Immigration Debate Tied to Rise in Hate Crimes

[AlphaCentauri]

Source: Washington Post

U.S. civil rights leaders said yesterday that an increase in hate crimes committed in recent years against Hispanics and people perceived to be immigrants "correlates closely" to the nation's increasingly contentious debate over immigration.

Hate crimes targeting Hispanic Americans rose 40 percent from 2003 to 2007, the most recent year for which FBI statistics are available, from 426 to 595 incidents, marking the fourth consecutive year of increases.

The Leadership Conference on Civil Rights Education Fund issued a report that faulted anti-immigrant rhetoric in the media and mobilization of extremist groups on the Internet. The conference said that some groups advocating for tighter immigration laws have invoked "the dehumanizing, racist stereotypes and bigotry of hate groups."

"Reasonable people will disagree . . . but the tone of discourse over comprehensive immigration reform needs to be changed, needs to be civil and sane," said Michael Lieberman, Washington counsel for the Anti-Defamation League.



Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/16/AR2009061603518.html

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dgibby]

2. Lou Dobbs, is that you?

Welcome to DU. Enjoy your stay.:popcorn:

[Sebastian Doyle]

3. Yeah, but the first two clowns on your list would fit right in at a "Minutemen" rally.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dgibby]

6. Links please?

[dorkulon]

11. Gee, this story really brings 'em out of the woodwork

Check out the last thread on this: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5865439&mesg_id=5865439

[nomorenomore08]

15. Yet not a peep about poor little Brisenia Flores...

Kind of shows you where their priorities lie, doesn't it?

[Kali]

4. selective choice of news there

or do you think those are the only crimes committed recently?

[dgibby]

7. Like this one, for instance?

http://americasvoiceonline.org/page/invite/Brisenia

[WriteDown]

8. Then lets end all debate...

Enforce the existing laws.

[AlphaCentauri]

30. witch laws?

[WriteDown]

31. Those Salem trials...

have been over for a long time.

[nomorenomore08]

9. That's because this "debate," like the "debate" over abortion, is mostly bullshit.

Fact is, as long as current socioeconomic conditions prevail, people will cross the border (or at least try to) any way they can. Once this reality sinks in, then it becomes possible to actually deal with the issue in a humane and sensible matter.

But the ugly truth is that people who claim they're "only" opposed to "illegal" immigration, are at best unaware of the logistics involved, and at worst feigning ignorance to hide their bias against dark-skinned foreigners. And when "mainstream" anti-immigration groups are often barely distinguishable from hate groups, that indicates to me that the whole immigration "debate" is poisoned beyond repair.

I can't claim to have any definitive solutions myself, but I do know that scapegoating impoverished, desperate people, and conflating them with terrorists and criminals, is a stance unworthy of any compassionate human being.

[a la izquierda]

10. +1

[DissedByBush]

12. I am married to a legal immigrant

She opposes illegals more than I do. Did anyone stop to think how those people who took the time and effort to go through the process properly feel about others who shirk the law and see no negative consequences?

[Kali]

14. yeah, they just have it so easy - no consequences at all

:eyes:

[DissedByBush]

17. They even have rights my wife doesn't

We'd be eligible for WIC if I made a couple thousand less a year than I do now. If I did lose my job we can't get any means-tested aid because she is a legal immigrant. We had to sign that as part of her coming over. And we have to pay it back if we catch an exception and do get it. Illegals can get WIC.

For the most part they live their lives here with nothing happening to them for their illegal act. There are over 10 million here and you hear of a few thousand deportations a year. That's pretty good odds.

[Kali]

18. ...

http://ciw-online.org/images/images.html

[AlphaCentauri]

27. Warning: Graphic Content not suitable for all audiences

[nomorenomore08]

25. How about instead of blaming "illegal" immigrants for allegedly sucking up benefits, why not ask

why there aren't more benefits to go around in the first place, in a nation of such immense wealth? I really think you're blaming the wrong people here...

[AlphaCentauri]

26. Legal immigrants can get WIC

refuges can get all the benefits a citizen can get

[DissedByBush]

28. Refugees are legal

It is a status that can be granted if you face persecution in your home country.

[AlphaCentauri]

29. Sure but there is a distinction on how much public benefits they can get

compared to the first 5 years of other legal immigrants sponsored by US citizens, refugees get all benefits from welfare to SSI instantly. also many legal immigrants never pay taxes or contribute to their pension fund but they are eligible to all those benefits. On the other corner illegals pay taxes for years and they do not get any return back.

