(Dallas) Police concerned about (Secret Service) order to stop (weapons)screening (at Obama rally)

[Algorem]

Source: Fort Worth Star-Telegram

Police concerned about order to stop screening
By JACK DOUGLAS Jr.
Star-Telegram Staff Writer

Police were told to stop screening people for weapons before the rally began.

DALLAS -- Security details at Barack Obama's rally Wednesday stopped screening people for weapons at the front gates more than an hour before the Democratic presidential candidate took the stage at Reunion Arena.

The order to put down the metal detectors and stop checking purses and laptop bags came as a surprise to several Dallas police officers who said they believed it was a lapse in security...

Several Dallas police officers said it worried them that the arena was packed with people who got in without even a cursory inspection.

They spoke on condition of anonymity because, they said, the order was made by federal officials who were in charge of security at the event...



Read more: http://www.star-telegram.com/dallas_news/story/486413.html

[maddezmom]

1. that is nutz

:crazy:

[Karenina]

6. Nah, just telegraphing the message in code.

[rosetta627]

39. Are you suggesting that it's a warning to Obama Karenina?

If so, I've been thinking the same thing. Just a theory mind you.

[NashVegas]

22. A Week or Two Ago

There was a post in GD: P from someone who said security was very lax at Obama events. Bad enough as it is, but it truly concerns me to see it publicized.

[ThatBozGuy]

173. Secret Service protection was increased not decreased

I was watching the debate and became very concerned several times because I saw behavior from the secret service that showed they were on a much heightened footing in dealing with Mr Obama. I said to myself at the time I wonder what triggered this, and with my concerns raised, I hope he is going to be ok.

It was after the debate that I saw this headline and discussion and I realize now I have the opposite reaction and am very comfortable with his protection.

I will not justify why there was a takedown of security but I can speculate and I guarantee you from the observation of the final minutes of the debate coverage that the Secet service was not happy with the decision and likely not the orginator.

It was likely a people moving logistics decision, to get more people into the debate quickly that caused the screening takedown.

There are many debatable points why that could be a bad idea, but the least point is if someone was going to try to get a weapon in they know there are checkpoints, they are going to bypass that route anyways.

What ever the reason or regardless of who decided for them to go down, the secret service compensated quite heavily and it was clear that they were fully aware that Mr Obama was a higher target threat level then Ms. Clinton.

This is demonstrated very clearly in the CNN footage at the close of the debate and it was these last few minute that raised my initial concern.

After the debate while the candidates were at the footlights signing autographs and handshaking Ms. Clinton had an obvious Secret Service detail at wing point dispatch and an observer scanning the crowd. These agents were loose and about 6 to 10 feet off her flanks, at each shoulder point, and the observer at the stage footline was several people away.

Mr Obama's detail was much different, and maintained a very controlled tight bubble while maintaining his ability to interact.

This bubble was in plain site but a casual observer could miss the Secret Service behavior because they are effective at what they do.

Mr Obama had two agents at wingpoint maintaining distances of 2 to 3 feet (as opposed to the more casual 6 to 10 feet of Ms Clinton) from his back shoulders. There were two line observers at the floor. These agents were were forming a cone of contact(funneling people between them to Mr Obama) that at all times maintained less than arms length distance from Mr Obama and each other in that controlled enviroment.

There was a third observer on the stage with Mr Obama looking into the crowd at all points.

It was this agent that originally raised my hackles and concern because he was obviously functioning as a body manager. This agent was within the wingpoins agent's bubble of protection looking over Mr Obamas shoulder but almost always in physical contact with him. His hands were at all times on Mr Obamas back or hip at finger touch. The line observers on the floor were very tactile and capable of hand swiping anything in front of Mr Obama's field of contact by hand.

In addition there were two agents to the left or right on the stage that were nearly holding Mr Obamas hand in direction of movement( literally reaching out to him at almost every step he took one direction or the other) on the stage and maintaining a clear path of removal at all times.

I am also sure that in addition to these observable details there were other such bubbles of control and observation containing each layer of this close quarter detail.

The compliment to the Secret Service is they did this massive choreographed dance of protection under the eyes of all those cameras and unless you looked for the specifics it was very easy to miss. Watch the hands on contact of the Body Manager agent in direct contact with Mr Obama and it all becomes clear just how safe he was.

Rest assured Mr Obama is in good hands and while the headlines of security removal scream to the fear that many are afraid to admit or are ready to take arms and claim conspiracy over, take a few minutes to watch the footage from the end of the debates to watch what real active protection is about rather than the somewhat fake comfort, passive peace of mind protection that weapons screening gives us.

[rosetta627]

196. I really appreciate the reassurance ThatBozGuy, tho' I will not rest assured

I will write to the media and forums and websites and the Obama campaign and raise hell about this.
I hope many more people do the same.

This incident was unacceptable, especially given Senator Obama's status as a relative outsider, and the location of Dallas where President Kennedy was murdered in 1963 due to "lax" (or worse) security.

We need to to make it clear to all that we're monitoring this situation closely. We, as a people, are not as naive as we were in 1963.

[ThatBozGuy]

207. Completely Agreed.

Rosetta wrote:
>I will write to the media and forums and websites and the Obama campaign and raise hell about this.
>I hope many more people do the same.

>This incident was unacceptable, especially given Senator Obama's status as a relative outsider, and the location of Dallas where >President Kennedy was murdered in 1963 due to "lax" (or worse) security.

>We need to to make it clear to all that we're monitoring this situation closely. We, as a people, are not as naive as we were in 1963.

I completely agree with your sentiment Rosetta, when I first met Mr Obama in chicago when he was running for the senate, my first reaction ( and its awful that I had to feel this way ) was man I hope no one shoots him because hes going to make an amazing president someday. I never expected that time to be this soon.

The very reason I made ts post is because like you and many I too am watching this situation closely and saw activity that made me worried that they were protecting him much more heavily than usual.

I just wanted to show people what my watching closely had uncovered and that far from "lax" security it was easy to observe very competent and clear effort to protect an individual that I believe by the very nature of fear has alot of enemies and by the very nature of his demonstrated will power and drive will have a tremendous positive impact on my life and many others.

[hatrack]

200. And you're from the government, and you're here to help us . . .

:eyes:

[peacetalksforall]

228. Why do I feel uncomforable about your post? You are obviously an in guy

about the operations. None of our people would be so cocky sure of themselves about saying who was an agent or was not.

Since you are new, do you know that there have been occasions when defenders of official government positions have joined here to push official government explanations? So you know how many people can see through official government positions? And can dissect them and take them apart in minutes or days? Jus so you know.

After observing how we citizens have been 'set up' in many situations where we have been robbed of something, I am a skeptic.

You even say =

"...the Secet service was not happy with the decision and likely not the orginator."

Wow! Amazing!

[kestrel91316]

236. All the dancing and hand-holding SS agents in the world won't

be able to stop a bullet to his head if somebody who's good with a gun gets in there and close enough to hit him.

Sorry. I ain't buyin' it. THey WANT someone with a gun to get in.

[tblue37]

256. Welcome to DU, ThatBozGuy--and thanks for this

detailed, informative post.

[Mozcram]

269. Wow! an amazingly detailed response, and I thank you for it

It sounds as if you have some background in this kind of
security.
I will look to see if I see what you are speaking about, and I
hope and pray that Mr. Obama
will be safe and secure. I have been annoyed at the tremendous
distance President Bush has kept from us, so that he has been
protected from dissent and disapproval, never anywhere near
protesters, blocks of the city (nyc) closed down for his
visits, but for Obama I say, closed down as much as you need
so that you are certain to be safe... Let's hope and pray that
he has a chance to do what he wants to do.

[bvar22]

275. I have a problem with your post.

You highlight all the security at the debates, while the story concerned the pulling of security at an Obama rally on Wednesday.

Whats up with your diversion? :shrug:

[FlyingSquirrel]

284. Good catch... Wow. Just wow.

We don't need another martyr in this country right now (not that we ever did). We need a LEADER.

[monmouth]

286. Hi BozGuy, What a wonderfully informative post. I do feel better

now and will look at those tactics you pointed out. Great post.

[my2sense]

23. WOW

You would think this type of security lapse would NOT be made public IF they are doing all they can to protect Obama.

:mad:

[defendandprotect]

44. Are you kidding . .. !!! They're letting it be known that he's an open target . . . !!!

Aside from what Obama may do or not do in office ---
there is a part of this nation which seems to still feel that it is a threat to
them to see an African-American in America rise to any position, leave alone the presidency!

Whatever we may be learning as a nation and individually about how ALIKE people are . . .
these people will try to destroy any message that says that white:black are equal.

Let's also remember the political violence of the past decades --- and there has been
no real accountability for those assassinations/crimes.


Also keep in mind that when JFK was assassinated in Dallas, half of the police force were KKK.

When Bobby Kennedy was killed in LA, half of the police force were John Birchers.

[Autumn Colors]

54. Then make sure VP running mate is someone they REALLY don't want

If it's the repubs, then I hope he chooses someone like Edwards as his running mate. I hate to think this way, but your post said it very well ... just call it "assassination insurance".

If they don't want "the populist president" then they'd better keep Obama safe.

[defendandprotect]

94. They'd probably try to get two birds with one bomb . .. !!!

...but I agree with you ---
In fact, I'm sure that JFK, Lincoln, Reagan, and Ford would agree with you --

LBJ, GHW Bush, Nelson Rockefeller . . . might not!

[JAbuchan08]

231. keep them apart from one another

if they both get it, it will be harder to advance a 'lone gunman' theory.

[Name removed]

147. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

216. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[rosetta627]

199. Excellent point Autumn Colors

Last time, in 1963, LBJ was the dream establishment replacement--ready to give his backers war the second he took office. And sure nuff within 24 hours he did.

[truedelphi]

73. Were you able to catch the substance of

Larry King's remarks with Michelle Obama on Sunday night?

He mentioned in passing that one reason that Colin Powell's wife refused to let him run was her concern over what might happen to Powell.

I think Michelle thinks about this all the time.

And it is disgusting that the security measures are not better than what they are. There is really no excuse.

[rosetta627]

197. I'm afraid that what you say might be true defendandprotect

That they're actually advertising his lack of security.

This is most alarming.

[Kitty Herder]

119. They might as well paint a big target on his back.

This makes me so angry. :grr: And just sick at heart.

[my2sense]

127. Is that the intent?

:scared:

[Kitty Herder]

129. I hope not. But it scares me. nt

[nebula]

244. Shouldn't they have the permission of Obama himself

before proceeding with such a major security decision on their own??

[donaldsd]

292. Secret Service Playbook

I consider myself an individualist and a Libertarian. I can't support any of the socialist candidates be they Democrat or Republican :). But the actions of the Secret Service are, I believe, <b>willful</b> incompetence. The last time they gave a stand-down order in Texas was in 1963 and we all know what happened there. Whoever gave the order including the people on up the chain of command can give all the usual disingenuous reasons they want, but I think a number of people smell the same rat I do. This should be a HUGE story and heads should roll -- but, of course, they won't. For and by the people indeed....

[thereismore]

2. Holy shit, haven't we learned anything? ML King? Hello? nt

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TheDebbieDee]

20. Oh, puh-leeeeez............

You aren't seriously trying to blame Sen. Clinton for this, are you?

The Clintons don't control the Secret Service, but the neocons do!

[Joe Chi Minh]

25. Why is it, "Oh, puh-leeeeez....." is always such a bad sign on here?

Frog was referring to the Republicans! Did you think he was talking about Bill and Chelsea, for crying out loud?

[rcsl1998]

27. How Is...

..."their girl" a reference to republicans?

[Zhade]

31. My guess: "their girl" in the sense that some Republicans allegedly want her running...

...so they can wallop her.

Looking at it from that angle, Republicans wacking Obama to get Clinton installed as the nom is the conclusion (justified or not).

[EFerrari]

81. Rachel Maddow said wing nut radio has been wanting Hillary for the

last year.

[bdamomma]

180. not only wing nut radio our own filthy MSM has been promoting

her candidacy for a very long time.

[TheDebbieDee]

28. So, the nickname around here for republican is "girl" now?

Sorry, I'm not buying it.

The poster was trying to sling some super-serious $hit - that of a Democratic candidate trying to set up another Democratic candidate to be killed. That was totally outrageous and I wouldn't be much of a member if I let the poster get away with such a statement unchallenged.

