Soldier mom plans to report for duty with kids

[kpete]

Source: MSNBC

Soldier mom plans to report for duty with kids
N.C. woman settles on alternative to leaving family behind, refusing orders
updated 12:22 p.m. PT, Sat., Feb. 28, 2009

DAVIDSON, N.C. - When Lisa Pagan reports for duty Sunday, four long years after she was honorably discharged from the Army, she will arrive with more than her old uniform. She is bringing her kids, too.

"I have to bring them with me," she said. "I don't have a choice."

Pagan is among thousands of former service members who have left active duty since the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, only to later receive orders to return to service. They are not in training, they are not getting a Defense Department salary, but as long as they have time left on their original enlistment contracts, they are on "individual ready reserve" status — eligible to be recalled at any time.
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Soldiers can appeal, and some have won permission to remain in civilian life. Pagan filed several appeals, arguing that because her husband travels for business, no one else can take care of her kids. All were rejected, leaving Pagan with what she says is a choice between deploying to Iraq and abandoning her family, or refusing her orders and potentially facing charges.

Then she hit on the idea of showing up Sunday at Fort Benning, Georgia, with her children in tow.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29441874/

[Cirque du So-What]

1. This will end badly, I'm afraid

One way or another, Ms. Pagan will be separated from her children when she reports for duty. If any good comes of this, it will spark discussion of whether stop-gap measures are worth the cost in human terms (of course it's NOT worth it, but try to convince the Pentagon of that).

[Tumbulu]

2. Such strong family values, huh?

The military thinks there is nothing to raising children. Nothing at all. Sick.

[shadowknows69]

11. And yet they'll punish "adulterers"

But think nothin of the ramifications of breaking families up for 15 months for every six months at home.

[midnight]

3. I'm rooting for this mom and hope that someone will step in and

let this woman finish her job as mom.

[Bunkie0913]

4. Brilliant!

Damn, she deserves 4 stars!

[kestrel91316]

5. I had a top notch, indispensible key employee a few years ago who

narrowly missed being called back to active duty in the Navy right after Bush started the Iraq War. She was VERY relieved not to have to do his bidding in what she saw as a very ill-conceived military boondoggle. I remember she was sweating buckets waiting for the clock to wind down on her ready reserve status.

[SheilaT]

6. I see at least two issues here.

One is that perhaps the entire Ready Reserve system is a bad idea. It seems as though once active duty soldiers are separated from the military, they really seem to think their obligation is over. That's apparently not true.

The other is that the soldiers themselves need to have a clearer understanding of their potential future obligation to serve.

Certainly, there needs to be some reasonable middle ground here.

Meanwhile, good for her for taking her kids along. I hope I find out what eventually happens in this case.

[struggle4progress]

7. Abstractly, it's really not a bad idea: it means that in a real war emergency,

the country could quickly mobilize some folk who already know the ropes. On the other hand, such a call up should really depend on a declaration of war

[Catch22Dem]

15. You're right

Their obligation is not complete after 4 years. I can't speak for anyone else, but the IRR was CLEARLY explained to me when I enlisted. I spent 8 years on active duty, so IRR ended up not applying to me anyway, but I knew what it was and what it meant.

Joining the military is a huge decision, and not one to be taken lightly. Certainly not one a person should enter into without understanding what they're doing.

[mrbarber]

8. Here's a thought....

STOP ENLISTING IN THE MILITARY.

It boggles my mind how many people willingly throw away their lives for America's imperialistic plans.

[alittlelark]

9. It is a 'poverty draft'.... many see no other option.

They are undereducated and living in economically depressed communities.

[davidinalameda]

10. when people still have no other options

for employment, money for college, etc, the military looks pretty good

[Catch22Dem]

14. I would reword it

And say, stop joining the military without understanding what you're getting into. This individual ready reserve commitment is not new. If you serve four years, you still have four more or IRR. Every military member should know this.

I spent 8 years in the Air Force in the 90s. Do you really think I did it for the sake of "America's imperialistic plans"?

[Karenina]

16. Why you did it and what you were used for

are entirely separate issues.

[Catch22Dem]

25. It's kinda funny you think that

But whatever

[Karenina]

30. Not funny at all...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x429511

[CRK7376]

12. She's going to lose this fight.

She signed a contract, may not like the terms of it now, but still it's the law and she does have a husband. It will be hard for this family, and husband will have to tell his employer that he is not able to travel on business as easily now. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

[Tempest]

19. I'll bet you she wins

If she shows up with her kids, you can bet the media will be with her and the military will back down.

[rainbow4321]

22. Then that opens them up to other troops showing up with their kids

if it gets her off the hook.
This may backfire on her if she uses the kids as (crying) pawns for the cameras.

[Tempest]

24. Calling up IRR's for active duty should have stopped the second Obama took office

I'm betting this changes the policy.

[WriteDown]

26. I'll take that bet....

I've got to wonder, if a woman has a job that requires extensive travel, but then has a child, should she be able to change her job duties? Of course not.

[Tempest]

29. We're about to find out

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3763012

And your analogy is off the mark.

Her job isn't the military on active duty. That would be a completely different situation.

