STOCK MARKET WATCH, Friday October 8

[ozymandius]

Source: du

STOCK MARKET WATCH, Friday October 8, 2010

AT THE CLOSING BELL ON October 7, 2010

Dow 10,948.58 -19.07 (-0.17%)
Nasdaq 2,383.67 +3.01 (+0.13%)
S&P 500 1,158.06 -1.91 (-0.16%)
10-Yr Bond... 2.38 -0.01 (-0.29%)
30-Year Bond 3.70 -0.02 (-0.40%)

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Market Conditions During Trading Hours

Euro, Yen, Loonie, Silver and Gold

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Bush Administration Officials Convicted = 2
Names: David Safavian, James Fondren

Bush Administration Officials Charged = 1
Name(s): Richard Lopez Razo

Financial Sector Officials Convicted since 1/20/09 = 11

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This thread contains opinions and observations. Individuals may post their experiences, inferences and opinions on this thread. However, it should not be construed as advice. It is unethical (and probably illegal) for financial recommendations to be given here.

Read more: du

[ozymandius]

1. Today's Reports

08:30 Nonfarm Payrolls Sep
Briefing.com -18K
Consensus 0K
Prior -54K

08:30 Nonfarm Private Payrolls Sep
Briefing.com 60K
Consensus 74K
Prior 67K

08:30 Unemployment Rate Sep
Briefing.com 9.7%
Consensus 9.7%
Prior 9.6%

08:30 Hourly Earnings Sep
Briefing.com 0.1%
Consensus 0.2%
Prior 0.3%

08:30 Average Workweek Sep
Briefing.com 34.2
Consensus 34.2
Prior 34.2

10:00 Wholesale Inventories Aug
Briefing.com 0.5%
Consensus 0.4%
Prior 1.3%

http://www.briefing.com/Investor/Public/Calendars/EconomicCalendar.htm

[tclambert]

16. Around here, the big report we're waiting for comes in tomorrow.

Michigan vs. Michigan State, both undefeated.

[Dr.Phool]

18. The victor to be sacrificed at the altar of Brutus Buckeye!

[InkAddict]

22. O-H...

[zbdent]

32. I-O!

(and I'm from the Pittsburgh PA area ... I had an interesting encounter at a Fridays one time, in the high "college football season" ... the waiter at another table, serving a group with at least one diner flying the colors, went "O-H!" ... I, at another table, and a person from Western PA, was the only person who answered back "I-O!".

I thought that was much more ingrained in Buckeyes than "Peace be with you"/"And also with you" is in Catholics ...)

[DemReadingDU]

35. B-4

Bingo!


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bingo_(U.S.)

edit:
http://tinyurl.com/23j84f7

[zbdent]

91. you sunk my battleship ...

[tclambert]

58. Sadly, I agree. I don't think there is a team in Michigan that can beat OSU.

Including the Detroit Lions.

[Dr.Phool]

27. US economy shed 95,000 jobs last month.

Just a banner on MSNBC.com right now.

[Demeter]

46. Was there ever any doubt?

[Roland99]

28. Sept. jobless rate 9.6% vs 9.7% expected (earnings details inside)

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-economy-loses-95000-nonfarm-jobs-in-sept-2010-10-08?dist=beforebell

The U.S. labor market shed more jobs than expected in September, as state and local governments shed workers during the month. The Labor Department said Friday that total nonfarm payrolls shrank by 95,000 in September, higher than the 8,000 loss expected by Wall Street economists. Private-sector nonfarm employment expanded by 65,000 in September, lower than the 85,000 gain expected. The unemployment rate remained unchanged at 9.6%. Economists forecast the unemployment rate to rise to 9.7%. Average hourly earnings were flat at $22.67, below the 0.2% rise economists anticipated. Earnings are up 1.7% in the past year. August and July payrolls were revised lower by a cumulative 15,000 jobs

[Ghost Dog]

55. U.S. Payroll Drop Tops Forecast on Teacher Firings

Oct. 8 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. lost more jobs than forecast in September as local governments fired teachers and other workers in response to declining tax revenue.

...

Treasuries rose and the dollar weakened as the report bolstered speculation the Federal Reserve will embark on a renewed round of large-scale asset purchases to spur growth. New York Fed President William Dudley said last week that further action is “likely to be warranted” unless the labor market improves.

...

The dollar decreased 0.7 percent to 81.87 yen at 11:40 a.m. in New York, dropping below 82 yen for the first time since 1995. The yield on the 10-year Treasury note fell to 2.34 percent from 2.39 percent late yesterday. The Standard & Poor’s 500 Index rose 0.5 percent to 1,163.25.

/... http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-08/employers-in-u-s-cut-more-jobs-in-september-than-economists-had-estimated.html

[ozymandius]

2. Oil falls below $81 as markets await jobs report

SINGAPORE – Oil prices slipped below $81 a barrel Friday in Asia as investors looked to a key monthly jobs report for clues about the strength of the U.S. economy.

Analysts estimate the U.S. economy likely added a net total of 75,000 private sector jobs in September, but that an equal number of temporary Census jobs were lost, leaving the unemployment rate slightly higher at 9.7 percent from 9.6 percent in August.

In other Nymex trading in November contracts, heating oil rose 0.22 cent to $2.254 a gallon and gasoline was steady at $2.11 a gallon. Natural gas held at $3.614 per 1,000 cubic feet.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/oil_prices

[hamerfan]

7. So....

IF the US economy ever starts to show signs of improvement, the oil speculators will drive up the cost of oil/gas, thus negating any improvement in the US economy.
Pardon me while my head explodes.
hamerfan

[ozymandius]

9. The people who write these headlines just make shit up.

Just like the oil speculators make up reasons either for buying or selling. A person will be interminably frustrated if seeking rationale in these markets.

