Blame American linguistic laziness for shortening that to "illegals," but don't think for a second that the bumper-sticker sloganeering bullshit makes half a square of used toilet paper's worth of difference in the legal status of those individuals' residency in this country. How would the VA tax base be affected if the illegals weren't there and un/under-employed Virginian/American citizens were working those jobs?

Aside from the big business "we like 'em 'cuz they're cheap labor" argument, there is absolutely zero reason to support or encourage illegal immigration.

[frylock]

14. "illegals" is a fucking adjective and it's the new NI**ER..

it's a non-word made up by stupid fucking ignorant racists.

[pingzing58]

31. "illegals" "wetbacks" "wets" and if you're liked you're not called a Mexican but "Spanish Boy".

I've heard this term since I was child and since I am educated I'm not called a Mexican because that is a derrogatory term rather a Spanish Boy working hard for a living.

[Igel]

37. "Progressive"

is an adjective. So is "liberal". As is "Republican".

Yet they all have plurals. So they must all also be "non-words made up by stupid fucking ignorant" folk, both on the left and the right.

At least "Democrat" is a noun. Etymologically speaking, at least, and we all know that words mean what their etymologies say they mean, and have the grammatical properties they had in the past. (Q.v. "etymological fallacy".)

Or maybe English has a way to coerce adjectives to acting like nouns. Nah, that would mean that this native speaker's instincts are correct, and Chomsky's not entirely wrong. And Lakoff and other functionists have a point.

[frylock]

41. if you want to parrot words invented by right-wing bigots, then that's your prerogative..

knock yourself out.

[Robbien]

18. Breaking laws is breaking laws

You are an illegal.

Using the same bigoted wingnut reasoning, you most certainly have broken laws (whether in driving, or licensing or even in the smaller act of jaywalking), so you are an illegal.

Denigrating people from other countries by using a catchall bigoted term hyped up by wingnuts is beneath contempt.

[H8fascistcons]

26. Hard to have a conversation..

This is one of the most difficult subjects to have a conversation about, it's so emotional. Here is the bottom line, undocumented aliens from what ever country they come from is not helpful to this country. Forget all the rhetoric about using services, not paying enough taxes, as a rule most undocumented aliens are poor and will work for low wages, too many workers and not enough jobs and low income Americans take the hit in the form of low wages. In Los Angeles, the janitors union was disbanded by business and the African American employees making a whopping $12.00 an hour were all fired and undocumented aliens replaced them for $7.00 an hour. Unemployment in the inner city is rampant and it is impossible for high school kids to find a summer job which leads to an increase in crime. BTW all the white illegal aliens have to go to. This is about decent paying jobs for Americans, whatever color they are...


Regards.......

[Robbien]

28. True it is hard to have a conversation

when the first word of the argument is bigotry.

Immigration is a huge problem for all workers in this country, exactly for the reasons you state.

But blaming the immigrants and labeling them with bigoted terminology does nothing to advance the conversation.

[LanternWaste]

30. I think it was Victor Hugo who wrote something to the effect of

"...slogan favored by the "we don't need no steenkin' borders" wackjob utopians"

I think it was Victor Hugo who wrote something to the effect of, "there are those who value imaginary red and blue lines on a map more than they do humanity itself". So if both you and Hugo are correct, it wold appear that only "wackjob utopians" see the borders for what they are-- imaginary.

And if the both of you are not correct-- that indeed, only one of you are, my money's going on Hugo.

[Warren Stupidity]

39. zero reason to support or encourage illegal immigration?

Correct - so how about we stop making legal immigration nearly impossible for the people on our southern borders? How about we reconsider ruinous economic policies that have created a northward torrent of economic refugees?

[kirby]

8. But how much did they cost taxpayers in services?

In services that are reduce to legal citizens?

