Cuba dissidents back Obama pledge

[dipsydoodle]

Source: BBC News

A group of Cuban dissidents has backed a call by the US presidential hopeful, Barack Obama, for direct talks with the new Cuban President, Raul Castro.

The organisation, Women in White, is made up of female relatives of Cuban political prisoners.

In an open letter to Mr Obama they wrote of their hope that his policies may help free their husbands and sons.

Mr Obama told Cuban exiles in Miami on Friday that America needed to talk to its enemies as well as its friends.


Read more: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7418941.stm

[annabanana]

1. I wonder if this will be mentioned in US Corpomedia?. . . n/t

[dipsydoodle]

2. Probably not.

We're ok with Cuba here in England as is the rest of Europe. Popular holiday resort devoid of external influence - as it should be.

[Judi Lynn]

3. A lot of Americans don't seem able to grasp that. They've been sold a very strange picture by the

Washington-serving media. It's a pity when you expect journalists to inform, rather than to mislead.

One of the most outspoken posters I've ever seen used to post at CNN's "US-Cuba Relations" message board who also posted here, and she raged against our lack of actual awareness, our complete, mind-boggling misinformed, profound ignorance and delusions concerning a place she and other Canadians visited regularly on vacation. She was not alone. There were OTHER Canadian posters who also were regular travelers there. They were keenly impatient, and incredulous Americans could be so deluded about the place.

She got tombstoned. It's a pity, because she could pin back the ears of anyone dealing in disinformation, and DID. She chased everyone down who tried to play games with the facts.

I saw "Father Ted" when it used to run on BBC America, and they featured a Cuban priest in one program, and I realized by the way they used the character, a man moving about freely in Ireland, that Cubans do come and go in Europe, too. He had exactly the same opportunities as a traveler from any country. That was interesting to discover.

[dipsydoodle]

4. One of my younger cousins

married a Cuban but they grew apart and now they've split. He's gone back to Cuba now - they're still good friends anyway. My son and other friends have been there on holiday too and they all wax lyrical about it.

Father Ted.......lol.

[eallen]

5. I hope Obama's presidency will be a good thing for Cuban reform.

We need a president who can explain that freedom of thought and speech and association are prerequisites for democracy, and encourage that in positive engagement, rather than seem a hypocrite because of his own torture policies.

:hippie:

[Mika]

6. freedom of thought, speech, association, and ACTION

That is why Cubans have world class health care, education, child care social infrastructures. They are free to organize and act upon their desires to create social equity because the US backed corporate profit motivated dictatorship was kicked out of their government in 1959.

Here in the US we might have freedom of thought and speech and association, but where is the health care and education social infrastructure that the vast majority of Americans desire/demand? Nowhere. Because government run by/for corporations stifle true freedom of thought and speech and association, and most importantly independent citizen action.

If you are truly interested in this subject then I highly recommend this book ...

Democracy in Cuba and the 1997-98 Elections
Arnold August
1999
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0968508405/qid=1053879619/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2/102-8821757-1670550?v=glance&s=books


- -



Revolution is the profound conviction that there
is no force in the world capable of destroying
the force of truth and ideas.


-

[eallen]

7. I guess you'll be opposing Obama. He is sincere in wanting to LIBERALIZE Cuba.

And frankly, you ought to oppose Obama and other liberals. Liberal democracy, if brought to Cuba, would be the death of Castro's revolution.

:hippie:

[Mika]

10. As in: neo liberal economic liberalization.

Liberalize Cuba? HA! Its all babble/code for corporate rule and US domination.

Bring US corporatocracy to Cuba - again. USA will save the day for Cubans - again.

NOT!


Obama (and the other Dem and repug candidate) and many DUers express maintenance of the US Platt Amendment to control Cuba.

I embrace real liberal progressives. Not those who feel that its our duty to change Cuba - especially not those pandering to the anti Cuba terrorist supporters and enemies of Cuba. Not those who ignorantly diminish the exemplary works of the Cuban people by calling their revolution "Castro's revolution".

Cubans in Cuba are quite capable of creating the changes they desire.

Their world class social infrastructure stats bear that out. It is all Cubans working hard together with their government that moves their revolution forward.

Can Americans make claims about their world class social infrastructure? Not any more (if ever).

Let's see the motivation of Mr Obama and this nation in tackling the deteriorating and critical social infrastructure issues in the US first.

How can we possibly show Cuba the way in this regard when they are further along the pathway than we are? We should be opening our doors, our hearts, and minds to learn from them.

Maintaining the blockade and travel sanctions on non Cubans (all the rest of us in the US) is the status quo Mr Obama claims to want to retain. We won't get very far that way.

But, of course, with the US campaign funding methodologies being completely corrupt as they are, the status quo rules (read: keeps the money rolling in to both sides of the issue).


I'm not a single issue voter, but regarding US Cuba/Latin American policies, we again have to choose between the lesser of evils.



-

[eallen]

11. As in, freeing political prisoners. Yeah, yeah, I know: they don't exist....

And Amnesty International is just a tool of the Corporate, Capitalist Dogs:

http://www.amnesty.org/en/for-media/press-releases/cuba-58-prisoners-conscience-must-be-released-20080218

[ronnie624]

12. According to this report by AI, the "prisoners of conscience"

received funds and/or materials from the United States government in order to engage in activities the authorities perceived as subversive and damaging to Cuba. These activities included publishing articles or giving interviews to US-funded media, communicating with international human rights organizations and having contact with entities or individuals viewed to be hostile to Cuba.

<http://www.amnesty.org/en/for-media/press-releases/cuba-five-years-too-many-new-government-must-release-jailed-dissidents-2>

Accepting funding from foreign sources for political activity in the U.S. is very much illegal and anyone found guilty of doing so can receive stiff prison sentences. It is probably illegal in most other countries as well.

The U.S. government has waged a 45 year long war against Cuba. It seems rather ridiculous to expect the Cuban government to allow "dissidents" to accept funding from a foreign government that is a declared enemy.

Sometimes AI's reports are a bit on the silly side.

[eallen]

14. No, that is protected by the 1st amendment here.

At the height of the Cold War, it was perfectly legal for Americans to receive literature from the Soviet Union, for distribution here. There had been attempts early in the 20th century to prosecute people for the distribution of communist literature, and some famous court cases reinforcing the 1st amendment. It was also legal to receive funds for that purpose. Various radical Muslim organizations today are free to publish in the US, including attacks on secular society, and religious arguments in defense of terrorism. Much of that is funded from abroad.

"Political activity" is a suspiciously vague phrase, one that typically it is used to cover and constrain free expression in an autocratic society.

AI's reports are "silly" only to those who don't care about civil liberties. You view AI as silly for the same reason and in the same way that the right in the US views the ACLU as silly. And worse.

Now, me? I'm a liberal. That means especially with regard to civil liberties. Given your views, you are quite right to oppose us.

:hippie:

[ronnie624]

15. You know nothing about my views.

There are many restrictions on foreign political activities in the United States, and I think you can rest assured that there would be none of any sort by agents of a government that had spent 45 years waging covert war against th U.S., including the financing of terrorist attacks and attempted assassinations of U.S. leaders. Context is very important.

<http://www.lobbyinginfo.org/laws/page.cfm?pageid=13>

I think your position is less about 'freedom of speech', and more about supporting an establishment that has spent a century meddling in the affairs of other countries. Old habits are hard to break and overcoming a lifetime of absorbing propaganda is not easy.

[eallen]

16. Again, at height of Cold War, it was perfectly legal to publish Soviet material.

And it was done.

What you're pointing to are much narrower restrictions than pushing a political point of view. Yes, there are restrictions on foreign agents in the US "making campaign contributions and paying for gifts and travel for federal officials."

But not on participating generally in political activity and debate. Not on publishing their views. And not even on paying to have their views published in the US.

Some of the seminal court cases surrounding the 1st amendment stemmed from socialists in the early 20th century publishing and distributing literature that expressed foreign views. There is quite a bit of irony in Castro using the notion of foreign influence as an excuse to crack down on dissent. Does he forget what books he read in his youth?!

:hippie:

[ronnie624]

18. The full range of activities by the "dissidents"

is not made clear by the AI report. They were, however, receiving funding from the U.S. government which makes them agents of a foreign government that is a declared enemy of Cuba.

Perhaps foreigners (ie: the United States) should simply respect the laws and sovereignty of other countries. The concept is really not so difficult to understand.

Amnesty International does not receive automatic credence from me. They often include unverifiable claims in their reports.

[AlphaCentauri]

26. wait, who can distribute propaganda when media corporations are part of the government

through government lobbies. What about the prosecution and black listing, remember if you look like red you can lost your job or we won't do business with you. That is freedom?

[eallen]

27. Of course that's not freedom. That why some of us view that as a black time.

Liberals condemn such behavior, regardless of who is doing it.

:hippie:

[AlphaCentauri]

31. did you see any of the mayor media groups telling us about education in the Soviet Union

during the cold war? or what about their health care system? mmmmmm!!! or what about giving the communist party a one hour each week to go on national corporate TV or Radio??? like the democratic and republican parties, I did not see it happening. so what is wrong with that freedom or first amendment when the little guy does not have access to the mass media?

[struggle4progress]

138. "unregistered foreign agent" prosecutions have been popular under *

Andy Card's cousin, Susan Lindauer, for example, who seems to have irritated the hell out of the White House by writing Card a letter opposing the Iraq war, was prosecuted as an unregistered foreign agent, though most of the press accounts incorrectly identified her supposed crime as espionage

Similarly, in the strange Argentinian suitcase prosecution, the guilty plea was merely for serving as an unregistered foreign agent, which seems to have nothing whatsoever to do with all the noise surrounding the case -- except to allow the noise makers to cheer that "we have a guilty plea!"

