Tensions with China? (five Chinese ships shadowed a U.S. Navy surveillance ship)

[sabra]

Source: MSNBC

From NBC’s Jim Miklaszewski and Courtney Kube
A senior defense official confirms that five Chinese ships "aggressively maneuvered" and shadowed a U.S. Navy surveillance ship yesterday.

The Chinese vessels moved into "dangerous proximity" to the USNS Impeccable, "in an apparent coordinated effort to harass the U.S. ocean surveillance ship," which was operating on a routine mission in international waters, the senior defense official says.

A written statement from the U.S. Defense Department says the Chinese vessels surrounded the USNS Impeccable, and that two of them closed in to within 50 feet and began waving Chinese flags and telling the U.S. ship to leave the area.

Unaware of the Chinese ships' intentions, the USNS Impeccable sprayed its fire hoses at one of the vessels to defend itself. Chinese crewmembers "disrobed" to their underwear, and continued to move closer, coming within 25 feet of the USNS Impeccable, officials said.

Read more: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/03/09/1828612.aspx

[BobRossi]

1. Nuke em!

Poof! No more debt!

[TheCoxwain]

2. Thank God you are not the POTUS

[David_NSU]

3. Ha, we shouldve done more than spraying water

tho, its ridiculous the way these things play out.

[Zhade]

25. Are you fucking crazy? Do you WANT a war with China?

NT!

[olddad56]

32. Nuke you

Poof, no more idiot

[Democrats_win]

4. Isn't the purpose of the USN to protect freedom of the seas?

If they can't even defend themselves, what good are they? I'm not saying we should be shooting, but what the Chinese "pirates" are doing is illegal. No ship at sea like this should be harrased by anyone.

Hey, lets deploy the U.S.S. George Bush...you know, to prove our ineptness.

[hack89]

23. This is an unarmed, civilian manned ship

I don't think this is something to get too worked up about - the entire world will try to test a President many think is weak. Once they figure out that he is not, things will calm down.

[Thothmes]

35. This was a USNS ship, it is not armed.

[B Whale]

43. What gives the USN the rights to protecting

the freedom of the seas? Who gave them that job? Do you mean protect American interests in the seas?

International waters are international waters, not the US paddling pool.

There's a lot of funny things go on at sea and i wouldn't trust any version of events. I wouldn't trust what the USN says or what the Chinese say

[TwilightGardener]

5. WTF?

[mbperrin]

6. OK, so did the USN understand or not? The article says they

couldn't understand, and that they also radioed to say they were complying.

And the bully Chinese dropped pieces of wood - wood - in front of the ship.

And then the USN sprayed firehoses.

Big deal.

Sounds like a coupla frats to me.

[TheMightyFavog]

7. You should have seen the Fark thread on this...

They seemed to be amused about the bit with the Chinese sailors stripping down to their underwear, and the usual Navy jokes followed.

[cloudbase]

8. These ships are civilian manned.

They have no permanently installed weaponry, but do carry a naval detachment equipped with small arms, which wouldn't do squat against a patrol boat. They are there to delay any boarding to buy time to destroy classified information. Absent a presence by a naval combat vessel or air support, the ship is essentially there for the taking. What is going on is all part of the game, though the Chinese seemed to have stretched the rules a bit here.

The ships are engaged in what is termed 'non-scientific' research. You can probably figure that one out.

How do I know? I spent some time over there on the USNS Bowditch several months ago.

[ConcernedCanuk]

9. I think China's and Russia's increased military visibility is trying to tell the USA something

.
.
.

GO HOME!

I'm pretty sure that the USA's invasions in the Middle East were the last straw.

Russia and China ain't gonna put up with too much more of the USA's aggression.

But somehow, I suspect the USA will continue it's belligerent attitude and push for global war.

President Obama does not run the USA, the Military does - -

it's been that way since, and probably BEFORE, JFK

Who do ya think killed JFK?

He wanted PEACE

sumthing to ponder . . .

[hack89]

19. Russia is a paper tiger

it is a shadow of its former might with aging equipment and demoralized troops.

China has a decent military but is still unable to project power too far from shore.

I think China is simply testing a president they perceive as weak.

[Arctic Dave]

31. Paper tigers still have sharp claws.

Many years ago when I was in the Gulf, our esteemed Captain thought it would be a hoot to sail right down the middle of of the Russian Battle Group while they were anchored. I thought I was going to get raditation sickness from the amount of feedback we were getting.

God Damn, I hate that idiots guts to this day.

[hack89]

34. We once did the same in the Med

had the same feeling about that CO too.

[Dirk_H]

33. Chinas weapon is money

China doesn't need military power to scare the US to death.
With more than two trillion dollar holdings and being the major financier of US deficits, it could destroy the USD and the US economy with a simple stroke of a feather.

[TheLastMohican]

38. Russia is not a paper tiger

In the matters of life and death, russians are the best to kick arse.

Remember the Georgian war, US didn't do a thing and wouldn't because Russia is no Iraq and no sane leader, even Bush would risk a direct confrontation with world's premier nuclear force.

[Pavulon]

39. Janes took notice of the equipment used and aircraft destroyed

including TU class. Russia's military is in decline.