[Po_d Mainiac]

73. Imagine the pressure on the PA

responsible for fuel contracts with any one of the major airlines. yikes!

[Roland99]

29. Want something to make your head explode even more violently?

Dollar is down and oil is still going down. Oil's been going up all week as the dollar tanked. Guess the fear of a sagging economy was enough to overcome that.

[Po_d Mainiac]

39. Patience

http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX
http://quotes.ino.com/chart/index.html?s=NYMEX_CL.X10.E&t=&a=&w=&v=w

Open the charts and bear in mind the lines will run in opposite directions...Looks kinda confusing don't it.

Now open each chart in the 1 month window...Not so confusing. There is actually a slight lag (disconnect if you will) with oil but gravity almost always wins.

What has been building mountains and valleys in the currency charts, as of late, is the new "bugger thy neighbor" (yes I know how to spell, sometimes) mentality acted out by a bunch of CB's simultaneously.

Yesterday I stated that I would not be surprised if PM's made it back to Wednesdays open by the end of the day..I only missed by a few hours. Metals are now at approx. Wednesdays close.

It was a guess, but somewhat calculated. The CB interventions that used to make impacts that would last for months, are now over in a matter of hours.

IMHO the U$D is turning into the material used to line a ditch, not the pavement we've grown accustomed to...The FED thinking they can print at will and the world will go along, ain't working out quit right.

The price of oil controls every aspect of the dollar and our every day lives. Whatever the FED thinks it can accomplish by QE, the price of oil will unravel. $4 gasoline is not going to put people back onto private sector payrolls.

The scary thing is will Benny quit QE at $100/Bbl oil or $150/Bbl oil?
YMMV

[Demeter]

47. "I Wish I Could Quit You!" Obama to Uncle Ben

[Po_d Mainiac]

49. Spot on!......On the other hand

The bankers wish that Goobermints would quit thinking that they are in control, and just get the the Hell outa the way.

[Festivito]

3. Debt: 10/06/2010 13,624,678,196,435.07 (UP 325,522,262.28) (Wed)

(Up a little. Good day.)
Many state troopers on the way back from Constatine.
(Debt under Obama seems to jump up big then drop slowly maybe up a little and down a little for days--repeat.)
= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 9,018,282,657,267.76 + 4,606,395,539,167.31
UP 102,633,566.23 + UP 222,888,696.05

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: Think 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 310-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.22 THAT'S 1B$, and $3,221.42 makes 1T$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: $9.66, ABOUT TEN BUCKS for a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is the federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)

PERSONALIZED DEBT:
Every 12 seconds we net gain another American, so at the end of the workday of the report, there should be 310,421,792 people in America.
http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html ON 10/04/2010 04:37 -> 310,403,677
Currently, each of these Americans owe $43,890.86.
A family of three owes $131,672.57. (And that is IN ADDITION to their mortgage.)

ANALYSIS:
There were 23 reports in the last 30 to 33 days.
The average for the last 23 reports is 8,231,957,619.44.
The average for the last 30 days would be 6,311,167,508.24.
The average for the last 33 days would be 5,737,425,007.49.
There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 75 reports in 112 days of GWB's part of FY2009 averaging 8.03B$ per report, 5.38B$/day.
There were 174 reports in 253 days of Obama's part of FY2009 averaging 7.33B$ per report, 5.07B$/day so far.
There were 249 reports in 365 days of FY2009 averaging 7.57B$ per report, 5.16B$/day.
There were 255 reports in 371 days of FY2011 averaging 6.72B$ per report, 4.62B$/day.
Above line should be okay

PROJECTION:
There are 837 days remaining in this Obama 1st term.
By that time the debt could be between 14.8 and 18.4T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
01/20/2009 10,626,877,048,913.08 GWB (UP 4,898,681,252,731.43)
10/06/2010 13,624,678,196,435.07 BHO (UP 2,997,801,147,521.99 so far since Obama took office.)

FISCAL YEAR DEBT CHANGE, Sep 30 prior year to Sep 30 named year:
(One "* " for each 40B$ reached)
FY1994 +0,281,261,026,873.94 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1995 +0,281,232,990,696.07 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1996 +0,250,828,038,426.34 ------------* * * * * * WJC
FY1997 +0,188,335,072,261.61 ------------* * * * WJC
FY1998 +0,113,046,997,500.28 ------------* * WJC
FY1999 +0,130,077,892,735.81 ------------* * * WJC
FY2000 +0,017,907,308,253.43 ------------WJC
FY2001 +0,133,285,202,313.20 ------------* * * C&B
01-WJC +0,053,598,528,417.78 ------------* WJC 31% of FY, 40% of FY-Debt
01-GWB +0,079,686,673,895.42 ------------* GWB 69% of FY, 60% of FY-Debt
FY2002 +0,420,772,553,397.10 ------------* * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2003 +0,554,995,097,146.46 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2004 +0,595,821,633,586.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2005 +0,553,656,965,393.18 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2006 +0,574,264,237,491.73 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2007 +0,500,679,473,047.25 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2008 +1,017,071,524,649.92 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2009 +1,885,104,106,599.30 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * B&O
09GWB +0,602,152,152,000.60 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB 31% of FY, 32% of FY-Debt
09-BHO +1,282,951,954,598.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO 69% of FY, 68% of FY-Debt
FY2010 +1,651,794,027,380.00 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO
FY2011 +0,063,055,165,543.30 ------------* BHO
Endof11 +100,484,136,665,617.00 ------------* * too many *s because of too few days * *

