Rep. Dennis Kucinich to vote "yes" on health care

[pampango]

Source: Cleveland Plain Dealer

U.S. Rep. Dennis Kucinich waited until Democrats had won last November's health care reform vote before casting his ballot against it on the House of Representatives floor..

This time around -- pressured by everyone from President Obama to Moveon.org -- the Cleveland Democrat had no luxury to dawdle before taking a stance. He just announced at a Capitol news conference that he'll vote yes on the bill's latest draft.

"I have doubts about the bill," Kucinich said. "This is not the bill I wanted to support. . . However, after careful discussions with President Obama, Speaker Pelosi, my wife Elizabeth and close friends, I’ve decided to cast a vote in favor of the legislation."

Kucinich's move came after months of insisting he'd oppose the bill because it doesn't do enough to curtail insurance company abuses. Kucinich advocates bolstering Medicare and expanding its coverage to include all Americans. "Even with the few modest improvements in the bill, the insurance companies will still have dozens of loopholes to deny care and continue to find ways to leave Americans with the unpayable bill," Kucinich stated in a column he authored for last Sunday's Plain Dealer.

Read more: http://www.cleveland.com/open/index.ssf/2010/03/rep_dennis_kucinich_to_vote_xx.html

[DCBob]

1. Common sense prevails...

Finally.

[RaleighNCDUer]

7. Nonsense.

What this is, is dad saying "You want to smoke? Here, smoke this carton of cigarettes, right now. Then tell me how you feel about it."

With everybody hammering on the left for standing up for REAL reform, killing the bill and possibly jeopardizing Dems in the upcoming elections would hand the DLC a victory over the left, because they would then blame the left for the outcome.

Now, it is squarely in the laps of the so-called centrists - and when this steaming pile of shit is proved to be what we have been saying all along and it costs Democrats the WH and congress for the next 20 years, the left will be able to say "We only gave you what you asked for."

All right, you got it. Now suck on it.

[DCBob]

9. Give it up dude, you a fighting a losing battle.. the centrist approach is only one that will work

in this political environment.... even DK knows it now.

[WriteDown]

10. It's worked well in Massachusetts. nt

[Name removed]

81. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Roland99]

14. yeah...let's keep the status quo. Let's keep corporate rule. yay us.

:eyes:

[DCBob]

18. Status quo is what we would have gotten if we fail to pass this bill...

and your approach would likely have sent us there.

[kenfrequed]

59. Actually...

The insurance companies had a nagging concern if no bill was passed. As the baby boomers retire they would be shuttled over to medicare which would have been good and bad. The good is that older Americans tend to have health problems but the bad is that they would no longer be paying premiums and deductables for medical care.

The younger crowd on the other hand are fewer and far more likely to run without insurance to save a few bucks and it is this crowd that the insurance industry needs to assure their profits. With increased costs of medical care (due in no small part to the insurance industry), a recession, and demand for profits increasing alongside a a greater level of joblessness the insurance company needed a solution. To them mandated insurance was the best imaginable situation.

So yes, the status quo is bad. But mandates and corporate welfare is not really changing the status quo, it is enshrining it and making it all the more difficult to fix. The insurance companies played all sides in this arrangement to assure themselves the best possible deal. They paid the Republicans to run wild and hostile agaisnt any reform so that the bar would keep switching towards a Romney-care/Medicare part D solution. And it worked. Sadly.

[Name removed]

89. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Roland99]

103. Uh, no. Status quo IS this bill. Even WORSE actually

Insurance companies are being forced to accept people with pre-existing conditions. That sounds great but, guess what?

They're allowed at least 100% over the lowest-cost policy. So, what are they doing now? Raising premiums across-the-board so the floor is higher and then the new ceiling will be even higher yet.

Who's going to afford these new premiums? People at or below poverty level already qualify for their state-level Medicaid. It's the Middle Class Squeeze again.


Bravo.

[backtomn]

26. Thank you

How do you paint this as anything other than a victory for insurance companies?? The insurance companies and supporting financial companies are saying that this should be a good year to invest in insurance companies. Thanks Dennis.

[BEZERKO]

16. Um, no.

The centrist approach is a part of what's been killing us the past thirty years. You need to read Lakoff, Jeffrey Feldman, Drew Westen, Crashing the Gates, if you haven't already. Sorry, but a lot of common knowledge about how the political world works is just wrong. You must unlearn what you have learned.

[DCBob]

21. You need to learn political reality. This country will never become what you and others yearn for...

there are just way too many conservatives. Progress will have to come in small steps with compromise and negotiation.

[mvd]

25. On, the other hand, I firmly believe this was not the best bill..

we could have gotten. If the Party really wanted the public option, I think we could have gotten the votes if Obama did a press like he's doing now. The public option is one of the most popular parts of the legislation. I also don't think a "centrist" approach works like a measured but principled stance does.

[DCBob]

30. No doubt it could have been better but this is what we have now.. for better or worse.

The road to progress now goes through this bill... that's the reality.

[mvd]

33. I hope you are right that it does lead to progress

I have my doubts and need to see that Obama isn't content to stop with a bill that entrenches the problem, even though it puts a band-aid on the problem.

[RoccoR5955]

62. Wrong, Progress will come as it has ALWAYS come.

Through the blood, sweat, and tears of WE THE PEOPLE, who get into the streets, and DEMAND that our government do things. It was that way in the 30s, in the 60s, and we should be out there now in the 10s! Howard Zinn taught us that social progress only comes only when the people demand it. Often times by violent means. If you doubt me, just read his book, The People's History of the United States.

[DCBob]

134. I agree with you but its still an incremental process..

Social Security, Civil Rights, Women's rights, Gay rights, etc did not all happen at the same time. The country is still very conservative and can only handle small liberal steps forward at a time. Patience and persistence is the name of the game.

