19 U.S. citizens charged with trying to join Somali terror group

[Turborama]

Source: MSNBC

Attorney General Eric Holder said 19 people have been charged with providing support for the terrorist group al-Shabab in Somalia. Holder said the charges reflect a disturbing trend that leaders in Muslim communities in the United States are try to help law enforcement agencies address.

Most of the people are U.S. citizens, with some supporting the terrorist organization from the United States and others traveling to Somalia to do so.

The charges in Minnesota are the latest development in an inquiry in that state which has been under way for some time.

Two indictments unsealed in Minnesota on Thursday added five new names to a list of people charged in the investigation in that state, bringing the total charged in the state to 19. Two were women from the Rochester, Minn., area accused of raising money for al-Shabab.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38575468/ns/us_news-security/

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Fareed Zakaria had a fascinating discussion about Somalia and al-Shabab a couple of weeks ago.

Here's part 1 (skip to 30 secs in to avoid the intro on both parts) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GATGmsub6ps

& part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AX5SRCDOLuA

Transcript: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1007/18/fzgps.01.html

[rocktivity]

1. Sounds like a setup-y thingy

Don't be surprised if there's an overzealous informant at the root of all this. By the way, what constitutes a "link"?

:headbang:
rocktivity

[rocktivity]

2. Case in point

Informant who ensnared Bronx terror suspects avoided by nearly everyone else at Newburgh mosque

5/23/09: ...Driving a silver Hummer or black Mercedes-Benz, Shahed (Malik) Hussain arrived at the Masjid al-Ikhlas mosque Friday mornings and stayed for hours in the parking lot trying to chat up those who seemed to be down on their luck. He offered meals, jobs and advice on how to get rich.

"If you need anything, just let me know," Hussain, 52, would say, according to people approached by him.

He was friendly. Too friendly. And that's what made everyone nervous.

"We would go to the person after he talked to them, and tell them to stay away," worshiper Shafeeq Abdulwaly, 39, said...

:eyes:
rocktivity

[EFerrari]

5. I want to find out if this group is real because I've seen it mentioned

several times now and want to know if it's a new product roll out or what the deal is.

[The Magistrate]

7. What is Real, Ma'am?

There is not much organization in Somalia at present. There was a faction of the Islamic Courts movement there which went by the al'Shabaab name. People using the name seem to be in the saddle in the south of the country. What it means specifically is anyone's guess. There are a lot of people running around there who know nothing but the gun.

[EFerrari]

9. That's a good question.

I think I mean it would be interesting to figure out if there is a group in the position to recruit Americans or if the name is being used to pull a reaction from the American public or if there is some other possibility.

[Alamuti Lotus]

12. No, this is absolutely true

as the Magistrate begins, Hizbu-'l ash-Shabaab (in English they kinda refer to themselves as the Youth Resistance Front or somesuch things, another Arabic version is Harakat al-Shabaab al-Mujahideen, "Movement of Warrior Youth"--"al-Shabaab" by itself means "the Youth" and similar implications) is formerly a faction of the Islamic Courts Union -- the only movement to successfully rule most of Somalia since the overthrow of the dictator Mohammed Said Barre. The 'courts' were funded and set up by businessmen sick of the warlords and the chaos; several largely irreconciliable factions coalesced into a government as they were able to drive out the US-backed warlord ruling at the time (I forget his name now). Some of the militants around Sheikh Hassan Dahir Aweys (a fine man with a long history, a former party of his was co-formed by Sheikh Ussamah while the latter was based out of the Sudan but was broken apart by US-backed warlords and mercenaries) began speaking of uniting all Somalis that were currently under Kenyan and Ethiopian occupation. Ethiopia took offense to such suggestions and invaded the country; ICU overthrown, chaos reigns, ICU splinters and becomes the victorious resistance in the form of al-Shabaab and other resistance movements.
The core Amirs of Shabaab itself splintered off from Aweys' movement (right now called Hizbu-'l Islam, formerly al-Itihaad al-Islamiya and more recently the Alliance for the Re-Liberation of Somalia) and are far more radical and successful than he. I think Aweys was driven north of Muqdishu, they raided and cleared out some pirate havens and set up shop there. al-Shabaab do have connections to Somalis living here, they get much money from some Somali-American businessmen and according to the tabloids the band of suicide fighters that struck the breakaway province of Puntland were recruited from the States. I'm not sure if that is true or not.