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
09/16/2010 -036,646,694,679.28 -
09/17/2010 -000,203,034,896.34 ---
09/20/2010 +000,019,446,813.89 ------------******* Mon
09/21/2010 +000,509,875,602.04 ------------********
09/22/2010 -000,022,020,658.96 ----
09/23/2010 -008,701,405,875.05 --
09/24/2010 +000,034,117,767.19 ------------*******
09/27/2010 -000,066,407,812.28 ---- Mon
09/28/2010 +001,463,391,855.14 ------------*********
09/29/2010 +000,391,315,850.35 ------------********
09/30/2010 +058,907,978,013.89 ------------**********
10/01/2010 -005,585,417,177.51 --
10/04/2010 +000,259,208,393.70 ------------******** Mon
10/05/2010 +000,697,809,032.26 ------------********
10/06/2010 +000,102,633,566.23 ------------********

11,160,795,795.27 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008 while Bush was in power JUST BEFORE fiscal year end.
Bush admin borrowed $962,245,245,654.01 in those last 124 days in office crossing two fiscal years.
$360,093,093,653.42 in last 12 days of FY2008, and $602,152,152,000.59 in subsequent 112 days before leaving office.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
DUer primer on National debt

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) LAST REPORT:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4567099&mesg_id=4567212

[zbdent]

33. Wasn't it amazing?

I mean, it was a constant entry in the Congressional Record ... one Republican was constantly, like clockwork, reciting the latest National Debt numbers, to the penny ...

that was, until September 11, 2001, with a Republican president. Suddenly, it was no longer to be found.

Until Nancy Pelosi became Speaker ... and shortly, the "Debt Clock" re-appeared ...

[Festivito]

86. What amazes me is that the historical information I'm using, slowly disappears over time.

So, if it has been read into the Congressional Record - good.

During Clinton's time, the deficit decrease was the interesting story, not the actual amount of the debt. Not surprising that Republicans would read into the CR the debt, after all, they were promising to reduce the deficit faster than Clinton reduced it.

Then they took power and increased the deficit.

Their story then became that the deficit is below 5% of GDP and Clinton left them a recession. They'd send us a check for $600 per person while borrowing $1500 per person. But, they could not be told that.

I don't know what's more amazing. That we don't know these things or that we do and we forget.

[Festivito]

83. Debt: 10/07/2010 13,615,674,949,267.91 (DOWN 9,003,247,167.16) (Thu)

(Down some. Good day.)
Dinner with young ladies.
(Debt under Obama seems to jump up big then drop slowly maybe up a little and down a little for days--repeat.)
= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
= 9,007,701,456,838.87 + 4,607,973,492,429.04
DOWN 10,581,200,428.89 + UP 1,577,953,261.73

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

THINKING IN BILLIONS: Think 3 or 4 dollars per billion in a 310-Million person America.
If every American, man, woman and child puts in $3.22 THAT'S 1B$, and $3,221.35 makes 1T$.
A family of three: Mom, Dad, Child: $9.66, ABOUT TEN BUCKS for a 1B$ federal program.
I hope that is clear. However, I'd suggest using $3 per 1B$ to underestimate it.
Use $4 per 1B$ to overestimate the cost when thinking: Is the federal program worth it?
Aid to Dependant Children: 2B$/yr =$8/yr(a movie a year) Family of 3: $24/yr(an hour of bowling)

PERSONALIZED DEBT:
Every 12 seconds we net gain another American, so at the end of the workday of the report, there should be 310,428,992 people in America.
http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html ON 10/04/2010 04:37 -> 310,403,677
Currently, each of these Americans owe $43,860.84.
A family of three owes $131,582.51. (And that is IN ADDITION to their mortgage.)

ANALYSIS:
There were 23 reports in the last 30 days.
The average for the last 23 reports is 7,691,481,314.66.
The average for the last 30 days would be 5,896,802,341.24.

There were 252 reports in 365 days of FY2007 averaging 1.99B$ per report, 1.37B$/day.
There were 253 reports in 366 days of FY2008 averaging 4.02B$ per report, 2.78B$/day.
There were 75 reports in 112 days of GWB's part of FY2009 averaging 8.03B$ per report, 5.38B$/day.
There were 174 reports in 253 days of Obama's part of FY2009 averaging 7.33B$ per report, 5.07B$/day so far.
There were 249 reports in 365 days of FY2009 averaging 7.57B$ per report, 5.16B$/day.
There were 256 reports in 372 days of FY2011 averaging 6.66B$ per report, 4.59B$/day.
Above line should be okay

PROJECTION:
There are 836 days remaining in this Obama 1st term.
By that time the debt could be between 14.8 and 18.5T$.
It could be higher. It could be lower.

HISTORICAL:
President's term begins and ends on Jan 20.
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years. Jan 20 data is missing before 1993.)
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 WJC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 WJC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
01/20/2009 10,626,877,048,913.08 GWB (UP 4,898,681,252,731.43)
10/07/2010 13,615,674,949,267.91 BHO (UP 2,988,797,900,354.83 so far since Obama took office.)