[Judi Lynn]

19. We've discussed this here so long, haven't we? These "dissidents" are paid U.S. functionaries.

We've all pondered Title 18, Section 951 of the U.S. Code. It's referenced again in this article:

"The Responsibility of Intellectuals: Cuba, the US and Human Rights"
By: James Petras, May 1, 2003

~snip~
It is best to begin with the most fundamental facts. The left critics, based on U.S. State Department labeling, denounce the Cuban government's repression of individuals, dissidents, including journalists, owners of private libraries and members of political parties engaged in non-violent political activity trying to exercise their democratic rights. What the "progressives" fail to recognize or are unwilling to acknowledge is that those arrested were paid functionaries of the U.S. government. According to the Agency of International Development (AID), the principal U.S. federal agency implementing U.S. grants and loans in pursuit of U.S. foreign policy, under U.S. AID's Cuba Program ( resulting from the Helms-Burton Act of 1996) AID has channeled over $8.5 million dollars to Cuban opponents of the Castro regime since 1997 to publish, meet, propagandize in favor of the overthrow of the Cuban government in co-ordination with a variety of U.S. NGO's, universities, foundations and other front groups. (Profile of the U.S. AID Cuba Program - on the AID web site). The U.S. AID program, unlike its usual practice, does not channel payments to the Cuban government but directly to its Cuban "dissident" clients. The criteria for funding are clearly stated - the recipients of payments and grants must have demonstrated a clear commitment to U.S. directed "regime change" toward "free markets" and "democracy" - no doubt similar to the U.S. colonial dictatorship in Iraq. The Helms-Burton legislation, the U.S. AID Cuba Program and their paid Cuban functionaries, like the U.S. progressive manifesto, "condemn Cuba's lack of freedom and jailing of innocent dissidents and call for a democratic change of regime in Cuba".

Strange coincidences that require some analysis: Cuban journalists who have received $280,000 from Cuba Free Press - a U.S. Agency for International Development front- are not dissidents; they are paid functionaries. Cuban "Human Rights" groups who receive $775,000 from the CIA front "Freedom House" are not dissidents - particularly when their mission is to promote a "transition" (overthrow) of the Cuban regime.

The list of grants and funding to Cuban "dissidents" (functionaries) by the U.S. government in pursuit of the U.S. policy is long and detailed and accessible to all the progressive moral critics.

The point is that the jailed opponents of the Cuban government were paid functionaries of the U.S. government, paid to implement the goals of the Helms-Burton Act in accordance with the criteria of the U.S.AID program and under the guidance and direction of the head of the U.S. Interest Section in Havana.

Between September 2, 2002 and March 2003 James Cason, head of the US Interest Section, held dozens of meetings with his Cuban "dissidents" at his home and office, providing them with instructions and guidelines on what to write and how to recruit, while publicly haranguing against the Cuban government in derogation of his diplomatic credentials.

Washington's Cuban functionaries were supplied with electronic and other communication equipment by USAID, books and other propaganda and money to fund pro-U.S. "trade unions" via the U.S. front, the "American Center for International Labor Solidarity".

These are not well-meaning "dissidents", unaware of their paymaster and their role as U.S. agents,since the U.S. AID report states ( under the section entitled "The US Institutional Context"), "The Cuba Program is funded through the Economic Support Fund, which is designed to support the economic and political foreign policy interests of the US by providing financial assistance to allies (sic) and countries in transition to democracy".

No country in the world tolerates or labels domestic citizens paid by and working for a foreign power to act for its imperial interests as "dissidents". This is especially true of the U.S., where under Title 18,Section 951 of the U.S. Code , "anyone who agrees to operate within the United States subject to the direction or control of a foreign government or official is subject to criminal prosecution and up to a 10 year prison sentence". Unless, of course, they register as a paid foreign agent or are working for the Israeli government.

The U.S. "progressive" intellectuals abdicate their responsibilities as analysts and critics when they accept at face value the State Department characterization of the U.S. paid functionaries as dissidents striving for "freedom".

http://www.queensu.ca/philosophy/cuba/responsibility_of_intellectuals.html



James Cason donating moral (and financial) support
to Marta Beatriz Roque, from the doorway of the U.S.
Interests Section in Havana.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Judi Lynn]

22. Democrats need fascists like a hole in the head. Your attempt to red-bait people

is crude, underhanded, dishonest.

Deal with the material itself, forget about trying to target posters.

Address the material itself, as advised in the D.U. rules. Don't use your time posting to try to devaluate other people.

[eallen]

24. There was no material. Likely, because there were no public trial.

See, in liberal nations, people accused of a crime get a public trial. One that even foreigners can sit and observe. Tell us, since it is a material question that is relevant, what kind of process rights were afforded these prisoners?

Here's something relevant. But I guess Human Rights Watch is another red-baiting organization, like Amnesty International:

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2003/04/03/cuba5480.htm

:hippie:

[Judi Lynn]

35. Human Rights Watch has something to say about Bush-supported, death squad loving Colombia:

Colombia: Rice Should Press Uribe on Rights Issues

~snip~
“Instead of pressing Congress to ignore Colombia’s deplorable record, Secretary Rice should use the trade deal as leverage to press Colombia’s government to effectively confront impunity and break the paramilitaries’ power,” said José Miguel Vivanco, Americas director at Human Rights Watch.

Colombia has the worst record of violence against trade unionists in the world, with more than 2,500 killings since 1985 and nearly 3,500 threats against trade unionists since 1991, according to the National Labor School (ENS or Escuela Nacional Sindical), a highly respected labor rights group in Colombia. While the numbers of yearly killings fluctuates, during the administration of President Álvaro Uribe, the ENS has registered more than 400 killings and more than 1,300 threats against trade unionists.

A significant factor contributing to the violence is the Colombian government’s persistent failure to bring the perpetrators to justice and fully dismantle paramilitary mafias that have deliberately targeted trade unionists. Fewer than 3 percent of the killings have ever been solved. Last year, the Colombian Attorney General’s office established a specialized sub-unit to reopen some of these cases. However, it is too early to assess whether the sub-unit will produce substantial results.

Meanwhile, the Uribe administration is embroiled in a growing scandal over links involving high-ranking officials and more than 40 congressmen from Uribe’s coalition with the paramilitaries. Rather than fully support investigations into these links, Uribe has repeatedly lashed out against the judges and journalists who are trying to uncover the extent of the paramilitaries’ influence.

The Colombian government claims that, thanks to a demobilization program it has implemented, paramilitaries no longer exist. However, the Organization of American States (OAS) mission verifying the demobilizations has identified 22 illegal armed groups, in which paramilitaries are actively recruiting new troops and participating in drug trafficking, extortion, selective killings, and the forced displacement of civilians.

In Medellín, one of the cities that Secretary Rice is scheduled to visit, Human Rights Watch has received disturbing reports of continuing paramilitary activity. Recently, an OAS representative who monitors paramilitary demobilization in the city received a serious death threat.

Paramilitary commanders, many of whom are wanted on drug charges in the United States, have yet to fulfill commitments to give up the massive wealth they have amassed through decades of drug trafficking, crime, and forced takings of land. Nor have they disclosed substantial information that would ensure a full dismantlement of their mafia-like structures.

Human Rights Watch pointed out that it does not oppose free trade agreements per se. However, any free trade deal should be premised on respect for fundamental human rights, including the rights of workers. It is impossible for workers to fully exercise their rights if, as in Colombia, they often fear for their lives when doing so.

The bilateral trade deal presents a unique opportunity for the US government to press the Colombian authorities to finally address paramilitary power and impunity for anti-union violence in a serious fashion. Human Rights Watch opposes approval of the trade deal at this time, until Colombia shows concrete, substantial and sustained results in dealing with these problems.

Human Rights Watch noted that by rushing for ratification of the Colombia trade deal and disregarding Colombia’s human rights problems, the Bush administration risks further damaging its credibility in a region that already questions the United States’ commitment to human rights.

“If the Bush administration keeps turning a blind eye to Colombia’s appalling human rights record, it will feed the common perception in Latin America that the United States applies a double standard on rights issues,” said Vivanco.

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2008/01/23/colomb17850.htm

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Liberal countries don't financially support nations which slaughter entire villages, which torture with chainsaws, which throw citizens into mass graves, and into rivers, bypassing trials altogether.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SUMMARY AND RECOMMENDATIONS
Human Rights Watch here presents detailed, abundant, and compelling evidence of continuing close ties between the Colombian Army and paramilitary groups responsible for gross human rights violations.

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2000/colombia/

[eallen]

40. Yes. Colombia sucks. But how is that relevant in a thread about Cuba?

Often, when I write about the torture policies that the Bush administration has implemented, some wingnut will respond by talking about atrocities committed by Al Qaeda or Iran. It always puzzles. It's as if pointing to others' horrible acts is supposed to excuse the political leader under discussion. Or maybe just distracts.

I'm always quite quick to point out the complete irrelevance of that. Bush should be tried for war crimes. It doesn't matter that other leaders have done worse.

:hippie:

[Popol Vuh]

25. "Please, leave the party"?????

What? You mean in your mind there needs to be a litmus test to exclude all others without your uninformed positions? I find it quite telling that you would use the word communists in the manner in which you did, and, post a hippie smilie at the bottom of your post.

:eyes:

[eallen]

29. I just hate Democrats being smeared as defenders of Castro.

The vast majority of us aren't. Liberals condemn the kind of rule that Castro has instituted.

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

32. You mean the kind of rule that refused to be bought by the US government?

You do understand that our Cuban policy is payback for Castro refusing to play ball, don't you?

[eallen]

37. Some of it is. Some of it isn't. I'm not sure why you think that matters.

Every autocratic regime has its reasons. Reza Pahlavi justified how he ruled Iran with reference to Shi'ite radicals. Were there really Shi'ite radicals who wanted to take over Iran and turn it into an oppressive, religious state? Yes, there were. And in fact, they did.