[greyghost]

33. Allow me to spell it out...

the Republiscum would like nothing better then to run against Hillary.
She's "their girl." Obama is fairly untouchable, she is far from it.

[muyojoe]

41. THAT'S BULL

That is an idiotic way to refer to her, if that is what the person meant. I don't believe it is. Nobody running for the dem nom this year is the repukes boy or girl. That is a ridiculous false argument.

[snappyturtle]

59. Didn't Hillary say at one point in the campaign process that if

blah, blah, blah, then "I'm your girl." I may be wrong but somehow this just rose to the top when I heard, girl.

[frog92969]

66. Yes.

I think it was- "If you want somebody who can take on the right wing attack machine, then I'm your girl!" -at the big labor union thing with KO.

But I didn't mean it as a sexist remark.

[snappyturtle]

69. Thanks.

[polmaven]

213. Sexist remark is not the concern.

Are you saying that somehow, someone inside Senator Clinton's campaign, or the Senator herself, is trying to set Senator Obama up to be assassinated?????!!!!????

That implication is disgusting!

[frog92969]

257. No.

I never implied that in anything that I said.

You are delusional.

[noiretextatique]

49. then why are they voting for obama?

if they want hillary to win?

[MADem]

265. Shhhhhhhh.....don't inject logic into the discussion!!! nt

[noiretextatique]

274. sorry

:D this is certainly not the place for logic right now.

[cornermouse]

153. No one is untouchable by the GOP.

Think Kerry and what they did to him in 2004.

[frog92969]

72. Referring to our corporate government actually.

But inclusive of republicans yes.

Thank you for thinking about what I said, and understanding what I DIDN'T say.:hi:

[Baby Snooks]

46. But who controls the Clintons?

The neocons. Wake up people.

[springhill]

225. And how do you know they don't support Obama?

After all, he is the one getting all the votes right now. Maybe he is the one they really want to win. Just a thought.

[frog92969]

60. No, not Clinton!

The GOP, DLC, and/or their corporate masters. It's been clear since early on that she is their choice, that's who I suspect.

And it's not the SS, it's the Dallas Police ordered by federal officials.
Read the Original Message, it's pretty interesting.

[pauldg0]

132. Whitewater.........

...mmmmm fishy.

[DS1]

48. Hell, even JFK

The guys who would have ridden on his bumper were told to clear off before the motorcade left the airport, and they were doing the standard "WTF" hand arm motions to the guys telling them to back off.

To get a clear shot?

[defendandprotect]

55. They removed all JFK's surround body guard security ---

The motorcycles should have been at the sides of the car ---
The security detail on the BACK of the car ---
and on the bumpers

And nothing like the route that required the turn/slow down to move in front of the School
Book Depository!!

PLUS, there should have been troops guarding the buildings/windows/watching the streets ---

all called off ---


Look also at how they set up MLK, Jr. . . .
Changing his room assignment, etal ---

[DS1]

77. Yep

You get it

:thumbsup:

[NOLALady]

78. Didn't they reassign all of the black policemen

to insure only white policemen were guarding MLK?

[defendandprotect]

89. Yes. . . . Pepper has an excellent book on this . . . really great investigating .. .

As I recall it --- and it's been a long while since I've thought about this --- but there was a special detail which guarded MLK --- as you are pointing out.

Hope someone else here read the book and remembers the details better than I can recall them at this moment.
I also seem to recall much of this story was also done in a documentary because I well remember one of the most dedicated African-American police officers who was always assigned to guard MLK spoke about it and how he was told to "go home."

--- it's been quite some time since I read his book ---
It's William Pepper, I believe . . .
and he has a wonderful video on YouTube where he explains all the details.

And --- his investigation led to a jury finding for a conspiracy in his killing by the government, didn't it ??? I believe so ---

I have the headline which appeared in one of the newspapers ---
not corporate-media, of course!

James Earl Jones was simply another convenient patsy --
Locked up all of his life for a crime he didn't commit . . .

This is an excellent look at the ways of the right wing --
and just how far they will go to keep control ---
though I think they were always keyed to watch for a "black messiah rising" as Hoover put it ...
it wasn't until MLK, Jr. took the very serious turn of condemning VN war that they seemed to have
decided that they had to kill him.

I was always amazed that the entire country didn't rise up at that point to protest ---
They seemed to be waiting for corporate-media to tell them what to do????

I also don't know if African-Americans could have felt they could at that time rely on "whites" coming out into the streets with them????

Later, of course, we had the riots/fires in African-American neighborhoods which created fear---
but basically destroyed African-American areas which I don't think have ever been brought back????

[Janice325]

123. Not intended to nitpick but aren't you referring to James Earl Ray

and not James Earl Jones?

"James Earl Jones was simply another convenient patsy --"

James Earl Ray is supposed to have killed Martin Luther King.
James Earl Jones is a well-known, highly respected actor, who is probably more well-known for being the voice of Darth Vadar.

[defendandprotect]

246. Sorry . . . it was late ---

Yes, James Earl Ray --- thanks

[MADem]

267. I'm sorry, but that conjures up a picture of abject absurdity...

You want to ask, did he say

THIS....... is C N N

before he did the nefarious deed?

Poor JEJ gets the Osama/Obama treatment, as it is his bad luck to have two syllables in his name that are the same as a murderous assassin.

[puebloknot]

145. "An Act of State," by William Pepper

It's been a long time since I read it, also.

Here is some information about the book and some comments by the author since its publication.

William F. Pepper - "An Act of State: The Execution of Martin Luther King

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/WFP020403.html

He is depicted on King Day as a civil rights leader. And that's the way you're going to see him probably forever. But he was much more than a civil rights leader and that's what no one in official capacity wants you to know. He had moved well beyond the civil rights movement by 1964-65 and he had become effectively a world-figure in terms of human rights people and particularly the poor of this earth. That's where he was going. That's the area you don't really get into safely when you start talking about wealth, redistributing wealth. Taking, diverting huge sums of money into social welfare programs and health programs and educational programs at the grass roots. When you start going into that you begin to tread on toes in this country, in the United Kingdom, and in most of the western world.

>>clip

It became evident that the military did not kill Martin King but that they were there in Memphis as what I've come to believe was a backup operation. Because King was never going to be allowed to leave Memphis. If the contract that was given didn't work these guys were going to do it. . . . This was not a one-off for these guys. They were trained snipers. You remember a hundred cities burned in America in 1967. These guys were sent around the country, teams of them, into different cities. These particular fellows had been in Detroit, Newark and Tampa and possibly L.A. They were given mugbooks. Those mugbooks were the photographs of community leaders and people who were to be their targets. And they would be put in positions and they would take out community leaders who would somehow be killed in the course of the rioting that was going on in various cities. The assassination of Martin King was a part of what amounted to an on-going covert program in which they tried to suppress dissent and disruption in America

>>clip

You can't put anything past this government or any other government of this sort. Because the people who are in power, officially, are really only foot soldiers for the people who run things from the shadows. 9-11 has personally given me a lot of difficulty. But this is not just something that is unique to the United States..

Comments above about safely talking about wealth redistribution, diverting sums of money into social welfare programs, health and educational programs casts some light (maybe only the light of speculation?) on the sudden departure of John Edwards from the primary scene, and the likelihood, or not, of any candidate (even if sincere) being able to deliver universal health care and other social programs.

[defendandprotect]

251. Thank you -- Unfortunately, I don't own this book . . . and probably should buy it ---

AGAIN . . . for anyone interested, you can find this story in video on YouTube ---
William Pepper ---
I've watched it and its excellent ---


Thank you for the insights on Edwards --- I agree ---

On the book, it was interesting to review some of this again ---

And reflecting on what I most fear that even though Americans are getting a little bit better
educated on the atrocious things corrupted forces within our government have done in the past,
that no matter the changes we try to make the people who run things from the shadows
are way ahead of us and amount to the "secret government" we've heard commented upon by many
insiders --- Fletcher Prouty among them.

I also feel that 9/11 was an inside job ---

In many respects, the "free press" should lead the way with these investigations, but as someone said: "The myth of a free press died with the assassination of JFK." However, Americans were put
into shock and awe by the assassination and though there was much suspicion, we seemed to be waiting
for the press to confirm to us that we were right and there was something truly wrong. We never got that confirmation, of course. The private investigators, fortunately, did keep on and the truth is quite clear now. But the press has never acknowledged the obviousness of the conspiracy -- and even more harmful to the public --- they have never acknowledged the long chain of political violence --- out in the open political violence --- that America has suffered over the past decades. Lacking such
information, the public --- IMO --- continues to sit and stare at their TVs feeling assured that if there is something important to be said or heard, it will come from that box!!


It became evident that the military did not kill Martin King but that they were there in Memphis as what I've come to believe was a backup operation. Because King was never going to be allowed to leave Memphis. If the contract that was given didn't work these guys were going to do it. . . . This was not a one-off for these guys. They were trained snipers. You remember a hundred cities burned in America in 1967. These guys were sent around the country, teams of them, into different cities. These particular fellows had been in Detroit, Newark and Tampa and possibly L.A. They were given mugbooks. Those mugbooks were the photographs of community leaders and people who were to be their targets. And they would be put in positions and they would take out community leaders who would somehow be killed in the course of the rioting that was going on in various cities. The assassination of Martin King was a part of what amounted to an on-going covert program in which they tried to suppress dissent and disruption in America

>>clip

You can't put anything past this government or any other government of this sort. Because the people who are in power, officially, are really only foot soldiers for the people who run things from the shadows. 9-11 has personally given me a lot of difficulty. But this is not just something that is unique to the United States..


Just a PS on this --- but Mark Crispin Miller is another truth-teller . . .
and he has said "these people will just as quickly kill you as look at you."

[rosetta627]

Yes they sure as hell did NOLALady

It was well orchestrated.

And the patsy was manipulated months in advanced and well positioned to take the fall.
Of course by then the bad guys had experience at killing our leaders, and would get even more experience in the following months.

[rosetta627]

201. Bingo. A complicit secret service is the first step.

Security stripping.

We need to raise hell about this.
And not just in DU--in the outside world as well.

Let the word go forth from this time and place...

[ailsagirl]

260. There is even a video showing the consternation of the SS when

they're told to get off the back of the limousine that day in Dallas.
"Stand down," they were told. By someone.

[Realityhack]

303. Um. correct me if I am wrong but...

Didn't JFK himself have the armored bubble removed form the limo?

[Supersedeas]

307. now, who at the WH would order such a thing...these days

[celestia671]

136. I was watching a show about JFK's assination the other day

and when they showed the tape I wondered why there weren't any SS around. It was wide open for the shooter.

What worries me is that there are some nutjobs out there who call Obama the 'antichrist'. If he gets elected, some whacked out fundy could try to do him in.

[rosetta627]

203. Nut jobs are not my concern.

The establishment, or what Eisenhower ominously referred to as the Military Industrial Complex, are my concern.

Nut jobs are patsies.

[truth2power]

220. This is the crux of it all. It's not about nutjobs....

If Obama or anyone else goes down, it won't be for any other reason than that they were a threat to those in the shadows. Pure and simple.

JFK, RFK, and MLK were not about nutjobs.

[rosetta627]

253. Exactly truth2power

You live up to your name.

[defendandprotect]

50. Yeah . .. THEY learned how to kill people better . . !!!

[tavalon]

80. Yes "we" have

Don't wait for a lone gunman, or worse, have to recruit a lone gunman. "We" learned on 9/11 that LIHOP works like a charm. Don't discount "our" learning, whippersnapper!


:sarcasm:

[sarcasmo]

3. Barack watch, and it was in Dallas, kind of eerie, like Kennedy.

Nominated and Bookmarked.

[roesch]

14. Just like before

I wonder if it was the same folks who ordered the Secret Service to stop running along side Kennedy's car while still inside the airport?

[dflprincess]

67. Where was Poppy?

n/t

[tavalon]

82. Hey, now, you're obviously a conspiracy theorist from a long time back,

therefore, we can discount any of your silly, silly, and did I mention silly, concerns around supposed "lax" security around Obama. I suppose you think they're trying to encourage the assassination of Obama. Silly, silly and did I mention silly?

I shouldn't need this, but......

:sarcasm:

[superkia]

40. They allowed it to happen to JFK after having warnings, you...

never know when it comes to wealthy, powerful people that are corrupt. If the system cant scare him with some athrax and he gets in the way of their agenda, they will do whats necessary in their eyes. Scary shit!