FISCAL YEAR DEBT CHANGE, Sep 30 prior year to Sep 30 named year:
(One "* " for each 40B$ reached)
FY1994 +0,281,261,026,873.94 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1995 +0,281,232,990,696.07 ------------* * * * * * * WJC
FY1996 +0,250,828,038,426.34 ------------* * * * * * WJC
FY1997 +0,188,335,072,261.61 ------------* * * * WJC
FY1998 +0,113,046,997,500.28 ------------* * WJC
FY1999 +0,130,077,892,735.81 ------------* * * WJC
FY2000 +0,017,907,308,253.43 ------------WJC
FY2001 +0,133,285,202,313.20 ------------* * * C&B
01-WJC +0,053,598,528,417.78 ------------* WJC 31% of FY, 40% of FY-Debt
01-GWB +0,079,686,673,895.42 ------------* GWB 69% of FY, 60% of FY-Debt
FY2002 +0,420,772,553,397.10 ------------* * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2003 +0,554,995,097,146.46 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2004 +0,595,821,633,586.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2005 +0,553,656,965,393.18 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2006 +0,574,264,237,491.73 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2007 +0,500,679,473,047.25 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2008 +1,017,071,524,649.92 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB
FY2009 +1,885,104,106,599.30 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * B&O
09GWB +0,602,152,152,000.60 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * GWB 31% of FY, 32% of FY-Debt
09-BHO +1,282,951,954,598.70 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO 69% of FY, 68% of FY-Debt
FY2010 +1,651,794,027,380.00 ------------* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * BHO
FY2011 +0,054,051,918,376.20 ------------* BHO
Endof11 +86,129,259,999,100.00 ------------* * Too few days project too many *s * *

LAST FIFTEEN REPORTS OF ADDITIONS TO PUBLIC DEBT(NOT FICA):
09/17/2010 -000,203,034,896.34 ---
09/20/2010 +000,019,446,813.89 ------------******* Mon
09/21/2010 +000,509,875,602.04 ------------********
09/22/2010 -000,022,020,658.96 ----
09/23/2010 -008,701,405,875.05 --
09/24/2010 +000,034,117,767.19 ------------*******
09/27/2010 -000,066,407,812.28 ---- Mon
09/28/2010 +001,463,391,855.14 ------------*********
09/29/2010 +000,391,315,850.35 ------------********
09/30/2010 +058,907,978,013.89 ------------**********
10/01/2010 -005,585,417,177.51 --
10/04/2010 +000,259,208,393.70 ------------******** Mon
10/05/2010 +000,697,809,032.26 ------------********
10/06/2010 +000,102,633,566.23 ------------********
10/07/2010 -010,581,200,428.89 -

37,226,290,045.66 Total of 15 above reports.

Heavy borrowing seems to start after 09/18/2008 while Bush was in power JUST BEFORE fiscal year end.
Bush admin borrowed $962,245,245,654.01 in those last 124 days in office crossing two fiscal years.
$360,093,093,653.42 in last 12 days of FY2008, and $602,152,152,000.59 in subsequent 112 days before leaving office.

For a prettier and more explanatory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
DUer primer on National debt

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) LAST REPORT:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4568655&mesg_id=4568659

[ozymandius]

4. Economy likely creating some jobs, but not enough

WASHINGTON – Companies likely added a small number of jobs last month, but hardly enough to bring much relief to the nation's 15 million unemployed.

Economists estimate private employers added a net total of 75,000 jobs in September. But they expect that number to be offset by the loss of an equal number of temporary Census jobs. Overall, economists expect no change in the nation's total payrolls.

The unemployment rate is projected to rise to 9.7 percent from 9.6 percent, according to a survey of economists by Thomson Reuters, as more people look for work. People who are out of work aren't counted as unemployed until they actively look for a job.

The unemployment rate can rise even when the economy is adding jobs — if the jobs aren't enough to keep up with the growing population. Private-sector job creation in September will likely to fall below the 125,000 net new jobs needed just to keep up with population growth. That growth stems from young people seeking their first jobs and new immigrants looking for work.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101008/ap_on_bi_go_ec_fi/us_economy

[Demeter]

6. Memo: Tax Cut Party: Painful Double-Digit Unemployment Doesn't Have to Continue

http://www.alternet.org/story/148400/memo_to_the_tax_cut_party_--_painful_double-digit_unemployment_doesn%27t_have_to_continue



There is a depressing complicity among much of the political leadership about the recession. Many politicians seem prepared to accept that we will have sky-high rates of unemployment for the indefinite future. Projections from the Congressional Budget Office and other authoritative forecasts show the situation improving little over the next few years.

...We know how to get the unemployment rate down...Part of the story should include programs like the Local Jobs for America Act that will save and create jobs in areas of high unemployment. This will be a way to give young people a decent start to their working careers in areas like Detroit where the youth unemployment rate is close to 50 percent. These workers can help maintain and clean up parks, schools and other public facilities. We should also build on the successful parts of President Obama’s American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009, by increasing their size. ARRA includes tax credits that will provide incentive to weatherize hundreds of thousands of homes. The target should be weatherizing millions of homes. This puts people to work in the short-run and reduces energy use in the long-run.

We also need to do much more to improve the country’s infrastructure. Modernizing the electric grid would both make the grid more efficient and also reduce the number of people who lose power every time we have a storm. We also need to modernize our transportation system, most obviously by increasing the use of mass transit and building the type of high-speed trains that have been operating in Europe and Japan for 40 years. The $50 billion the president has recently proposed for infrastructure spending is a good first step, but more can be done.

This is an affordable agenda. In the short-term, the deficits are clearly not a problem. Investors from around the world are lending their money to the United States at extremely low interest rates. In other words, the people with big money on the line are not worried that the U.S. government is going bankrupt...Over the longer term, we will likely need more revenue. The best place to look for money is the root of the crisis: Wall Street. A modest tax on Wall Street financial speculation can raise an enormous amount of money, by some calculations more than $150 billion a year or more than $1.5 trillion over the next decade.