But does that justify how Reza Pahlavi ruled?

Absolutely not. Iran went from fascist state to a theocracy. Both should be condemned by liberals.

I don't have to approve Pahlavi's reign, propped up by the US, in order to condemn the current regime. I don't have to approve the current regime, in order to condemn Pahlavi. I don't have to approve Batista, in order to condemn Castro.

I would be quite happy if Obama, as our next president, were able to partly remove Castro's excuse while at the same time nudging Cuba toward more respect for human rights. Like Obama, I recognize the great need for the latter. And the lack of justice to it, regardless of what excuse can be made.

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

39. There is no comparison. Pahlavi was an American puppet

put in after we got rid of an elected leader in Iran. So, Iran went from democracy to fascism because that's where we pushed them.

You're focused on the wrong frame -- which exists to occlude US interference in other nations for profit.

If Castro had coorperated with the US, he'd be hailed as a hero in this country.

[eallen]

41. No, I am denying that that is the only frame in which to see things.

I don't see Pahlavi as a hero. Because I don't use that frame. But that doesn't mean I use some mirror frame that let's me excuse autocratic regimes simply because they are opposed to the US.

I'm using a liberal frame. One concerned with human rights. First.

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

43. It's not about opposition but about political realities.

And anyone who is seriously concerned with human rights first would recognize that the US record against the people of Cuba is miserable and still actively predatory.

We have absolutely no high ground at all when it comes to Cuba, political prisoners or human rights, and Obama, frankly, looked silly last week when he went to speak to a group that fronts for terrorists about human rights in Cuba.

[eallen]

46. Explain how the Ladies in White front for terrorists?

And again, explain how you know what awful crimes their husbands committed? What kind of trial was it, that found them guilty? What due process was followed?

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

55. Obama spoke to CANF. n/t

[Mika]

73. See posts # 56 and 59.

The Ladies in White received funding from Luis Posada.

Even so, the small group continues to stage protests every week in Cuba.

[Ken Burch]

49. Property rights aren't human rights. No one is liberated by owning property.

Property is simply a tool of creating misery. Nothing progressive is ever done with the individual ownership of it.

And that is the only freedom the Miami exiles want. They don't want anything progressive in Cuba.

[eallen]

51. The rights at issue are freedom of speech & association. Due process.

The core rights that liberals are supposed to support.

The kind of rights for which the ACLU fights in the US.

:hippie:

[Ken Burch]

52. Those will come. But it goes without saying that, with our history

No U.S. president and No American citizen has the right to push Cuba on human rights. You're not allowed to judge a country you once held as a colony.

[eallen]

53. So England couldn't reprimand the US on Bush's torture policies?

And "those will come"?! WTF? Basic human rights aren't something we should be happy to see an autocratic regime suppress until it achieves the desired revolutionary state, at some hypothetical future point.

I reject your notion that X can't address human rights issues in Y, just because Y was once a colony of X. Bush is in no position to address human rights issues in Cuba, because of the failures of the Bush administration on similar issues. But once we have Obama as president, I fully expect him to push on those issues.

:hippie:

[ronnie624]

68. The biggest problem with your analogy

in my opinion, is that the Bush Administration's policies on torture are part and parcel to the "war on terror". They are directly related to wars of aggression in the Middle East and elsewhere. They are also directly related to the expansion of U.S. global hegemony and increased tensions throughout the world. In other words, the Bush administration's foreign policies affect everyone in the world, thus are they the concern of everyone in the world, including the citizens of the UK.

The domestic policies and laws in Cuba on the other hand, affect only the Cuban people, thus are they solely the concern of the Cuban people. You may not like the Cuban government, but no matter how brutal and despotic you may regard it, It is ultimately none of your business. If the Cuban people decide to overthrow the Revolution, nothing can prevent it. This is called sovereignty, and according to international law, every nation on earth has a right to exercise it.

Perhaps the matter is now clear to you.

[Popol Vuh]

69. And Ronnie

Isn't a shame that some of us complain about certain laws of Cuba when it was our actions there which caused them to have to create those laws in the first place?

Don't you wish people would understand cause/effect?

[ronnie624]

74. Exactly.

Our actions did most certainly force the Cuban people to take matters into their own hands, but they are far better off for it. Even after a half century of oppressive bullying by the richest, most powerful nation on earth, according to the U.N. and other organizations, Cubans ranks in the top 5% in terms of social indicators such as literacy, health care and infant mortality. And as far as the oppressiveness of the government goes, most, if not all of the dictatorships that the U.S. has supported were far worse.

Another thing I find ironic, is the hypocritical 'concerns' about human rights expressed by the Castro critics. Most Americans think about human rights in terms of how they are affected by the policies and laws of their own government, but never in terms of how their government's foreign policies affect people in other countries. Even if the citizens of the United States do enjoy a degree of freedom that most others do not (which is certainly debatable), how on earth can the U.S be held up as a beacon of freedom after our history of intervention and the undeniably brutal effects it has had on millions of people throughout the world? Personally, I would be very uncomfortable expressing such blatant hypocrisy.

[fed_up_mother]

111. And years after a divorce, "couples" still live together because of severe

housing shortages.

Social indicators are sometimes just a bunch of crap.

[ronnie624]

118. Here is some "crap" for you to read, in case you're interested.

A good place to start in upholding the above thesis is to look at Cuba’s education system, one of the areas of “basic need” targeted by the CAFC. The fact is that 100% of Cuban children attend relatively well-funded and adequately equipped elementary schools, where the student-teacher ratios are among the most favorable in the world (well below the average of even some of the most developed nations). In addition, university and professional training are accessible to all. Although this island nation is smaller than the state of Virginia, it contains 57 centers of higher education, with the government guaranteeing the right to free education at all levels in any of these institutions, provided that admission standards are met. This commitment has resulted in an exceedingly highly educated population. At 98%, the adult literacy rate in Cuba is on a par with the world’s most developed nations and averages 15 percentage points higher than the literacy rates found in other Latin American countries. This does not mean that the system is perfect; Cubans face a grievous shortage of resources, sometimes including food for mandated meals served during school hours. What it does demonstrate, however, is that the CAFC is seemingly divorced from reality in identifying Cuban education as a sector desperate for American succour.

*****

Another sector targeted by the CAFC is Cuba’s healthcare system. Contrary to what one would expect of a “cruel dictatorship,” the Cuban government has been committed to the provision of universal health services since it first came to power. Prior to the advent of the Castro administration, Cuba had 6,286 practicing physicians, which meant that only a small elite sector of society had access to doctor’s care, while health services in the countryside were virtually non-existent. By 2002, the number of doctors had meteorically risen to 67,079, with the physician-civilian ratio improving from 1 doctor for every 1,076 patients in 1958 (pre-Castro) to an extraordinary 1 for every 168 in 2002 in revolutionary Cuba. Cubans today have an average life expectancy that exceeds that of other Latin Americans by 8 years and its mortality rate for children under 5 is staggeringly low compared to other countries in the region (in 2005, Cuba’s child mortality rate was lower even than in the U.S.). While these are not the genera of statistics that normally make their way into the American media, Cuba is viewed throughout Latin America and other parts of the world as providing an exemplary model for the provision of universal healthcare to its people. In Washington, however, anti-Castro imperatives continues to cloud the picture with heavily politicized information, generating misguided and sterile initiatives as epitomized by the CAFC. At the same time, a flourishing educational and medical system doesn’t mean that the issues of human rights observance and political pluralism have been resolved.

*****

The Torricelli Act was passed in 1992 in an effort to mortally damage Cuba’s trade relations with third countries. According to its provisions, subsidiaries of U.S. companies were prohibited from trading with Cuba and foreign ships that docked at a Cuban port were banned from entering U.S. ports for a period of six months. When Castro’s regime did not crumble as hoped, the Clinton administration, under increasing pressure from the exile community, again tightened sanctions, this time passing the notorious Helms Burton Act in 1996. The bill, which was ruthless in its quest to sever third country ties with Cuba, was energetically opposed by the European Union for its violation of international law and its members’ business interests on the island. Prior to the Castro revolution in 1959, a major part of Cuban wealth rested in the hands of rich Americans who, among a number of other things, owned much of the island’s sugar and rum producing land. These properties were seized by Castro and redistributed among the campesinos to be used as farm parcels. The Helms Burton Act states that any foreign investor currently engaged in business ventures involving property that once belonged to an American citizen (fifty years ago or more) could now be sued in American courts.

Although completely isolated by a continued U.S. policy aimed at hermetically sealing Havana from both diplomatic and economic contacts abroad, the Cuban authorities managed at enormous effort to maintain existing funding levels for their health services, viewing healthcare as a primary right of all of its citizens. Social unrest and extreme hardships were contained during the 1990’s precisely because the government devoted what few resources it had to maintaining the provision of basic food, healthcare and social services to the population. In 2002, just as Cuba began to emerge from this “special period” of enormous hardship, 99.2% of all Cubans were still under the care of a family physician, with the infant mortality rate remaining among the lowest even in the developed world. Considering the severity of Cuba’s recent economic crisis following the fall of the Soviet Union, these statistics are quite impressive. They are incongruous, however, with what Washington describes as a heartless system under the unyielding heel of a cruel bureaucracy.

<http://www.coha.org/2007/05/24/rethinking-cuba-taking-off-those-miami-sunglasses-may-help-clear-up-the-picture/>

More "crap".