[hack89]

40. The Russian army is stilled stuck in the Cold War

Georgia made it very clear they have not kept up with western armies when it comes to technology and modernization. A single division with ancient tanks, no UAVs, no precision guided bombs, no modern C4I. They would have had their asses handed to them by a US division.

Don't forget - the Russian military was starved for funds for almost 15 years. They buy very few modern weapons annually. Their Navy is rusting at the piers, it takes 10 years to build a single nuclear submarine, and they are building nothing bigger than a corvette.

You are right that America would not risk war with Russia over Georgia - it was not worth it. But the fact remains that nuclear weapons is the only reason that Russia can still be considered a military superpower. And even then, they are definitely not the world's premier nuclear power. Look no further than the problems they are having with their new SLBM. The US Trident missile, on the other hand, has had nearly a hundred perfect test launches.

[B Whale]

44. I think they're slightly more capable than you make out

They have submarines operating under the arctic, a huge (admittedly less well equipped) army and aircraft and missiles with vast ranges.

They have recently been playing fun games over the North Sea and North Atlantic with the RAF. Flying long range bombers into British Airspace and having fighters scrambled after them.

They are not what they were but are still the most powerful forces after the US and they use it as well as can be seen in Georgia. Beligerent sunofabitches as well

[hack89]

46. No they are not

they are at least a generation, if not more, behind the US and other NATO countries. The revolution in western military technology truly is revolutionary - and Russia is left far behind. They could have never pulled off the 2003 invasion of Iraq with only 3 division for example.


Submarines under the ice is no big deal - what is important is that what few subs that can actually go to sea never venture far from home. It has been a very long time since the Russian navy had the ability to project power far from home.

Flying ancient propeller driven bombers is not only unimpressive but no big deal. It is a cheap way to say "look at me".

[B Whale]

48. I couldn't name any country other than the US

that has a more scary armed forces

[ohio2007]

49. Russian navy pollutes the oceans when deployed and their army pillaged and plundered its way

through Georgia. What that Russian heavy cruiser/aircraft carrier did off the Irish coast last month was proof they lack commitment and discipline.....
unpaid conscripts doesn't an elite fighting force make.

jmo

[JJ]

10. China testing Obama

Remember the US plane that was forced down in China, and held for a while when Bush first took office?

[Xithras]

14. Yes, but it sounds like the ships captain was smart enough to avoid an international incident.

You'll recall that their test with Bush involved their pilots harassing a USN aircraft in international airspace. One buzz cut a little too close, and the Chinese pilot was killed. The Chinese demanded, and got, an apology from Bush over an incident they provoked (international waters are, by treaty, international...one nation may not like what others do in them, but that doesn't give them a right to intercede).

It sounds like the Chinese may have been trying to provoke a ship collision, which probably would have also been followed by a demand for an apology. The ships captain, with his quick-thinking full-stop, may have just saved Obama from a confrontational and potentially embarrassing situation.

[gratuitous]

11. China testing the new president again?

Remember when they brought down one of our spy planes early in Bush's presidency? Bush huffed and puffed about it, but eventually, he had to turn to our good friends the Russians to intervene to return the crew from their captivity by our good friends the Chinese. Then the Russians got the spy plane back in teeny, tiny pieces from the Chinese and shipped it back to us. But I'm sure neither of them peeked at all our most sophisticated surveillance equipment and stuff.

Anyone remember that?

[enuegii]

12. And Bush called the crew "heroes"

for failing to do their job and destroy sensitive equipment.
Heck of a job!

[gratuitous]

13. You think Al Qaeda was watching and taking notes?

Deciding whether or not the Bush gang had what it took to stop them or respond effectively? And what conclusion did they reach about Bush's abilities? Was he an ineffectual blowhard in far over his head, or a steely-eyed commander-in-chief not to be messed with?

[IrishBuckeye]

27. In fairness, how should of the U.S. reacted?

Honestly, what type of response did you expect back in 2001?

[maxrandb]

15. Firehoses and Underwear??!!!

That's a rather dangerous game of "Whose Penis is Bigger"

Oh well.

[AngryAmish]

16. What did Joe Biden say about an international test?

[olddad56]

17. Waht, the chinese don't like our balant spying on then.

But we would be cool with them being 40 miles off of our coast. Better be because they are are. This stuff has been going on since the end of WW2.

[Pavulon]

18. Or working at sandia, los alamos, and the massive industrial

espionage they pull off all the time. This is normal, all countries spy.

[DavidDvorkin]

20. China is asserting its sphere of influence

at sea.

[ohio2007]

22. Don't they have a problem with Japan over sovereignty of a few rocks and shoals in that area?

gas and oil rights are in dispute somewhere in the China sea

[ohio2007]

21. USNS Impeccable, interesting looking research vessel

Looks like it could raise a sunken submarine if need be.

In this photo released by the U.S. Navy, the military Sealift Command ocean surveillance ship USNS Impeccable is seen underway on Monday, March 9, 2009
Mission
The mission of Impeccable is to directly support the Navy by using SURTASS passive and active low frequency sonar arrays to detect and track undersea threats.