This tax would have very little impact on the sort of investing that middle-class people do to save for college or retirement, but it would impose a substantial cost on fast-paced financial speculation. The money raised would go a long way toward funding a serious jobs agenda...Tens of millions of people are suffering each month the downturn persists, and the pain gets worse over time. What makes the situation more infuriating is that this crisis was entirely preventable if the people running economic policy had done their jobs. In the same way, we can get the unemployment rate down to more reasonable levels if Congress will just do its job.

[Roland99]

30. They actually got one right for once. Private sector up 65k while govt jobs were shed (Census jobs?)

[Change Happens]

5. I am hoping we can get a nice 150K number...

Good morning Oz

[ozymandius]

8. Good morning.

:donut: Pray tell, what do you mean by 150K number?

[Change Happens]

13. Positive upside surprise: 150K private sector jobs created

Not sure where the net number will come in...

[Change Happens]

43. :(

[florida08]

10. this is my wtf moment of the day

Senate probe links Afghan contractors to Taliban
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/9a8515e8-d288-11df-9e88-00144feabdc0.html

WASHINGTON, October 7 – A US Senate inquiry into private security contracting in Afghanistan concluded on Thursday that funds had sometimes been funneled to warlords who were linked to the Taliban, murder and kidnapping.

The inquiry by the Senate Armed Service Committee found private security forces were often poorly trained and supervised by their companies and inadequately overseen by Defense Department contract managers.

“All too often our reliance on private security contractors in Afghanistan has empowered warlords, power-brokers operating outside Afghan government control,” Carl Levin, Democratic Senator, said in releasing the report.

“There is significant evidence that some security contractors even worked against our coalition forces, creating the very threat they are hired to combat,” he added. “These contractors threaten the security of our troops and risk the success of our mission.”

Richard Fontaine, a senior fellow at the Center for a New American Security, said the committee report “fills out a picture many have already suspected – that taxpayer dollars in Afghanistan at times end up in the hands of those we are fighting”.

“It is another wake-up call that the US needs to take aggressive steps to get a better handle on contractors and subcontractors in Afghanistan,” said Mr Fontaine, who authored a June report on contracting.

“Getting a better handle on who is doing what, with what money and where that money is going, should be priority number one,” he said.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Get a better handle?? How about stop the insanity and get the hell out? Collectively we the people need to sue our government for fraud in these fiascoes. Where is Robert Gates on this? Why haven't these contractors been fired? Where are the damn teabaggers? Pentagon? Fighting them over there to make us safer here? oh it is to laugh. I know this is not relative to the SMW but am so angry I put it here anyway. The toon ozy put up is indicative of this whole mess.

[ozymandius]

12. I like to use the term 'Chaos Capitalism'.

They who are responsible for this fiasco make an incredible amount of money from such things.

[florida08]

15. yes

and I would add 'Predatory capitalism' but in this particular instance I would call it treason!

[Ghost Dog]

21. Think Milo Minderbender

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milo_Minderbinder

[florida08]

23. good analogy

and apparently wasn't as fictional as once perceived.

[boomerbust]

20. And some of this money

Just might be funneled back to the US Chamber of Commerce to run attack ads for the Republican Party. This country is in deep deep trouble.

[florida08]

24. omg

never occurred to me but at this point wouldn't be surprising.

[Dr.Phool]

25. The Nation broke this story over a year ago.

The Senate finally woke up?

[florida08]

31. apparently so did I

as I had not heard about it. Had heard something about the contractors paying a 'protection tax' to get relief to the afghan people but not this. Hell some of them are guarding the US bases there. Taliban guarding US bases. Just mind-numbing.

[Tansy_Gold]

36. Oh, I think it's entirely apropos of SMW

We often discuss how The Economy is affected by DoD spending, and it certainly seems that the rush to privatize the military via "contractors" has not had a salutary effect either on spending or on performance. Since The Pentagon is entirely funded by tax revenues, and since it seems to have no more financial accountability than say AIG, what The Pentagon does with its funding has a direct bearing on The Economy.

FRSP all around.



TG, NTY

[florida08]

42. your intellect is just marvelous..I mean it sincerely

It would not have occurred to me to connect AIG and the Pentagon in that vein but you did it brilliantly. Indeed..both have no financial accountability and have a big part to play in wrecking this economy.

[Tansy_Gold]

50. I just have a warped point of view.

The Pentagon has had no sense of accountability for eons. $10,000 toilet seats, $600 hammers, that sort of thing. But they're all good "spiritual warriors" for the God of Capitalism, so it all just figures.

It used to be that The Military was The Military. The Military didn't outsource Military Operations. But when defense contractors saw how much filthy obscene profits were to be made providing materiel to The Military, they just decided to start contracting for services that were done by The Military. Food services, security, construction, laundry -- all of that shit used to be done "in-house" so to speak. KP, MP/SP, CB (SeaBees), etc. was all The Military providing for The Military's needs.

WHY would that be contracted to civilians? Because someone was gonna make money on the deal. So now you have "contractors" providing all this shit, and in many cases the contractors have taken over -- for a profit -- the real work of The Military, which is the fighting of the wars. And now the contractors themselves have outsourced that job too. . . . to The Enemy!!! For a profit!!!

To me it's no different from AIG offering insurance on deals they know they can't cover and then outsourcing the coverage to. . . . The Taxpayers!!!

It's all the logical extension/expansion of corporate capitalism on steroids with a side order of Absinthe.