[emlev]

134. and on the eve of the anniversary of Malcolm X's assassination

Today's that annniversary.

[Newsjock]

4. OK, there's K&R #5

That's just creepy beyond belief, and very quickly gets into the territory of that subject We Just Won't Talk About.

[southern_belle]

5. OMG!!!

:(

[tridim]

7. Who gave the order?

I want to know, and I want him or her questioned and possibly charged.

[RantinRavin]

11. charged with what ?

Not everything that people don't like is a fucking crime.

[LakeSamish706]

13. There may not be charges from something like this, but it certainly should be...

investigated before something does happen. Why the hell would the SS give an order like this?

[tridim]

16. It's a major lapse of national security at the very least.

I'm pretty sure that would fall under "high crimes".

What if someone had pulled a gun? Who would you blame?

[seriousstan]

30. I would start with the person wth the gun. Exactly which "high crime" would this be?

[superconnected]

128. Possibly conspiracy to kill

It looks like the person is intentionally creating a situation to get Obama killed.

[Fearless]

19. Derelection of duty at least.

[JerseygirlCT]

187. dereliction of duty, perhaps?

If their job is to protect the candidate, then calling off that protection shows they aren't doing the job.

[Demeter]

71. Stupidity Is Not a Crime, Alas

And corruption is very hard to prove.

[tridim]

85. Stupidity is a fireable offense though.

And I still want to know who gave the order, we pay for him/her.

[The Wielding Truth]

122. Stupidity?? This was said to be a federal order. n/t

[superconnected]

130. Since they're a security agency they likely violated their own policys.

[pokercat999]

160. Why would we pursue crimes that are "hard to prove"

we should just work the easy stuff like sale and possession of drugs.

Are you by chance involved in the PD or DA's office?

It sure does sound like it. I've been told the IRS used t have a saying "small cases small problems, big cases big problems", hence their pursuit of relatively small time tax cheats while ignoring the big guys.

[Realityhack]

304. reckless endangerment?

probably just a matter of firing them for violating their own policies unless there was some intent found. Probably just run of the mill stupidity though.

[tavalon]

84. That is a really interesting and pertinent question

An equally interesting thing to me is, who allowed this to become public knowledge? Was it an antagonist who hoped to let the people know that it is open season on the uppity N. (not my word, but certainly the sentiment of anyone who would hear the message and lock and load) or was it someone looking to avoid another LIHOP?

[LakeSamish706]

8. The scarier question is why would the Secret Service make that request and who's directive? Heres..

my post of concern from yesterday....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=108x125961#125969

[sasquatch]

9. Can you say Kennedy Assisination of 1963 all over again?

:wow:

[cloud75]

29. my thoughts exactly and the book depository is right down the street

from reuninon arena.

[cbayer]

10. Dupe.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2903968

[Megahurtz]

12. WTF???

>>>"the order was made by federal officials who were in charge of security at the event..."<<<

Shit rolls downhill, I wonder where it came from this time? :eyes:

Evil fucks! :grr:

[santamargarita]

17. Dallas, what a surprise

K&R

[Subdivisions]

208. Could you please elaborate? n/t

[reggie the dog]

18. there was less security

than for a hockey game. Bags are usually always checked at sporting events, why not for political rallies?

[truthisfreedom]

21. Heads should roll for this.

Unconscionable.

[Joe Chi Minh]

24. If Obama makes it to the Presidency, he needs to get advice from some of the

good guys in the CIA/FBI on body-guards certain to remain loyal.

They faded away - under orders - at the crucial time in Dallas, and an SAS expert on protecting individuals while travelling or in public areas, in a cable TV programme here in the UK, pointed to one of Reagan's body-guards who should have kept much closer to him. He was standing much too far away.

[Baby Snooks]

105. There are no good guys...

The head of the security detail, which later became known as the Secret Service, that protected Abraham Lincoln was alleged to have conspired with John Wilkes Booth. Something few people have ever talked about. But something people should think about. Reality is Ronald Reagan was simply lucky. John Hinckley was not a very good shot. If he had been, Ronald Reagan would have been dead. Questions were raised about that as well with regard to how someone with a gun could get that close to a president. The same questions were asked when attempts were made to assassinate Gerald Ford. The answer probably lies in the matter of "crowd control" that is handled by local law enforcement. But which acts at the direction of the Secret Service. The Secret Service probably has never had a local law enforcement agency question its direction before. But thank god one did.

Barack Obama represents a threat to quite a few people. Mainly because no one foresaw the enormous reaction to him by the people.

He probably needs to hire someone to watch the people watching him.

[Joe Chi Minh]

295. A difficult job, I would imagine. But spot on, nevertheless.

[mirrera]

26. In Maine we ALL went through metal detectors and were individually wanded...

We were only about 7000 inside and 2000 who didn't make it in. This is scary with 15000 people.

[fight4my3sons]

194. yes, and they even opened my camera lens

Then inside there were those secret service guys in the back looking out that little window at the crowd with that telephoto lens or whatever it was. It is shocking that they would do that in a crowd as big as 15,000.

[onehandle]

32. Supposedly Dallas is where Bush plans to live after he gets off scot free.

That's all I have to say.

[greyghost]

34. Yeah, Ive heard that to...

his weekend place Crawford is in that part of the state.

[pop goes the weasel]

113. check a map

Nope. Not near Dallas.

But it doesn't matter, because the pig farm is only a media backdrop. It'll be "Good-bye Green Acres" and "Hello, City Life," just as soon as the screen door slams on the White House back exit.

Assuming the White House has a screen door.

[greyghost]

277. You mean Waco's closer, right? LOL

I drove through Texas in October, I'm here to tell ya it's one big empty.

I visited his "hometown" Midland. No wonder the MF' er is as crazy as he is.

[pop goes the weasel]

291. hey, that's an important difference

"Closer to Waco" is another way of saying "near perdition."

[greyghost]

294. :)

[rainbow4321]

300. He's not moving to the ranch...

Local reports say that he and Pickles will be moving back to Highland Park which is in the middle of Dallas but not called Dallas...with the rest of the local zillionaires. Within spitting distance of his library.

I hate it when people/MSM say he's moving "to Dallas". He likes to use the city as a prop, kinda like he did with his 2004 Election Day eve "rally". It was a closed door, held at midnight (literally) , invitation only get together near Highland Park at SMU before he went off to the "ranch". But the media had a field day flashing "Dallas" all over the screen making it look like everyday/normal/non-zillionaire area residents actually support him.

Dallas County went 49% blue on Election Day 2004.

[Ian David]

47. I thought it was his Post-Holocaust Survivalist Compound in Paraguay. n/t

[onehandle]

51. shh...

That's Plan B.

[truedelphi]

74. The latest I've heard about Paraquay is that they are not really interested in living there

They are in open negotiations to divert the publicly owned water supplies of that nation into their own private pockets, much as Bechtel did with Bolivia.

[JPZenger]

99. Paraguay - Great Story, But Apparently Not True

The story about the Bushes buying a huge compound in Paraguay to escape war crimes charges came from one article in a minor foreign newspaper, which then spread through the innernets and the youtubes. There has been absolutely no evidence of it.

But it does make a great story.

[The Wielding Truth]

144. Well, here are two more sources. Maybe, it is true?

Yet it reads that the land is for Jena's grandfather?
http://www.lanacion.com.py/noticias.php?not=143871
¿Bush tiene estancia en el Chaco?

El gobernador del departamento de Alto Paraguay, Erasmo Rodríguez, dijo carecer por el momento de todo tipo de información respecto de una eventual visita de la hija de George Bush (h), Jenna, al Chaco por actividades humanitarias de voluntariado para la Unicef, lo cual lo extrañaba considerando que Alto Paraguay abarca una de las zonas más necesitadas del país.

Reveló que en este departamento existe un establecimiento de unas 70.000 hectáreas, cuya propiedad se atribuye a George Bush padre (abuelo de Jenna) y que actualmente lo estaría administrando Timothy Towell, embajador de EEUU en Asunción, cuando aquel ejercía la presidencia de su país.

Rough translation:
It revealed that in this department an establishment of 70,000 hectares, whose property exists father attributes itself to George Bush (grandfather of Jenna) and who at the moment would be administering Timothy to it Towell, ambassador of the U.S.A. in Asuncio'n, for when the president leaves his country.

then on this site where it also says the land is owned by george bush sr...
http://upsidedownworld.org/main/content/view/457/0/

[Ian David]

169. That's disappointing, but it's always good to know the truth. Thanks. n/t

[Wetzelbill]

35. that's the thing I've been worried about, but too nervous to say it....

I just don't like even thinking about it, but you know the closer Obama gets to being president, the more wackos will be out.

[barbtries]

38. unfortunately it's not the wackos who worry me

well, not the street wackos. the neocon bushie wackos, they scare me. there is nothing, just nothing, that i would put past them.

[defendandprotect]

57. Absolutely . . . and they are very adept at finding people to set up as patsies .. .

[Wetzelbill]

76. I was thinking racist wackos

but yeah, just all around wackos. Smart ones. I'm not talking about the dude down the street who eats garbage for dinner and holds a sign screaming around about the apocalypse all day. I mean the ones who can actually figure out how to do something.

[ngant17]

159. what about the brain-washed religious wackos?

Don't forget that Mark David Chapman (assassin of Lennon) and John Hinkley (attempted assassin of Raygun) both were associated with the same World Vision Christian fundie church.

World Vision is an evangelical order which often fronts for the CIA. They performed espionage work for the CIA in Southeast Asia while Operation Phoenix (the murderous project that left 40,000 people dead) was in full effect. In Honduras, they maintained a presence at CIA contra recruiting camps in the war against the Sandinistas. In Lebanon, the fascist Phalange butchered Palestinians at World Vision’s camp. In Cuba, their refugee camps hosted numerous members of the anti-Castro terrorist group Alpha 66 of Bay of Pigs fame. After the Guyana massacre, World Vision developed a scheme to repopulate Jonestown with CIA-linked mercenaries from Laos. Laos, of course, was where the CIA was running it’s “secret war” during Vietnam, which for the most part was a smokescreen for a widespread opium trafficking operation.

One particularly important World Vision official was John Hinckley, Sr., an oil man, reputed CIA officer, and friend of George Bush. You may have heard of his son. Less than four months before Hinckley Jr. became known as Jodie Foster’s biggest fan, another member of the World Vision order, Mark Chapman, gunned down John Lennon in what may have been a practice run for the bigger hit on President Reagan. One of the policeman who found him was convinced that he was a mind-controlled assassin. Chapman was clutching a copy of the novel Catcher in the Rye, which was also owned by John Hinckley Jr. (The book was written by J.D. Salinger, who worked in military intelligence with Henry Kissinger during World War II.) Before going to trial, Chapman plead guilty after a voice in his head (which he attributed it to God) commanded him to do so.

[Wetzelbill]

242. well you definitely have a class of people

who are driven by that sort of thing. And that many of them think Obama is a Muslim, yeah, you can't overlook that.

[defendandprotect]

258. Thank you --

Just as an aside . . . that's a big and important subject . . .
and religion, of course, has been used as a foothold to conquer people/nations throughout history.

While I think there are real questions about whether or not either Chapman or Hinckley actually intended to kill anyone, they certainly became patsies.

I do completely agree with the "mind-controlled" aspects ---

[windbreeze]

36. should we be surprised?

Let's hope Obama takes care of this, ON HIS OWN...this sort of thing gives a message loud and clear...some people cannot be trusted...and sometimes it's those closest to you or the ones you are depending upon the most...I wonder how one combats being blindsided from within...??? By hiring a personal police force??? Perhaps he better watch his back from now on, this sure gives me a creepy feeling...wb

[DiverDave]

37. WTF??

The Obama handlers should have told him to take a walk.
This could have been bad...

[Gman]

42. In Dallas of all places the SS stops screening for weapons?

"But, he added, the turnout of more than 17,000 people seemed to be a "friendly crowd."

The crowd was really friendly in Dealy Plaza too. But it only took (allegedly) one person. Dallas can literally be a dangerous place for any Democrat of influence and stature.

I'm about as staunch a Hillary supporter (surrogate to you Obama people) as you're going to find but I do worry a lot for Obama's safety the more it looks like he may be the nominee because there are some crazy MF's out there in the RW. It's the same people that took out John, Bobby and Martin. They'll take out Obama if they get a chance.