[Plucketeer]

65. In other words.........

Go ahead and yearn for a Caddy. Just remind yourself how lucky you are to have a Yugo. Go ahead and wonder how it is that other nations (ones not as glaringly great as OUR fine country) are already DRIVING a Caddy, and why our "leaders" are telling us we've actually got the better deal with the limping Yugo. Yeah - that works! :crazy:

Edited for spelling.

[kenfrequed]

73. That only works

If the opposition has something to gain. We are compromising with a minority in the senate and a minority in the house that has most of what they want and no incentive to bargain in good faith.

What would we compromise on with the republicans percisely?

People that talk about bipartisanship, centrism, and compromise have to be a good deal more specific about what it is they are willing to trade and what they want for it to be credible.

The only way for a compromise to work would be to start out at a point to the left of our own position and then force them to compromise somewhere in between. In healthcare this would have required keeping Single Payer Universal-government run on the table and starting from there to arrive at someplace barely palatable to our own base. Which would basically be a public option. Instead the white house encouraged the media to pay attention almost exclusively to the finance committee and Baacuus knocked most legitimate reform off the table all in the name of compromising with republicans that will never agree to vote for it.

The isnurance companies get tons of money, the republicans get Romenycare and they get rid of healthcare reform, and the Democrats get the blame for this terrible bill. (in turn the DLC will probably blame the progressives for agitating reform in the first place)

[Lydia Leftcoast]

74. And who CREATED all those conservatives?

The DLC with their acceptance of right-wing memes, their deregulation of communications, their failure to help farmers and blue collar workers who were losing their assets and jobs to "progress," and their unseemly haste to demonize and ridicule anyone who actually stood up for ordinary people.

Thanks for nothing, DLC. You turned the Democratic Party into the party for yuppies who are just a little bit too smart to be Republicans but who basically care about nothing but the interests of their own class.

[liberation]

44. So the best "political" approach is to stand for nothing...

good grief. The ever diminishing standards crowd has passed rock bottom level and are furiously digging towards China.


As "moderates" some of you make great "reactionaries."

[DCBob]

49. My standards have not diminished....

its just the road to get there may be long and winding with many bumps and potholes along the way.

[goclark]

67. He took a stand and then as he gained more information

he decided to take another stand.

I applaud DK for doing so. :patriot:

[RaleighNCDUer]

105. Wrong,

http://www.cleveland.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/03/latest_health_care_reform_bill.html

That was just two days ago. He is NOT supporting this POS bill, he is supporting the Democratic Party, which is aimed at a humiliating defeat in November, and possibly in '12, because of the centrists positions which are at odds with the people that put Obama in the WH.

He has no more information today than he had two days ago. But he knows that if the bill was killed, the blue dogs would blame the left and the infighting would KILL the party, handing it right back over to the repukes.

Changing his vote is a matter of tactics, and supports his principles overall by allowing this personal defeat to not undermine the (somewhat) progressive Democratic platform.

Personally, I'm a "burn it down" kinda guy, and I disagree with him changing his vote - but I understand why he did it. And it ISN'T because he suddenly likes this bill.

[goclark]

118. Didn't say he Liked this bill

I said he changed his mind about his vote.

We'll see in the end.

[RaleighNCDUer]

120. Your implication was that he changed his mind on the substance of the bill

not that he merely changed his vote for political reasons.

But yes, we'll see in the end.

[icee]

127. His changing his mind gives more amunition for the Repubs who

will win huge victories in November. You can take that to the bank.

[WeekendWarrior]

139. Want to place money on that?

Passing this bill will guarantee a continued Democratic majority in November.

I haven't been wrong yet.

[JDPriestly]

47. The centrist approach is giving us unacceptably high unemployment,

and now this useless bill that does only one thing -- cut Medicare benefits. This bill will not be popular. Ordinary people are going to hate it. The DLC is on the wrong track. The DLC is only slightly better than the Bushies were.

[DCBob]

53. Huh?? This economic mess originated in the Bush era.

How soon some forget.

[kenfrequed]

114. Uhm.

If you pull off the freeway and end up driving into the ditch because some jackass turned the wheel wildly to the right you have to do a hell of a lot more to get on the road again than just straightening the wheel.

[JDPriestly]

138. FDR had a worse mess on his hands and he got people back to work.

It was only when FDR dropped some of his stimulus/employment programs that the economy worsened again. Obama has not done what needs to be done. And he does not seem interested in doing it. So far, no indictments, no clear message sent to Wall Street that the stealing and gambling have to stop -- not so much as a meaningful warning. Obama have inherited the mess. We all know that. Problem is, he has done very little if anything to clean it up -- and that makes it his mess.

[Eric Condon]

79. Sure, now.

A year ago, when the president still had something resembling a mandate, would have been the time for him to fight for a PO (or, dare I say it, single payer). If Obama had expended ONE OUNCE of energy to push for progressive reforms back when he still had political capital, then things might look very different today. Instead, his approval ratings are down, we're about to get hosed in the midterms, and for what? A shitty UNCONSTITUTIONAL bill that only benefits corporations.

It's not even like Carter, where he was unpopular but still made principled stands. This administration, and indeed the Democratic Party at large, are pathetic.

[backtomn]

17. Goodbye Dennis!!

We didn't support him because he was a centrist. In the end, he is no different than any other DINO. Admit it!! Be honest!! He had his chance to hold out for something better and he folded like a cheap suit. He is nothing to me now.