TG, NTY

[Po_d Mainiac]

48. kinda sorta

With over 40% of current spending adding to the deficit, then only 60% of the Pentagons budget is actually funded by revenues. The other 40% is in that beat-up can getting booted down the Ally. Or maybe it's spelled alley? (You said u like puns)

[Po_d Mainiac]

51. Robert Gates?

Funny u should mention his name...He gets a nice cameo in Part #2 Section IV (probably more appearances, but I'm still reading)

Warning:This is a book, not a brief essay
Part #1
http://ampedstatus.com/the-road-to-world-war-iii-the-global-banking-cartel-has-one-card-left-to-play#
Part#2
http://ampedstatus.com/inside-the-global-banking-intelligence-complex-bcci-operations

[ozymandius]

11. Greenspan pretends the last thirty years did not happen.

...especially the last ten. The hack is back and just in time for Halloween.

Oct. 8 (Bloomberg) -- Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said the U.S. fiscal deficit is “scary” and the federal government needs to cut spending on entitlements.

“We’re involved in a dangerous game,” Greenspan said yesterday at a foreign-exchange conference in New York sponsored by Bloomberg LP, the parent of Bloomberg News. “We’re increasing the debt held by the public at a pace that is closing” the gap between our debt and “any measure of borrowing capacity,” Greenspan said. “That cushion is growing very narrow.”

U.S. companies may be holding back on investment because of the rising federal deficit, which causes uncertainty about future tax policies, Greenspan said in an opinion article for the Financial Times this week. Weak investment by businesses in capital equipment and fixed assets has helped to crimp the U.S. economic recovery, he said.

This is just what the asshole of a bastard always wanted to happen ever since he was sworn in the first time as Federal Chairman with Ayn Rand at his side.

http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601010&sid=akB_IZ1E7ulg

[Change Happens]

14. There is no going back for him, he will go down in history as a bad Chairman...nt

[florida08]

17. he's a real son of bitch that one

and yes you are exactly right. The first place entitelements need to be cut is in Washington. Let them pay their own healthcare like we do. No pension funds...they don't need it. Pay for their own transportation. The list is endless on how they abuse us then want to tell us no..we can't have what they have.

[fasttense]

26. He wants to cut your Social Security because he ran this country into the ground.

No mention of the billionaires paying their fair share. Or the corporations actually paying taxes instead of getting welfare. No, his target is the people that are suffering from his bad decisions. No mention of the fact that people were warning him left and right about the calamity to come that he was creating.

[JNelson6563]

40. He is the epitome of evil.

I hope he dies a horrible death, like bone cancer or something just as wretched. I try not to hate anyone but this guy, I just can't help it.

Julie

[AnneD]

52. Julie...

My honest solition....pray that God 'bless' him as God sees fit. Believe me, I have seen people blessed in ways that I would not have wished on them. It keeps you in the clear and gets rid of all that negative toxic energy. I take the marathon mentality rather than the sprint.

It is amazing what eventually comes to light. I have got to the point in my life that I appreciate a bit of mystery. When I was young, they had not found Amelia Erhart, or the Titanic, or Jimmy Hoffa's body. I use to wonder but (with the exception of Hoffa) now I know and I realize that it was the mystery that was what was most exciting.

AnneD-who knows the difference between perplexed and clueless (it's about 80 IQ points):evilgrin:

[tclambert]

57. "Entitlements" is Republican code for Social Security. Yet that has nothing to do with deficits.

Social Security has its own separate taxation system and has always, always, always paid its own way and then some. But those damn Republicans want to get their hands on it, bleed it, and ultimately destroy it, so they try their hardest to link it with deficits. I realized Fred Thompson was an idiot when he was running for President and someone asked him about the huge deficist Bush had run up and he started talking about how "we have to do something about social security."

Greenspan must know better. What is his game?

[florida08]

19. Former ChiPs star charged with securities fraud

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-chips-sec-20101008,0,3330645.story

Federal regulators on Thursday brought securities fraud charges against more than a dozen penny-stock promoters — including Larry Wilcox, who played California Highway Patrol officer Jonathan "Jon" Baker on the hit TV show "CHiPs" in the late 1970s and early '80s.

The Securities and Exchange Commission said it caught the promoters in "various illicit kickback schemes to manipulate the volume and price of microcap stocks and illegally generate stock sales."

The SEC, the U.S. attorney for southern Florida and the FBI set up a sting to lure stock promoters, according to an SEC statement.

The agency said the schemes it uncovered "generally involved the payment of kickbacks to purportedly corrupt pension fund managers or stockbrokers, who would use their clients' accounts to purchase the publicly traded stock of microcap issuers controlled or promoted by the individuals and companies charged today."

"What the promoters and insiders did not know was that the people with whom they arranged these illegal transactions were actually undercover FBI agents or confidential sources participating in undercover operations," the SEC said.

Wilcox, 63 and a resident of West Hills, "perpetrated interrelated kickback schemes with two other penny-stock company executives," one in Florida and one in Calabasas, the SEC alleged. The agency lists Wilcox's company as UC Hub Group Inc.

[DemReadingDU]

34. ChiPs

My kids loved that show!

[Roland99]

37. 11,000! par-tay! (and gold pushing $1,350/oz)

Dow 11,000 +51 +0.47%
Nasdaq 2,394 +11 +0.45%
S&P 500 1,163 +5 +0.46%
GlobalDow 1,997 +7 +0.34%
Gold 1,349 +14 +1.06%
Oil 83.10 +1.43 +1.75%

[JNelson6563]

41. Ah gold!

Since I went long on it it has never disappointed. Unlike just about everything else.

Julie

[AnneD]

53. And that brings us to our theme song today.....

Peggy Lee's version...