Like the rest of the Cuban economy, Cuban medical care has suffered from severe material shortages following the end of Soviet subsidies and the ongoing United States embargo against Cuba that began after the Cuban Missile Crisis.<13>

According to the World Health Organization (WHO), the chance of a Cuban child dying at five years of age or younger is 7 per 1000 live births in Cuba, while it's 8 per 1000 in the US. WHO reports that Cuban males have a life expectancy at birth of 75 years and females 79 years. In comparison, the US life expectancy at birth is 75 and 80 years for males and females, respectively. Cuba's infant mortality rate is lower than the US with 5 deaths per thousand in Cuba versus 7 per thousand in the US. Cuba has nearly twice as many physicians as the U.S. -- 5.91 doctors per thousand people compared to 2.56 doctors per thousand, according to WHO. <14> <14>

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Cuba#Health_indicators_and_issues>

[Judi Lynn]

119. Great links, terrific way to educate oneself on Cuba "crap!" It really pays to be informed

on the subject being discussed, doesn't it?

In the first link, it mentioned something ugly that comes up again and again: _Bush's whole push has been to overwhelm and seize the government of Cuba somehow, and override the will of the people, to tear apart their infrastructure which as is pointed out is certainly world-class, and world-famous, best in Latin America, and PRIVATIZE it.

Absolutely hideous. _Bush needs to get the hell away from Cuba meddling as soon as possible, and the rest of the corrupt, violent first wave of the "exiles" need to go ahead and die off. Things will never be right until every one of those Batista era, racist monsters is gone.

Thanks for providing some actual information for those wise enough to educate themselves.

[Mika]

127. And how many homeless in Cuba?

Near zero.

Not so in the USA. Over 2 million per year. 40% veterans. Families are the fastest growing demographic in homelessness. (Those are 1999-2001 stats, its much worse now, under Bush.)

http://www.nypirg.org/homeless/facts.html

[fed_up_mother]

132. We're discussing CUBA - not the U.S.

I will gladly stop in the middle rather than swing to the opposite extreme.

Do you really think the people of Cuba are as free as the citizens of France or Sweden, for instance? Those are my models - NOT Fidel's Castro. I don't have to love Cuba because of the flaws in my own country.

[ronnie624]

134. No one expects you to love Castro.

But you should at least try to view Cuba from a rational perspective, and refrain from perpetuating misinformation. Castro did not appear out of thin air and take the people of Cuba prisoner. The revolution was supported by the Cuban people or it would not have been successful. It was a direct result of the Batista dictatorship that was fully supported by the U.S. government and the corporate culture of the day.

Opposition to the government was brutally suppressed. U.S. industry controlled virtually all of Cuba's resources and profited from them at the expense of the people there. The conditions under which many Cubans lived was abysmal; inadequate health care, education, housing and a high infant mortality. Not to mention existing under governance that was answerable to foreigners. This is what triggered the revolution to begin with.

When Castro came to the United States, asking for recognition and assistance, he was rebuffed, and received and embargo instead because he refused to continue in the same manner as Batista. In other words, the U.S. had no intention of recognizing Cuban sovereignty, something that all independent nations have a right to.

For decades, Cuba has been subjected to a war by the U.S. government that has included the sponsoring of an invasion, terrorist attacks and assassination attempts. Whatever oppression exists in Cuba is a direct result of this. What government wouldn't impose repressive measures against its citizens, when it is under constant threat from an almost overwhelming power?

You would be far better served by attempting to understanding the underlying dynamic that has resulted in the conditions that exist in Cuba today. It requires time and effort, but in the end, you'll be better off for it, even if you are called a communist, or told to go live there by certain dumb asses here who prefer to parrot propaganda-for-simpletons as opposed to understanding the world in which we live.

[fed_up_mother]

135. I understand the dymamic, and I know a dictator when I see one. No thanks.

Why don't "you" take a little cyber stroll through Cuba. You'll find plenty of pictures taken by Europeans who don't have an anti-Cuban bias.

The place is a dump - everyone but some party leaders - has been reduced to the lowest common denominator. Dictators tend to do that to countries.

[Judi Lynn]

137. You know one when you see one. That's ripe! You WON'T see Castro because your own government,

bending to the pressure of assholes in Miami, has FORBIDDEN you to go to Cuba.

As for having seen Castro, there ARE posters here who HAVE seen him, in broad daylight, coming and going freely in Cuba themselves. They are people who either live elsewhere and travel there freely, or people who have gone there many, many times in a professional capacity.

You don't see them foaming at the mouth and trying to label others as "communists," which is actually AGAINST THE RULES at DU, which tells you not to personally attack posters.

[fascisthunter]

79. nah... Our American Government Is NEVER to Blame

"look over there"

[fed_up_mother]

121. "Those will come?" But meanwhile its the workers' paradise?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl::
:

[Popol Vuh]

45. "The vast majority of us aren't."

Fist, how do you know that for sure? Have you gone around and asked the vast majority of Democrats? Sorry if that question is on the blunt side.

Secondly, I don't think you'll find anyone who'll defend everything about Castro, but, does that disqualify all the other things about Castro?

Thirdly, we Democrats are smeared about many things, so why focus attention on Castro and the Cuban Revolution? Or is it that you believe Democrats should pass 'your' litmus test?

I don't know about you, but, I've always liked the idea that the Democratic party was about the poor and middle class's struggle for social and economic justice. Not some worrying about the opinions from the right-wing.

Don't mean to be offending, but, I am just saying....

[Ken Burch]

47. Nothing progressive would come of the Cuban Revolution being stopped.

Anything that brought the Miami exiles back would mean permanent right-wing ugliness.

The answer is democratic socialism, not a capitalist restoration.

Privatization and equality can't be good for the Cuban people. Neither would the end of racial equality, which most Miami exiles would want scrapped.

[eallen]

54. The issue is basic human rights, not bringing back the exiles.

The only way for the Cuban people to truly decide the course of their future is if they have the prerequisites of real democracy: Freedom of speech. Freedom of the press. Freedom of association. And freedom from arrest and harassment without basic forms of due process.

:hippie:

[fed_up_mother]

122. Socialists/marxists/communists here would gladly give up their freedoms

Thankfully, most democrats in fly over country (from coast to coast) don't read DU.

[Mika]

126. Any proof? Or do you just come to DU to post accusations about other posters?

Links? Proof? Informed debate?

Thankfully, most DUers have more to offer in the form of informed discussion than you. Thankfully many provide references/links to posts, if they have a legitimate claim to make about the comments of others here.

I notice that you don't provide any links to the accusations you have made of other posters here.

You seem show up on these Cuba threads mainly to flame others.

-

[fed_up_mother]

131. Well, most democrats want a European model

not a Cuban model for our country, but some people would gladly take us down to the lowest common denominator lest one evil, greedy person gets more than he does.

Their ideas of freedom suck.

And I don't have to offer proof. Just read the DU boards, but then, you probably agree with all of them.

[The Onyx Key]

103. Thank you!! I don't think this has been said nearly enough!! n/t

[Mika]

106. If you don't like it, then stop smearing.

Please show us the posts of the "defenders of Castro".

I've seen no posts by anyone here defending Castro.

I do see posts describing conditions in Cuba, both pro and con, but none defending of Castro.

Unless ... you think ant Castro is responsible for all things in Cuba?

If so, that would make him superhuman - and I don't think that even hard core defenders of Castro think that.

But still, please show us posts that defend Castro.


Otherwise, your smearing (or claiming worry over the repugs smearing like you do) is complete bullshit.


-

[fed_up_mother]

109. Their defense of Castro makes it very difficult for my relatives

to vote democratic.

Sucks.

[Mika]

124. Please show the posts that are in "defense of Castro".

Where are they?

Quit with the mewling, and post some examples so we can try to understand WTF you are talking about.

Otherwise, you are posting bullshit. Sucks.

[Judi Lynn]

136. Take the time to back up your remarks. Point out the threads which "prove" DU'ers

are "in defense of Castro."

Why don't you pay attention to the U.S. Congress which votes yearly to remove the travel ban to Cuba, only to get it sabotaged behind the scenes by that piece of filth, Republican Miami "exile," Lincoln Diaz-Balart? Diaz-Balart is a flaming insult to this country, working for his own selfish interests and that of his group of brain damaged violent half-wits in Miami, and the ultra-right reactionary faction-serving the Republican pResident _Bush who stole the White House with the assistance of the vicious Vigilia Mambisa "rent-a-riot" leader Miguel Saavedra who helped close down the Miami-Dade vote recount?

Any semi-responsible person only has to look at the way the Miami hardliner "exiles" conduct business in their city to realize beyond all doubt why the Cubans had to drive their filthy behinds out of their country. Too bad Florida hasn't rebelled against them.

[Zorro]

143. Talk about "foaming at the mouth"

You seem to have a nasty attitude about south Florida voters.

Have you ever been to Miami?

[Mika]

50. Funny thing. Its you who are making the same accusations as you claim "Freeptards" will.

Hmmm. :think:

I don't see anyone defending Castro here. He's quite capable of doing so himself.

I do see defense of Cubans in Cuba maintaining their national sovereignty as they see fit (and they do it with world class social infrastructure stats to boot).

I constantly read ad hominem attacks upon those of us who care to spend a little time analyzing & discussing some of the positive outcomes of Cubans in Cuba building-out their society.

Why take the time to attack those of us who engage in Cuba discussions here like "Freetards" would and then worry about how "Freeptards" might attack us?

- -

On another subject: Do you know how HRW gets its reporting, like the diatribe you linked-to, from Cuba? It comes second hand. From "journalists" paid by the US gov, US funded foundations, and anti Cuba Miamicuban exile groups (some of whom are terrorists). When it comes to their Cuba reports, regrettably HRW republishes "some people say" style reporting. None of it documented in any way other than hearsay and fabrications from US paid "dissident" groups.