[AlphaCentauri]

40. Not much considering that they are not collecting pensions n/t

[DeeDeeNY]

9. I don't understand how they pay income taxes

This may be a dumb question, but I honestly don't understand -- if they're illegal aliens, then wouldn't that mean they don't have social security numbers and therefore couldn't file tax returns and pay income taxes even if they wanted to? I can understand their paying sales, property and other taxes of that sort, but not income taxes.

[underpants]

10. There are several ways

one is that they have fake SSN's (the most common)not all of them are paid "under the table"
their is also a program in which they CAN pay taxes and basically get put at the back of the line to get busted.

[DeeDeeNY]

12. Thanks.

Interesting.

[FreakinDJ]

15. The majority do not pay income tax

You forget people still work "Under the table"

Do you think all those people being hired standing in front of Home Depot have W-4 forms

[underpants]

19. Do you think that there are 12 million people standing in front of the Home Depot?

read up on it

The latest most complete study of the undocumented sector
http://www.ilw.com/articles/2007,1219-camarota.shtm

Which bascially goes along with this (aside from the % of Undocs 20% on "welfare" as opposed to the "native" population 17%)

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/underpants/27

For round numbers there appear to be about 10 Million "illegal immigrants" or "undocumented workers". Not to parse words here, they both mean basically the same thing.

Of undocumented/illegals--> 60-75% entered illegally. The other 25-40% entered legally and overstayed their visas or otherwise violated the terms of their admission.
-Of those 57% are Mexican, 23% are from other Latin American countries, 10% are Asian, 5% are European or Canadian, and 5% are from everywhere else.

Of the Foreign Born Population (~ 35 Million) in the US 25% are illegal/undocumented-- 30% are Legal, 30% Naturalized, 8% Refugees, 5% Temporary legal.

40% of illegals are women. 54% live in married families or other families. Fewer then half are single men and unattached.

According to the US Social Security Administration 75% pay payroll taxes and will contribute $6-7 BILLION in Social Security funds that they will never claim.

Okay here is where it gets fuzzy.

90-96% are employed (I saw both numbers)

AND NOW the big question

Do they drain social service resources MORE than they contribute?

The CATO Institute (yes them) says:

Myth number four: Immigrants impose a financial burden on taxpayers. Immigrants do make somewhat heavier use of means-tested welfare programs than natives. There have been especially flagrant abuses by immigrants of particular welfare programs, such as Supplemental Security Income. But because immigrants tend to come to the United States during the start of their working years --between the ages of 18 and 35 -- they make very large net contributions to the two largest income transfer programs: Social Security and Medicare. When the payroll tax contributions of immigrants are taken into account, the Urban Institute found that the foreign born constitute a net fiscal windfall to the public sector of some $20 billion a year. To the extent that welfare use by immigrants is a problem, this can be addressed by restricting the welfare eligibility of immigrants, not by keeping immigrants out.
http://www.cato.org/dailys/4-22-97.html

PBS (yes THEM) says

Immigrants pay more in taxes than they receive in public services in their lifetime?

REALITY: Welfare use among non-refugee immigrants is lower than among U.S. native-born citizens in the same age group (15-64). The 1990 census reported that 20.4 percent of immigrants were on welfare, compared with 26.2 percent of U.S. native-born citizens. In 1997, immigrants paid an estimated $133 billion in federal, state and local taxes. A typical immigrant and his or her offspring pay an estimated $80,000 more in taxes than they will receive in federal, state and local benefits over the course of their lifetimes.

[LanternWaste]

32. You have a valid source or peer-reviewed link

"The majority do not pay income tax"

Do you perchance have a valid source, or peer-reviewed link for that particular assertion?

[pingzing58]

34. Yes but their employers pay taxes on their own business income. The more they make the more they pay

Right? Your argument has holes in it.

[PsN2Wind]

17. I didn't read the article

but does it mention the dollar cost to other taxpayers of educating, medicating and incarcerating illegal aliens? Using their numbers of 400 million contributed, divided by the 109 thousand households, gives an average contribution of $3700, if each of those households has one child in school the cost of their education alone is probably about double the contribution. You have to look at both sides of the equation. But if Virginia still feels there is a net gain from these illegal aliens they should contact Arizona because we'd be willing to send them another quarter million.