Is That All There Is

[Change Happens]

45. Can I get SP 1200 PLEASE?

[DemReadingDU]

38. BofA Halts All Foreclosures in all States

10/8/10 BofA Halts All Foreclosures

Bank of America Corp. is placing a moratorium on all foreclosure proceedings and sales across the U.S. amid political pressure on U.S. banks to examine foreclosure-documentation problems.

The nation's largest bank by assets is the first financial institution to stop all foreclosure actions amid revelations that the banking industry had used "robo-signers," people who sign hundreds of documents a day without reviewing their contents, when foreclosing on homes. Bank of America, J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. and Ally Financial Inc. last week postponed foreclosures in 23 states where a court's approval is required to foreclosure on a home.

The decision by Bank of America to extend its postponement to all 50 states takes effect Saturday. The bank doesn't intend to lift the moratorium until its assessment of all documentation is complete, a spokesman said.

On Thursday, Rep. Edolphus Towns (D., N.Y.), chairman of the House oversight committee, became the latest lawmaker to call for a nationwide moratorium on foreclosures.

Bank of America Chief Executive Officer Brian Moynihan plans to be in Washington, D.C., Friday for an appearance before the National Press Club, but a person close to him said he isn't expected to discuss the moratorium decision.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704657304575539963605720860.html?mod=googlenews_wsj


Edit to add ZeroHedge link...

As we expected when we reported that the Delaware AG got into the foreclosure fray (Delaware not being a judicial state), it was only a matter of time before foreclosures would be halted in all 50 states. Sure enough, Diana Olick has just reported that BofA has just expanded its foreclosure halt from the 23 judicial states, to all 50 states. And so, the pendulum swings from populist anger to adulation. The only question is when will Tarp 2 be enacted now that banks are facing tens of billions in losses.
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/bank-america-halts-foreclosures-all-50-states

[Change Happens]

44. I keep thinking all of this is good news for people, no?

Some of them can win their cases in court, and avoid losing their homes all together!

[StarburstClock]

67. Yes, Bank of Fraud America can't hide their crimes any longer

I'm sure they'll find yet another criminal way out of it, as long as no one is ever charged with the massive criminal conspiracies they've all played a part in the crime will continue unabated. So this is not good news for "the people", it's just more information regarding how nothing will ever be done to charge the elite with their crimes. As we've been told by the propa-media, if we hold them accountable we'll descend into chaos. Actually, we'd ascend into being the America the majority of people want but hey, what does "truthiness" matter anymore.

I actually admire (in a sick way) the massive brainwashing of the American populace that has taken place, a mind-numbing so complete that when America's number 1 bank has to shut down it's real estate operations in the entire country due to fraud, most Americans remain so clueless about it that they just keep chanting their slogans of political correctness fed to them by their information masters. You have to admit, if a person were to ever in their wildest dreams attempt a brainwashing scheme so massive that it would delude millions into becoming nothing but sloganeering sheep, you'd say that person was an ego-maniacal madman. Yet it has happened and is displayed in its full, sick entirety today.

America's bank is a fraud but hey, nothing to see here, move along people. We've got hero-worshiping stories all lined up for you at our new Hero Central. You can worship war in all it's civilian-killing and torturing splendor, and praise the defense industry that props up your 401k plan. Remember, it's just "a few bad apples", go out and shop and the terrorists won't win!

[Roland99]

54. What the heck is up in commodities?? >>>>

Corn futures close up 6% at $5.283 a bushel
Soybeans close up 6.6% at $11.35 a bushel
Wheat futures close up 9.1% at $7.19 a bushel

[Roland99]

56. Corn rallies to two-year high after crop forecast

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/corn-at-two-year-high-after-crop-forecast-cut-2010-10-08

Corn and other grains futures shot up Friday after a U.S. Department of Agriculture report pointed to the tightest supply and demand balance for corn in fourteen years.

The USDA on Friday forecast a 2010-2011 corn crop 3.8% smaller than government expectations just a month ago, as a hot Midwest summer preceded by floods in June takes its toll.

...

Following flooding in June, the Corn Belt suffered from a hot summer and, more importantly, warmer-than-usual nights that interfered with corn’s ability to pollinate as it normally would, he said.

The rally in corn, widely used as feed and biofuel, also pushed up prices for soybeans and wheat and drove up shares of fertilizer and agricultural-equipment companies. Livestock producer shares fell.

[CatholicEdHead]

61. Looks like a new bubble to me

CNBC has been pushing those alot lately trying to get investment going for a new bubble.

[Po_d Mainiac]

62. Two ways of looking at it

You want the equities to rise, then the buck has to drop and shits just gonna cost more.

Or in simpler terms...a banker just snuck up on one of the kids and stole the lunch money for next week.

[Ghost Dog]

59. Finance Chiefs Seek to Soothe Not Solve `Currency War' at IMF

Global finance chiefs warned a race to weaker exchange rates risks hurting the world economy even as they sought to downplay investor fears of a “currency war.”

As the International Monetary Fund’s annual meeting began in Washington, policy makers expressed concern that efforts to boost exports by embracing weaker currencies threatened to provoke protectionism and trade imbalances at a time when economic growth is already slowing. China was again the target of criticism as foreign officials called the yuan undervalued and pushed for its rise to be accelerated.

... snip: comments from participants ...

In an article in the Financial Times, billionaire investor George Soros said he shares “the growing concern about the misalignment of currencies” and that talk of a currency war “is not far off the mark.”

New York University Professor Nouriel Roubini, who predicted the 2008 credit crisis, said in Washington that the euro at $1.40 is “painful” for the euro area, and that it may relapse into a recession.