I told this to my neighbor across the fence yesterday and he said he didn't think there was anything to worry about because security nowadays is so tight. Wait till I see him.

[ooglymoogly]

109. Its de ja vu all over again....anyone remember the secret service protective guards on the JFK

limo were removed in Dallas as a precaution to be sure the assassination could go smoothly.

[Redstone]

43. Oh, Christ, Open The Floodgates Of Conspiracy, Real And Imagined, Present And Past.

Boy, am I glad I'm going to bed early tonight. It's going to get real ridiculous REAL fast right here.

Redstone

[Trajan]

108. Fact isnt a conspiracy ....

Metal detectors have been used for a reason, and the reasoning is sound ...

To have them shutdown, when they are needed most, should cause even the most skeptical among us to pause and say 'why' ?

Attempting to insinuate those here who are concerned about this are kooky 'conspiracy theorists' seems a tad over the top ....

Caution is wise .... an intentional lack of caution may have be criminal ....

[ooglymoogly]

111. Much better to just pretend.

[Marrah_G]

181. It already has ! People have already worked themselves into manic fits and paranoia.

It's rather un-nerving.

[Ian David]

45. I went to an Obama rally in Boston, and security was so awful that I decided not to write about it.

I was afraid that dangerous elements might take advantage of it.

But it looks like Bush is trying to do to Obama what they did to Bhuto.


Since the cat is out of the bag, here is my experience.

1) You pay your $25 donation for a "ticket" online, and print it out. The instructions say to bring it with you.

2) Staff at the door looks closely enough to see that you have something in your hand that approximately looks like the receipt.

3) You walk past a table with a couple of cops, a secret service agent, and a bunch of college freshman volunteers, all of whom look overwhelmed.

4) I stood 2-3 rows from the stage.

5) The stage is ringed by a mix of cops and secret service who closely scrutinize everyone within spitting distance of the stage. There was one female secret service agent who gave me the impression that she could tell my entire life history as if she was Adrian Monk.

6) I do not recall seeing even one bomb-sniffing dog. And although I looked, I did not see any cops on the neighboring roofs.

7) In this particular venue, the stage was directly next to an exterior load-bearing wall and beneath a balcony. While anyone close to Obama INSIDE would have had to deal with his multiple layers of security personnel, he was only about 3 inches of 100 year-old brick and mortar away from possible danger from the outside of building.

6) The over-all impression I got was that just about anyone could walk in without paying, and carrying anything they wanted to, so long as they were not close to the stage. If something terrible happened at that event, Obama would be saved from a direct assault by his phalanx of protection, but dozens of people in the general audience could have been turned to red jelly if someone walked in with a device.

7) There is better security at the local Renaissance Faire, and people THERE get to carry swords.

[rox63]

174. I was in that same line in Boston

And I didn't have to pay anything for my ticket. Of course, after waiting in line in the cold for over 4 hours, I finally gave up and went home. I never actually got into the event.

[Ian David]

179. At other events, Obama has gone outside to speak to the crowds that couldn't get inside.

A well-intentioned gesture that is also a serious security breach.

[MidwestTransplant]

182. Visible security isn't the only security.

[AnnieBW]

52. Yeesh...

And I just heard "In the Name of Love" on the way home from work. :scared:

[Aviation Pro]

126. The name of the song is "Pride".....

....

[Puzzler]

53. Remember...

... there is huge difference between a "lapse" in security, and a direct ORDER to not screen people!


-P

[defendandprotect]

56. I'd like to hear what corporate-media do with this report, if anything .. ...!!???

[Omaha Steve]

58. I saw Senator Obama two weeks ago tonight

I thought the security was good. The night before we were told by a campaign manager the auditorium would be one of the safest places in the country for several hours. But I was one of the first to get inside the day of the event. I have no idea what happened after that.

[varelse]

61. I've been afraid of this since it was first rumored Obama might run for President

And frankly I view an attempt on his life as a deadly weapon aimed and a shot fired at ALL of us and against our democracy. And I'll act accordingly, too.

[JI7]

62. whoever made that decision should be fired

[BeachBaby]

63. I've Said This Before and I'll Say It Again......

For all the people of the world who hate our current president, he needs not fear them; you see, he is doing what he's being told to do. He's the puppet, with the masters pulling the strings. It doesn't matter that pretty much every leader in every country hates his guts; it doesn't matter that religious zealots the world over would blast themselves into oblivion if they could get close enough to him. IT DOESN'T MATTER - HE IS DOING WHAT HE WAS HIRED TO DO.

It's the "fresh minds" like JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcolm....the ones who strived for change in a positive direction. They were not doing their jobs correctly, and they were a threat to the status quo. Don't mess with the status quo - and then expect your security detail to take care of you.

I think many have forgotten who the SS works for. I don't mean who they protect, but WHO THEY WORK FOR.

And guess what? THEY DO WHAT THEY ARE TOLD.

I've been worrying about Mr. Obama since he started campaigning. Everytime I see him on TV, walking around shaking hands, I get nervous and sometimes have to walk away from the TV. I hope he is not relying solely on the SS. I hope that he has contracted a private security firm to assume the responsibility of his welfare. I hope he hasn't forgotten that, while the SS may be standing there in front of him, to the sides of him, and behind him, they aren't working FOR him.

[defendandprotect]

91. And, yes, it is ironic --- and I'm grateful for it --- that we haven't had incidents against Bush -

as unpopular as he is --- nor any liberal hosts trying to create personal animosity and hatred for him --- as we had with Sen. Helms and Rush Limbaugh and others -- and the incidents which followed
of attempts to do harm to Clinton. Shooting into the White House. . . flying into the White House!

And, too, we all know, should we ever be able to hold Bush accountable, liberals would ensure that
it was by the most significant rules of justice!

As I've said before, I imagine that Bush/Cheney begin every day by saying to one another:
"Don't worry; they won't do anything!" ---

[salin]

64. On the one hand, publicizing such lax security could be a dangerous thing,

but on the other hand - by having the info go public - is more likely to prevent such future lapses because now folks up the chain of command would be clearly easily blamed for any tragedy that could be a result of such lax security folks might be not so willing to play such a dangerous game. Hopefully it will prevent recurrences.

[backscatter712]

65. It seems the SS is becoming like the Praetorian Guard.

Corrupt, frequently the power behind the throne, purportedly there to protect the Emperor, but actually doing the exact opposite.

By the ending years of the Roman Empire, the situation was so fucked up that we were looking at Emperor of the Week.

[ClusterFreak]

68. A security stand-down in Dallas?

Jeez, there's a first.:sarcasm:

[bonito]

70. At this point I'm just a fly on the wall

And I must say things are surprising in that Obama is in the lead, now that is a given, and Hillary the chosen one, the only way the neocons can win is if Obama is out of the picture.

[kaygore]

75. Security was very lax for the Obama rallies in Virginia

I attended the one in Alexandria and everyone was commenting on how lax security was. My friends who attended the one at the convention center in Virginia Beach where over 18,000 people showed up said that only the people who were up front close to Obama had to go through metal detectors.

At the time I wondered if the Secret Service didn't want Obama killed.

Talk about a country rioting if that happens! It will be the late 60s-early 70s all over again!

[my3boyz]

79. I was just about to post that..I was at the VA Bch rally too

and I was surprised they did not make everyone go through metal detectors.

[ngant17]

288. if Obama is taken out

by some mind-controlled assassin, given a convenient lapse of security by police/SS/FBI, then the Dept. of Homeland Security would have an excuse to declare martial law and start rounding up "suspected leftists". Of course, for this to happen the alleged assassin will have to be tied to some obscure leftwing outfit, like Oswald was in the "Fair Play for Cuba" front. Lots of scenarios can be imagined, and don't be surprised if the alleged assassin is suddenly silenced in a police basement, or some place where the events can be controlled to the neocon's advantage. A new "Warren Commission" will be published in 45 volumes of trivial gossip and silly innuendo, and America will not recognize another coup d'etat even when it hits us in the face again.

[CreekDog]

83. Jeez, they won't even let people see Bush if they are carrying the wrong question

But they don't stop anything when they go to see Obama.

Ridiculous. :grr:

[defendandprotect]

92. Bush I has always been heavily guarded; barricades went up everywhere in DC ---

and Bush II is same way --- even more protective of himself.

I would imagine because both of them are familiar with that turn of mind!!

[debbierlus]

86. Omg.

That is sick. They are telling the security to stop screening????

[classykaren]

150. Remember Rev Jackson only used his own son for security

I guess that was all he could trust God help us all

[Diane R]

87. This is extremely frightening and ominous.

[PuppyBismark]

88. In TEXAS! Land of the GUN!

Give me a break. There are more guns than people in Texas and many of them thar Texans don't go anywhere with out them guns.

KO: My nomination for "Worst Person in the World", the Secret Service protecting Barack Obama!

:wtf:

[defendandprotect]

93. ".......because guns don't kill people . . .. "

[depakid]

117. Impressive, eh?

Tempting to think that someone is sending Obama a none too subtle message...:tinfoilhat:

Then again, as Napaleon is reported to have said: “Never ascribe to malice that which can adequately be explained by incompetence.”

[candymarl]

90. Good grief

Not Dallas again. Didn't we live through this nightmare already? I agree with the poster that asked where Poppy was. I think the better question is: Where are all of the Bush-men? Poppy and the boys I mean. Neil was having lunch with Hinckley's brother when Reagan was shot. But I'm sure that's just another "Bush coincidence".

[MrsBrady]

95. I was in Dallas...I saw it myself, and I was surprised and worried.

I'm glad this point was raised, because as one who was standing in line from 9am (many were there much earlier) and I finally got in at 11:45 (the speakers started about noon, Obama started about 1),
no one searched my purse, no one waved me down with a hand wand, no metal detector was at the door. NOTHING!

This really disturbed me, and I even mentioned it to the people I had been standing in line with.
When I got home, I even told of my concerns to my husband. Perhaps I should have called Obama's people. Perhaps I should anyway.
I thought it was stupid, stupid, stupid.

They had a single file line wrapped around the building and the parking lot...they opened the doors about 10:30, and it took me over an hour, from where I was in line, to get in the front door.
There was more than 15,000 people waiting to get in. That's a long freaking line.
When finally my place in line got to the north entrance where they were letting everyone in, there were about 4 or 5 cops standing NEAR, but NOT AT the door...mostly standing around talking.
I expected someone to stop me. NOTHING, absolutely nothing.
Once inside the double door, there was only one middle aged man, don't know if he was security or a volunteer...all he did was tell me what section to go sit in.

The only people inside that I saw in the seating areas were just the regular arena ushers.

Everyone was peaceful, there were no problems. But HELLO!!!!!! All it takes is one crazy racist redneck. Now Dallas is a very cosmopolitan town, but it's not as cosmo as it wants to be.

After the event, the moment he finished...it was really easy for me to get to the floor. I was trying to take a picture...but what if I had been some nut?
He had secret service directly around him before and after he spoke like you see on tv when the crowds come up.....

But you know what...he was standing up on a raised podium, IN CLEAR VIEW, in a 360 arena were people had not been searched for weapons....DO YOU CONSIDER THAT WISE!!!!! NO F*ING WAY!!!

I think I will make that call.

[AnnieBW]

96. If HRC was the front-runner

They'd be doing the same thing to her. They just can't get away with it as much because she's entitled to SS protection because she's a former First Lady, and everybody knows it. There's a lot more Hillary-Haters with guns out there than Obama-Haters.

[JPZenger]

97. Musharriff Removed Bhutto's Security Protection Before the Attack

Before the second attack on Bhutto's life (which killed her), Mushariff removed her government security detail. Maybe Bush is trying to plagarize an idea from his good friend.

[lovuian]

102. I know in St Lou they searched our purses

before we went in

[Corgigal]

98. I was trying to find the chain of command structure

for the Secret Service. I can't imagine this order was placed locally at the event. Every Secret Service agent I've ever met (hubby assisted with Presidential work detail for both Carter and Reagan) took their job very seriously. I can't believe that Obama's campaign people can over ride the main job description for S.S. detail. Didn't Obama get and S.S. detail earlier then most candidates because of the threats that were aimed at him months ago? All we can now hope for is that this article being printed changes this lack of security.

[kitty1]

100. Let me guess; Blackwater is running things behind the scenes..n/t

[kitty1]

104. ;Obama goes after Blackwater; Iowa city speech here....

