Letters Outline Legal Rationale for CIA Tactics(illegal tactics ok if thwarting a terrorist attack)

[maddezmom]

Source: NYT

By MARK MAZZETTI
Published: April 27, 2008
WASHINGTON — The Justice Department has told Congress that American intelligence operatives attempting to thwart terrorist attacks can legally use interrogation methods that might otherwise be prohibited under international law.


The legal interpretation, outlined in recent letters, sheds new light on the still-secret rules for interrogations by the Central Intelligence Agency. It shows that the administration is arguing that the boundaries for interrogations should be subject to some latitude, even under an executive order issued last summer that President Bush said meant that the C.I.A. would comply with international strictures against harsh treatment of detainees.

While the Geneva Conventions prohibit “outrages upon personal dignity,” a letter sent by the Justice Department to Congress on March 5 makes clear that the administration has not drawn a precise line in deciding which interrogation methods would violate that standard, and is reserving the right to make case-by-case judgments.

“The fact that an act is undertaken to prevent a threatened terrorist attack, rather than for the purpose of humiliation or abuse, would be relevant to a reasonable observer in measuring the outrageousness of the act,” said Brian A. Benczkowski, a deputy assistant attorney general, in the letter, which had not previously been made public.

Mr. Bush issued the executive order last summer to comply with restrictions imposed by the Supreme Court and Congress. The order spelled out new standards for interrogation techniques, requiring that they comply with international standards for humane treatment, but it did not identify any approved techniques.



Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/27/washington/27intel.html?_r=1&ref=world&oref=slogin

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7,000 Pages of Justice Dept-CIA Torture Documents
By Spencer Ackerman 04/24/2008 08:47AM
A coalition of civil-liberties groups filed a Freedom of Information Act request for documents detailing discussions between the CIA, the White House and the Justice Dept. relating to CIA's interrogation program. It turned out, according to the Washington Post, that a staggering 7,000 pages of documentation on the program exist. Or as the Post put it:

The flow of documents, by itself, also suggests that the CIA's unorthodox interrogation program was the focus of behind-the-scenes debate at the highest levels of the Bush administration after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. The documents indicate that lawyers at the CIA and elsewhere were aware that CIA personnel might be subject to criminal prosecution or other legal sanctions.

You think? De-euphemized, this means that, as reported in this piece, culpability for torture isn't on the shoulder's of the interrogators. It's on the shoulders of the highest levels of the administration -- the ones who ordered the illegality, condoned it, covered it up, and apologized for it.

Despite the FOIA, most of the torture documents remain classified. But there are some indications of what's contained. First, the Justice Dept.'s Office of Legal Counsel, under torture-condoning chief Steve Bradbury, had at least 12 torture discussions with CIA in 2005 and 2006 -- after a famous December 2004 OLC memo ostensibly retreating from John Yoo's 2002 justifications


http://www.washingtonindependent.com/view/7-000-pages-of


CIA Admits To Seeking White House Support For Interrogation Techniques
April 25, 2008 1:13 p.m. EST

Kris Alingod - AHN News Writer
Washington, D.C. (AHN) - A court filing by the CIA this week said that the agency expected to be questioned about its controversial interrogation techniques, the Washington Post reported on Thursday.

In its filing for a New York court, the CIA revealed that agency officials had sought the support of the White House since they believed that questions about their interrogation techniques, such as waterboarding, would inevitably arise.

The agency also disclosed that it had 7,000 pages of classified documents relating to its interrogation program and secret prisons, some of which were authored or solicited and received by the President's senior advisers in connection with a decision, or potential decision, to be made by the president," according to the Post.

The disclosure follows a lawsuit filed by advocacy groups demanding that the CIA de-classify its documents about waterboarding and other interrogation techniques.

more:http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/7010759125

[acmavm]

1. How can these people live with themselves? How can they call themselves

decent people? What would they do if faced with torture themselves?

I bet if they went a couple rounds of waterboarding I doubt that they'd think that it is as harmless as this administration would like the simple minded to think it is.

And those dead guys in the pictures in Abu Graib. How moral and decent was the treatment that caused that?

[whistle]

2. W.W.J.D.

[maddezmom]

3. headline has been edited:Letters Give C.I.A. Tactics a Legal Rationale

[truthisfreedom]

4. Oops. Forgot about the innocent.

The bush admin forgot they might actually exist.

[cal04]

5. CIA tactics given legal cover, newspaper says

Source: Reuters

Justice Department letters say interrogation rules may not bind U.S.

Recent letters from the U.S. Justice Department to Congress state that intelligence agents working on counterterrorism can legally use interrogation techniques that might otherwise be banned by international law, The New York Times reported in its Sunday editions.

The Justice Department's interpretation shows the Bush administration is contending that the boundaries should have a degree of latitude, the Times said, despite the president's order last summer that he said meant the CIA would hew to international norms on the treatment of detainees.