[Karenina]

33. You know what GALLS me, Tempest

is all this "they signed the contract" bullshit. The MIC has been absolutely derelict in THEIR END OF THE BARGAIN.

[Tempest]

31. I win, pay up

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3764025

[marshall]

13. Does she plan on stashing them in her luggage?

She needs to recognize the reality of the obligation she signed up for. The husband can change his job, or she can get extended family to take care of the children. Or she can go ahead of time and try to negotiate a state-side assignment where she can have her children with her on base. There are many options other than putting her children through the trauma of what she is planning. Has she really thought out what she will do if they say "Fine, ut the kids in the back, we'll find something for them to do in Afghanistan."

[alarimer]

17. It sounds like the husband is being the real asshole here.

He needs to step up and take care of his kids. She has an obligation (I doubt she will win) and I don't really like it either but they can throw her in jail. Better for the husband to do his part and let her finish out her obligation without having to worry about the kids.

[angrycarpenter]

18. It happened to my uncle and he had been out for 17 years.

Apparently Rangers can always be called back. He just got back from his tour and they are going to let him out in April.

[Igel]

20. "I don't have a choice"

She's absolutely correct.

Only women can raise kids, and if they have a job that takes them out of the home without having some surrogate live-in caregiver, they're shirking their biological duty. Men, friends, relatives--unless they're grandmothers--are simply unable to do so.

Oh, wait. What website is this?

My bad.

The man can find different work--it may take a while, but isn't it nice that we'll soon have legislation saying that if you quit work to take care of dependents you'll be able to get unemployment benefits. It may force them to alter their lifestyle, for a while, but her lifestyle's about to be altered. (On the plus side, he'll have her military pay, won't he?)

[rainbow4321]

21. Why put the kids thru that?

So she is taking them to the base and says "guess they will have to call the highest in command on the base".

OK. Then what? Is her husband tagging along so when the commander says "too bad, the kids need to leave" she can hand her kids over or is she going there just with the kids and the base staff get to look after the devastated kids until their father gets there? Tellme she is not trying to cause a scene for the cameras by having the kids crying and screaming?
Would it not be better to have the kids in the comfort of their own home when they have to say goodbye?

[rd_kent]

23. As a retired Navy guy, the whole Individual Ready Reserve is horseshit, but...

It is FULLY explained upon your first enlistment. You are told several times, AND you sign several papers showing that you acknowledge your IRR responsibility.
As a disclaimer, I personally do not agree with the policy, but it is and has been, law for a long time. What it boils down to, is that when you join the military, you are on the hook for 8 years, regardless of how many years you signed up for. For example, if you enlist for a 4 year hitch, you still have 4 more years on the IRR. Sign up for 2 years, you are on IRR for 6 years. There is no IRR obligation after 8 years, even if you continue to serve past the first 8 years.
In the case of this woman, it sucks for her, BUT she did enter into an agreement and she was called to fulfill her contract. Also, everyone is required to have a "family care plan" in place for if/when you have to go on deployment, and that same plan is supposed to cover your entire obligation to the military. She probably did her time, then ASSUMED she would not get called up. As much as the situation sucks, she is to blame (ultimately) for not having a contingency plan for something she agreed to be bound to.

Further disclaimer---- I posted this as both my opinion and as FACT of the situation. I am not looking/asking for debate on whether the policy is right or wrong, Im just explaining how it is.

[IndianaGreen]

27. UPDATE (2 hours ago): NC military mom heads for Fort Benning with kids

NC military mom heads for Fort Benning with kids

By TOM FOREMAN Jr. – 2 hours ago

DAVIDSON, N.C. (AP) — A North Carolina woman who was recalled to the Army four years after being honorably discharged was driving nearly 400 miles and braving a Southeastern winter storm to report for duty Sunday, with her children by her side.

Lisa Pagan was en route to Fort Benning, despite the snow, and said in a phone interview she hoped to reach the Georgia post by early evening.

"I know I'm on my way doing what I need to do," Pagan said. "But I'm a little nervous."

Pagan said she wasn't expected at Fort Benning at a specific time, other than to get there by the end of the day. She said road conditions weren't too bad, but the weather had slowed her down.

Pagan is among thousands of former service members who have left active duty since the Sept. 11 attacks, only to be recalled to service. She filed several appeals, arguing that because her husband travels for business, no one else can take care of her kids. All were rejected, leaving Pagan to choose between deploying to Iraq and abandoning her family, or refusing her orders and potentially facing charges.

Master Sgt. Keith O'Donnell, an Army spokesman in St. Louis, said earlier that the commander at Fort Benning will decide how to handle the situation.

"The Army tries to look at the whole picture and they definitely don't want to do anything that jeopardizes the family or jeopardizes the children," O'Donnell said. "At the same time, these are individuals who made obligations and commitments to the country."

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ihu3Wdjr7sGD-gcS2OY0Gx7UX-swD96LHEPO0

[WriteDown]

28. Doesn't sound like her husband is with her....

Maybe her kids can do odd jobs around the base while she's gone. Peel potatoes, shine shoes, etc.

[Tempest]

32. The military is discharging her

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3764025