[DissedByBush]

32. Refugees are considered to be hardship cases

They came here because they had to, not because they just wanted to.

[AlphaCentauri]

33. Most are economic refugees not political as many other immigrants

the majority fall in situations were they countries were destroy by war or because there is a special law that gives them refugee status.

[DissedByBush]

38. No such thing

Expanding the definition of refugee to coming over for better employment demeans the real refugees.

To be a refugee you have to have a "a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion"

A Mexican coming for a better job is not a refugee. A Cuban who pissed off Castro would be a refugee.

[AlphaCentauri]

39. Cubans can go and visit Cuba with out fear of prosecution

Actually US citizens may fear prosecution if they visit Cuba

Obama allows unlimited travel to Cuba by relatives
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/apr/14/world/fg-cuba-policy14

So there are laws that gives the refugee status to some economic refugees

[DissedByBush]

40. That has nothing to do with refugees

A refugee is someone who fears persecution in his OWN country and flees to another.

[AlphaCentauri]

41. Then Cubans are not refugees?

what person who fears persecution goes back on vacations to the country they supposedly were prosecuted

[DissedByBush]

43. If they are here then this is their country

They don't fear persecution in the US. They are refugees from Cuba.

They go back at their own risk. Some may go back and be willing to keep their mouths shut while they are there and the government may turn a blind eye because they are spending desperately needed foreign currency there.

Back to the point, there is no such thing as an economic refugee. Such people are what we have called regular immigrants throughout the years coming here for better opportunity.

[Zavulon]

20. Wow.

So if someone is against illegal "immigration," they're racists?

[Rage for Order]

21. That appears to be the long and short of it, according to that poster

Nevermind the fact that on a per capita basis, attacks against Hispanics actually went down from 2003-2007.

[Zavulon]

22. It's always amusing to see

people painted with one broad brush like that. Not closed-minded at all. :rofl:

[AlphaCentauri]

37. Attacks on Mexican immigrants often go unreported

Immigrants 'afraid' to report crimes
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/local/article/0,1299,DRMN_15_4964115,00.html

Many Crimes Against Illegal Immigrants Go Unreported
http://www.propeller.com/story/2006/12/13/many-crimes-against-illegal-immigrants-go-unreported/

Crimes Against Immigrants Go Unreported
http://fairimmigration.wordpress.com/2008/06/12/video-crimes-against-immigrants-go-unreported/

Fear and Distrust Keep Latino Immigrants from Reporting Crime
http://www.splcenter.org/legal/undersiege/ch3.jsp

Attacks on Mexican immigrants often go unreported
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/front_page/20090615_Attacks_on_Mexican_immigrants_often_go_unreported.html

[nomorenomore08]

23. Way to oversimplify. I never said that was necessarily the case.

I just think that a lot of people don't understand the reality of the situation, which is that no amount of "enforcement" is going to work if people are desperate enough to come here. So I think that some form of amnesty/citizenship process - especially for those who've been here years or decades - combined with re-negotiating trade agreements in a way that would benefit both American and Mexican workers, would be far more logical, not to mention humane, than some blanket "Deport 'em all!" approach - deporting millions of people being logistically impossible anyway, not to mention the countless families it would break apart (and financially ruin).

And yeah, there are those folks, no shortage of them sadly, who simply don't want more brown people in their country. I'm not saying you're one of them, but to deny they exist in large numbers is willfully ignorant.

And on a final note, before you start in about "illegals" stealing jobs or wrecking the economy, just remember that it's not the guys at the bottom of the heap who are screwing you - it's the guys at the top. Namely those multinational corporations who've helped to ruin the livelihoods of so many Americans *and* Mexicans.

[Zavulon]

36. "...before you start in about 'illegals'..."

Wow, you just have all the answers and know what everyone's going to say, don't you?

Don't bother to answer, you'll be on ignore before you read this. I had a question about your arrogant assumptions, and then realized that after seeing two of your posts I don't give a flying fuck what your answer would be. Life's way too short to deal with people like you when there are plenty of smart people on DU who DON'T think they know everything.

