Pray-in at S.F. gas station asks God to lower prices

[RamboLiberal]

Source: SF Chronicle

Rocky Twyman has a radical solution for surging gasoline prices: prayer.

Twyman - a community organizer, church choir director and public relations consultant from the Washington, D.C., suburbs - staged a pray-in at a San Francisco Chevron station on Friday, asking God for cheaper gas. He did the same thing in the nation's Capitol on Wednesday, with volunteers from a soup kitchen joining in. Today he will lead members of an Oakland church in prayer.

Yes, it's come to that.

"God is the only one we can turn to at this point," said Twyman, 59. "Our leaders don't seem to be able to do anything about it. The prices keep soaring and soaring."



Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/04/26/BUCN10C1KR.DTL

---

God's answer - did the devil tell you to buy SUVs?

[tridim]

1. I like Malloy's suggestion best..

They should just fill their tanks with water and pray it turns into gasoline. At least that cuts out the middleman.

[StarryNite]

2. Oh good lord!

Are they nutz!

[Joe Bacon]

58. Yes, they are nuts

Republicans bullshit about Jesus but they follow Ayn "as in mine" Rand. These ignorant fools have no faith in their invisible hand that Sister Ayn's disciples say is so infallible!

[meow2u3]

57. The powers that be will jack up the price of water

out of sheer spite

[DesertRat]

72. Good one!

I love Mike Malloy! :rofl:

[Mad_Dem_X]

87. Hee hee!

I like that!

[LakeSamish706]

3. Holly Crapolla.. They gotta be Republicans. n/t

[CreekDog]

18. Republicans in San Francisco?

Moooooooooo!


very doubtful.

[LakeSamish706]

19. Must be just plain nut jobs then.... n/t

[CreekDog]

22. i've heard worse ideas than praying for change

I'm voting for Obama but in the meantime, I'm praying. :shrug:

[Zhade]

49. There are worse ideas, but given that it's been demonstrated that prayer has no effect...

...it's sort of a watse of time.

[CreekDog]

59. You are soooo goddamned wise!

In all of human history, though Jesus, Martin Luther King, Gandhi, Joan of Arc, Mother Teresa all prayed, but you in your wisdom have shown us that they were wasting their time.

Your wisdom exceeds theirs and thus you have shown their greatness to be overstated based on the supreme amount of time all of the above at critical moments that established their greatness to be heavily devoted to an activity that is a "waste of time".

Since you are not wasting your time with prayer, I'm hoping you can change the world in the way that they did and faster since you are not slowed by wasted moments of prayer.

Please keep us posted on your great accomplishments, unfettered by devotion to useless prayer.

[Zhade]

73. No, you give me too much credit - double-blind trials have shown they were wasting their time.

They accomplished great things DESPITE wasting valuable time praying (well, MLK and Ghandi did - Joan of Arc was likely schizophrenic, Mother Theresa prolonged people's suffering and confessed in her diary that she wasn't even sure she believed in her god, and there's no real evidence Jesus even existed).

Imagine what they could have accomplished with all the time they used praying. As a truly wise person once said, "hands that work are more useful than hands that pray" (or something to that effect).

Anyway, you don't need to get petulant and insulting just because I pointed out the lack of efficacy regarding prayer. Facts shouldn't anger you so much.

[CreekDog]

77. Go on...

please. I like the part "imagine what they could have accomplished with all the time they used praying..."

oh yes, you, Zhade, imagining how *much more* they could have accomplished had they spent their time more efficiently by not praying.

Yes, Zhade, please remind me that MLK and Gandhi could have been better and that you know just how they could be better if only.

My goodness, this just puts a smile on my face. Somebody had the guts to say that MLK and Gandhi could have been better!

Why didn't I think of that? :think:

[Zhade]

79. If you think even great people can't be better and do more, you worship idols.

Your view is uncharitable if you assume that people like MLK couldn't have done even greater things with more time (which he spent praying). You're selling him short.

Not sure why you want to do that - I prefer to wonder how much more progress we'd made if their full potential were unleashed and not restricted by running out of time (and, tragically, dying). That's not dismissive of their deeds at all; if anything, it's supportive of them and in the spirit of wishing they could have done even more.

(And to think, this conversation started because you can't accept the demonstrable fact that prayer has been shown to have no efficacy whatsoever.)