Now, before you go off on an uninformed rant about the political climate in Cuba, NO ONE here on DU has ever said (at least that I've seen on any Cuba thread, and I've read most all of 'em) that the only political opposition groups/parties in Cuba are US functionaries, such as you have posited up-thread. Cuba does have a wide range of active and very vocal domestic created and run political groups. Many of us have discussed and celebrated them. Interesting thing about a lot of those groups is that they are excoriated by the Miami based anti Cuba industry that sucks at the US taxpayer teat. Its as though the RW don't want to recognize that there exists a range of domestic political exchange and campaigning going on in Cuba that doesn't need or want US funding or strategic support. A VAST majority of Cubans in Cuba and Cuban expats in S Florida who feel that Cubans in Cuba should decide and steer the course of their nation.

I take the time to mention this because I've been there and seen it. Many times.


Why take the time to attack those of us who engage in Cuba discussions here like "Freetards" would and then worry about how "Freeptards" might attack us?



-

[TheWraith]

66. So why not let the Cubans argue on their own behalf?

Oh, right--up until a few weeks ago, they weren't allowed to own computers.

Yeah, that's a free and equal society. :eyes:

Oh, and in case you're wondering, your criticisms of HRW are nonsense. I defy you to offer proof that HRW's reports aren't as accurate as possible.

[Mika]

71. What does "as possible" even mean?

http://www.hrw.org/reports/1999/cuba/Cuba996-01.htm#P400_38494

The Cuban government has not allowed Human Rights Watch to return to Cuba since 1995.

Last in Cuba 13 years ago. That's a long time. Kicked out for collaborating with groups aiding and abetting the declared enemies of Cuba (the US gov and Miami based exile terror groups). So how does HRW get its "reports" about Cuba?

Here's how ... US paid "dissidents" who have a financial motive to produce negative "reports".

HRW's Cuba reports are nothing more than hearsay from people well paid to produce it - with no official documentation nor first hand exposure to any events they report on.

OIW, "some people say" (some people who are on the US payroll and some receiving financing from terrorist groups in Miami).


I'm not bashing all of HRW's work, just their second hand and VERY partial methodology for their Cuba reporting.

- -

As to the rest of your post - uninformed babble.

Please tell us about your vast experience in Cuba.


-

[TheWraith]

81. I notice that you can't actually debunk what I said.

You just try to slide past the fact that Cubans have been banned from owning computers, or communicating in practically any way with the outside world. You want to talk about "infrastructure stats"? How relevant of a measure is that to whether or not you can speak freely, travel, and criticize the government without getting black-bagged and thrown in a dungeon after a kangaroo trial?

Yes, Cuba kicked HRW's official presence out 13 years ago. Gee, why could they possibly want to kick out a human rights watchdog group?

[EFerrari]

89. Shouldn't you be more concerned with Guantanamo than with Havana?

Jesus on a trailer hitch.

Did I miss something? Does HRW have an office and free access at Gitmo?

[fed_up_mother]

110. Change the subject? Truth hurts a bit, heh?

[EFerrari]

114. Excuse me? Are you reading this thread? I did answer the question.

See just below.

Truth, my granny.

[EFerrari]

87. Okay, I'll take a shot. But with the understanding that I understand

they'd rather err on the side of caution.

This is their piece on the lapsing of RCTV's license. Even their headline is inaccurate.

Venezuela: TV Shutdown Harms Free Expression

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2007/05/22/venezu15986.htm

Here's an actual media watchdog on the same event:


Coup Co-Conspirators as Free-Speech Martyrs
Distorting the Venezuelan media story

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=3107

There was no shutdown of RCTV: their license wasn't renewed AFTER FIVE YEARS had gone by. If Fox had tried to get Bush killed, their name would be written on sand by now. And, HRW got the whole context wrong as well.

HRW is not infallible. They're not even always as right as possible -- as you can see above, because FAIR was able to get it right with the same access.

[darue]

58. this statement should be removed and qualify for warning if not banning n/t

"Please, leave the party." - eallen May-26-08 09:20 AM #21

[Judi Lynn]

38. More on funding dissidents, as in Title 18 Section 951 of the U.S. Code:

April 26, 2003

Cuba Crackdown:
A Revolt Against the National Security Strategy?
By ROBERT SANDELS

Since becoming principal officer at the U.S. Interests Section in Havana in September 2002, James Cason has increased official U.S. connections with Cuban dissidents. Entering directly into Cuba domestic politics, Cason helped launch the youth wing of the dissident Partido Liberal Cubano. Nowhere in the world, said Foreign Minister Felipe Perez Roque, would it be legal for a foreigner to participate in the formation of a political party. In October 2002, Cason invited a group of dissidents to meet with U.S. newspaper editors at his residence in Havana. Although it has become routine for heads of the U.S. mission to seek out dissidents, it was unusual to meet them at home.

Feb. 24 of this year, he participated in a meeting of the dissident Assembly for the Promotion of Civil Society at the home of prominent dissident Marta Beatriz Roque. Also present at the meeting were several reporters to whom Cason repeated his criticisms of President Fidel Castro's government and reaffirmed U.S. support for dissidents.

Cason organized two other such meetings at his residence in March even after receiving a formal complaint from the Foreign Ministry.

In a recent television interview in Miami, Cason said the help he gave dissidents was "moral and spiritual" in nature. But, according to the testimony of several Cuban security agents who infiltrated the organizations that received U.S. support, the Interests Section became a general headquarters and office space for dissidents. Some of them, including Marta Beatriz Roque, had passes signed by Cason that allowed them free access to the Interests Section where they could use computers, telephones, and office machines.

The State Department calls these activities "outreach." However, under the United States Code, similar "outreach" by a foreign diplomat in the United States could result in criminal prosecution and a 10-year prison sentence for anyone "who agrees to operate within the United States subject to the direction or control of a foreign government or official (Title 18, section 951 of the United States Code).

More:
http://www.counterpunch.org/sandels04262003.html

[fed_up_mother]

108. Maybe they were in prison for owning a computer

God only knows that a little more contact with the outside world might corrupt their little paradise. :(

Officially, some Cubans do travel, as in some Russians used to travel. If you were a trusted member of the party you had a little more freedom than the average joe.

[Mika]

130. Please post some links to Cubans being arrested merely for owning a computer.

Try telling your fantasy story about only trusted members of the party being allowed to travel to the families in Miami who host their relatives on a trip to Miami (and then they return to their home in Cuba).

You are just making shit up.

-

[Ken Burch]

48. The real Cubans would never want capitalism back.

Democratic socialism, yes. But never what all the Miami exiles want.

[EFerrari]

30. I hope Obama's presidency will be good for AMERICAN reform,

beginning with the release of the Cuban Five and the extradition of the terrorist Posada Carriles.

[Popol Vuh]

8. Here's a video link

Click Image To View:

[Judi Lynn]

9. Excellent opportunity for DU'ers to see an important film without buying it!

Estela Bravo an outstanding filmmaker.

This will be a real experience. Thank you.

[Popol Vuh]

17. Thanks Judi Lynn

:hi:

[lumpy]

115. Thanks JudiLynn

Your posts are always informative and interesting

[Judi Lynn]

120. lumpy, you are really generous. So glad if they help at all. I got my first ever information

on Cuba by studying a thread at CNN's old "US-Cuba Relations" message board when Elián Gonzalez was living in the madhouse in Miami while they attempted to keep him from returning to his father, 4 grandparents, cousins, aunts, uncles, half brother, step mother, neighbors, schoolmates and teachers, in short, everything he knew in the entire world.

We're all learning together now about a subject which has been FORBIDDEN to us to know about (except by propaganda!) in person.

[lumpy]

123. I watched the video in it's entirety . I have taken an interest

in Cuba US relations all these years since Castro liberated Cuba. I have lived with the hope all these years that the US would recognize Cuba for being a nation that has gained it's independence by the PEOPLE of that nation not only by Fidel Castro acting alone. As a leader, Fidel Castro is a rarity. He has lead Cuba for no other reason but for the benefit of it's citizens. Unfortunately, these days we cannot claim that selflessness in the leadership we have foolishly elected.
I think the Elian Gonzalez fiasco showed millions of US citizens that our government can do the right thing when people speak out against injustice.
The US must open up relations with Cuba before we lose complete faith in this country. The Cuban people must have the basic right to self determination much as they have for all these years.

[ronnie624]

13. A very interesting and revealing video. Thanks for posting.

The crowds that greeted Castro in Bolivia, Brazil, Chile, Paraguay and Venezuela make it clear that not everyone swallows the position of the U.S. government and corporate media monopolies.

91 minutes is a bit long for the attention spans of some who post here, however. It will no doubt be waved aside in favor of posting one-line bits of propaganda and insults to other posters.

[Popol Vuh]

20. Thanks Ronnie

I also liked the part where Nelson Mandela insisted upon his visiting South Africa and then the reception he received in South Africa. Its something I've never seen on CNN.

[lumpy]

116. Thanks for the video posting.

will be watching.

[AlphaCentauri]

23. good movie

I like the chronological order of events it follows, most propaganda we absorb ignores causes and effects.

[Popol Vuh]

28. Thanks AlphaCentauri

I wasn't sure how this video would be received. I was a bit unsure if I should post it.

:hi:

[lumpy]

125. Thank God you did post it. It is a document that every US

citizen should take the time to view. If Obama is to be our leader, I hope he doesn't follow the set Cuban policy all our past presidents have bowed to.

[EFerrari]

33. That's a great video.

:thumbsup:

[Popol Vuh]

34. Thanks sfexpat2000

I always enjoy your input..

:hi:

[EFerrari]

36. I just saw a really good one about the Cuban Five.

It's not up at their website. Maybe it's up somewhere, though. The film lays the issues out very clearly with interviews from lawyers and family members and an ex-CIA agent. Here's the program description:

http://www.linktv.org/programs/mission

:hi:

Here it is on YouTube!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=CCdGdpeNps8

[Popol Vuh]

42. Thanks again sfexpat2000

Watching the video now.