[Zambero]

28. A whopping 1% of primary voters didn't support him because of what?

The other 99% deserve better than a Republican wet dream come true. I'm sure those who would reject legisltion that's not 100% perfect would delight in seeing Glenn Beck and Michele Bachman revel in the defeat of HCR. And they along with the entire teabag whacko universe would claim full bragging rights for its demise. Would this spectacle provide those claiming to be" ideologically pure" on the left with a warm and fuzzy feeling? Progressives need to be very careful which bandwagon they decide to jump on, and at the moment there are only two to choose from. Passing a less-than-ideal bill that includes some good provisions is far better than settling for the status quo, and does not preclude improvements with subsequent legislation.

[backtomn]

35. How many votes for the Presidency????

1%..............so you are agreeing, he was a joke all along. Right??

[Zambero]

He's not a "joke"

I listen to what he has to say and usually agree with him on principle. But given his lack of traction as a presidential candidate, he's best not referred to in the context of someone who represents a sizeable share of the Democratic base.

[backtomn]

45. Where do I start.....

Is it practical to give insurance companies their best profits in years?? Investment people are telling everyone to put their money in insurance companies right now. AND.....if this is so critical to our well-being, why does it take effect in 2014?? If you are sick now.....too bad. Sounds nice.

I guess anyone who disagrees with you is pushing for "ideological purity" over pragmatism. Sounds like an Obama ad. For every "good provision" there is a bad one (HUGE cuts in Medicare, but not used to save Medicare......taxes on everyone.....abortion controls??......everyone FORCED to purchase insurance......but with a small fine, we can wait until we are really sick until we buy insurance, letting everyone else pay for it at that time....smart.)

Beck and Backman may want nothing, but will prefer this over a real bill.....the insurance companies still control.

Spare me your pragmatism. Please.

[Zambero]

63. Yes it's pragmatic. No reason to kill it however.

If it provides improved medical coverage for 30 million+ currently uninsured and does away with pre-existing condition denial, then I can accept it, insurance profits notwithstanding. Certainly not the best scenario, but the ONLY option available. Again, it's far from perfect but its a starting point. Which part of the status quo would you miss the most if the bill was to fail?

[backtomn]

78. How about the truth.......

30+ million people MIGHT be covered 4 years from now, when the plan takes effect (in 2014).....of course the cuts to Medicare and tax increaseds occur now. Need help prior to 2014......to bad.....good luck. That was all done to make the plan look economical.

After all the complaints on DU about insurance companies, we are now OK with them reaping huge profits on this plan??

What part of the "status quo" would I keep??? How about.....BEST emergency care in the world....BEST pharmaceutical advances (or ONLY pharmaceutical advances) in the world.......Medicare works for the elderly.......shorter wait times than Canada or England for elective and non-elective procedures....Better rates of recovery on nearly all forms of cancer than Canada and England......my grandparents like their hospice and elderly care......etc.

I am sure that you would not disagree, but a small agreement with a couple of Republicans (not everything or all Republicans) would get us coverage for pre-existing conditions, portability, insurance reform, and cost reduction without all the rest. I know that might not be popular here.....but you are saying that you are willing to accept something other than perfection.....maybe that is just a act.

Which of these is pragmatism??

[RoccoR5955]

64. The previous post,

has been made by a Republican shill.

[Zambero]

76. How many "Republican shills"

take the time to contact their Senators and representatives weekly and demand that they support HCR, including my apparently intractible DINO rep? My correspondence includes support for a public option. I hope that option somehow still prevails, but absent that I would still support the leadership's efforts at getting a bill passed. Again, if you wish to join the big bash "HCR is finally dead" celebration with Beck, Limbaugh, the Micheles etc., work to defeat this bill, demand that your reps vote "no", and then find out the hard way who the shill really was!

[RoccoR5955]

123. Teabaggers and The "Christian" Coalition. That's who! n/t

[backtomn]

85. I agree....How else do you explain it ???

Unless they have insurance company stocks.

The plans sounds great.....UNLESS you are on Medicare....or Medicaid, don't want to buy insurance, like your current doctor, you are in the middle of treatment, etc.

Does anyone else get a choice about what is right for them?? Maybe not.

[MrRight]

117. Support of this bill is suicide

Unfortunately any support of this bill is political suicide. Doesn't matter what part you're in. The polls are decidely against HCR and there will be hell to pay come November.

[SandWalker1984]

122. Loopholes, hoopholes and lies.

Apparently the best kept secret about Orahma care is that people talk about the elimination of pre-existing conditions but what people do not realize is that THE BILL DOES NOT SAY THAT THE INSURANCE COMPANIES CANNOT CHARGE YOU WHAT THEY WANT TO CHARGE YOU if you have a pre-existing condition. So there goes the benefit of that change, and the politicians know it.


The Ensign Healthcare Loophole
posted by Greg Kaufmann
The Nation
January 8, 2010

Taken at face value, Senator John Ensign's amendment which was included in the final Senate healthcare bill sounds pretty decent: by meeting "wellness" standards people can receive discounts on their employer-based healthcare premiums. Stop smoking--pay less. Hit a certain weight--pay less. Meet a cholesterol target--you get the idea.

Dems probably should have stopped and realized since the amendment was offered by Ensign it probably wasn't motivated by "wellness" at heart.

In fact, it allows premiums to be raised from current levels, and then "discounts" would reduce the premiums to current rates. People who don't meet the insurance companies' targets could pay up to 30 percent more for coverage, roughly $4000 based on the average cost of family coverage. The amount could increase to 50 percent which is over $6,600 for a family.

There is also the problem that this is biased against people with a genetic predisposition to high blood sugar, hypertension, high cholesterol, being overweight and a host of other often hereditary conditions. It's also biased against a lower-income person working two to three jobs to pay the bills, who has to stop and chow down some fast food between jobs rather than get to the gym where he or she can't afford a membership anyway. It's even biased against communities that don't have grocery stores where they can find fresh fruits and vegetables.

So what does this all mean? Remember a central promise of healthcare reform--even the watered down version--how people with preexisting conditions weren't supposed to be denied coverage or forced to pay more for their insurance? That all sounded pretty good, right? Well, guess again.

"Incentives quickly become penalties for those who cannot meet the target," said Sue Nelson, vice president for federal advocacy at the American Heart Association (AHA). The AHA has led a coalition of more than 200 health and consumer organizations who oppose this Senate provision, including the National Organization for Women, American Cancer Society, the American Diabetes Association, and many mental health groups. "A wellness program could consist solely of a PREMIUM SURCHARGE based on a blood cholesterol count over 200. are significant potential unintended consequences such as burdening sicker employees and their families with significant increases in healthcare costs thereby making coverage unaffordable for those who need it the most."

Read the full article at:

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion/514042/the_ensign...

PREMIUM SURCHARGES.

As far as subsidies go -- the Republicans and the media are setting up for a political change in Congress in 2010. Once Republicans gain more control, they will cut or hack many subsidies. Don't forget that the Republicans cut the CHPS program for children's health care.

Last, they did not remove the insurance corporations anti-trust exemptions. So welcome to the monopolies.

There is no guarantee in the Senate bill that citizens of the US get a minimum, guaranteed health benefits package at a guaranteed affordable price. Therefore, those who need health care the most (people over 50 years of age and those with pre-existing conditions) will be going without health care insurance and paying fines if they cannot afford the allowed PREMIUM SURCHARGES. That's a loophole big enough to drive a Mac truck thru.

Our country is already spending $10,000 per person for health care while leaving out over 10% of our population from coverage. That's over twice what they are spending per person in Canada for complete, universal care for all Canadians and almost three times the $4000 spent for universal care in France. The politicians are always talking about the market place and global competition, why would you handicap the citizens of the US with such a corporate ball and chain and anti-competitive mandates?

Hip, hip hooray for transparency and chains we can believe in.

[NJmaverick]

2. Thank you Dennis for finally doing the right thing

and thank you President Obama for taking the time and effort to get Dennis to do the right thing.

[mzmolly]

3. Good for Dennis!

:toast:

[Roland99]

4. If it actually does contain a public option, I can understand his change of stance

Otherwise, he's just like the rest of the Dems selling out Americans to be mandated captive suckers to higher premiums going to insurance companies.

[pattmarty]

12. I am not going to slam him. It was a strictly political move in the.................

.............thinking if it doesn't pass the Dems will lose big in Nov. I don't think this is the case, as I believe that the Dems will lose seats in Nov whether they pass this piece of shit or not. The Dems will lose primarily because they will be perceived (correctly in my opinion) of having huge majorities and getting absolutely nothing done. I will still stand by my belief that is why they lost "Kennedy's seat".

[LibDemAlways]

60. By passing this bill the Dems are handing the keys of

Congress back to the Repukes this fall. When the public discovers they are required to purchase expensive private insurance - still chalk full of co-pays and deductibles - under penalty of law, the bloodletting isn't going to be pretty. I think the Dems have a death wish.

[BREMPRO]

87. when you finally read the bill and see that it has subsidies

linked to a reasonable percentage of income that make it affordable to everyone, and the exchange will include a non-profit option, and that when 30 million more people are covered and not going to the emergency room for care, and lower premiums for everyone, you'll realize this was a long term win for Dems.

[pattmarty]

94. Well, instead of being "Glen Beckish" and just throwing shit out there..............

...................Ya better provide links and articles that "prove" your assertions. No public option, no revocation of anti-trust, absolutely NO cost containment. Jesusfuckingchrist, need I go on? Pass stand alone anti-rescission, anti pre-existing conditions and no "cap" on total coverage amounts, then you can still pass Medicare for all down the road. With this you will INSTITUTIONALIZE the insurance forever in the healthcare system and will never have a chance of a single payer (Medicare for all) system.

[LibDemAlways]

102. Someone on another thread who claimed to have done the numbers

asserted that for a family of four earning 66K the after subsidy premium would run over $6200 a year. That's nearly 10% of that family's gross income. Add in co-pays and deductibles and there is no way this could be considered "affordable." People will still be one major illness away from economic ruin. That poster, by the way, was using those numbers to try and convince me that this is a good thing.

No one wants to be forced to hand over their hard earned dollars to a bunch of corrupt businessmen whose motive is not to provide health care - but to cook up ways not to provide health care.

If this stands it is first and foremost a win for the insurance cartel and big pharma. Then it's a win for the politicians who are pocketing big contributions from the insurance cartel and big pharma. For the average guy - as always - screwed.

[Roland99]

106. +1

[BREMPRO]

132. 10% -in his case $500 a month for health care for a family of 4 is "unaffordable"?

what planet do you live on?- that's a fair premium for covering 4 people and the insurance companies are required by the legislation to spent 85% on actual health care instead of the 70% they get away with now. They also will not be allowed to deny coverage anymore. BTW most people have insurance through employers anyway- we are only talking about the 20% who are self employed, unisured by choice (a risk we all pay for if they get sick) or not eligible for medicare or medicade. If we get everyone covered, costs should go down for even employer managed plans. we subside the uninsured already at a much more expensive rate.

[AllyCat]

130. Exchange that starts in how many years? Whoopeee!

The insurance companies will just jack up the rates to include the amount the tax payers will pay them, plus what they get now, plus some extra for that vacation home in the Bahamas the CEO has been eyeballing.

"30 Million more covered" under duress is a crock of $hit.

I hope I'm wrong. I don't think I am.

[Iowa]

111. +1. You summed it up perfectly - as usual. n/t

[Democat]

5. Thank you, Rep. Kucinich!

I appreciate that he is going to support the president, even if he doesn't agree 100% with the current bill.

[SandWalker1984]

43. Thanks for supporting the president, even if you disagree with him?

A chill just went up my spine.

For 8 years, no matter what he did or how he did it, many Republicans supported George Bush as he led our country down the path to endless wars, spying on Americans, torturing people and holding them without trials and an economic meltdown.

I thought then, HOW can people support someone when they are so obviously wrong? My spouse said it's "team mentality." My team is better than your team. My team must beat your team. I must support my team.


Now I am seeing Democrats spewing the same gotta support my president, my team mentality.

I fear for the future of my country when reason and sanity are thrown out the window in support of "my team."

[liberation]

51. Apparently, some here think there is nothing more democratic than marching in forced lockstep

At least they are not requesting we do the marching goose step style, so that is real "progressive" I guess.

[Joanne98]

6. YAY

[WriteDown]

8. Mitt Romney had a personal talk with him.

Or maybe I'm thinking of Mitt Rombama.

[No Elephants]

29. You keep trying to sell that, but no one seems to be buying.

[newtothegame]

40. I'll buy. n/t

[WriteDown]

55. If only it was just a sales pitch.

You're up in MA, is Romney-care the dream I've heard it is?

[Jester Messiah]

11. Glad to see he finally saw the light. [nt]

[Plucketeer]

71. Light alright

From a thousand watt heat lamp.

[BumRushDaShow]

13. Just heard this on AP radio (on XM).

This was surprising.

[tweeternik]

15. Pass the bill !!

Enough talk .... it's time to vote. Pass the damn bill. Thank you Dennis !!!!!!!!!

[BEZERKO]

19. I was thinking about this last night and thought about how

his being possibly the vote that could kill the bill could haunt his legacy. It's not everything I wanted by a long shot, but it's pretty clear that it's this bill as is or nothing at all. It is what it is, and I think DK sees the light, searched his soul, and made the right decision. I take back everything I said about him the last few days.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

20. I hope to the gods --

assurances have been made to him about some changes to the bill that are immenent and will make it a bill worth voting for.

Otherwise, I am very disappointed in him. :(

[mvd]

24. Hope it was assurances and not other pressure

If it was other pressure, I'll definitely be even more disappointed in our leadership.

[pampango]

27. There is this from DK.

http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/health-care/breaking-kucinich-to-vote-yes/

Kucinich revealed he’d met four times with President Obama, mostly going over his objections, but said he’d been persuaded in part because at one recent meeting he recognized how difficult Obama’s challenge is.

“I left it with a real sense of compassion for our president and what he’s going through,” he said. “We have to be compassionate towards those who are called upon to make decisions for this nation. It’s not an easy burden that he’s taken up.

Kucinich said that ultimately he couldn’t escape the argument that “something is better than nothing.” “People are looking for some hope that maybe something can be changed,” he said, suggesting that he may have been persuaded by Obama’s frequent argument that passing reform is essential in order to prove to Americans that government is not entirely dysfunctional.

Kucinich conceded that he decided to swallow the bill because failure would be a threat to Obama’s overall agenda. He said he has “a real desire for our president to succeed,” adding that “one of the things that bothers me is the attempt to deligitimize this presidency.”

[mvd]

32. Interesting - thanks

Is this guy's bl;og usually reliable? Ultimately, that's what made me support voting yes, but how come Nelson got the deal? x(

[JonLP24]

34. I supported him then and I support him now

One thing I love about him is his campassion and this quotes says it all imo.

“I left it with a real sense of compassion for our president and what he’s going through,” he said. “We have to be compassionate towards those who are called upon to make decisions for this nation. It’s not an easy burden that he’s taken up.

I 100% agree. I may not agree with Obama 100% but I deeply understand what he's facing and how difficult it is to get things done in this political environment where the right makes a lot of noise and are sadly effective in their misinformation campaigns.

[SandWalker1984]

48. Wrong reasons to vote for a bill.

A member of Congress should not vote to support a bill because he has "compassion" for the president.

He should vote to support a bill if it is what is good for his constituents and the rest of America.

Dennis is not saying it's a good bill. He has made it very plain that he does not and has given the reasons why it is not.


A MEMBER OF CONGRESS SHOULD NEVER VOTE FOR A BILL JUST BECAUSE HE HAS COMPASSION FOR THE PRESIDENT. WHERE'S THE COMPASSION FOR THE COUNTRY AND OUR FUTURE? That should be any public servant's #1 priority, and that is what is wrong with our country.

[JonLP24]

93. That's a good point

I'm not a fan of the bill either way but I can understand why he might be convinced this is the best we can get or not have one at all in the future. I really do hope things work themselves out and we get REAL health care reform.

[laughingliberal]

42. +1 nt

[choie]

69. and why do you think assurances from Obama

mean anything?

[vegleftie]

22. disappointed in dennis

I thought I could always count on him to stick to his principles. One can only hope that the final bill will contain the public option and/or medicare buy-in, or American consumers are screwed.

[Jefferson23]

23. I wish I could have been a fly on the wall when he and Obama spoke to each other.

[bertman]

31. A wise and prudent move by a thoughtful politician. If you read his comments on why

he has decided to support the bill he basically says that he fought as hard and as long as he could to make it a better bill, but in the end he feels this is at least a step in the right direction.

This is why I wish we had many more Democratic politicians like Dennis. If there had been twenty or thirty Kucinich-type Representatives we would have the Public Option in the bill.

Rec.

[RaleighNCDUer]

50. I'm not so sure he even thinks it is a step in the right direction,

unless you mean in the 'right' direction. But killing the bill would give the repubs a 'victory' (even though passing the bill helps the right and the corporations far more than it helps the people) and that would damage Obama's presidency, and he still has stuff to get done.

There is a difference between voting for a bill and supporting a bill.

[LeftHandPath]

36. Another sellout...

politics always wins above principle.

Like we had any doubts.

[Ozymanithrax]

37. Kucincih finally does something progressive...

He has a strong record of talking progressive, with no record of acting progressive.

I admire Kucinich taking the plunge into doing something that helps people.

[mvd]

Definitely disagree with you about the record

It will help people short term (though some will also pay more), but long term, this bill is not the answer at all.

[Ozymanithrax]

39. I looked at his record on bills. It just isn't there. He talks a good game...

but never moves the ball...until now.

[mvd]

41. I looked at the record and get..

a completely different opinion. I am very satisfied with what I have seen; no one is perfect.

[laughingliberal]

46. +1000 nt

[kenfrequed]

80. His positions are unpopular with the centrists

He raises a lot of hackles and since he runs for president frequently there are those in the party that would prefer none of his legislation goes anywhere, much less actually passes, lest he claim it in his resume on another of his perennial runs.

He also is stridently liberal and progressive and his positions tend to rock the boat a bit with the conservadems, the DLC, and the BCBS Dogs. So they don't like him either.

Couple that with the fact that until recently the repukes have had the run of the place and you have a recipe where he isn't going to get much that he sponsors or cosponsors to go anywhere.

Blaming or hating on him for not getting much done is ridiculous because of this.

[Ozymanithrax]

98. The fact that he doesn't get anything done isn't popular with people.

I agree with most of his stands. But that was all they were (until now) stands. He was never willing to recognize that he had to get his hands dirty and compromise (yes, the c word) to get something good done.

Back when Bush was "P" and republicans controlled everything he spoke truth to power. He never left that mode.

He wasn't capable of building a coalition that could pass a bill and get things done.

Until now he refused to join a group that was willing to pass something, even if it wasn't everything they wanted.

Deeds speak much louder than words. Kucinich has finally decided to do something and I support him in that decision.

[kenfrequed]

101. Eh...

But compromise during the Bush era WAS the problem.

[liberation]

54. Oh, is this when moderate conservatives get to redefine what "progressive" is?

I had no problem with the center-right crowd leaving the GOP once the conservative brand became damaged beyond repair. But good grief, don't pretend to take over the "progressive" moniker and drive our brand to the ground too.

Get your own brand, I heard "compromised milquetoast" is not taken, and it is a compound term... so you get two for one.

[Ignis]

97. Fail: IWR vote. Care to try again? (nt)

[ermasdaughter]

38. The Civil Rights Act of 57

When Eisenhower signed the Civil Rights Act of 57 everyone and I mean EVERYONE thought it was a dud - and perhaps it was on the face of it. MLK was livid with the bill that, at it's core, ONLY offered African Americans the right to vote and not much else. Clearly MUCH more was needed and everyone knew it. But it opened the door for the the Civil Rights Act 64 which bought sweeping changes to the laws of the land.

Those of you who expected this bill, in one fell swoop, to solve all or even many of the problems of Health care need to read up on our history. We as a nation don't seem to work like that. We take small steps and keep fighting.

PASS THE BILL!!!

Good for Kucinich.

[liberation]

57. Good grief. Are you serious?

You had to go all the way to 57, and use a completely unrelated piece of legislation to justify this POS?

Funny, you didn't give recent pieces of legislation like the Patriot Act, or NAFTA which are closer in nature to what this bill is. Hum, I wonder why?

[ermasdaughter]

61. YES, I am!

What difference does it make when the legislation was passed? Moreover its completely analogous to health care reform and illustrates the point: Some issues are very difficult to get enacted into law and don't always begin where everyone would like. Both of these pieces of legislation illustrate that. But the former illustrates that once the door is opened the platform for change can be built upon.

[SocialistLez]

52. Ugh

This makes me want to do horrible things but I think I'll just throw stuff around my house to vent my anger, sort of like when Bush was reelected.

::screams::

[GoddessOfGuinness]

116. Welcome to DU!

~catches vase before it is hopelessly smashed~

[lumberjack_jeff]

56. He got almost as much mileage out of "principles" as Bart Stupak. n/t

[WheelWalker]

58. He has found The Middle Way. This is the path of less suffering

for himself and others. It is good.

[S_E_Fudd]

66. I will give credit where credit is due...

I am most emphatically NOT a fan of Dennis Kucinich. I think he has wasted his time in Congress...

However, on this issue I appreciate that he has taken a longer view and is doing the right thing. And I also appreciate that he has not apparently tried to extract any future promises from the President...

So Kudos!

[craigmatic]

68. Peer pressure works Obama won

[SandWalker1984]

70. Dennis is nothing more than a grand standing politician after all.

A wise man once said "It is easier to fight for principles then to live up to them."


Dennis today has proven he does not live up to them.

[robcon]

72. He's been bought off. I don't his opinion would change otherwise.

He's been offered something (or maybe he's been threatened with something.)

His actions make no sense otherwise.

[LibDemAlways]

109. They must have something on him, and they showed him

what it is during that flight on Air Force One. Principled people generally stick to their principles except under coercion.

[1American]

110. Kucinich being "bought off"

"Bought off"...that is nonsense bordering stupidity!
If you read the conservative websites (which you probably
adhere to) you will discover that the Republican party is the
Party of OMG-NO...I call them the Party of sNOt because of
their arrogant, self-serving behavior.

No, Kucinich was not bought off..think about the state he
serves!

November 2 is the critical time to remove the scheming
right-wingers out of office. Replace them with new, original
thinking younger men and women.
I will remain an independent with Democratic Party leanings
toward the middle.

[martymar64]

135. He should've demanded that Obama fire Rahm in exchange for his vote

That would have been reasonable.

[jimmyzvoice]

75. Thank you Dennis Kucinich…

I watched all of Congressmen Kucinich’s news conference today.
I am with him in today’s decision to vote for the bill and his
continued quest for Single Payer Medicare for all. He is
dedicated, passionate, and honest. We need more like him in
congress.

I heard recently that the health insurance industry is
spending a million dollars a day to oppose this bill.
Shouldn't that make us all want to support it and work to
improve it over time?

[Eric J in MN]

77. Radio host Ed Schultz's response...

...on his radio show today:

Dennis Kucinich played every card he had before he folded. A principled Yes.

[eyepaddle]

90. I don't listen to Ed much at all, but I think that sums it up.

Not to get into the famous 11th dimensional chess, I get the feeling that the bill would've drifted even further to the right if not for the voices of the progressive caucus--down to DK here at the end.

[Iowa]

112. +1

[h9socialist]

82. THANK YOU DENNIS!

Glad you're back in the fold!

[JoePhilly]

83. "Game over man, game over!!!"

[Towlie]

91. "Come see the stupidity inherent in the system! Help, help, my healthcare is being repressed!"

I just love saying things via movie quotes.

[BREMPRO]

84. you can't always get what you want, but if you try sometime.. you'll get what you need

kudos to Kucinich for fighting to the end for his priciples and finally recongnizing the benifits of passing this bill and political reality. The legislatiion will reign in the worst practices of the insurance industry build a framework for further improvements (like a public option, medicare buyin etc..) and get us on a path to a better and sustainable health care system.

[martymar64]

136. They won't enforce SEC regulations, what makes you think they will enforce HI regulations?

[mdmc]

86. God Bless DK

pass this crap and move on dot org..

[Green_Lantern]

88. it's not about centrism or DK caving in

It's simply realizing that the Republican use of the filibuster in the Senate has made it so the only way to pass meaningful health care reform is by having the consensus of 60 Democrats, including 10 corporatist Dems. Without these 60 votes the other option is to sit around and wait until we have 60 progressive Dems in the Senate.

We would produce no legislation and end up with GOP back in the majority.

[LibDemAlways]

107. With this POS bill the GOP will be in the majority again come

November. The corporate media has been very quiet about the details. Once this thing is signed and people find out they are being forced under IRS threat to do business with a bunch of crooks, do you honestly think they are going to go to the ballot box and reward the ones who did it to them?

[Green_Lantern]

113. I'm not sure..

The corporate media has been pushing tea party lies about this bill so it's hard to say what voters will believe.

But I don't think the majority of voters will oppose what this bill actually does.

I don't think people will have to be forced to buy insurance under this bill since it's a total myth that the uninsured people in this country are choosing to not have health insurance.

I find it odd that some progressives are perpetuating that myth.

[LibDemAlways]

115. People who are barely scraping by now without insurance aren't

going to suddenly come up with the money to pay for it - even with subsidies. A poster on this site who is in favor of the bill quoted after-subsidy premiums of $6200 per year for a family of four grossing $66K a year. That's nearly a tenth of their before tax income and doesn't address co-pays and deductibles. There's no way that's affordable given the high cost of everything else. What are people supposed to do without in order to come up with that kind of money? Food, clothes, transportation, a roof over their heads?

Many people will still be a major illness away from economic ruin, and they'll be forced to enrich the coffers of big corporations in the process. Doesn't sound like a good deal to me.

[Green_Lantern]

119. without this bill how high will premiums be?

Secondly we don't even know what'll be in the final bill so we don't know what it'll do to premiums. We do know it puts caps on premiums which is a major accomplishment.

[handmade34]

92. Thank you Dennis Kuchinich!!

[Laelth]

95. Rats. Even DK can be pressured. This is sad. n/t

:dem:

-Laelth

[Tarc]

96. And the "progressives" throw Kucinich under the bus in 3...2...1...

[sulphurdunn]

99. Obama never publically leaned on any Blue Dog

to support his so called HCR. In fact, he used them to destroy any kind pf public competition to the insurance industry. Obama sold out the American people, not Kucinich. He merely symbolizes the relative power imbalance that exists in Congress between the liberal minority and the de facto conservative majority. What just happened to Kucinich speaks volumes about how conservatives rule regardless of which party is in power.

[earcandle]

100. Dennis knows what he is doing. Thanks again DK!

[NICO9000]

104. I think 2014 is the poison pill here

Does any of this even take effect before then? If not, that'll give Rethugs plenty of time to fuck with this bill even further, especially if they gain seats (or God forbid) a majority/WH in 2012. They could pass legislation to eradicate the bill, yes? Then President Romney/Palin (a major God forbid there) or some currently unknown clown could sign it and be done with it. I'm pretty sure Obama has just consigned himself to the failed one-termer column.

The Democratic Party has been a joke for about 20 years or so at this point. I've said for many years that a vote for Democrats is basically a vote for slightly less repression. After 9/11, they folded and that was it. I've never voted R in my life and wouldn't do so if you put a gun to my head. The only Democrat I stopped voting for was DiFi for many reasons. I was always suspect of her, but after the 2000 coup, I'd had it. Back then, I wrote to her about Bush's nomination of anti-labor Elaine Chao for "labor" secretary. Her paraphrased response : "I believe a president has the right to have the cabinet he chooses." That was enough for me.