[CreekDog]

83. It's presumptuous, that's the problem

the idea that you think those great people could have been better and would have but for prayer (and attendant time savings) coming from someone who is more mortal than them (so to speak) just sounds like the height of arrogance.

second, i don't pray and expect results like i do when flipping a light switch, i pray for faith, for wisdom, for things i need or to accept and appreciate what i have. and something has been efficacious regarding those things because the most critical things i have asked for that i really needed have come through (not tangibles mind you). don't think those studies really tested that.

[Zhade]

84. "more mortal than them" means what, exactly? That I haven't done great things like MLK?

And? That doesn't invalidate the argument at all.

"and something has been efficacious regarding those things because the most critical things i have asked for that i really needed have come through (not tangibles mind you)."

Well, you can't actually KNOW that's the case, though you can suspect it. Even if the things did happen as needed, there's no justifiable way you can tie them to your prayers, because you can't prove they worked. You can't test them. It's irrelevant anecdotal data.

What's truly presumptuous is assuming, absent evidence and in fact contrary to it, that prayer has any effect - at all - except in the mind (such as appreciation). But I will grant you that there's a self-efficacious nature to prayer/meditation/positive thinking, if only that it orders your mind in a positive way (if, of course, it's positive).

But I still contend that actually doing something (like driving less, for those in the OP) rather than praying is the only real way to affect any change.

[brentspeak]

28. "Nut jobs" who also give up their free time to volunteer at a soup kitchen

[dmallind]

89. Does doing something good stop anyone from being a nutjob? NT

[Speck Tater]

4. OMFG! We are supposed to outgrow "magical thinking" by age 12

I can't believe there are supposed "grownups" who still think they can tell their God what to do.

What's the point of having an all-knowing God, if you have to keep on telling Him what to do when He gets it wrong? Either your God knows what He's doing or He is incompetent. If He needs you to tell Him what to do, then He's incompetent. If He already knows what He's doing then He won't change His mind because you ask Him to; He's already factored all the data into His decision.

[Orsino]

51. Didn't you get the memo?

This is *'s America. We're supposed to keep doing exactly what we've always done, and pray for different results.

[fshrink]

5. I heard you. I will lower them down.

[samdogmom]

6. Gosh...I'm sure "God" will get right on this!

Probably on the "To Do" list somewhere right after ending world hunger, disease, and war.

:sarcasm:

[fshrink]

31. I just did.

[samdogmom]

48. Wow, God, thanks!

So now that you've cured high gas prices, what's next on your list of things to do? Me? I sure hope you stop war....and illness...and hunger....and....everything bad in this world (including Hillary's run for President of the U.S.). Can you do this, God? Thanks!

[fshrink]

60. I do have a long list. See what I can do though.

I have to take care of a few things at the White House. Gotta go.

[Donkeykick]

7. Most chances are...

that you will get a faster response from God than you would this administration. :eyes:

[KamaAina]

8. WWJP?

What Would Jesus Pump?

:rofl:

[BlueJazz]

9. I Love this part >> "Our leaders don't seem to be able ....."

Ah..Yeah...You mean the right-wing simple-minded crooked village idiots that YOU elected ??

[Mojorabbit]

30. This is the problem

The people have the power if they use it to affect change. Instead these people look outward for someone to make the change for them.

[Ian David]

10. If I owned the gas station, I'd start raising the price by $0.01 every minute until they left. n/t

[emilyg]

11. Like chicken soup - it can't hurt.

[ohio2007]

33. Tell that to PETA .............. nt

[Zhade]

50. In this case, agreed, because no one's sick. But it's been demonstrated through valid studies...

...that sometimes knowing you're being prayed for makes you WORSE, and in no cases whatsoever does it make anyone better.

[Scairp]

12. Hey!

Why didn't we all think of that? Of course! Pray to the heavens and maybe they will open up and oil will fall like rain. Religion, why else is it called, to paraphrase Marx, opiate for the masses?

[Mabus]

13. Now if he could just cast out the demons in the candy rack

I'd start feeling a little better.

[boobooday]

14. Geez, why didn't we think of that before?

Excuse me, now I'm going to go pray for the price of health insurance to drop.

[angstlessk]

15. they're praying to the wrong God, ain't that Allah's domain, oil???

they need to join with some muslims to teach them how to pray to Allah! :crazy:

[Mz Pip]

16. We do have our share of

loonies out here.