IOWA CITY –Sen. Barack Obama charged today that a private security firm operating in Iraq has acted "with reckless disregard to Iraqi life," as he called his proposals to better monitor such contractors the toughest reforms offered by any candidate in the presidential race.
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2007/10/obama_goes_after_blackwater.html

I think they may have it in for their pal Obama.

[lovuian]

101. this just proves there is someone in charge of the Secret Police

that is allowing poor protection

Who wrote the stand down order???

a pretty good seer predicted Obama assasination

this just looks like another step to that possibility

Glad the Dallas Police leaked it

[TankLV]

103. Gee - not TOO subtle, are they?

God help us...

[Infinite Hope]

106. WTF??? Let me know when an answer has been provided someone, please. n/t

[FATCATs]

107. In Dallas No Less

Shit should hit the fan over this one and whoever gave that order should
be fired and investigated.

Something stinks here man, Big Time

[DFW]

110. Whoever gave that order needs to give a thorough explanation

And if it's unsatisfactory, then be charged with attempted murder.
If Obama is elected, the Secret Service will have some personnel
shake-ups. But an order (if that is what it was) of that magnitude
would not have originated from within the Secret Service. It would
have come from higher-up. For example, from a guy with the power to
convince Bush to invade Iraq without justification.........

The origin of that order MUST be found.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

112. Well they had better step up security at Obama's events

if this is true then an investigation should take place on whose orders the SS were told to stop the screening. No doubt the Obama campaign are dealing with this?

[OneBlueSky]

114. I'm no Obama supporter, but this is absolutely terrifying . . .

someone's ass needs to be hauled before Congress tomorrow to explain just what in the hell the Secret Service thought they were doing, who gave the order and why . . . Jesus, this is Dallas! . . .

[pop goes the weasel]

115. Here's props to the Dallas PD

I'm glad they are calling the Secret Service out on this crap. I bet they were freaked out worrying that Obama would get killed in Dallas.

[redqueen]

226. Yes, good point... they deserve praise for this. (nt)

[DFW]

281. That's a good bet

I know some retired DPD guys, and whatever their political persuasions,
they would have absolutely freaked about this.

[David Zephyr]

116. Kicking this up so it stays in the "news".

Grrrrrrrrrr.

[Kitty Herder]

118. This just makes me sick. Literally.

I have this heavy, sinking, cold, sick feeling in my stomach about this. I'm scared for Obama. I've been a little scared for him all along, but this just makes my fears seem real.
:scared: :scared:

[powergirl]

120. I was there and I was shocked that there were no metal detectors

[sce56]

121. If you think you can trust the Secret Service watch closely how well the SS were doing in the same

car as JFK!


They looked around and waited until the head shot before reacting! and there were bullets flying into the windshield! It wasn't until after the head shot that they hit the gas!

[RamboLiberal]

124. 2 out of 3 times I attended Kerry/Edwards events in Pgh area 2004

I was not screened. Last time right before election it scared me that we could all be so close to Edwards w/o being screened. At the one event it was because they couldn't get everyone in by time Kerry was supposed to appear. In Edwards case it wasn't that large a crowd and it was plain damn bad security. Only the first Kerry/Edwards event did they have excellent security. I can only comment on my area. So I don't think this lax security is unique to Obama.

But this is damn stupid by Secret Service. If Rent-A-Security guard can screen NFL and College crowds numbering near 100,000 and get everyone in the stadium in about 90 minutes in time for kickoff then Secret Service has no excuse.

[MilesColtrane]

125. Henry Paulson is the Treasury secretary.

As such, he's the capo di tutti capi of the Secret Service.

He's an old Nixon administration worker bee just like Cheney was.

In fact, Paulson was the assistant to Watergate conspirator John Ehrlichman.

So the responsibility for an order to stand down ultimately rests with him.

[williesgirl]

131. Everyone should call the SS and their local newspaper and TV stations 1st thing in the morning.

If this is really publicized, someone will look into it and have to stop this shit. rec'd

[file83]

133. I don't know what to think about this, because back in 1992 when Bill Clinton

was campaigning in Oregon, he was to have a rally at the University of Oregon. The rally was inside "The Pit", the basketball court building. There was almost no security and we "snuck" in by entering a door where someone else exited. There was no security.

So, I'm not sure how serious this situation with Barack really is. The guy isn't President yet.

[RamboLiberal]

140. Come to think of it I attended an outdoor Clinton/Gore rally

in 1992 right after the convention when they were on the bus tour. No search!

[lovuian]

135. I want to know who gave the stand down order

this is exactly what happened to Kennedy

[lisainmilo]

137. That is appalling and irresponsible!

grrrrrrrrrr! Bastards!

[leftcoastie]

138. Just when you feel we're

rising from the ashes, shit like this makes you realize that there are evil forces within our own country that would act against the will of the people (not to mention what else). God forbid if we were to see a repeat of the 60s horrors, it will be time to shut down the country by the millions, and demand justice.

[Azazel]

139. I'll bet this was Barack's decision.

The Secret Service probably gave in to Barack's wish to have the seats filled. If so, this was unwise on Barack's part and unwise on the part of the Secret Service. (I am an Obama supporter.)

[Mithreal]

142. If you are right, many here are getting a good workout

jumping to conclusions. I suspect you may be right and I am actually hoping so too.

Welcome to DU.

[ShortnFiery]

141. IMO, fear-mongering BUNK. The Secret Service are *true* professionals.

Oh, and BTW, you really need not check under your bed for terrorists this evening. :eyes:

[RamboLiberal]

219. Yes they are truly professionals but even they can get sloppy

And as I mentioned before at one event I attended in SW PA just days before the 2004 election at an Edwards rally we were not screened and close enough to the candidate it was scary to me. I'm familiar with handguns and I knew someone could've had one in their pocket and could've gotten off a shot. I'd rather depend on them having us go through metal detectors than having them depend on their skill of scanning the crowd and watching for that indication of someone drawing out a gun or grasping a gun in a jacket pocket.

[theHandpuppet]

143. WHAT THE HELL???

Words fail me.

:grr:

[McCamy Taylor]

146. Now that the Dallas Police have advertised the lack of security by Secret Service

Secret Service must start providing adequate protection for Obama and Hillary and McCain, since reports of lax protection like this will increase the risk. Trouble makers may have stayed away, assuming that the Secret Service was doing its job.

If Obama 's staff told the SS to let everyone in w/o screening, maybe they need to release a statement to defuse things. If they did not, maybe someone should find out if there is a protocol.

[MrSlayer]

148. This is a propaganda move to scare people away from Obama.

I doubt this is true, this is one of those stories put out to, quite frankly, intimidate African-Americans and liberals. You'll see a lot of things like this if Obama gets the nod. It's an attempt to make people fear to vote Obama so they can "save" him from being killed. C'mon, the idea of the Dallas Police coming clean alone should put a person on to the scent of fish.

[candymarl]

149. Well if the idea is to intimidate

African-Americans it won't work. We've lived through worse than this. The threat of violence toward a prominent black person? It won't scare us. What it will do is piss us off.

[MrSlayer]

152. These people are coming from an outdated mindset.

They are going to try all the old tricks and they are going to backfire. They aren't used to nearly everyone looking at a black candidate and seeing a brilliant, inspiring man or at least a legitimate, worthy opponent. After Obama wins the general they are going to be sitting around wondering what the hell happened.

This story was an old school tactic that would have been crippling even 15 years ago. I'm not buying the SS calling off searches.

[defendandprotect]

243. Wondering if the corp-media will report on this --- and if ....

Obama has received any personal threats.

I think we have to be prepared for this and ENSURE that that what should be happening with
protection for him --- and for Hillary, as well --- is actually happening!

[RainDog]

248. we stand together

candymarl - I'm a white woman and I have HAD IT with the right wing in this country CONSTANTLY working to kill hope. And, yes, African-Americans have had it worst of all in this nation. For the entire history of this nation.

Knowing this, knowing they have assassinated our leaders before, I want to think about how to be PRO-active, not reactive. We need a strategy in place to respond to right wing violence. Riots are not going to help us. But I could certainly understand them if such an event were to happen.

so what can we do instead? We KNOW Bush Sr. covered for Pinochet when Ambassador Letelier, from Chile, was assassinated in the U.S. They also murdered an American woman. We KNOW Kissinger was in bed with Pinochet and his murder of thousands and thousands of Chileans who had voted for Allende, who was democratically elected and then overthrown with U.S. support and approval.

http://www.democracynow.org/2006/9/21/thirty_years_after_the_assassination_of

We KNOW the right wing was happy to murder JFK (pls, if you think Oswald was a commie, get some history - he was an asso. of Shaw's and Shaw was a CIA guy, which Helms testified about under oath) There is too much evidence now, over the years, to believe the Warren Commission b.s.

We KNOW MLK was murdered because he was right about what was wrong and they tried as hard as they could to stop civil rights (just as they are doing now with voter caging, etc.)

SO - what can we do beforehand to tell the right wing they will pay if they, once again, resort to violence because the majority of America doesn't agree with them?

I wonder about this both from the perspective of voter fraud, and from the perspective or harm to a candidate. (btw, on Slate.com, soon after the selection, before I knew DU existed, I was arguing with some asshole about Scalia's "one time ruling" and they guy on Slate said it was a good thing Gore wasn't elected or he'd have been killed by now...and I didn't and don't take that as a joke b/c it's too much of their truth for too many years.)

We need plans about how to respond to these potential situations. I, for one, do not trust the dems to do anything to stop the right wingers... I've had a few years to disabuse myself of that notion. But citizens, going viral- spreading the word, empowering each other with a plan for this versus that situation...

I also think a plan is good because I don't want a war between Americans again. But if the right wing keeps up this shit, then what choice does someone have? If they are not held accountable, isn't this nation already lawless?

anyway, I wish some activists and planners could discuss effective mass action. Walk outs, sit ins, general strikes, march on DC, filing charges in another country when your own won't pursue justice...

I want a way to prevent the violence against democrats, first. However, if that doesn't work, what do we do in response?

[Elspeth]

224. I wonder if you aren't correct, MrSlayer

That seems the best explanation so far.

[izquierdista]

151. Bush has won, you're all nuts

Try and ratchet down on the Gestapo-like security ever present in America and you Americans go ballistic.

"No,no,no! All must be searched! More metal detectors, more screening! We must find every last Jew....(er, whatever the hated group of month it is now)."

Once the conversion to fascist state is made, it's difficult to turn back, to have less 'security' running around checking everybody's papers.

I, for one, hope that Obama wins and does turn things around. It's going to be hard for you to adjust to though. And the unemployment, what's going to happen to those thousands of industrious security guards who inspect every shoe, belt buckle, shampoo bottle, and anal cavity that tries to pass?

[Name removed]

154. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lochloosa]

Would you like to explain your post before you are tombstoned?

[Lochloosa]

162. ..

[NM Independent]

155. I hope for all our sakes that this turns out to be less...

...than what my sickening stomach told me it was.

I lived in the DFW area for 6 years, and I assure you there is not a shortage of insane racists (of all races). I sensed a lot of division the further you get from a college campus...it bothered me.

It may be the case that all the other candidates have had the same thing happen. However, for the SS to not provide overkill protection is just gross incompetence for Barack or Hillary. C'mon, I was expecting to see overkill and I've been wondering where it was just watching on TV. Mostly, for this to happen in that city, with this candidate...well, I think somebody was betting the bank that something would happen.

[rambler_american]

156. Secret SErvice stand down in Dallas

when JFK was shot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8

Who is really running the show here?

[cornermouse]

157. Having screening for weapons is a sane policy.

Especially with our history, to stop screening for weapons at a political rally is wrong. It should never have been stopped. This needs to be reinstated.

[BreweryYardRat]

158. Gross incompetence or conspiracy. Either way, some people need to be fired. n/t

[my2sense]

161. Couple this incident with this conspiracy theory

Source: http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2008/02/371943.shtml

Obama Security Lax
author: raven
Just what Bush needs to declare martial law
O'bama's security is so horrible, that it looks to be intentional.

I saw footage last night that just blew me away. O'bama was walking across a concrete lot, in the near background were several multi-stored buildings as near as 100 yards away. There were no security agents within 10 feet of (the principle), most were 20 to 30 feet away, I don't believe any were as tall as he is, and I did not see an agent of color either.