The gaps in my history lesson could be driven through with a truck; but suffice it to say that this subject is not an invention of the yellow press. Embellishment, I am sure, but no invention.

[The Magistrate]

14. Some Of the Question, Sir, is Whether The People Arrested Here Actually Contacted the Group

It is not impossible that there was such contact, certainly. But it is not impossible, either, that these people never had any dealings with anyone who was not an agent of U.S. law enforcement.

[Alamuti Lotus]

17. the women seem to have

the guys involved appear to be largely chumps and patsies indeed, but what is kinda more interesting to me is the timeline of accusations towards the two women: fundraising and money transfers from 2008-2009, back when they were 'only' the key resistance movement in forcing out the Ethiopian occupation.

[The Magistrate]

18. That Does Have A Solid Ring, Sir

But there are two questions that come to the mind of a practiced advocatus diaboli. First, can they really trace the money through the hole and corner arrangements practiced in the 'money shops' of the Middle East? Second, why are the prosecutors not arguing for immediate detention of the persons with the strongest apparent actual ties to the armed body? At this point, we cannot rule out the possibility the women were scamming the donors....

[EFerrari]

16. Thank you. I didn't know that history. nt

[The Magistrate]

13. A Young Man Recently Was Arrested Here In Chicago On Such Charges, Ma'am

He had been in contact with an informant for many months, working in a place that sold and translated Korans. He is said to have said a good many imflammatory things, and to have been departing the country for Somalia by some circuitous route. It is not clear he had contact with anyone but the informant, however. Under the law, though, that is not necessary: if you say you want to join such a group, and make any attempt to do so, even if it is one wholly directed through an agency provided by law enforcement, you have committed a crime. It is hard on fools, certainly: the thing reminds me of kids who read a few issues of 'High Times' and thought they would have a great and profitable time buying pounds of marijuana in Kingston or Cartagena years ago, trips which seldom turned out well. But there is to be said for keeping the amateurs out, and giving people the idea that if you hear somebody talking up the virtues of violence by some religious group or other, it might be a good idea to tell him to shut the fuck up and get the hell away from you, rather than say, 'Cool, I'm so down with that", or words to that effect.....

[EFerrari]

15. LOL. That's pretty good advice, your Honor. n/t

[The Magistrate]

8. What is Real, Ma'am?

There is not much organization in Somalia at present. There was a faction of the Islamic Courts movement there which went by the al'Shabaab name. People using the name seem to be in the saddle in the south of the country. What it means specifically is anyone's guess. There are a lot of people running around there who know nothing but the gun.

[marmar]

3. Did they offer them cool Jihad boots like they did the Miami "terrorist" wannabes?

nt

[EFerrari]

4. Thanks for those links!

I want to see that.

[Turborama]

6. It's a really good discussion, unfortunately the YouTuber has added some conspiracy stuff to go with

it. The transcript is worth a read, just to make sure the YouTube version hasn't cut anything out.

[Turborama]

10. MSNBC totally changed the article again (at least the 3rd time)

1st it was 14, then they changed it to 19 and now it's 14 again, even though in the article it says "at least 7 of the 14 are US citizens". So, what is it? And now they are solely attributing it to AP...

14 U.S. citizens charged with trying to join Somali terror group

updated 8/5/2010 6:08:26 PM ET

The government announced Thursday that it has charged 14 people as participants in "a deadly pipeline" to Somalia that routed money and fighters from the United States to the terrorist group al-Shabab.

The indictments unsealed in Minneapolis, San Diego and Mobile, Ala., reflect "a disturbing trend" of recruitment efforts targeting U.S. residents to become terrorists, Attorney General Eric Holder told a news conference. In one case, two women pleaded for money "to support violent jihad in Somalia," according to an indictment.

The attorney general credited Muslim community leaders in the United States for regularly denouncing terrorists and for providing critical assistance to law enforcement to help disrupt terrorist plots and combat radicalization. "We must ... work to prevent this type of radicalization from ever taking hold," Holder said.

At least seven of the 14 people charged are U.S. citizens and 10, all from Minnesota, allegedly left the United States to join al-Shabab. Seven of the 10 had been charged previously in the probe.

Same link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38575468/ns/us_news-security

[Turborama]

11. Link to the actual press conference to get the full picture of what he said

Here: http://www.c-span.org/Watch/Media/2010/08/05/HP/A/36620/Atty+Gen+Eric+Holder+Press+Conference+on+Arrest+of+SomaliAmericans.aspx