Actually God isn't the only one they can turn to. How about electing some representatives who would be willing to put some real pressure on the auto industry to come up with cars that get good gas mileage. Of course that takes a bit of effort. Praying is so much easier.

Good luck with it, though. Chances are God's answer will be "NO! You created this problem,fix this yourselves!"

Mz Pip
:dem:

[diane in sf]

17. Time to save money for an electric car, or pray for it.

[TroglodyteScholar]

20. Sounds like the GA rethug governor's plan for dealing with the state's water shortage...

ATLANTA - What to do when the rain won’t come? If you’re Georgia Gov. Sonny Perdue, you pray.

The governor will host a prayer service next week to ask for relief from the drought gripping the Southeast.

“The only solution is rain, and the only place we get that is from a higher power,” Perdue spokesman Bert Brantley said on Wednesday.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21680340/

[ozymandius]

21. As good-intentioned as it sounds, I am skeptical it'll work.

God (being a god with all the trappings that come with it) doesn't work at Goldman Sachs. Neither does s/he work at the New York Mercantile Exchange nor the London Oil Bourse nor at the Singapore Exchange. (At least - not the last time I checked.)

If I may offer a suggestion - perhaps they could implore the Almighty to convince those people in Kenya to stop blowing things up. That may offer a direct consequence of lowering prices. At least for about 24 hours.

[snooper2]

90. you are "skeptical" it will work...

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[dysfunctional press]

23. i am so fucking sick of religious nut-jobs EVERYWHERE.

i just wish that there was SOMETHING- ANYTHING that could happen to wake these fucking people up and make them realize that corrupt men CREATED "god", and NOT the other way around. we would ALL be so much better off if people realized that their corporeal time on this planet is the ONLY short shot they get at existence, and we're on our own to provide for ourselves. religoids of ALL creeds PISS me off.

[hunter]

24. Bad news. God's not going to make any more oil.

It's sorta like a teenager asking for more money after he spent all his allowance on video games, junk food, and pot.

[olddad56]

62. But Bush and Cheney are going to make more oil...

In Iran, it just won't be ready for a few thousand years. Takes a while to turn the dead bodies into fossil fuel.

[Joe Bacon]

69. Oh, that's not true

My idiot aunt, hard core Republican and follower of any asshole who thumps a Bi-Bull on the Trinity BS Network keeps telling me that when Jesus comes back he'll make all the oil we need.

Trouble is she's been telling me that Jesus is coming back in a week or 2 since she was "born again" in 1971. I keep reminding her of that.

[electron_blue]

25. Some people have no clue how things really work in the world, do they?

Yes, God is out there and he cares how much your gas costs at the pump. Never mind the people on the other side of town starving to death, he'll get to the gas pumps first.

[DavidMS]

26. The Dark Ages called...

They want their religion back.

If he really wanted to cut gas prices, help get more public transit.

[depakid]

27. That will be one of the prevailing responses to peak oil in the states

along with a substantial increase in crime and gun violence.

[struggle4progress]

29. Okay, I'm gonna take an unpopular stand to defend Rocky here:

Why should we pretend that the automobile isn't America's most popular religious cult?

In most of the US, you can do almost nothing without a car: you cannot buy food or go to school or hold down a job

Worshipping the Gasoline Pumps is the American way of life: should the Gasoline Pumps ever stop favoring us, we are screwn -- and everybody knows it

The gas pump is the last true universal church we have; it is our last remnant of a true community held together by common practice and belief; it is the only place where Americans of every socioeconomic backgroup still meet regularly

So when the Gasoline God demands blood or treasure, America immediately complies, as shown recently in Iraq, where we have unblinkingly sacrificed thousands of Americans, hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, and billions of dollars at the Gasoline God's altar

The cult rituals of the Gasoline Pumps are straightforward. One drives up, usually alone; one is responsible for one's own tank; and the whole routine is often concluded without the slightest human interaction. The Gasoline Pumps do not teach that we should know our neighbor but promise instead that we will be conveniently able to flee his/her company at a mile a minute

Rocky's little act challenges our presuppositions: it properly treats the Gasoline Pumps as religious sites and correctly identifies American angst about gas prices as a form of religious angst

And, as already pointed out in the article, what he's doing is at least as effective as anything anybody else has done or is doing:

"Given the complete inertia and silence of this White House on a crisis that has people feeling just hopeless, prayer is probably as good as anything," said Judy Dugan, research director with the nonprofit group Consumer Watchdog. "Frankly, I wish them luck."