(Edit): People should see this video too.

[Judi Lynn]

44. This is great, I'm watching it, also. What a find. Thank you, so much. n/t

[AlphaCentauri]

76. interesting how the FBI used the Cuban information to trace the Cuban 5 in Miami

instead of finding the terrorist plotting bombs in Cuba. They just cover all up.

[Mika]

78. Posada & his ilk aren't terrorists. They work for US interests. That means they're freedom fighters.

At least that seems to be the opinion of the Bush policy lackeys posting here.


-

[Billy Burnett]

80. Hi Mika. I used to discuss Cuba on CNN's old message boards with similar lackeys.

Before September 2001 the same types of pro anti-Cuba terrorism/ pro US policy lackeys used to compare the US efforts to oust the Cuban government with the "valiant and noble" works of the Mujahadin and the Taliban and their ousting the commies from Afghanistan. No matter what reports of the Mujahadin and the Taliban terrorizing the population of Afghanistan, or the subjugation of women, or the destruction of schools, harboring Osama bin Laden, etc etc, they would continue insisting that getting rid of commies was worth any cost, and that the US supported terrorist and so called dissident movement in Cuba was very comparable.

Then came Sept 11 2001.

They became really quiet afterward. Nary a post of support of terrorists on the message boards. Now, it seems, they're back at it.


USA = angelic and all things good in the world
Anything hinting of socialism or communism = needs to be brutally destroyed by any means necessary



:hi:

[EFerrari]

97. And the Contras were just like our Founding Fathers

no matter how much it oost to hire them and no matter how many civilians they slaughtered.

Got it.

[EFerrari]

86. It is. And it shows you who was working aboveboard and who was not. n/t

[EFerrari]

56. Two more bits of information on the Damas en Blanco.

Cuba accuses U.S. envoy of ferrying cash from Miami to anti-Castro group
They say U.S. envoy ferried cash from anti-Castro group

By Ray Sánchez | Havana Bureau
May 20, 2008

HAVANA Cuban officials on Monday accused the top U.S. top diplomat in Havana of delivering private funds from a jailed Miami exile to a leading dissident on the island.

At a news conference, Cuban state security officials released a series of e-mails purporting to show that Michael Parmly, the outgoing head of the U.S. Interests Section in Havana, carried cash from Miami and delivered it to dissident Martha Beatriz Roque.

The money, about $1,500 a month, came from Santiago Alvarez, an anti-Castro militant serving a 30-month prison sentence on weapons possession charges. Alvarez also served 10 months for refusing to testify against reputed terrorist Luis Posada Carriles.

Alvarez's Miami-based exile group, Fundacion Rescate Juridico, also reportedly sent $200 a month to dissident Jorge Luis "Antunez" Garcia and $2,400 to Laura Pollan, a member of the Ladies in White dissident organization, Cuban officials said.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/caribbean/sfl-flauscuba0520sbmay20,0,3646161.story?track=rss

Dialing for Dollars in Cuba

By Machetera, Machetera. Posted May 24, 2008.

The U.S. government p.r. creation, the “Ladies in White,” (Damas de Blanco) takes money from right-wing terrorists.

There are so many things wrong with this story that it would be hard to know where to begin, so let’s start with Tuesday’s headline in El Nuevo Herald, the Spanish language fiefdom of the Miami Herald, which says “Dissident Cuban Woman Says Government Hounds but Doesn’t Allow a Defense.”

Now, aside from the striking fact that the Cuban woman in question, Martha Beatriz Roque, is given a free platform by a major U.S. daily from which to defend herself (and doesn’t) - something which is never offered those hounded by the United States government, Machetera’s going to take a wild guess here and say that if the Cuban government didn’t also invite her to appear on the Cuban political television program, Mesa Redonda (Round Table) where her grasping emails were unveiled, demanding payment for services rendered, it would have been to save her from being killed by the audience. Because Martha doesn’t just take money from anybody. She takes it from the ugliest people - Santiago Alvarez, the benefactor of Luis Posada Carriles, who blew up a Cuban passenger plane in 1976, killing all 73 people on board.

Alvarez, you’ll recall, spirited the aging terrorist Posada Carriles from Mexico to safe haven in the United States, aboard his vessel, the Santrina - a felony, incidentally, but one that has so far not been prosecuted since the government has been otherwise occupied slapping him on the wrist for his unusual weapons collection: “machine guns, rifles, C-4 explosive, dynamite, detonators, a grenade launcher and ammunition,” according to the Miami Herald.

(snip)

The p.r. geniuses who thought up the “Ladies in White” have counted on a short public attention span and a compliant press, but Hebe de Bonafini, a real mother from Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo was perfectly blunt about the insult in an interview with Salim Lamrani in 2005:

Lamrani: The Cuban authorities arrested and harshly sentenced various people to prison terms, which the international press calls “dissidents,” for having collaborated with the economic sanctions against Cuba and for receiving subsidies from the United States. The French press has often alluded to the “Ladies in White,” the family of these “dissidents,” who march in Havana to ask for the liberation of their family members. Several media have referred to these people as the “Cuban Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo.” What does Hebe de Bonafini, President of the Association of the Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo think?

De Bonafini: First, let me say that the Plaza de Mayo is in Argentina and nowhere else. Our white headscarf symbolizes life, while the women you speak about to me represent death. This is the most important and most substantial difference that should be noted by these journalists. We are not going to accept their being compared to us, or that our symbols be used to trample upon us. We are in complete disagreement with them.

More at link: http://www.alternet.org/audits/86309/?page=entire

Ay de mi.

[Judi Lynn]

59. The real "Lady in White" introduces an impressive tone of reality in this amazing article.

More from that priceless interview:

However, they are demanding the release of their family members. Doesn’t that seem legitimate?

These women defend United States terrorism. They defend the world’s foremost terrorist country, that with the most blood on its hands, that which launches the most bombs, that invades the most countries, that imposes the strongest economic sanctions against others. We are talking about a country that is responsible for the crimes of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

These women don’t realize that the struggle of the Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo symbolizes love for our abducted children, killed by tyrants imposed by the United States. Our battle represents the Revolution, the one that our sons and daughters wanted to make. Their struggle is different, since they defend the subversive policies of the United States that only contain oppression, repression and death.

What, according to you, are the interests being defended by the “Cuban dissidents?”

The interests of the United States, of course. You’d have to be blind or dishonest not to see it. You only have to read the reports published by the U.S. State Department, in which it is said that a $50 million budget is earmarked for the fabrication of an opposition in Cuba. The information is public, and it’s available. The dissidents themselves, as they are called, meet with Mr. James Cason {the U.S. representative preceding Michael Parmly in Havana} and are under his command. These dissidents have openly supported the maintenance of economic sanctions that so harm the Cuban people. Who, besides the United States, supports those economic sanctions? Tell me!

This is vital information, and I'm hanging on to this link for future reference.

You know, I've thought of the high nausea level generated by the prospect of seeing these clowns parading themselves around as the Ladies in White before now. It's just BLISS hearing how the real article lady feels about it, personally!



Marta Beatriz Roque, with _Bush's U.S. Interests
Section Head, James Cason, gazing upon his star from the doorway



Marta, staging another "Ladies in White" demonstration



Marta Beatriz Roque



Marta Beatriz Roque's (and Luis Posada Carriles') benefactor, terrorist Santiago Alvarez

As a side note, the real Ladies in White suffered during the U.S.-supported military coup first by having their children tortured and murdered by the junta, then, their infants stripped from them physically, in some cases by C-section, and handed
off to favored Argentinian officials and their wives, and finally, as targets in their own organization of the junta, which
sent infiltrators, like the Blond Angel of Death, officer Alfredo Astiz, who got into their meetings, their confidence, then
informed on them, getting some of the tortured and murdered, including two nuns from France.



Alfredo Astiz

[Mika]

61. Interesting that posters attack supporters of Cuban sovereignty...

... note that these same posters usually vouch for the veracity of US & US terrorist paid "dissidents", know almost nothing of the funding stream or operations of these "dissidents", know nothing about over a century of US intervention in Cuba, and know almost nothing about Cuba - but yet post wildly ignorant general disinformation supplied by the US government and anti Cuba Miamicuban exiles with ad hominem attacks added for an extra measure of degradation of discourse.

Their posts read like republicans, but less informed. ;)


-

[Zorro]

64. Well

We do know about Cuban military intervention in Africa in the 70s and 80s, which was an overtly provocative act of aggression.

Somehow the Castro apologists don't seem to find anything wrong with that, if they acknowledge it at all.

[Judi Lynn]

65. DU'ers have spent time learning about that. Oddly, your point of view was never represented here.

SECRET CUBAN DOCUMENTS ON HISTORY OF AFRICA INVOLVEMENT

National Security Archive Electronic Briefing Book No. 67
Edited by Peter Kornbluh

NEW BOOK based on Unprecedented Access to Cuban Records;
True Story of U.S.-Cuba Cold fear Clash in Angola presented in Conflicting Missions
Washington D.C.: The National Security Archive today posted a selection of secret Cuban government documents detailing Cuba's policy and involvement in Africa in the 1960s and 1970s. The records are a sample of dozens of internal reports, memorandum and communications obtained by Piero Gleijeses, a historian at the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies, for his new book, Conflicting Missions: Havana, Washington, and Africa, 1959-1976 (The University of North Carolina Press).

Peter Kornbluh, director of the Archive’s Cuba Documentation Project, called the publication of the documents “a significant step toward a fuller understanding Cuba’s place in the history of Africa and the Cold War,” and commended the Castro government’s decision to makes its long-secret archives accessible to scholars like Professor Gleijeses. “Cuba has been an important actor on the stage of foreign affairs,” he said. “Cuban documents are a missing link in fostering an understanding of numerous international episodes of the past.”