The United States has faced heavy criticism from rights groups and some allies for its use of a simulated form of drowning known as "waterboarding" during interrogations and for holding hundreds of suspected militants in a prison camp at a U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.

A March 5 letter from the Justice Department to Congress makes clear the Bush administration has not set boundaries for which interrogation methods might violate the ban in the Geneva Conventions on "outrages upon personal dignity," the Times reported.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24330863/

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Letters Give C.I.A. Tactics a Legal Rationale
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/27/washington/27intel.html?hp

Administration Says Particulars May Trump Geneva Protections
By Joby Warrick
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/27/AR2008042700016.html?hpid=moreheadlines

(snip)
Benczkowski's letters were provided to The Washington Post by Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.), who asked the Justice Department last spring to justify the administration's interpretation of the Geneva Conventions. The existence of the letters was first reported last night by the New York Times.

[williesgirl]

6. This is bullshit. We need to fire everyone in DOJ and start anew. rec'd

[judasdisney]

8. Cheney's Sleeper Cells

are here to stay, everywhere.

How soon we forget: http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1118-23.htm

[crimsonblue]

7. Just because the doucebags at DOJ write non-binding memos, doesn't mean its legal.

Did we ever take a minute to think that we are the terrorists? We are the ones invading sovereign countries, displacing and orphaning millions, murdering and maiming hundreds of thousands, destroying inherent human dignities and basic rights, fear-mongering, bribing "terrorists" to kill other "terrorists", employing mercenary armies whose only aim is profits, illegally tapping all of the internet & telephones, illegally spying into every American's bank account via new "laws" that require federal notification for any transaction over $10,000 (many banks voluntarily send data on much lower transactions- and some even deny spontaneous withdrawals over a couple grand), torturing and persecuting men women and children merely because they had the evilness to be Muslim or live in a "terrorist" country or have a "terrorist" name, looting the national treasury in order to enrich Bio Oil and Big Defense and China, burning the Constitution, and killing FOUR THOUSAND FIFTY TWO (at last count) MEN and WOMEN from this country, by sending them to die in an egregious and futile war.

Tell me, who are the REAL terrorists?

God, I have never hated my country before.... who know anymore?



edit: fixed a couple grammatical errors.

[jonnyra]

11. Yes I have stated this many times

America is the lawless, rogue nation stocked with weapons of mass destruction threatening the world. We kill innocent children indiscriminately, destroy entire cities, wipe out infrastructure and threaten nations who refuse to go along with our agenda with the same. We torture people and hold them indefinitely with no recourse. The propaganda machine cheers this shit on and never questions its morality or legality. We are under the control of a fascist regime complete with a high tech media propaganda apparatus that keeps the public confused and distracted while giving the criminals cover. Our congress has been hijacked by the same criminal element and is now useless. The DOJ is clearly an arm of the fascist regime as is every other federal office.

Yes America is a terrorist state which should be confronted by the other democratic nations of the world...militarily if necessary. We have stood by for 8 years now while the nation has been ransacked, twisted and reshaped into a sick, militaristic evil doer killing millions and stealing resources at will from other nations. I'd have that argument with any right wing fascist pig anytime, anywhere.

[annabanana]

9. It's illegal for everyone but US.. See? The letter here says so....

It's exhausting.

[maddezmom]

10. U.S. asserts new interrogation rights - NY Times

U.S. asserts new interrogation rights - NY Times
Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:52pm
NEW YORK (Reuters) - Recent letters from the Justice Department to Congress state that U.S. intelligence agents working to prevent terror attacks can legally use interrogation techniques banned by international law, The New York Times reported on Sunday.

President George W. Bush issued an executive order last summer in which he said the CIA would observe international regulations regarding detainee treatment. The letters indicate the Bush administration now contends these boundaries may be stretched in some interrogations.

A March 5 letter from the Justice Dept. to Congress makes clear the Bush administration has not defined which interrogation methods might violate the Geneva Convention's bans on "outrages upon personal dignity," the Times said.

The letters were provided by the staff of Sen. Ron Wyden, an Oregon Democrat and member of the Senate Intelligence Committee. The panel received classified briefings on the matter and Wyden requested further information, which yielded the letters, the Times said.
more:http://in.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idINIndia-33257820080427

[tanyev]

12. Of course when Republicans are out there equating voting for a Democrat

to supporting terrorism, that really broadens the scope of what they might consider a terrorist attack.

[Solly Mack]

13. I'm to the point where I'm far more outraged that they are getting away with this,

and far more disgusted with those in government who pretend Bush isn't a war criminal or that America doesn't torture, than I am by/with the Bush Admin.


Oh, I'm disgusted with them all...but there's a special kind of disgust reserved for those who could do something and don't (for whatever their reasons)

[angstlessk]

14. so basically this means that EVERYONE they tortured MUST be found guilty and put to death

BECAUSE they tortured them? cause if they tortured an 'innocent' person they would be liable? do I have that correct???