[ohio2007]

34. worshipping the sacred RAC for 50 years now

Ritual among the Nacirema;

The Sacred Rac



Pat Hughes

http://www.drabruzzi.com/sacred_rac.html

[struggle4progress]

38. That might be an interesting anthropology course

[muriel_volestrangler]

64. The sacred Royal Automobile Club?

http://www.rac.co.uk/

They do complain when petrol taxes go up, and may get a spokesman on TV, but I think worshipping them is going a bit far ... :evilgrin:

[bitchkitty]

65. Ha! At first I thought that

it was real and thought, hmmm, must live in Portland. Very amusing, thanks!

[Karenina]

39. What a GREAT post S4P!!!

This thread gets a R from me for it! :yourock:

[Mabus]

43. I guess it depends on where you live and how you choose to live your life

My husband and I moved from Kansas to the DC area. Yes, we have a car but we use the bus and metro system when we can because it is available to us. And since we've moved here our gasoline consumption has dropped dramatically. Back home, we would fill the car about three times a month. In the four and a half months we've lived here, we've filled the tank five times. The reason we've filled it that many times is because we use the car to go visit a friend in Virgina every other weekend or I use the car to pick up large items. For instance on Thursday I used the car to go get a lawn mower (an old-fashioned reel mower that depends on me to move it) and several large plants for the garden (mainly blue berry and raspberry bushes). Otherwise, we try to use public transportation or walk as much as we can. We would use the metro go to go visit our friend in Virgina but we often stay later than the metro is running. I admit, for us, it is a lifestyle choice. And when I do fill up the tank, I've made it a point to know the guy(s) I buy gas from. It's a family operation so I've met both the dad and the son who run the shop.

It's kind of weird. Today, when I was mowing the lawn (fwiw, I mowed wherever it was shady, so I had to mow in shifts), I heard air conditioners in use. Maybe I'm just a tightwad or from another planet but it was only 80 today. I didn't see any reason to use the AC. I don't like shutting the house up. I like smelling the flowering bushes in the front and I like the fresh air. This morning we opened the sliding glass door and slid the screen over and the house was very comfortable. In fact because of the breezes it was cool enough that I ended up wearing sweat pants most of the day. Granted, unlike my neighbors, I closed the shades on the side of the house where the sun was coming in to keep the temperature in the house down. I try to be active and aware when it comes to keeping the house comfortable. Since it has clouded up, I've opened the shades and we're utilizing something called "natural sunlight".

I do agree that too many people have a love affair with the automobile. I don't see it as a cult or a religion though. It is just what people are used to doing and they don't have a lot of motivation to change despite high gas prices.

[llmart]

76. I disagree....

My sister has never owned a car, never learned how to drive, and she has a master's degree. She lives where there is public transportation, finds whatever work she can (you have to be flexible)that she can reach via public transportation, and believe you me, she has never missed a meal and she cooks everything from scratch. She is extremely frugal. It's just that a lot of people in this country, especially people younger than 60, can't think outside the box.

[ohio2007]

32. This douchebag is from DC yet...he went to SF to do this PR stunt? WTF is he smoking? nt

[mwb970]

35. He sounds bitter.

In fact, it sounds like he is bitter about the government and is clinging to religion instead. Imagine that.

[tavalon]

41. Good one!

[LeftishBrit]

36. I didn't know God was in charge of petrol prices!

[madmom]

37. So watch bush will hear this, open the reserves, and say god told him to!

[TheCowsCameHome]

40. ...and miraculously, the prices were instantly posted at ground level

instead of at eye level.

He has truly created a miracle..............

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Broadslidin]

42. As our Born Again Christan Bush decrees death & destruction upon the insolent Iranians...

Our fearless leader's oily business :patriot: associates will

sure hit the oil futures jackpot as the bombs rip into Iran.

[Canuckistanian]

44. This actually makes me incredibly sad

That after a million years of evolution and 500 years of scientific and technological advances, people are still looking to an invisible metaphysical entity to solve their REAL-WORLD problems.