Conflicting Missions provides the first comprehensive history of the Cuba's role in Africa and settles a longstanding controversy over why and when Fidel Castro decided to intervene in Angola in 1975. The book definitively resolves two central questions regarding Cuba's policy motivations and its relationship to the Soviet Union when Castro astounded and outraged Washington by sending thousands of soldiers into the Angolan civil conflict. Based on Cuban, U.S. and South African documents and interviews, the book concludes that:

• Castro decided to send troops to Angola on November 4, 1975, in response to the South African invasion of that country, rather than vice versa as the Ford administration persistently claimed;
  
  
• The United States knew about South Africa's covert invasion plans, and collaborated militarily with its troops, contrary to what Secretary of State Henry Kissinger testified before Congress and wrote in his memoirs.
  
  
• Cuba made the decision to send troops without informing the Soviet Union and deployed them, contrary to what has been widely alleged, without any Soviet assistance for the first two months.

~snip~
Missions also argues that Secretary Kissinger's account of the US role in Angola, most recently repeated in the third volume of his memoirs, is misleading. Testifying before Congress in 1976, Kissinger stated "We had no foreknowledge of South Africa's intentions, and in no way cooperated militarily." In Years of Renewal Dr. Kissinger also denied that the United States and South Africa had collaborated in the Angolan conflict; Gleijeses' research strongly suggests that they did. The book quotes Kissinger aide Joseph Sisco conceding that the Ford administration "certainly did not discourage" South Africa's intervention, and presents evidence that the CIA helped the South Africans ferry arms to key battlefronts. The book also reproduces portions of a declassified memorandum of conversation between Kissinger and Chinese leader Teng Hsiao-p'ing which shows that Chinese officials raised concerns about South Africa's involvement in Angola in response to Ford and Kissinger's entreaties for Beijing's continuing support. The memcon quotes President Ford as telling the Chinese "we had nothing to do with the South African involvement." Drawing on the Cuban documents, the book challenges Kissinger's account in his memoirs about the arrival of Cubans in Angola. The first Cuban military advisers did not arrive in Angola until late August 1975, and the Cubans did not participate in the fighting until late October, after South Africa had invaded.

In assessing the motivations of Cuba's foreign policy, Cuba's relations with the Soviet Union, and the nature of the Communist threat in Africa, Gleijeses shows that CIA and INR intelligence reports were often sophisticated and insightful, unlike the decisions of the policymakers in Washington.

More:
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB67/

[EFerrari]

67. Our own Angola policy turned out about as well as Iraq is turning out.

From a good summary piece on Reagun's greatest hits:

"In the case of Angola, Reagan, in cooperation with South Africa's apartheid regime and Zaire's dictator Mobutu, helped to sponsor UNITA, Joseph Savimbi's rebel band, against the left-leaning MPLA, which also happened to have far stronger support from the Angolan people. Reagan hailed the power-hungry Savimbi as a "freedom fighter," and enlisted wealthy arch-conservatives like beer merchant Joseph Coors and Rite-Aid owner Lewis E.Lehrman to organize assistance and lobby Congress for millions in aid.

In fact Savimbi turned out to be one of the world's most lethal terrorists. Even after UNITA lost UN-supervised elections in September 1992, he continued the war, financing his operations by trafficking in "blood diamonds."

The resulting guerilla war cost the Angolan people up to 1 million dead, turned a quarter of Angola's 12 million people into refugees, and devastated health and education programs and the domestic economy. It also left an estimated 6 to 20,000,000 land mines scattered all across the country, one of the world's most heavily mined countries, with more than 80,000 amputees as a byproduct. Only with Savimbi was finally killed in May 2002 was the country finally restored to peace."

http://bloodbankers.typepad.com/recent_posts_and_pdfs/2004/06/061704the_reaga.html

[Judi Lynn]

70. Great info.! I'd like to add that Cuban "exile" Jorge Mas Canosa bonded with Savimbi,

raised money for Unita, etc.:

4/1/88 4/10/88 In the wake of successful lobbying efforts to secure $30 million in military aid to UNITA forces, Jorge Mas Canosa travels to Angola to meet with rebel leader Jonas Savimbi. He is accompanied by five directors of CANF, including Alberto Hernandez, Pepe Hernandez, Tony Costa, Jorge Rodriguez, and Feliciano Foyo. (MH, 3/26/88) They bring Savimbi tapes of Radio Marti to broadcast to Cuban troops fighting with the MPLA in Angola, which include encouragement for Cuban troops to defect. During their visit, the Foundation and UNITA sign a declaration of common cause, and CANF pledges financial and material support to UNITA. (MH, 4/6/88)

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:GDsUVLZcYHcJ:cuban-exile.com/doc_126-150/doc0146a.html+Jorge+Mas+Canosa+%2B+UNITA+%2B+Angola+%2B+Savimbi&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us

Jorge Mas also was crazy about D'Aubuisson, and the Contras, Pinochet, etc., and that figures, doesn't it?

Thanks for the link, it looks very interesting.

[EFerrari]

90. OMFG.

This slime is a US tax-funded global MAFIA.

[Zorro]

99. How about a little research about the Horn of Africa

I look forward to reading your excuses for Fidel's support of the butcher Mengistu Hailemariam.

[Mika]

72. You know almost nothing about Cuba...

.. so little that it would fit on the head of a very small pin, and there'd be room left over.

But yet you continue hectoring us with uninformed bullshit.


Please, tell us of your vast experience in Cuba that informs you so well. :eyes:

[Zorro]

75. So you're OK with Cuba putting troops on the ground in Africa

But vehemently disagree with US forces used to support US interests abroad.

Just like to pop in and point out the rampant hypocrisy of the pro-Castro stooges that seem to think their position is beyond reproach.

Call me ignorant? Typical lame response when you can't defend your position.

Don't like my comments? Tough shit.

Go read a comic book.

[Mika]

77. And your vast experience in Cuba is?

Not holding my breath for an answer from Bush policy foils.

[Zorro]

98. Can't say I've been there

I'm a law abiding US citizen.

You must have drunk some of that cement powder-laced milk there; US policy has been consistent for almost 50 years regarding Cuba; that's not exclusively Bush policy.

And there won't be any change until there are political and economic reforms in Cuba. The US doesn't need trade with Cuba, but Cuba's society could be improved with trade with the US.

But there's no reason for US policy to change if there's no reform. That's the way it is and the way it will remain until the Castro brothers bite the dust. And that's fine with me.

[Mika]

101. So, you are a Bush policy advocate.

Bush is in power now, he supports current Cuba policy - as do you. What more need be said about your position. You are a Bush Cuba policy supporter, have never set foot on the island, you know virtually nothing about Cuba, and presume to be an expert. Laughable, if it wasn't so tragic.

Always interesting to read from Bush policy supporters that Cuba must cow to American hegemony, that Cuba must "reform" economically (we all know that the political reform mewlings are complete bullshit as the US gov - Bush - and corporate America negotiates trade & trades with some of the most brutal murderous dictatorial regimes in the world). That is just exactly what Cubans overwhelmingly revolted against in 1958-59.

Interesting to read from Bush policy lackeys about how Cubans don't have rights to organize or speak freely. But when one considers the state of representation of the people's will, Cuba stacks up quite favorably in the world community - Cubans speak volumes with their abilities to create world class social infrastructure that treats all equally. Compare that to America where the vast majority of people seek very much the same kind of infrastructure but have a government that hasn't done so, has resisted almost every step of the way, and is in fact aggressively dismantling what infrastructure does exist.

Cuba has received international recognition as a leader in global millennial goals to feed and shelter all citizens (both of which are recognized as human rights in Cuba's constitution). Cuba has been recognized as a world leader in equal access to quality health care, and has been awarded many times for their educational programs and international literacy programs. Cuba is a world leader in organic farming that many nations are sending agronomists to study Cuba's transition to non petro reliance in farming and local farm development.

The Cuban government didn't do these things- the Cuban people did. These works by the Cuban people screams freedom of expression, of organizational freedom, of democratic representation and the powers of citizen controlled government. It falls on deaf American ears who insist on Cuba's "reform". Too late. The Cuban people rose up to re-form the country they wanted, and they have it. It moves forward every day.

Now, just who needs this political and economic "reform"?


-

[Judi Lynn]

102. I would trust someone who has made many trips there, who has lived and worked there

for various lengths of times, on multiple occassions, in various capacities, who has close loved ones there now to have some basic clue about his subject when he discusses Cuba!

Thanks for taking the time to cover this material. It really needed to be said.

[Zorro]

107. Oh yeah it's a worker's paradise of freedom and democracy

When are you and the rest of the cell moving there permanently?

Sounds like it's just the place for you and the herd. What's stopping you?

I'm actually glad to hear they're making it on their own. No need to drop that trade embargo, then. Thanks for the info.

[Mika]

128. A post that is perfect example..

.. of someone who knows nothing about Cuba nor US/Cuba relations, but yet joins-in the Cuba threads only to make absurd accusations and comments. A DU spammer.

IOW, a Bush policy supporter.


-

[Zorro]

139. Guess my man Obama is a Bush policy supporter, too

Wouldn't you say?

And what absurd accusations and comments you talking about?

A DU spammer? That's quite a bold statement, considering the number of posts you and the rest of the unemployed loudmouths put up in this thread and others.

If you don't like what I have to say, well you're just going to have to lump it. This isn't Cuba.

[EFerrari]

142. Your man Obama might rethink why he's pandering to the same people

who have funded terrorism in Havana and in Miami. Who have been implicated in the assasinations of both JFK and RFK by the Church committee and by the House Select Committee on Assassinations.

Yes, Obama's positions are 'way too close to Bush's, especially when he welcomed the Kennedy family's endorsements.