Design
The ship is a designated a T-AGOS vessel built to tow Surveillance Towed Array Sensor System. The SWATH design prevents the vessel from rolling in heavy seas and gives additional deck space for storing the acoustic equipment.<3>


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USNS_Impeccable_(T-AGOS-23)

Must have been sniffing in an interesting area to get such a greeting.

[hack89]

24. I bet there was a Chinese exercise in the area

and she was there to monitor submarine activity.

[Arctic Dave]

30. Hammer, meet nail head.

[ohio2007]

41. Officials: US ship in China spat was hunting subs (video )

WASHINGTON – The U.S. Navy ship that got into a scrape with five Chinese vessels last weekend in the South China Sea was looking for threats such as submarines — presumably Chinese — in waters that China claims as its own, defense officials acknowledged Tuesday.

snip

The ship is operated by a civilian crew under Navy supervision. It is not a warship or, strictly speaking, a spy ship. Its work is part of a largely unseen cat and mouse game in which the United States tracks foreign submarines on the open seas.

In this case, the sub-hunting took place in a disputed band of water far off the Chinese coastline but within what Beijing considers a 200-mile economic zone under its control. The zone, under international law, gives a state certain rights over the use of natural resources there. That clashes with one of the cardinal principles of America's doctrine of ocean navigation — the right to unrestricted passage in international waters as long as vessels are not encroaching on the economic interests of the country they pass.

"It is our view that we were operating in international waters," State Department spokesman Robert Wood said Tuesday.

snip


U.S. defense officials had said the Chinese boats veered so close to the Impeccable that the U.S. civilian crew had to spray one Chinese vessel with a high-pressure stream of water. Stripped to their drenched underwear, the Chinese crew came within 25 feet. When the Impeccable tried to withdraw, U.S. officials said, Chinese boats veered in its path and dropped debris in the water.



http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090310/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_china_incident

[IrishBuckeye]

26. China did the same thing to Bush back in April 2001

In 2001, just Bush's 3rd month in office, a U.S. spy plan was grazed by a Chinese aircraft fighter (which crashed) causing the U.S. spy plane to perform an emergency land on Chinese soil sparking off a major row for the new President. I have no doubt these incidents were designed by China to test the new President and gage their reactions.

[goforit]

28. They MOONED us????? I'm sure GW Bush got a kick out of it!!!

[FudaFuda]

29. Just a distraction. Something to keep cable news busy on something besides the economy.

China and the United States need each other so badly right now to repair the world economy, there's no way they would engage in a military fracas. China might take advantage of the current situation for a bit of puffing up their perceived military strength so they can insinuate themselves more into the picture in the near future, but consider how many trillions of dollars the Chinese would forfeit if we had a war with them right now.

This is smoke and mirrors.

[Blandocyte]

36. Probably a Chinese repo sqaud

Maybe unfettered access to our WalMarts for their products isn't enough "interest" on the loans they gave us anymore?

[ohio2007]

37. US Surges Half Of Its Pacific ( ballistic missile defense ) Aegis Fleet To Korean Coast

As North Korea threatens to declare war if we intercept their upcoming ballistic missile launch, nearly half of our BMD-ready Aegis ships in the Pacific are now on station in the Sea of Japan, according to a South Korean newspaper:



Seoul Snubs NK Warning Against ‘Satellite’ Interception
In a move to strengthen its missile defense against North Korean missile threats, the U.S. Navy has deployed more warships equipped with the Aegis Combat System for this year's Key Resolve/Foal Eagle joint military exercises with South Korean forces than it did before, according to a news report.

According to the report, the U.S. Navy dispatched seven of its Aegis warships to the eastern coast of Korea to conduct exercises with South Korea's 7,600-ton Sejong the Great Aegis destroyer during the annual combined command-post/joint field training exercises March 9-20.

snip

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/03/205_40981.html

Meanwhile, North Korea confidently clears the surrounding commercial air corridors before its missile test ...


N Korean threats prompt rerouting of flights
By Christian Oliver and Song Jung-a in Seoul

Published: March 6 2009 09:34 | Last updated: March 6 2009 09:34

South Korea’s two main airlines said on Friday they had diverted flights after North Korea warned it could not vouch for the safety of passenger aircraft while the peninsula was on a war footing.

Pyongyang has demanded the cancellation of next week’s US-South Korean joint military exercises, arguing such war games are a smokescreen for an invasion and could spark conflict. The Pentagon says it has no intention of scrapping the manoeuvres.

snip
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/cbb44048-0a30-11de-95ed-0000779fd2ac.html

[TaffyMoon]

42. Why don't you Yanks

just sail in your own waters - you don't own the world, you know.

[Alamuti Lotus]

45. China's "aggressive maneuvers" OFF CHINA

A spy ship thousands of miles from home, off the coast of another country, complains of their 'aggressive' actions.. Stupid, or just insane?

I don't understand the underwear part. Was this the top-secret experimental anti-uniform firehose on a test run?

[defendandprotect]

47. Cheney and Rumsfeld worked for decades to recreate the Cold War . . .

Gringrich will take China --- "The Chinese are coming! The Chinese are coming!"