There have been many threats already and he looks to be on a standard 'packet'. With threats already made, he should be on 'special packet' that should include at least 8 agents as tall or taller. 4 each for both a front and rear fan design. He should never have been taken across that parking lot in the complete open under any circumstances. Your average deer hunter can be deadly accurate at those distances.

In the handshake crowd, there should be an additional 2 tall agents directly in front about 4 foot back from the line. Standard protection in the line should be as it is but to include the taller agents both in front and behind the principle.

The footage I saw was just unbelievable. This nation has a sordid history of gunning down progressive leadership. In a time of economic hardship, there are internal pressures that build in those who see their economic world crashing down, nothing left to loose, throw in some racism and that creates extreme danger for O'bama.

I bring this up fo 2 reasons, not only does he need 'special packet' protection to keep him secure, but his killing and the explosion in the city streets would be the prime trigger point for just what bush and cheney really want, martial law and the delay or cancellation of the election. This would work perfectly for them and their 'unfinished agenda'.

This lack of protection needs public posting, this site is monitored and that is a good start, once this security lapse is posted, there can not be any denial that this was not 'foreseen'.

[dysfunctional press]

188. add another layer of conspiracy for an even better flavour...

obama gets rfk'd, and it's made to look like the hillary campaign was behind it.

can you say "president mccain"...?

[my2sense]

163. Can we get this on the Greatest Page? n/t

[liberal N proud]

164. There is something terrible wrong that allowed this to happen

There are so many bigoted people still in this nation that of all candidates, the current Democratic candidates need protection more than any since Lincoln.

[bigworld]

171. It's top story on Drudge

in red, no less. With a link to the Star Telegram story <http://www.star-telegram.com/667/story/486413.html>

[INDIA]

215. Good for Sludge...

Even a broken clock right? This story needs COVERAGE

[Ian_rd]

165. Test run. nt.

[RestoreGore]

166. 'Federal Officials In charge of security'

Is it even normal procedure for a candidate to have federal officials in charge of security? So I can then assume that Obama did not know of this directive before he took the stage?Troubling if true. I read an article recently where Doris Lessing, the current Nobel prize winner for literature stated that should he be elected he would be assassinated. I think it is definitely something to be afraid for considering the amount of wackos in this country... which is why all of this "messiah" garbage only adds fuel to that fire. A lot of that sentiment is being spread bya segment of his supporters and the media that gives the impression he is "perfect" and "untouchable." That only makes a nut more determined to be the one to "touch" someone depicted that way. Now as far as stopping checking for weapons, someone should lose their job over that, but I think it is also time even for Obama to check his ego a bit and be realistic and start to have smaller gatherings and take more precautions for his safety.

[Vinca]

167. This is scary. I'm fully expecting there will be a "terror" attack

in order to get us to vote Republican. What would be more upsetting than the assassination of a beloved figure in today's society? Keep this on the front page.

[mojowork_n]

168. I heard Michelle Obama's speech this past Monday,

at the Pabst Theater, in Milwaukee, WI.

I just walked in the door, and sat down.

The people next to me, remarked, "Hey, there was no weapons screening!" I was sort of glad (I hate having to go through that kind of nonsense), but in retrospect...

[4_TN_TITANS]

170. Big O - stay away from Tennessee...

If that's the way they want to play.

[ThatBozGuy]

172. Secret Service protection was increased not decreased

I was watching the debate and became very concerned several times because I saw behavior from the secret service that showed they were on a much heightened footing in dealing with Mr Obama. I said to myself at the time I wonder what triggered this, and with my concerns raised, I hope he is going to be ok.

It was after the debate that I saw this headline and discussion and I realize now I have the opposite reaction and am very comfortable with his protection.

I will not justify why there was a takedown of security but I can speculate and I guarantee you from the observation of the final minutes of the debate coverage that the Secet service was not happy with the decision and likely not the orginator.

It was likely a people moving logistics decision, to get more people into the debate quickly that caused the screening takedown.

There are many debatable points why that could be a bad idea, but the least point is if someone was going to try to get a weapon in they know there are checkpoints, they are going to bypass that route anyways.

What ever the reason or regardless of who decided for them to go down, the secret service compensated quite heavily and it was clear that they were fully aware that Mr Obama was a higher target threat level then Ms. Clinton.

This is demonstrated very clearly in the CNN footage at the close of the debate and it was these last few minute that raised my initial concern.

After the debate while the candidates were at the footlights signing autographs and handshaking Ms. Clinton had an obvious Secret Service detail at wing point dispatch and an observer scanning the crowd. These agents were loose and about 6 to 10 feet off her flanks, at each shoulder point, and the observer at the stage footline was several people away.

Mr Obama's detail was much different, and maintained a very controlled tight bubble while maintaining his ability to interact.

This bubble was in plain site but a casual observer could miss the Secret Service behavior because they are effective at what they do.

Mr Obama had two agents at wingpoint maintaining distances of 2 to 3 feet (as opposed to the more casual 6 to 10 feet of Ms Clinton) from his back shoulders. There were two line observers at the floor. These agents were were forming a cone of contact(funneling people between them to Mr Obama) that at all times maintained less than arms length distance from Mr Obama and each other in that controlled enviroment.

There was a third observer on the stage with Mr Obama looking into the crowd at all points.

It was this agent that originally raised my hackles and concern because he was obviously functioning as a body manager. This agent was within the wingpoins agent's bubble of protection looking over Mr Obamas shoulder but almost always in physical contact with him. His hands were at all times on Mr Obamas back or hip at finger touch. The line observers on the floor were very tactile and capable of hand swiping anything in front of Mr Obama's field of contact by hand.

In addition there were two agents to the left or right on the stage that were nearly holding Mr Obamas hand in direction of movement( literally reaching out to him at almost every step he took one direction or the other) on the stage and maintaining a clear path of removal at all times.

I am also sure that in addition to these observable details there were other such bubbles of control and observation containing each layer of this close quarter detail.

The compliment to the Secret Service is they did this massive choreographed dance of protection under the eyes of all those cameras and unless you looked for the specifics it was very easy to miss. Watch the hands on contact of the Body Manager agent in direct contact with Mr Obama and it all becomes clear just how safe he was.

Rest assured Mr Obama is in good hands and while the headlines of security removal scream to the fear that many are afraid to admit or are ready to take arms and claim conspiracy over, take a few minutes to watch the footage from the end of the debates to watch what real active protection is about rather than the somewhat fake comfort, passive peace of mind protection that weapons screening gives us.

[Baby Snooks]

177. Or not happy they were caught?

"I will not justify why there was a takedown of security but I can speculate and I guarantee you from the observation of the final minutes of the debate coverage that the Secet service was not happy with the decision and likely not the orginator."

There is no way Dallas PD made the decision. Anyone who has ever dealt with the Secret Service knows they make the decisions. All of them.

[ThatBozGuy]

186. Actually I believe this decision was likely outside of security concerns

And therefore did not come from the Secret Service or the Dallas Police.

While the Secret Service does have some dictate for control, they do not have overriding ability to the final degree, there are alot of people outside of their control that can override their best direction and they adjust accordingly to protect their charges.

That as clearly at work here.

[Baby Snooks]

191. Sorry but that is not correct

You obviously have never worked with the Secret Service. They establish the protocol and the procedure. They work with event planners. But in terms of security, it is their call alone.

[LiberalArkie]

195. Wrong, in the end it the the decision of the pricipal - the person being protected.

[natrat]

192. yea and one call from cheney or whoever and they suddenly disappear

[rox63]

175. Because nothing bad ever happens to young, charismatic politicians in Dallas...

:sarcasm:

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

176. Probably Obama had a say in this

Delay the speech until security checks are done, or drop the security checks and get the rally going.

It might be a little risky, but it also displays trust in his audience. People are there to hear him, not to cause harm. If it was Obama's call, my respect just went up.

Plus, once the first 20 rows are filled, he's pretty safe from the average would-be assassing with a pistol. Nobody is going to get off an accurate shot from a distance without being smothered by others in the audience.

And, it's Texas. Going out without strapping on the six-shooter is like forgetting to zip your fly. It just isn't done.
:rofl:

[Baby Snooks]

183. Not his call

Once you accept Secret Service protection, and candidates can refuse it as I understand it, you no longer have a call to make. They make the call. Among other things, someone possibly could have smuggled in a hand grenade. Or two. Not to mention a high-powered collapsible rifle. Smuggled in by that sweet looking little old lady carrying the big old bag. Who would question a sweet little old lady? They all carry those big old bags. Or so we think. The Secret Service is trained not to think the way we do. Which is why their call on this is so alarming. And it was alarming enough for Dallas PD to call them on it. And called them on it because it was their call.

This is very serious. Made even more serious by the fact that the media itself for the most part seems to be ignoring it.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

202. Yeah, your probably right, it's not his call

he has no option but to accept the protection and restrictions of Secret Service.

I'm adding this to the long list of reasons why I would never want to be President.

[Baby Snooks]

212. What the Secret Service is supposed to do...

The Secret Service has learned from two assassinations, and most people consider the death of Robert Kennedy an assassination, and attempted assassinations on both Gerald Ford and Ronald Reagan. Their main focus is to "reduce risk" and that includes the "cattle stampede" that often occurs whenever a president or presidential candidate is leaving an event. As you saw last night, they now form a pretty obvious shield around them. I was with a former first lady who got separated from her detail in the stampede as we were leaving. It frightened both of us. So I imagine it frightened the Secret Service as well.

Part of the "risk reduction" with regard to large crowds in auditoriums and stadiums and hotels is to prevent access to anyone with any type of weapon. That is part of the protocol. And that is a protocol that wasn't followed in Dallas. And that is very alarming. It has to be unnerving to the staff working with Barack Obama. And to Barack Obama.

Absolutely it is restrictive upon the candidates. But most are very appreciative of the restriction not long after the Secret Service detail arrives. Which is usually about the same time the death threats begin to arrive.

[RantinRavin]

214. Is this the same little old lady everyone gets so upset about when screened at the airport

Or is this a different one ?

[Baby Snooks]

217. Probably the same one..

In our "new" America sometimes it isn't a question of whether you're a potential assassin but merely a question of who you might assasinate.

So the little old lady with the big old bag gets strip-searched at the airport and then is personally escorted into the political rally and given a nice front row seat.

[bdamomma]

178. Is this the beginning of something bad to come?

or do I have this :tinfoilhat: on.

Now Obama is a presidential candidate like Hillary and both of them need protection. This is shameful, and very disturbing.

Should we do anything like send e-mails to his campaign to protect his butt. Sorry I am so blunt, but there are alot of evil people out there.

[MidwestTransplant]

184. Not to say this wasn't necessarily boneheadded but there is one important fact

The SS is there to guard Obama and not the crowd. Apparently they stopped looking for guns after a ton of people had arrived. Thus it would have been hard anybody who intended harm to get to the front and sit down without being noticed as they would have had to get somebody to give up their seat or just push them out of the way.

I went to a Clinton event a few months ago (now proud Obama supporter) and I was within 10 feet of her for a good half hour. Never had a search or anything. But the eyes of the SS were on everybody and I am confident that if anybody had reached for a weapon or whatever, their actions or face would have betrayed their intentions before they could do anything.

[Baby Snooks]

204. Not even a metal detector?

"I went to a Clinton event a few months ago (now proud Obama supporter) and I was within 10 feet of her for a good half hour. Never had a search or anything."

You didn't even go through a metal detector? Was this a private event or a public event?

[Little Star]

185. That is just wrong and stupid!!!!!!!!!!!! Both candidates need a

high level of security and security checks. There are to many gun totin' R's and also just to many crazies out there, looking to make a name for themselves!

[HopeforChange]

189. I Volunteered at the Houston Rally and they checked everyone

People are being told for the Austin Debate not to bring bags. We had walk through scanners like at the airport for high security areas and hand scanners for everyone else. All bags are checked also.

It is scarey though but I thinkb the secret service is being very careful.

[HopeforChange]

190. Why are they printing this? We should write the paper n/t

[mod mom]

193. Why shouldn't they print it?

[helderheid]

198. !

:wow:

Holy shit.

[rosetta627]

205. K&R

Let's keep this kicked up until the end of Obama's second term.

[Subdivisions]

206. I went to the event. Arrived late. Obama was to speak at

noon and I arrived at the arena at 11:40. On my approach to the arena I could see a long line of people waiting to enter. Then I had to park a couple of blocks away and walk to the arena. As I got to the arena, I noticed everyone was moving from the south side of the building to the north side so I decided to head in the direction everyone was walking and I walked right up to the arena and walked right in with absolutely NO resistance or security clearance. Obama came within two feet of me.