[EFerrari]

141. No kidding. n/t

[EFerrari]

105. Cuba doesn't need to "reform" politically or economically.

In other words, she doesn't need to sell out to American corporate interests. The lefty governments in Latin America are developing a sturdy network with Cuba and most of the rest of the world is on Cuba's side against this obviously retributive US policy.

We're facing the well earned consequence of becoming superfluous. I hope that's fine with you, too.

[Zorro]

112. You've convinced me there's no need to reform

What a wonderful place.

That must be the reason why I see all those reports about the masses of people struggling to emigrate there.

When are ya moving there? Sounds like just the right place for you.

[EFerrari]

113. I keep wondering if you're lost or what. n/t

[Zorro]

117. I'm not lost, but do you need directions to Cuba?

Try going to Key West and swimming 90 miles south.

[EFerrari]

140. I've a pretty good grip on all kinds of geography, thanks. n/t

[lumpy]

129. The US needs political and economic reforms right here at

home before we can become the reformers we pretend to be. It is obvious that the US only acts in it's own interests. Every position and act the US government has take regarding other countries has resulted in disaster for the people of those countries. I cannot name one country who has benefited from our involvment in their internal affairs. The only way we can be number one is to draw in our horns and stop policing the world in the name of democracy or freedom. The best teaching is by example and that is not by the barrel of a gun or not-so-subtle surreptitious means.

[EFerrari]

88. Castro went in to support Angola against South Africa

and Zaire, who were killing their people with the cooperation of your government.

Are you even reading this thread?

[lumpy]

133. You said it. " .....with US forces used to support US interests

abroad." That's always what it's all about isn't it? US interests. And just what are those interests?, something that will benefit the US 'economy'. Not an interest in the wellfare of the people of those countries.

[High Plains]

85. I acknowledge it and salute the Cubans for stopping the apartheid armies.

Battle of Cuito Cuanevale. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cuito_Cuanavale

So, defeating the South African apartheid regime and the UNITA CIA pupppets was a bad thing?

[darue]

57. CUBA is not an enemy. if it is, it's only because we've MADE them be

how would any country in the world react to a rich outside power trying to overthrow their government? The "political prisoners" are people caught conspiring with a foreign power to overthrow the government, what would we do with such people?

[eallen]

62. And you know that because they have been tried and found guilty?

In open court? Tell us what procedural rights they had? Tell us how fair the trials were?

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

63. You're not making your case. n/t

[darue]

82. ...

[darue]

83. when you start boycotting China I'll give a shit - until then it's just bullying hypocrisy n/t

[eallen]

91. I don't favor the embargo. And I think we SHOULD condemn China on human rights.

I'm a civil libertarian. I want to see the Bush administration investigated for war crimes. I want this nation to return to the fold of civilized nations. And I think we should condemn the lack of civil liberties in places like China, Saudi Arabia, and -- yes -- Cuba. I don't see anything at all inconsistent in those views.

The embargo doesn't make much sense to me. Why would you think I support it?

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

92. The inconsistency is your double standard.

The world has been privy to our shameful treatment of detainees. ETA: And that's on top of what the world has tried to overlook, before this latest perversion.

You have nothing on Cuba but the word of paid shills. And yet, you feel fine about climbing onto your hobby horse.

News for you: those little brown people south of the now US border have been the most progressive on the continent until the US was armed enough to stop democracy in its tracks at the convenience of business interests.

Any talk about "democratizing" Latin America is laughable coming from an American when America has done its best for hundreds of years to stop democracy and keep those resources and workers in check.

[eallen]

94. I'm not the one who is willing to overlook the lack of procedural rights.

My standard here is quite consistent. I condemn the same abuses, whether they occur in the US or abroad. I don't take the "war on terror" as an excuse. Nor maintenance of the revolution. Civil liberty is prerequisite to democracy, in any meaningful sense, not something that can wait.

:hippie:

[EFerrari]

95. You haven't established that there was any lack at all.

What you have posted is hot air.

Maybe you could establish that human rights were violated and build from there. Can you?

[ronnie624]

100. It's worse than laughable.

For America as a nation to condemn other countries for human rights violations, must be a form of collective psychopathology. At this very moment, we have an occupying army in Iraq. Justification for the invasion was based entirely on lies. Ninety percent of the earth's population has condemned it as immoral, and the overwhelming majority of legal scholars in the world have labeled it a violation of international law. Two of the most prestigious research centers in the world have concluded that it has resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, mostly women and children. And this is after a century of atrocities that few other nations can match, including the toppling of other governments, the instigation and financing of proxy wars, the carpet bombing of cities and the almost complete destruction of another nation (Viet Nam) as a cultural entity.

Yet Americans have little interest in anything beyond consuming and watching garbage on television. Even those who should know better, such as certain individuals who frequent DU, and thus have ready access to good information, feel compelled to point fingers at others instead of engaging in even a small amount of self examination.

It's collective insanity, I tell ya.

[darue]

93. I think the practice of singling countries out for tongue lashings has never worked

we need to commit to the UN charter on human rights, add FOOD to it (which the US alone vetoed) and pursue the goals of better standards of living for all in all countries, through an international framework and standards process, rather than picking on the easy targets.

Also, I don't know for a fact that cuba's hasn't given these prisoners "fair trials", the ones saying they didn't are proven lairs and terrorist supporters that fled cuba when they realized their elite position was gone. They want 'freedom' to go back to treating their nations poor like virtual slaves, and open up a bunch or Mob run casinos all over the place? Batista was a major league shit head, and I don't see Castro as having been any worse, and probably better.

glad to see you also do oppose the embargo. I'm just on hair trigger against any momentum toward enabling bush to do anything to anyone in Latin America, I think they're doing fine and don't need lectured by the Torture Nation. We've got A LOT of cleaning up to do here at home.

[EFerrari]

96. There are more human rights violations in Cook County, IL

than in Havana.

With that speech, Obama disappointed a lot of people who were looking to him for real change.

[Judi Lynn]

60. The Buying of "Democracy" Agents in Cuba

Weekend Edition
May 24 / 25, 2008
The Politics of Unequal Exchange

The Buying of "Democracy" Agents in Cuba
By NELSON P. VALDÉS


"The populace may hiss me, but when I go home and think of my money, I applaud myself. "

Horace (c. 25 BC)

"Unequal exchange, as practiced by the conquerors with the natives purchasing gold with mirrors, marbles and European trinkets, must cease."

Fidel Castro, 1998

In fiscal year 2008-2009 the United States government has budgeted $45,000,000 to finance the opposition against the revolutionary government in Cuba. The money is used to fund rightwing exile organizations, eastern European rightwing politicians involved with Cuba and money oriented "civil society" promoters. Some of the money ends up in Cuba. The details of such counterrevolutionary program is little known by the world. The Cubans within the island who receive the so-called "assistance" claim to be involved in promoting "civil society" and "democracy." They maintain that what they are doing is not subversive. The official line from the United States government is that the money it supplies has a humanitarian intent. The recipients, however, are agents of a foreign power if we follow US law definitions. <1> It is unknown how much money the United States government is really spending to bring an end to the revolutionary government in Havana. <2>

The videos, photos, documents and phone conversation logs transmitted over the Mesa Redonda TV program in Havana during three consecutive days (May 19, 20, 21) disclosed some of the mechanisms used to provide money payments to dissidents via Marta Beatriz Roque, a sort of dissident paymaster/accountant in Havana. She describes herself in her emails to rightwing exiles and US officials, as Tia McPato (as in the Disney character - Aunt Scrooge McDuck. )

The money provided to the "dissidents" seem to be mere peanuts, when compared to the total amount of money appropriated by the US Congress. Indeed, it is obvious, that the "dissidents" provide the "cover" for the real entrepreneurs in Florida to enrich themselves. One can very well assume that if the US AID grants a lump sum of, say, $5 million to a Miami "democracy promotion organization" and then the organization puts the money in a bank to get yearly earnings - the earnings might be sufficient to finance the "dissidents". Miami, of course, will keep the lion's share of the grant. And the "grant" will be renewed the following years. Both Republicans and Democrats in the Congress approve of a "foreign aid" that ends up in Coral Gables and the Florida keys.

In a sense, the "dissidents" in the island face all the political and economic costs but receive very little of the financial benefits - when compared to exile “donors.” Granted, a monthly payment of $200-1,500 US dollars is certainly 100 times what the average Cuban earns. Yet, the island "dissidents" thank the exile "donors" abroad when in fact; the exile entrepreneurs should be thanking the "dissidents." Or, to put it differently, the "dissidents" are the proletarians while the Miami hustlers are the bourgeois employers.

More:
http://www.counterpunch.org/valdes05242008.html

[fascisthunter]

84. Wow....

[Judi Lynn]

104. Cuba: Shunned by the world no more, official says

South Florida Sun-Sentinel.com
Cuba: Shunned by the world no more, official says
Ray Sanchez

Direct from Havana

7:29 AM EDT, May 28, 2008

HAVANA

Cuba's Foreign Minister Felipe Perez Roque said the communist island was overcoming U.S. efforts to isolate it, the state press reported Wednesday.

Perez Roque told the National Assembly's international relations commission that Cuba maintained diplomatic relations with 30 of the 32 countries in Latin American and the Caribbean. Worldwide, Cuba had relations with 186 countries, and served as a leader of the Non-Aligned Movement.

"There was a time, 40 years back, when only Mexico had relations with Cuba," Perez Roque said.

Opposition to the nearly 50-year-old U.S. economic embargo against Cuba was "practicially universal," Perez Roque said, adding that 184 nations publicly opposed the measure in 2007.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/cuba/sfl-0528havanadaily,0,4732847,print.column

[Popol Vuh]

144. I think this thread could use a little musica

Click Image:



Same song, different artist.

Click Image: