Report: More crossers are being deported

[Ptah]

Source: Arizona Daily Star. Tucson, AZ

PHOENIX - The Obama administration is deporting more illegal
immigrants than ever before. Statistics compiled at Syracuse
University challenge criticism by Republicans, including
Gov. Jan Brewer, that federal authorities are failing to deal with the problem.

Findings by the Transactional Records Access Clearinghouse at Syracuse
show more illegal immigrants were removed from the United States during
the first nine months of this fiscal year than during the same period in
2008, when Republican George W. Bush was president and controlled immigration enforcement.

The number of those ejected from the country between Oct. 1, 2009, and June 30
of this year is nearly twice as high as it was in the same period ending June 30, 2005.

The TRAC report also shows the Obama administration is devoting more resources
to removing those who have committed serious crimes.

Read more: http://azstarnet.com/news/local/border/article_bb4c50a8-3e86-5187-a243-7c7f1b69d3c1.html

[Xenotime]

1. This is so sad. How many families are being torn apart because of stupid laws?

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

2. "Dem laws is dem laws" crush-the-weaker fetishists in 3... 2... 1...

[Kweli4Real]

3. Yes ... some families are being torn apart ...

by the deportations; but look at whom this administration is choosing to focus on ... those undocumented immigrants that have been accused, and convicted, of committing serious crimes. Compare that to those that the right would focus on ... any and everyone Brown.

I would think that we would want the criminal element gone, rather than incarcerate them here.

But that said, we democrats/liberals/progressives should be focusing our attention on pressuring congress for a path to citizenship for undocumented immigrants that includes timelines and background checks.

[JDPriestly]

6. These criminals are in many cases young and foolish, and believe me,

they, too, have families. And their mothers sob and cry as they watch the judges in the Immigration Court deport their children.

I see both sides of this issue.

Many of those deported due to crimes are here legally. And a lot of their crimes have to do with possession of weapons or assault. It's really hard on the families. When green cards are issued, they should be accompanied by a warning in the language of the person in whose name the card is issued about our laws regarding gun possession, assault, especially of a family member and other such crimes.

[EFerrari]

11. What criminals are you talking about?

[JDPriestly]

13. The criminals who are immigrants and are deported due

to crimes.

[EFerrari]

10. That's the hype but there's no indication that it's true. nt

[JDPriestly]

14. It is true. Go to an immigration court, especially one that

deals with people were came here legally and are being deported for criminal acts. I'm not saying that they should be allowed to stay here. I'm just saying that the families are torn apart. It is heartbreaking. Those who have committed certain types of offenses can never return to the U.S. At least that was the law a few years ago. I don't think it has changed.

The mothers cry when their children are deported.

[proud2BlibKansan]

15. Once they're deported they can NEVER come back unless they post a $3000 bond

I know dozens of families who have been affected by this. These people are NOT criminals. I know a couple who were witnesses in court and deported as soon as they testified. They had not committed a crime, they were witnesses.

But if they don't post bond they can NEVER return to the US.

[JDPriestly]

32. For a poor mother with other children living here, that means that she

will never see her child again. We must remember that. It is in some cases almost a death sentence.

[proud2BlibKansan]

40. One of my former students told me "My dad might as well be dead"

He was deported to Dominican Republic. Way too far to go visit.

[pinboy3niner]

33. Witnesses may be eligible for the U Visa program

I just read about this in the L.A. Times:

The U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services agency's U visa gives temporary legal status to people who suffer physical or mental abuse from crimes and help authorities apprehend perpetrators.

By Teresa Watanabe, Los Angeles Times
August 2, 2010

U.S. immigration officials are boosting efforts to protect immigrant crime victims with increased funding and greater outreach to publicize visa opportunities for those who assist law enforcement in prosecuting their perpetrators.
<snip>

The so-called U visa grants temporary legal status to those who suffer substantial physical or mental abuse in specified major crimes and help authorities pursue the cases; after three years, visa holders can apply for permanent residency.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-crime-visa-20100802,0,950731.story

[proud2BlibKansan]

41. The two I know personally were just witnesses, not victims.

[superconnected]

39. They really ought not be committing those crimes. I mean come on.

If someone goes into any country legally and start committing crimes they should expect to be deported.

[EFerrari]

59. No, what I mean is, two things. One, Mexican immigrants

have a lower, not higher, incidence of criminal behavior than other groups. And two, there is no indication that I know of that the administration is focusing on criminal immigrants in their sweeps.

[Lightning Count]

62. Illegal immigrants have a 100% rate of criminal behavior.

:).

[EFerrari]

65. Well, no. They don't. n/t

[Luciferous]

68. Yes, they do. They are here illegally, which means they are

breaking the law. That's not including the fraud and identity theft.

[Lightning Count]

5. Hopefully, this guy is sent back by those stupid laws.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2010/08/03/128964178/nun-s-death-by-illegal-immigrant-s-alleged-dui-joins-national-debate

[Xenotime]

18. Why do you say that? Doesn't he have human rights just like everyone else?

[Lightning Count]

20. He has the human right to be sent back for trial.

:)

[lynne]

26. No "sending back" for trial for him -

- He's been tried in the county where he did the crime. They don't want him deported, they want him to get and serve the maximum sentence.

[Lightning Count]

27. Guess you get the human right of the punishment phase of your home country then. nt

[lynne]

28. More like the rights of the punishment phase of his victim's country -

- as that's where the crime occurred. Sounds fair to me.

[Igel]

7. Few necessarily so.

It seems to work this way:

If an immigrant tears his (or her) family apart by immigrating, the US is horribly wrong because it doesn't allow the entire family to immigrate. The immigrant, in breaking up his own family, is blameless.

If an immigrant is deported by virtue of breaking the law or having an "irregular" status, the US is wrong if s/he's established any familial bonds in the US. The immigrant, in violating the law, is blameless.

In the first case, the immigrant has voluntarily chosen to break up his family--perhaps there are economics behind his decision so that he and his family would die of starvations in the desert back home. Usually not It's not a matter of life or death, it's a matter of quality of life.

In the second, the immigrant has chosen to be in the US by violating immigration law, or s/he chosen to engage in behavior that they know might well result in deportation. I'd be very cautious in having kids or getting hitched in a country I resided in illegally. I'd be starting something I might not finish. Of course, if family unity is really as important as everybody says that the deportee's family would strive to be reunited by going to join him in his original homeland. Some do. Most don't, because the desire to have a better quality of life justifies letting their family remain torn apart. In exactly the same way that in the first case a better quality of life can justify tearing a family apart.

I'm a believer in mercy "rejoicing" against judgment. I'm not a believer in mercy altering the facts and replacing critical thinking or judgment.

[joeglow3]

9. Agreed. Why parents would choose to leave there kids here is beyond me.

Terrible parents.

[proud2BlibKansan]

16. Because they have a better life here; it's actually very easy to understand.

Better schools, a lower crime rate, safer communities, better paying jobs.

Of course they leave their kids here. I know I would if I was in their position.

[joeglow3]

17. But then, it is THEIR decision to split up the family

I don't get people blasting the government.

[proud2BlibKansan]

19. Actually it's not

Their decision was to make a better life for their family in spite of the risks. I find that admirable.

[joeglow3]

21. As do I.

And I would do the same thing. However, as someone who was left near homeless when illegal immigrants flooded my father's profession (drywall) in the 80's & 90's, I expect the laws to be enforced. It is easy to sit there and support the practice, so long as you are not the working class family that ends up on street as a result of this (which happened to many of my father's friends). Thus, if you break the law, you should expect to pay the price when you are caught.

[proud2BlibKansan]

22. And I am inclined to blame the employers who hire the workers

rather than the workers. The real criminal behavior is by the contractors who hire the laborers. Yet we call the workers criminals while ignoring the folks who get rich off their labor. There's a contractor here who pays one dollar an hour and gets away with it while the immigrants he hires are being painted as public enemy #1.

[Lightning Count]

23. If the workers have ID, then is it a crime?

Like has been argued with the police, employers are not set up to check immigration status.

[proud2BlibKansan]

24. If a liquor store sells booze to a minor with a fake ID, what happens?

[Lightning Count]

25. Not sure.

I suppose the questions are "what should happen" and "why". If they have a real ID with a very similar photo, then I would hope they would not be blamed. Same goes if they had a good fake ID.

[proud2BlibKansan]

29. The store owner is penalized

Same deal when they sell cigarettes to minors.

But we ignore employers who hire undocumented workers. And forget about the fake ID, since it's still easy to get a job without an ID. The contractors who hire day laborers off the street aren't checking for ID.

[Lightning Count]

30. Shouldn't be that way though....

How can a store counter worker be expected to be an ID or photo expert. That is nuts.

Not sure we ignore them. Been several raids lately. The excuse is always that they had a valid SSN and valid ID though.

Also, stopping contractors is almost impossible unless you have roving bans of ICE inspectors to check construction crews.

[proud2BlibKansan]

34. The law expects store owners to be experts

Whether it's fair or not, that's the law.

If they have a valid ID and SS number, they aren't undocumented. No law has been broken.

Construction crews can be monitored. Other businesses are. Why make an exception for the construction industry? That's not fair to the nursery/garden shops that are raided fairly often. Or the restaurants.

[Lightning Count]

36. So Arizona would be in-line with that if they expected their officers to be immigration experts.

Afterall, it would just be another form of ID evaluation. Like not having a license or any other identification or having ID that looks faked?

If they have a valid ID(but their older brother's) and are buying alcohol, what is the difference?

Please outline how construction crews can be monitored. The difference between the industries is that they are picked up and then paid in cash. No paper trail.

[proud2BlibKansan]

42. Don't contractors need permits?

Perhaps they could be required to submit worker documentation when applying for building permits.

[Lightning Count]

43. If you're working on the books....

Even if you're requiring daily permits, nothing stops a contractor from taking the pickup truck to a day labor spot and carting a load of cash paid workers to the construction site. That is why it's so prevalent.

[proud2BlibKansan]

44. It was also very easy to buy liquor under age when I was young

It's literally impossible today due to enforcement and strict penalties.

If we really wanted to fix this we could.

[Lightning Count]

45. We didn't have holograms or RFID chips when I was a kid either.

:).

[proud2BlibKansan]

47. Or cell phones or personal computers

Parents could also beat the shit out of their kids and get away with it. And men could beat their wives. I remember well one night when the woman up the street banged on our door asking for help after her husband beat her up. My dad called the police who said sorry there was nothing they could do.

Thankfully times have changed. And as a society we have a choice to make. Here's hoping the right choice will be made, as we have done in the past.

[Lightning Count]

48. There were good and bad things.

Obesity rates were much lower. Reality TV did not exist. There was more green space, etc. And every movie in Hollywood did not seem to be a remake.

[LanternWaste]

66. I imagine selectivity...

I imagine selectivity allows one to better validate a pre-defined belief.

[joeglow3]

31. I support going after both, as both are criminals

Frankly, "well, he gets to do it" is not an argument I lend much credence to.

[proud2BlibKansan]

35. I don't consider kids who are brought here by their parents to be criminals

It's pretty hard for me to look at a child and call him a criminal.

[joeglow3]

37. In almost all cases, the kid is not the criminal

However, just because mom and dad managed to squeeze out a kid doesn't mean they are no longer guilty of crimes. As I have said before, it is the PARENTS who comitted the crime, the PARENTS who have to pay the price and the PARENTS who decide to split up the family.

[LanternWaste]

64. Decisions made under duress...

Decisions made under duress are not really decisions at all.

[Mopar151]

4. The folks I hear carrying on about immigration

Have never made rational arguments - they are upset that service workers do not speak "English", and they fear "illegals" commit an inordinate number of crimes. Both of these themes seem driven by Fox and the radio talkers, not reality.

[MikeW]

49. no but how about

Travel to Miami sometime .. I lived there for quite a while. I left because it was getting hard
to do any business in town in english ... aka no one spoke it!.

The communities are not integrated they form their own community and it looks less and less like America as time goes on.

Different cultures are great but when you enter this country and become a citizen you need to integrate into our society.

There are some rational arguments you just disagree with them.

[proud2BlibKansan]

51. What does America look like to you, Mike?

Do tell.

[MikeW]

54. nice dodge ... nice attempt to deflect the issue

Why dont you try commenting rather than being provocative.

So you agree that these communities are fully integrated into our society? American values? American way? Language? Government?
Because without that your essentially saying its ok to set up a foreign country compound on American soil.

Maybe you should do some reading on the exact same problems France is experiencing right now with the same issue.

[proud2BlibKansan]

55. It's not a deflection, Mike

I'm curious. What does America look like to you? My America is rich in diversity with a variety of cultures and people from many backgrounds. I'm gathering your America is somewhat different from mine. And I would like for you to describe it for me.

I am also going to suggest problems in France may be due to bigotry and disagreement on what France looks like to various French people.

You know what they say about the eye of the beholder. So please tell me what does your America look like?

[MikeW]

60. CCSF has a very nice explination

I dont articulate well but this sums up exactly what I was after.

"When immigrants arrive in the United States, they will be exposed to the American culture and many other cultures. To assimilate into the American society, immigrants have to assimilate into the American culture and the other cultures which exist in American society. If they don't do so, they will be isolated from the mainstream, and they also will separate into many groups which belong to their own cultures. Generally speaking, one race has one culture. Usually, people who belong to different cultures have different ways to do things and solve problems. If people don't understand cultures other than their own, they may not understand what other people are doing or why they do in different ways. That's the misunderstanding between races. Conflicts emerge. Therefore, immigrants' assimilation into new cultures is very important to the society. "

It is from http://www.ccsf.edu/Resources/Tolerance/

[Mopar151]

63. The irony is

Many of the most vocal on this subject (at least the ones I hear) are of French-Canadian ancestry, and French was often spoken in the home. There seems to be a resentment issue - they feel that spanish speakers are accomidated more than Acadians were. As to the crime issue, any other ethnic group, IMHO, is far behind the shallow end of the caucasian gene pool in sheer depravity. As a very politically incorrect friend of mine put it: "Colored people go bad, white people go rancid!"

[EFerrari]

57. You realize that Spanish was spoken in Florida long before English, right?

So, if someone came along and set up another country in Florida, it wasn't Spanish speakers.

[Lightning Count]

61. And many languages before that.

Maybe we should bring back some of the Native languages.

[EFerrari]

67. Whoooooooooooooooosh.

[thereismore]

8. See what overturning Prop 8 can lead to?

:rofl:

[EFerrari]

12. Obama promised reform, not deportation. nt

[MikeW]

50. he never promissed to end deportation

and deportation has to be part of the reform.

Sorry but there have to be consequences.

[proud2BlibKansan]

52. Consequences for who, Mike?

Do you favor consequences for employers who hire undocumented workers?

[MikeW]

53. consequences for both parties

they are both complicit but not equally.

[proud2BlibKansan]

56. Define the parties.

[EFerrari]

58. There is no comprehensive reform right now. There is only deportation.

Your argument makes no sense whatsoever.

[superconnected]

38. I would be fine with this if they would deport them within even a few months of crossing.

Not after they've worked here for years, started a family and have kids that have never see Mexico before. At that point just make them Citizens.

[slackmaster]

46. I keep thinking that "crosser" sounds like British slang for cross-dresser

Am I wrong?