[Myrina]

209. ... how Manchurian of the Secret Service ...

:scared: :hide:

[Outraged As Usual]

210. Watch the JFK Dealy Plaza video a little closer..

I have been studying the video(s) of the Kennedy hit for many hours and comparing lighting and motion. Please go to the video mentioned above and watch very closely ( a better video is on Youtube for this purpose ) and you will see that the DRIVER of the limo and the passenger SS agent BOTH turn and see what is happening behind them. Both then turn back to face the front without making a move to help or jump to the rear. The SS agents who normally ride the back of the limo were withdrawn moments before by the lead agent, which left the bumper men totally puzzled and raising his arms in the air questioning WHY they were taken off the bumper.

But this is the telling part: Watch over and over a number of times and focus on the driver and the position of the head of the passenger agent up front: The DRIVER takes his RIGHT arm and crosses over his body to his left, then the DRIVER turns hard to his right and looks back ( for the second time since shots began hitting the car ) and then the DRIVER takes his left arm and turns hard to the right and points a pistol at Kennedy at the EXACT moment that the Presidents head explodes. At that moment the passengers really begin to freak out and duck, and Jackie realizing what happened tries to flee the limo.

An agent who was supposed to be on the bumper finally races up on foot and shoves Jackie back into the limo, which FINALLY begins to react and speed up. Watch closely 20 times or so and watch the smooth motion of the driver; he turns and points an obvious pistol directly at JFK and JFK's head erupts.

There are some who say that the ' pistol ' is a reflection of the passengers agents Brylcreem but that is not true, and close observation shows that the head of the passenger agent in the front seat is NOT what is seen. Also, watch the actions of the driver closely: He turns and sees the distraught and injured Kennedy grabbing his throat and bullet fragments flip thru the car...but yet he turns away again, just like the passenger agent, ignoring the minor wounds.

Then, watch very closely and see the driver: Take his right arm and cross his chest to the left, probably jacking a round into the chamber of the pistol in his left hand and using his right hand to stady the wheel while he then: Takes his left arm and as he turns his head to the right, you see his LEFT arm travel across his body and you will see the driver point a pistol at the head of JFK. At that instant the Presidents head explodes. WHY would the driver turn to the right and move his left arm across his body as he glances back? It is a unnatural motion. The driver should have used his left hand to steady the wheel if he was turning to the right for just a peek at what was happening..but his body language betrays what happened.

You have to watch this video many times and watch the actions of the driver and passenger agent to catch it, but you will. It is plain and clear. The driver agent looks back and see's that the car is under attack. He looks back and readies the pistol in his left hand..the passenger agent looks back and then ignores the scene and looks front again. The driver then moves his left arm with pistol in it across his body and over his right shoulder and points it at JFK, whose head erupts exactly at that moment. Remember that the first autopsy reports showed that the major head wound was on the exact path that the drivers bullet would take. JFK's autopsy was rigged and an empty coffin flown back and a switch made so the fix could be done.

But if you spend some time and do some research I believe you will see a smooth and seamless event: The driver shot JFK in the head and the video shows this, if one takes the time to analyze it to a degree. Watch and see if you see it too. It takes a few times to catch the actions, but it is plain and clear. Sorry for a less than perfect first post, but after realizing what really happened on 9-11, I am more than willing to believe in conspiracies, both past and present, if the evidence leads that way..and it does.

[Baby Snooks]

221. And those who seek the truth end up dead...

The late Dorothy Kilgallen told several people she was working on a story that would shock everyone with regard to the assassination of JFK and then was found dead from an apparent accidental overdose although the death certificate never listed an official cause of death.

The problem was no one ever found her story notes. She was also found with a book in her hand. But her reading glasses were downstairs.

There were rumors Jackie Kennedy didn't trust the Secret Service completely. That she had private security watching her children even while they were protected by the Secret Service. She may have had them watching the Secret Service while they were watching her children.

And questions will always be asked about the plane crash that killed John F. Kennedy, Jr. Because of rumors he had been investigating the assassination himself finally. That he had been in Sedona going over reseach notes with someone from Oliver Stone's office.

As with the death of Dorothy Kilgallen, all you had were rumors, although several people did state she had told them about the story she was working on. But none of them knew what exactly she had discovered. Or so they said. The people who may have known something never said anything. Scared to.

There were also quite a few people involved with the Warren Commission who ended up dead. Whose deaths, like Dorothy Kilgallen's, raised a lot of questions. But also served to silence the people who may have had the answers.

Scary country we live in. But it has been a scary country for some time.

[LeftHander]

211. K&R

[RamboLiberal]

218. Drudge has this up as a huge headline

Which is probably one of the few times I think a Drudge headline is a good thing. It should force the Secret Service to now make sure all people coming to an Obama event are screened - at least I hope so.

And if heaven forbid anything would happen - there's no hiding if they failed to protect him now.

Do your job Secret Service and if becausse his events are huge you need more agents - get them in there - there is no excuse for this when Rent-A-Cops can screen an entire football crowd nearing 100,000 and have them in their seats for kickoff in most cases in < 2 hours.

BTW those of you going to rallies - do your part. Leave the big purses and bags at home. If you need a bag take a small one. Keep the stuff in your pockets minimal. Leave the metal stuff that sets off detectors like jewelry and belts at home. Think of it as going to the airport - if people were smarter we'd all get through the lines faster and the candidate you support will be safer.

[Baby Snooks]

222. But not a headline in the major newspapers...

Not even the Dallas Morning News is carrying the story.

[peabody71]

223. FUCK TEXAS.

[RedEarth]

232. huh.... wasn't this ordered by the Secret Service?

[texastoast]

255. Would you care to elaborate?

I would very much like to hear what you mean.

[Phred42]

227. Here's an Important companoin piece to the SS preventing weapons screening!!!!!!

Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists Publish Ominous Threats to Obama's Life

http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/77509/

The most heated anti-Obama talk appears to be on Internet sites that allow people to post messages anonymously.

With the selection of Barack Obama as the first black Democratic nominee for president seeming more possible by the day, racists and white supremacists are posting increasingly ugly and even threatening remarks on the Internet.

"OBAMA WILL DIE, KKK FOREVER," concludes a Feb. 15 post by "Rodney" to a blog run by a person identified only as Strider333. Above that signoff, Rodney wrote: "The KKK or someone WILL assassinate Obama! If we get a NIGGER President all you NIGGER's will think you've won and that the WHITE people will have to bow to you<.> FUCK THAT."

On traditional white supremacist and neo-Nazi sites (for instance, here and here), there are lengthy discussion threads about what would happen if Obama were elected president.

[RedEarth]

229. That's just sick.........

[Baby Snooks]

230. The Blue Dogs

And some of these posters are probably Democrats. Blue Dogs. Who basically believe in separate but equal. Emphasis on the separate.

And the Clintons are pandering to them. As evidenced by their silence when the governor of Pennsylvania came out and said some Democrats will not support an African-American for president. That may be the reality. But it is a reality that the Clintons didn't address and chose instead to pander to. Because it might get out the Blue Dogs in Texas and in Ohio. Never mind it might be inciting some to think about just assassinating him. To make sure he doesn't get the nomination.

There are some who given the opportunity will assassinate Barack Obama and the Secret Service for some reason seems to be intent on possibly providing the opportunity.

[lovuian]

238. this is exactly what a Seer who has a great record saw

that Obama was in danger

and this is proof

I saw Obama in St Louis and the police were checking for guns

but to give a stand down order is absolutely sheer lunacy
or premeditative murder

[From The Left]

233. This is So Fucking DIsturbing

What is the Dallas PD/SS thinking?

[NoodleyAppendage]

234. Well. That cinches it. If Obama gets too close to removing the power elite, they will remove him.

Who will we blame when some nut (or someone planted to look like the lone nut) goes after Obama at an event where the Secret Service PURPOSEFULLY FAILED at their job?

J

[New Earth]

235. I really hope somene tells Obama this

wtf is going on? :scared: :(

[Broadslidin]

237. Could it be, the C.I.A.'s "National Endowment for Democracy" unit is planning Another Hit.....?

:patriot:

[Supersedeas]

239. notorius security for Dems in Dallas -- lest we forget

[High Plains]

240. I find it sad and weird that everyone just assumes...

...that we should have to submit to warrantless searches just to see a presidential candidate.

Should we also search everyone in the crowd along a candidate's motorcade?

C'mon, people, let's not be so quick to forget about our rights.

[High Plains]

241. The assassination of JFK was 45 years ago.

Linking it to this story is just silly.

[defendandprotect]

245. Whaat? Evidently, you don't understand the powers behind the coup on JFK . ..

[High Plains]

247. Evidently.

Do the Illuminati live?

[RainDog]

262. cut the bullshit

yeah, some conspiracy theorists have some whacked ideas about the illuminati and bilderberger.

however, that doesn't mean that conspiracies don't and didn't occur. remember a little thing called Watergate? How about Iran/Contra? Did you know that the U.S. media did not break this story? Instead it had to come out of Lebanon and that Israel, Russia, Iran and France have all validated all or parts of the story? And those same assholes who conspired to ignore the constitution are now the "great minds" behind George W and the Iraq invasion?

How about the drug running by the CIA in the 1980s to fund covert wars that killed nuns and priests b/c they didn't support the fascists in Central Am? I recommend you read Lost History, by Robert Parry (of Consortium News) to learn some truth about the right wingers in this country. Parry was a pulitzer-nominated reporter who left the mainstream media after he saw their complicity with the ring wing (and dems too, no doubt) to smear anyone who told the truth. Read about Gary Webb and what happened to him after he broke the story about the drugs coming into L.A. Time and Newsweek have never apologized for their lies.

Are you familiar with Kissinger's work in Chile? They've had truth and reconciliation hearings and have posted information online that came from those hearings that talk about what happened during the Pinochet era- again, the asshole the official U.S. supported. Suharto - Wolfie was big on him. The coup against Mossedegh, the democratically-elected leader of Iran in the 1950s, who was replaced by the Shah - and is why Iran has fundies in power today.

Are you familiar with Watergate man E. Howard Hunt and his deathbed confession about a conspiracy (actually he said lots of diff. ppl wanted JFK dead... and he named names... names that others have talked about and provided evidence about for years.) Have you heard of Robert Blakey, who said, maybe 5 years ago, that, knowing what is known now, he would question the official story about JFK? crazy conspiracy nut... that conservative lawyer.

What about the man responsible for Obama's SS security being connected to Watergate and the ratfuckers (as they called themselves) who engaged in every dirty trick imaginable... what about Haldeman saying Nixon's reference to the Bay of Pigs on his tapes referred to the JFK assassination.. and not wanting to open up that issue? What about Don Hewitt, then producer for CBS news, more recently producer for Sixty Minutes, who, in his taped session for the archives of television history, said that he thought, based upon all the evidence over the years, that the JFK murder was a conspiracy? What about about Robert MacNeil, of PBS News Hour, who was in Dallas and who was photographed with dozens of others looking over the concrete barrier at the grassy knoll because of the assumption (which was also, btw, reported on tv news at the time... footage of this also exists and I can show you where) who said that people would have to be totally naive to think that conspiracies didn't and hadn't happened. He's not exactly a big spouter of illuminati b.s. - and btw, I also wonder how many ppl who talk about that crap aren't really trying to discredit real information..

What about MKUltra and CointelPro? These conspiracies existed to defame/destroy left wing leaders in the U.S. in the 1960s. What about the lies of things like the Tuskeegee airmen who were given v.d. in order to study its effects? (they were all black men, btw).

What about Gladio, which the Italian govt acknowledged in a govt. meeting, and their use of nazis in post-WW2 Europe, and up until at least the 1970s to assassinate people like, oh, maybe Aldo Moro and blame it on the left wing in Europe? (this you can learn about via google vid which has a documentary from Europe about this.) And of course, Gehlen and others from Nazi Germany were brought to the U.S. to advise on Soviet policy... and his lies about the USSR and the resultant McCarthy bullshit?

What about the America First Committee and others who tried to get General Smedley Butler to be their figurehead after they assassinated FDR? They wanted a fascist govt here, and J.P. Morgan and the DuPonts were behind this. Read Butler's War is a Racket, and you can also see The Plot to Seize the White House via Google vid. Smedley testified before the House, but they suppressed his testimony... yet it's there.

and speaking of, what about Sibel Edmonds and the virtual news black out about her accusations of a spy ring inside the state dept that is selling weapons tech?