[underpants]

20. Hi!

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2007,1219-camarota.shtm


-----ALSO_-------------
Do they drain social service resources MORE than they contribute?

The CATO Institute (yes them) says:

Myth number four: Immigrants impose a financial burden on taxpayers. Immigrants do make somewhat heavier use of means-tested welfare programs than natives. There have been especially flagrant abuses by immigrants of particular welfare programs, such as Supplemental Security Income. But because immigrants tend to come to the United States during the start of their working years --between the ages of 18 and 35 -- they make very large net contributions to the two largest income transfer programs: Social Security and Medicare. When the payroll tax contributions of immigrants are taken into account, the Urban Institute found that the foreign born constitute a net fiscal windfall to the public sector of some $20 billion a year. To the extent that welfare use by immigrants is a problem, this can be addressed by restricting the welfare eligibility of immigrants, not by keeping immigrants out.
http://www.cato.org/dailys/4-22-97.html

PBS (yes THEM) says

Immigrants pay more in taxes than they receive in public services in their lifetime?

REALITY: Welfare use among non-refugee immigrants is lower than among U.S. native-born citizens in the same age group (15-64). The 1990 census reported that 20.4 percent of immigrants were on welfare, compared with 26.2 percent of U.S. native-born citizens. In 1997, immigrants paid an estimated $133 billion in federal, state and local taxes. A typical immigrant and his or her offspring pay an estimated $80,000 more in taxes than they will receive in federal, state and local benefits over the course of their lifetimes.

http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thecity/immigratio...
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/underpants/27

[PsN2Wind]

21. Maybe I'm confused

but I believe the OP was about illegal aliens, not immigrants. Even at that the two quotes you give contradict one another, one saying they do use more welfare services, the other saying they don't use more of these services than native born citizens. It's also difficult for me to believe that more than one-in-four citizens were on welfare in 1990 as the census is supposed to have shown

[underpants]

23. I am the OP

"Illegal aliens" is used by those who see immigrants as a tool for fear
.

Everything that I have posted deals with the same set of people, different names are used.

"Welfare" is (no accident this) used to cover all social programs. I am not sure where you saw 25% but when you include TANF WIC Food Stamps school lunches etc. and in a recession like back in 1990 is might not be that far off since about 17% of "natives" right now are on some sort of social program.

[PsN2Wind]

33. Sorry I wasn't aware that in Virginia

immigrant and illegal alien were considered synonymous. In Arizona we consider immigrants those people that went thru the process to come here legally and illegal aliens those thousands sneaking across our border daily.

[Hulk]

22. Toss into the mix the US citizens that take payment "under the table"???

Are they paying their fair share?? I'm against most things "illegal", but I'm also against slavery and indentured servitude, which is what we have now.

The employers bare NO responsibility, when in fact THEY are the ones who make out on the whole situation. CHEAP LABOR....NO TAXES (in many cases)

Keep blaming the non-citizens for striving for a better life. Keep blaming them for not paying taxes and SS on ALL their wages, when in fact they are prevented from doing so.

I am so sick of this "white supremest society" of ours, where the color of your skin groups you to a social ceiling. If these "non-citizens" were all white skinned Canadians, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Ninety-nine percent PLUS of these people are law abiding, good people with good morals and good intentions. We chose to focus on the gang element, the breaking of our "laws" that apply to everyone else but the white collar criminals. This country is a walking joke.

DO SOMETHING about the 18 million non-citizens in this country. Something besides BITCH about it.

[underpants]

24. Thank you

the entire construction/home improvement (lawns and gardens too) industry is rife with "under the table" economies. In the inner cities as well (heard that on NPR).

[pingzing58]

35. You're right. Some think that only the Rich can find loopholds in tax law but there are other ways..

[sarcasmo]

36. Who's Social Security Number are they using?

[Warren Stupidity]

38. Hush. Heads will explode. Luckily they are empty. nt.