I really don't know what to think anymore. I knew Obama was a centrist (if not center-right), so I had no illusions about what I was voting for. I want to believe his heart is in the right place, but I'm starting to think he's either a RW tool or just a pussy. When you think about how LBJ said his party would be fucked for a generation, but still knocked them into line to vote for the Civil Rights Act because it was the moral thing to do, I have to conclude Obama may just be the latter. I would have preferred a single-payer bill to go down in flames then to have this shit sandwich, and I have no confidence that it will ever be "fixed" by a bunch of cowards/crooks like those in the Democratic party.

:mad:

[Faygo Kid]

108. Here's some immediate benefits

These go into effect right away:

Strengthening Medicare: Health care reform will strengthen and improve Medicare so today’s seniors and future generations have the health care they need by:

Protecting guaranteed Medicare benefits: You will continue to receive all of Medicare’s guaranteed benefits, including doctor and hospital visits and rehabilitation services.

Closing the Medicare Part D coverage gap or “doughnut hole”: In 2010, if you reach the doughnut hole, you will receive a rebate for $250 to help you pay for prescriptions. Beginning in 2011, if you reach the doughnut hole, you will receive a 50 percent discount on your drugs. The doughnut hole will be fully closed over the next 10 years.

Providing preventive care, such as screenings for cancer and diabetes, free of charge: You will no longer have to pay out of pocket for preventive care services. You will also be able to work with your doctor to develop your own plan to keep you as healthy as possible.

Improving access to primary care doctors: Your primary care doctor will receive bonuses for treating people in Medicare, so you can get higher quality and better coordinated care.
Making Insurance Affordable: Health care reform will make insurance more affordable for older Americans and hold down overall health care costs by:
Protecting Retirees: If you have retiree health coverage through your employer and are between 55 and 64, new Federal funds will encourage your employer to continue offering you health benefits.
Covering the Sick: If you can’t find affordable coverage because of your medical history, you will have access to temporary insurance coverage.
Providing Preventive Care: Your insurance company will be required to provide you with preventive care, such as immunizations and screenings for cancer or diabetes, free of charge.
Helping Young Adults: If your young adult son or daughter needs health insurance, you can cover them on your insurance policy until they are 26 years old.
Promoting Healthy Living: You will be able to make healthier choices because chain restaurants and vending machines will be required to disclose nutrition content.
Helping Small Businesses: If you work for a small business, your employer may be eligible for tax credits that would cover up to 50 percent of your premiums.

Holding Insurers Accountable: Health care reform will stop insurance company abuses and discrimination by:
Preventing annual or lifetime limits: Insurance companies will be prevented from imposing lifetime limits or arbitrary annual limits on coverage, which will give you the peace of mind of knowing that your benefits won’t run out just when you need them most.
Limiting insurance company profits: New consumer protections will make sure insurance companies spend the bulk of their revenues paying for your medical care—not insurance companies’ overhead—and provide rebates to you if they don’t.
Preventing insurance companies from dropping the sick: Insurance companies will no longer be able to deny you affordable coverage when you get sick.

Living Independently: Health reform will give you and your loved ones more choices to live independently at home as you age:
Expanding access to home and community-based services: Your state will receive new financial incentives to provide more access to the services and supports you need to live independently in your home and community.
Making informed choices about long-term care: Finding information on long-term care can be overwhelming. This legislation provides funding for “one-stop shops” to make it easier to get the information you need.
Providing better information and accountability for nursing home care: There will be a better process for you to file complaints about quality of care at a nursing home, and more information about complaints that have been filed. You will also get more information on nursing home quality and consumer rights. There will be improved training to help health professionals care for people with dementia and to help nursing homes prevent abuse.
Improving criminal background checks for long-term care: The legislation expands a successful program that runs criminal background checks on employees of long-term care providers to help prevent potential abuse of older adults and people with disabilities needing long-term care.

[judesedit]

121. Thank you, Dennis. This is just the beginning of a change that is decades overdue

Keep speaking out

[Zorra]

124. Well, I guess time will tell if he made the right decision. "We Don't Get Fooled Again"

by The Who is playing over and over in my head right now.

[Shining Jack]

125. Sigh !

I can't help finding this depressing. :(

[RBInMaine]

126. Good Dennis. You are being SENSIBLE ! Now persuade others !

[RBInMaine]

128. Only on DU would "progressives" toss Dennis under a bus. They really need to get on meds.

Dennis finally used some common sense and realizes this is a START that needs to happen. He is using good judgment. And the ultra left needs to get a grip and into reality. Give it up nutties. We have Dennis. We have Bernie. We have Big Ed. You've not nuts rolling around in your heads.

[AllyCat]

129. I'm sorry. The fact that he had to have a discussion with his family tells me

he was unduly coerced. Tin foil hat firmly in place and flame suit zipped. This bill sucks. He knows it and has fought against it and now with no changes, he votes for it.

What a crock. I'm so done with this Congress I could just scream. I'll vote in local elections and work for local candidates, but cannot support any of these people anymore. I'm done sending them money (maybe Grayson, we'll see). But this is the final nail in the coffin of the American dream of having health care be part of "the general welfare". It might be the genereal welfare for corporate citizens and "persons" but the rest of us are screwn.

[Xenotime]

131. Awesome!!

[DCBob]

133. So are there any elected progressive Democrats against the bill now?

It appears its now just the blue dogs and GOPers fighting the bill.

[vanboggie]

137. Then quit bitchin' and take it to the streets

Kucinich did everything he could for the little people like us. He has no choice but to vote yes on this bill - good or bad it is something. Do you think it would be better if he stood with the tea-bagging Rethugs?

Take it to the streets. I've been out there and it's lonely as hell. Get off Facebook and DU, turn off the TV and do something. It's the only thing that will change the status quo.

[Cha]

140. Good!

[ProudDad]

141. The corrupt USAmerikan Imperial system corrupts all it touches... (n/t)