[McCamy Taylor]

13. I wrote about the rhetoric anti-immigrants use a few years ago. It is fascist.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2371537

After a series of pieces on the anti-immigrant movement and its fascist methods (three by me, many by other DUers), I noticed that the immigrant haters sort of disappeared. This was back in 2007. Maybe it is time for a second round of exposes on what anti-immigrants are all about.

Anti-immigration is a Republican issue designed to divide and conquer the working class and draw attention away from the real culprits in our bad economy. Democrats who advocate it are helping the opposition.

[JonQ]

45. Anti-illegal immigrant does not = anti-immigrant

any more than being against drunk driving means you're opposed to driving in general.


True/false: people in this country illegally, who are working illegally, and are likely using someones stolen social security number to do so have broken the law?

[RedCloud]

16. Fascism is permitted by our Homeland Security overlords.

Mrs. Red Cloud recently got her citizenship. You have to take an oath to renounce things such as never been a member of the Communist Party. However no such clause exists for Fascists. They can get in with no penalty and no swearing never having been a fascist and probably get express service to vote for the Republican of their choice. Mrs. Red Cloud waited two years. All Bush's government did was take our money and then "age" her fingerprints and notify her right after Obama was President. She could have voted against McCain the Insane if they had done the six month maximum wait in only one year.

[Rage for Order]

19. Well, they're obviously completely full of shit

That is to say, I have no doubt that there were 426 incidents against Hispanics in 2003, nor do I doubt that there were 595 incidents in 2007. However, let's consider that in 2003 there were http://www.census.gov/population/socdemo/hispanic/ASEC2004/2004CPS_tab1.1a.html">28,828,100 Hispanics in the United States. By the year 2007 there were http://www.census.gov/population/socdemo/hispanic/ASEC2004/2004CPS_tab1.1a.html">45,913,018 Hispanics in the United States, an increase of almost 60%. So in 2003 there was one incident for every 67,671 Hispanics, and in 2007 there was one incident for every 77,164 Hispanics. It looks to me like we are moving in the right direction.

[nomorenomore08]

24. You're awfully defensive, for someone not in any actual danger.

Wonder why that is? :shrug:

[Rage for Order]

35. Pointing out erroneous arguments is not defensive

I happen to belive that facts matter. If you don't like the numbers take it up with the census bureau.

Interesting that you attacked me by implying I have an agenda, but you did not address any of the substantive parts of my post. Wonder why that is? :shrug:

[Starbucks Anarchist]

34. Even one is too many.

[JonQ]

46. True, but

if you're trying to claim an upward trend your data should reflect that. And not accounting for a substantial change in population over the course of the study is a rather glaring error.


It'd be the equivalent of not taking in to account inflation when looking at earning over time. A pretty big detail. And it looks like hate crime rates have been going down by these numbers, isn't a downward trend a good thing?

[JonQ]

47. Excellent catch

seems like an attempt to use misleading statistics to push a very biased viewpoint. I hate it when people do this, not in the least because it means you can't take any stats you are shown at face value without an exhaustive look at their criteria.

But does this mean that the increase in anti-illegal-immigration debate has reduced hate crimes against hispanics? By the logic in the OP, yes. So clearly we have the minutemen to thank for a relative decrease in crimes against hispanics. Heh, see how that goes over.

[depakid]

42. Newspapers like The Oregonian are also responsible for this

as their comment sections actively promote race baiting- and they choose to let it continue. Guess they gotta get those clicks, even it it means publishing the vilest and foulest commentary.

[tlwinslow]

44. The U.S.-Mexico Problem Requires a Paradigm Chang

Racism is so sad, and solves nothing. Let's try chucking it and thinking of a true solution.

The age-old pesky U.S.-Mexico border problem has taxed the resources of both countries, led to long lists of injustices, and appears to be heading only for worse troubles in the future. Guess what? The border problem can never be solved. Why? Because the border IS the problem! It's time for a paradigm change.

Never fear, a satisfying, comprehensive solution is within reach: the Megamerge Dissolution Solution. Simply dissolve the border along with the failed Mexican government, and megamerge the two countries under U.S. law, with mass free 2-way migration eventually equalizing the development and opportunities permanently, with justice and without racism, and without threatening U.S. sovereignty or basic principles.

Take time to read the proposal. Google "Megamerge Dissolution Solution", or click

http://tlwinslow.weebly.com/megamerge-the-dissolution-solution.html