It's pathetic, it really is.

Sorry spiritual people, but this is what society does with myth and irrational emotional beliefs.

A total waste of time, energy and intelligence.

[Critters2]

45. Oh Lord....

[MJJP21]

46. Prayer

What are the three possible answers to prayer? Answer: Yes No or not now but somehow the result is ALWAYS the will of God. Someone should bring this up to Twyman.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

47. Why can't we separate our material crap from our spiritual beliefs?

I just don't get it.

[zanne]

67. You mean like praying for your football team to win?

I always thought that sports-themed prayer was so ridiculous. Everybody knows that God is a Patriots fan.:sarcasm:

[DeSwiss]

52. Now that's what I call "Prayin' For Ethyl"

K&R!!!

[JackRiddler]

53. God is totally going to listen to this. It has no higher priority.

First thing, it will double the available global oil reserves.

Then, it will give them all bigger cars.

Unfortunately, I feel like this isn't a hoax story.

[Sabriel]

54. He's gone a bit deaf, apparently.

I just got back from paying $3.59 for regular unleaded.

[samdogmom]

55. But.....God just answered me up thread!

He/She's solved the high priced gas crisis! Thank goodness! Don't worry...I asked God to start working on bigger problems like War, and Illness, and Hunger, and Hillary Clinton.

God hasn't gotten back to me yet, but I'm sure he/she is on my request!

[bluesmail]

56. someonebeat me to the Good Lord bs.

[olddad56]

61. Before I went to Costco for gas today, I prayed it would be less than $4 a gallon....

#3.80, thank you dear God. Who said Jesus doesn't save? Saved me $.20 a gallon.

[zanne]

66. HAH! nt

[truthisfreedom]

63. Might work.

Them rethugs are a strange lot.

[tanyev]

68. And God said, "Why didn't you listen to Jimmy Carter 30 years ago?"

[Minnesota_Lib]

70. And while you're at it, God, can you check under the hood? Amen.

[Historic NY]

71. Did it go down yet? 4 cents here in NY since yesterday............

it will probably be back up on monday.

[timtom]

74. Not one of the better uses for prayer...

What an embarrassment.

[timtom]

75. I am astonished at the intellectual level of discourse on this thread.

If you're gonna bash religion because YOU don't believe in it then take it to the religion thread.

The OP seems to be about a group of believers abusing a core practice.

It's about asinine behavior.

But, as far as intellectual philosophical discourse -- most of this is trash.

No scientific substantiation on articles of faith??? Gaia forbid!!!

C'mon, people. Get a grip. There are many loving people of faith on this board, and such opinionated piling-on is extremely disrespectful. Especially after all the whining about how Christians just want YOU to believe the way THEY do!

Learn to parse sentences and ideas and quit falling into such semantic reactions.

[Zhade]

81. Excuse me, but pointing out facts isn't "piling on".

Reality doesn't really care if you agree with it or not - and I don't know where you get the idea that religion is off-limits for discussion, or that you dictate said discussion.

[Acadia Blue]

78. Pray for nationalized oil companies.

[Skittles]

80. idiots n/t

[BlooInBloo]

82. HAHAHAHA!!! Note to SF bible-thumpers. Religion jumped the shark a loooong time ago.

[Duer 157099]

85. Read "The End of Faith" by Sam Harris

if you want a good cogent discussion of why religions, today, are no longer just quaint eccentricities that we can tolerate with our usual "live and let live" attitude - because these religions certainly DO NOT share the sentiment (live and let live).

I have become less and less tolerant of ALL religions recently. I think our country (and world) got into the mess it's in because for too long, we tolerated irrational beliefs and behaviors BY THOSE IN POWER. It's time to enter the Age of Reason (for real this time).

http://www.amazon.com/End-Faith-Religion-Terror-Future/dp/0393327655/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1209371789&sr=8-1

[bdamomma]

86. too much religion can REALLY make people stupid.

[lonestarnot]

88. OMG

[Solly Mack]

91. Have they tried the laying off the hands directly on the gas pump?

[Javaman]

92. Kind of gives you a good insight into the future of things

when the price goes way up and everything in society slows down. All the crazies will come out of the wood work to "solve" everything with prayer.

can't wait till they start putting on witch trials again...

:banghead:

[shain from kane]

93. Please, God, give me gas.