What about BCCI, the largest bank fraud in history, which was also an early funder of the Muslim Brotherhood... which also helped Bush Sr. to cover for selling nuclear components to Pakistan?

so before you go making a smart ass remark meant to dismiss all concerns about right wingers in our govt and outside of who are willing to assassinate leaders who are left of Attila the Hun, maybe you should learn some real history and not the bullshit the U.S. media feeds you like pablum.

but then again, maybe you don't want to know, because then you'd have to decide if you will speak up or remain complicit.

[High Plains]

264. You assume quite a bit.

You assume that I am unaware of the various conspiracies you mentioned. Wrong.

Now, please tell me what all that or the JFK assassination 45 years ago has to do with Obama's security today.

[RainDog]

271. okay.

As noted, the man in charge of the SS was a Watergate conspirator. Do you think he suddenly stopped being a ratfucker because his protege Karl Rove was Bush's brain? (that's sarcasm, as in... can you not understand that there are groups who align with one another and do the same things over and over? (c.f. the CIA overthrow of democratically -elected leaders and installation of right wing dictators... of course, one has nothing to do with the other, right?)

and then the 6 degrees of Richard Nixon... did you know Jack Ruby testified before the House on Unamerican Activity and was a protege of Nixon?

The militia nutcases who (such as Milteer on tape) were out to murder "that commie" Kennedy? Are these not the same ppl who are now part of the fundie bloc in the republican party? (pssss, yes, they are... and, speaking as someone born and raised in the south, I can tell you the fundies have always been on the side of the racists.)

George Bush Sr. was CIA operative at the time of the Kennedy assassination, and the CIA of that time has been implicated in the murder of JFK by more than one source. When George Bush Sr. was head of the CIA in 1975, the Church Committee was outing the black ops that he and the CIA perpetrated? When George Bush Sr. was v.p. he is alleged... cough... to have met with the Iranians in Paris to put together the "October Surprise" which, btw, was illegal b/c he was illegally acting as a rep. of the U.S. govt. - and that the Arms for hostage deal (by Reagan, never negotiate with hostages lying son of a bitch) used to defeat Carter?

And during the Reagan admin. - Iran Contra and all the other atrocities in Central Am... and during Ford and Reagan's administration - Cheney, Rummy, Wolfie, Perle -who, btw, were paranoid and wrong about the Soviet threat at the time, as has been shown as well.

the point, see, is that these folks do not operate in a vacuum. Tell me this. If you were a police officer and there were a repeated string of murders on your beat, and the same ppl showed up time after time to misdirect your investigation... wouldn't you begin to think they were complicit? Why would they do this, if not?

And of course George Sr. and the Cubans and the Bay of Pigs... the CIA and the Cuban right wingers were totally pissed at Kennedy for not supporting them (b/c Dulles operated w/o his approval.. and Dulles was then fired... and then put on the Warren Commission?

I suppose, if you want to claim there is no logical reason to think that these same people who are continually implicated in crimes against democracy, you can. However, I find that position to be naive in the extreme and, really, ahistorical, if you look at dirty political deeds throughout the course of human history.

[ailsagirl]

272. The list goes on and on and on

Anyone who has looked into these things can see there are powerful forces
behind the throne.

[defendandprotect]

266. Thanks for providing some light against ignorance . . . meanwhile ---

What about the man responsible for Obama's SS security being connected to Watergate and the ratfuckers (as they called themselves) who engaged in every dirty trick imaginable...

I hadn't heard about this ---
can you add anything to what you've already said --- ???

[defendandprotect]

263. Is the oil industry impacting your life . . . ?

Start somewhere . . . even if it's only post #262 --- !!!

[Realityhack]

305. Unfortunately...

We are talking about security for a VERY high profile target. It would be nice to go watch a federal court proceeding without being 'searched' as well but good luck with that.
In this case we are not talking about highly abstracted potential threats. The risk of someone trying to kill Senator Obama or any other presidential candidate is quite real. As is the risk of someone assassinating the sitting president.

I think pushing this level of security to a rights issue is going a bit over the top.

I must say the same for those who seem to assume this is some kind of conspiracy simply because it happened.

[1776Forever]

249. I pray everyday for Barack and his Family - If you are a spiritual person I suggest you start too.

I am 60 years old and remember JFK, MLK, and Bobby Kennedy all being killed in just a few years. It CAN happen. This needs to be investigated by the press, and the authorities both Local and Federal! This should not be tolerated for ANY candidate - Republican or Democrat!

Be Vigilant!

:grouphug:

[ailsagirl]

261. The ugly truth of the matter is that anyone can be "removed"

should the Powers That Be choose. And get away with it.

[defendandprotect]

268. As Mark Crispin Miller has said: "These people will ...

I'm not sure if he said "kill" or "shoot you" ..... "as sure as look at you!"

And FATES seems to have been on their side all this while ---
They've had a lot of help from their corporate-press ignoring our political violence over decades ---
and ignoring reality re the assassinations ---

[ailsagirl]

270. You bet they will. I have no illusions anymore. That day in Dallas

in 1963 was the beginning of a long slide for all of us...

[Baby Snooks]

273. The turning point

As he left office, Eisenhower warned of the dangers of the "military-industrial complex" and four years later Kennedy was assassinated and not long after the "military-industrial complex" was firmly established finally through Halliburton establising its "war-support machine" in Vietnam. Kennedy apparently was not committed to any escalation of the situation in Vietnam and some believe he may have withdrawn and that was the reason why he was assassinated. LBJ of course sent more troops and escalated the situation and thus began the ascent of the Republicrats in this country. Oligarchists. Politicians of both parties who were easily bought. And who in turn supported the idea of oligarchy. Mainly because it paid so well. The CIA of course was central to the original escalation of the situation in Vietnam and and of course it was a CIA that was established by Prescott Bush and John Foster Dulles.

The Bushes are intertwined with most of the history of our country for the past 100 years. Few have ever taken the time to look at it all and connect the dots. Even fewer are willing to connect the dots of the Clintons and the Bushes and see how even the Clintons are intertwined in it all.

The projected McCain versus Clinton race was merely a ruse to ensure HIllary Clinton would become president. Only a fool would believe the main reason why impeachment has been kept off the table is to ensure the same thing. An angry people voting against this administration. Plus the ego of Hillary Clinton. Were Cheney and Bush to be impeached and convicted and removed from office, Nancy Pelosi would become the first Madame President. Nancy Pelosi. Loyal Democrat. Who believes homeless people should be arrested and thrown in jail. That's a Democrat?

The one thing no one counted on was Barack Obama receiving the overwhelming support of the people. And that puts him in far more danger than anything else. Just his standing in the way of Hillary Clinton. And in the way of the agenda.

People really need to finally wake up in this country while there is still time.

[ailsagirl]

287. Not only that

Kennedy had actually decided to begin withdrawing troops in Dec. 1963.
Big mistake as far as he went-- after he died, Johnson "quietly" suspended
that decision.

Then, Kennedy was furious over rogue elements of the CIA who were allowed
to go off half-cocked and make terrible decisions without clearing anything.
He wanted to break down the CIA and scatter it into a million pieces. And he
then wanted to give the power to the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
Another "mistake."

He simply didn't toe the line so... he was out.

That was a coup that day and anyone who believes that LHO had anything to
do with the murder is living in a dream world.

BTW, have you ever seen this clip?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-rcdBNFnGs

[defendandprotect]

296. JFK had actually issued a NSAM on withdrawing troops ---

and LBJ immediately overturned it after taking office ---

JFK fired Allen Dulles --- later the head of the Warren Commission !!!
and Bissel --- whose brother was Mayor of Dallas ---

BUT . . . I think what he did was put the CIA under the control of the Pentagon/military so that any
new Bay of Pigs type activities would have to be under their jurisdiction, their planning, their approval!

The CIA wasn't intended to be involved in military operations --- which is what the Bay of Pigs was.

The recordings from the Cuban Missile Crisis/Era and some of that history also makes clear how nuts
the Joint Chiefs of Staff were --- especially "nuke 'em Le May" . . . !!!

And "Operation Northwoods" . . . makes it even clearer --- !!!!

[mzmolly]

250. WHAT!?

Obama needs to address this even if he hires his own security. I'm stunned.

[mzmolly]

252. I just sent this out to a list of media contacts including K.O. and others.

This must be addressed asap.

[Castleman]

254. Interesting how many of you have shortened

the Secret Service to SS. And we all know how Prescott Bush's pals played the game..
btw, Kennedy conspiracy folks?
I know who whacked JFK.
It wasn't Oswald, or the CIA, or Castro or any of the obvious suspects.
It was Joe DiMaggio.
He was an Italian kid from North Beach, JFK was messing with Marilyn, he lost his head, boom.
They found cleat marks of the grassy knoll.


:popcorn:
This ought to be entertaining....

[BobbyVan]

259. This is very suspicious

Especially when you see this story about a Dallas PD officer being killed in a Secret Service motorcade.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3193146&mesg_id=3193146

Did someone know too much?

Is the Carnahan/Wellstone hit squad back together?

[ExPatLeftist]

276. The message is clear

"We own you, and we decide whether you live or die."

This was far from subtle, and the choice of Dallas as the location for this "mix-up" was no coincidence.

No need to go through the trouble of actually assassinating him (yet), just pull his detail and watch him squirm.

In the off chance that this WAS a cock-up, it is inexcusable. If not...

[nebula]

278. Couple of things

1) Why didn't the Dallas police or the Secret Service notify and check with the Obama campaign BEFORE deciding to implement this major change in security operation on their own?? Why would they want to keep Obama and his people in the dark about it? Because they know Obama would be totally against it?

2) Obama might want to think about hirring his own private security detail at this point. I wouldn't entrust my life to any of those security people(FBI, CIA, SS) in the government.

[ExPatLeftist]

279. Regarding notifying Obama...

#1 in your post: Do we know yet for sure that they were not notified or even that they were not involved in the decision?

I also think this smells to high heaven, but was wondering if you know #1 for a fact.

Anyone have any info or links about this?

[nebula]

280. It's a given

it isn't specifically mentioned in the article, but I think it's safe to assume that they
didn't even bother to notify Obama and his people about any change in security procedure.

And if they did, I seriously doubt any candidate in their right mind would have agreed to it. Particularly a Black candidate campaigning in a state where the Confederate flag is still commonly flown, would agree to an inexplicable suspension of such basic and critical security procedures.

[ExPatLeftist]

282. I agree that it is a no-brainer

...but prefer not to take anything as a given until I know for a fact.

[nebula]

283. No problem

it's a valid question.

[Outraged As Usual]

285. That pic is great!!

I wonder how many people get the meaning of the blocks and cranes picture at the bottom of your posts..it says it all about the Twin Towers and how funny things like laws opf physics seem to melt away when the Neocon parade comes to town..neat illustration of a telling ' anomaly ' !

[dailykoff]

289. Private security is essential at this point.

We're getting bled trillions annually for an entire fecking "Department of Homeland Security" and they don't have enough useless agents driving around in white cars to run security at a fucking rally???

These guys would whack Obama in a second if they could get away with it and it's a miracle they haven't already.

:mad:

[Raydawg1234]

290. at least the policeman are honest

i wonder if there will be a response to this

[StarryNite]

293. This is so wrong...

What the hell are "they" cooking up now? I can't even bring myself to say it. Something like this would be a piece of cake for them compared to 9-11.

[defendandprotect]

297. Was just thinking that it's interesting that "several Dallas police officers" have brought this

info forward ---

who's acting on it--????

It's like the story is there, but no official response --- ????

[nebula]

298. The MSM remain dead silent on this?

This seems to be the sole article in existence.

[Xenotime]

302. Agreed. Obama probably shouldn't return to Texas

[defendandprotect]

306. Still the outlaw state?

[Tektonik]

299. Dallas

:(

[ohio2007]

301. "the order --was meant to speed up the long lines outside and fill the arena's vacant seats .."

the order -- apparently made by the U.S. Secret Service -- was meant to speed up the long lines outside and fill the arena's vacant seats before Obama came on.


http://www.star-telegram.com/667/story/486413.html

the tin foil conspirecy theorists need another spin " Why are people being stopped and denied access to hear Obama ? ;)

/sarc