/... http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-08/global-finance-chiefs-seeking-to-soothe-not-solve-currency-war-at-imf.html

[TexasObserver]

60. It's a bad day for people who hate good news in the markets.

11K.

[SarahB]

63. It's a bad day for Americans

Or did you miss the employment report?

[Po_d Mainiac]

64. Ignored thinks the world revolves around the Dow

If ignored owned a car or bought groceries, ignored would not enjoy the next fill-up or checkout

[TexasObserver]

65. I'm quite comfortable, having made sound decisions a long, long time.

[Name removed]

77. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TexasObserver]

78. I'm a Democrat. What are you?

[TheWatcher]

80. I'm an Obama Hating Republican Terrorist, of course.

What else could I be, by refusing to mindlessly wave pom-pom's for the Computerized Casino Savior of the Economy.

:eyes:

[TexasObserver]

74. It's a good day for long term.

As I've said, I don't look at one event - such as employment numbers that dip - and run around the room with my hair on fire. I leave that reaction to others.

I focus on long term trends.

Here: Notice the market trend since the president's taking office.

http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/charts/big.chart?symb=djia&compidx=aaaaa%3A0&ma=0&maval=9&uf=0&lf=1&lf2=0&lf3=0&type=2&size=2&state=8&sid=1643&style=320&time=9&freq=1&nosettings=1&rand=6805&mocktick=1&rand=8531

That's a nice trend for anyone who owns a piece of the stock market.

It's good news for Democrats. I realize that many here relish bad news, but I'm not one of those people.

[TheWatcher]

81. He conveniently ignores that.

He's an expert at selective reasoning.

Besides, he's completely unaffected by stuff like that, so honestly, why should he care?

It's all about the Casino and the Propaganda.

Nothing else matters.

[TexasObserver]

84. Private sector jobs rose by 64,000.

The losses were in government jobs, a condition that is somewhat alleviated when private sector jobs increase, which helps government jobs incrementally at all levels. It's unreasonable to expect everything in the economy to right itself in only two years. In fact, it's irrational and defies logic.

We're in the recovery from the worst economic trench since the Great Depression. One would think that would speak for itself.

[nc4bo]

66. DOW good. That's nice but what's in it for me?

Someone's sitting on a crapper full of dough but it sure ain't me or any one in my circle of friends and acquaintances.

We still can't get a nut.

[TexasObserver]

68. There are DOWting Thomases and Debbie DOWners.

I'm not among them.

This ain't my first rodeo.

The economy is on a long, slow, often painful recovery.

No day is all good news or all bad news.

[Hugin]

69. "The Markets" always have a joygasm on bad employment news.

If it's your thing you can flip back through the past couple of years and re-experience the joy with each and every new announcement of rising unemployment.

The higher the unemployment number... The bigger the rise.

Every time.

If all you consider to be "Good News" is an increase in the DOW.

It takes all kinds.

[TexasObserver]

70. I'm a big picture guy, having done this successfully a long time.

I don't panic at every bit of bad news, or turn flips at every bit of good news, but I know good news from bad. This day is good news for Democrats and those who support Democrats. I'm a Democrat who likes good news for Democrats.

[DemReadingDU]

71. I'm a gonna bookmark this post

so I can find it again.

[TexasObserver]

72. Didn't you use the same line last week?

Which part of my post intrigues you to the point you want to retrieve it?

I can assure you I will never bookmark any post on this recurring thread, unless for the sheer hilarity.


edit: Yes, you did. I checked.

[Name removed]

79. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hugin]

82. Inflated stock prices (which is what a high DOW really means) is good for Democrats?

I've never seen any consistent correlation between a High DOW and an improved QoL for the working and middle classes... However, there is a monstrous undeniable correlation between employment (or the lack there of) and QoL.

Mark me down as a Democrat who doubts your assertion about the benefits of an Inflated DOW. (and your claims about it being good for Democrats.)

[Mickeyc1004]

76. Exactly!!!

Ha, Ha, wow, super! Dow 11,000!

Couldn't check at work, but as soon as I got home and checked I was absolutely elated! Very good for middle class people with 401Ks and ordinary people who like to buy stock.

[Mickeyc1004]

75. Dow 11,000!!!!

Yahoo!!

Stock market is doing great, and I'm doing great after getting a great job after being unemployed for a long time. Lots of people were also hired the same time I was. I hope that things get better for everyone.

GOP's been predicting doom and gloom, stock market 7,000 for almost two years now. Now, today stock market 11,000! Market goes up and down and can't be predicted, but today I'm celebrating because I want this country to do better and I want to see the stock market go up.

Thank you Obama for my job and the stock market!

[TexasObserver]

85. Some are disappointed it never fell below 6000.

Remember the constant predictions that the DOW was going to fall below 4000?!

Some never got over the DOW finding a floor above 6500 and quickly recovering above 7000.

There's been a consistent growth from 6700 to 11,000, and it is looking considerably better than it did two years ago, before the last election. A 65% increase in stock values in the past 18 months is good news for all Americans, whether they all realize it or not. As the net worth of companies and individuals is enhanced by stock value increases, it makes several things more likely: fewer loans will have to be called; more funds are available to companies and individual because they can sell or hypothecate their stocks easier; companies and individuals are more likely to start thinking about new hires.

This economy is a patient that was at death's door 18 months ago. Now it's up and around, and learning to walk again. It's unfortunate the mess that Republican leadership created in 8 years can't be undone in 18 months, but that's reality.

[Mickeyc1004]

87. All 100% true.

[hamerfan]

88. Please explain to me,

TO,
Exactly why the stock market is at 11,000. I'm no Wall Street scholar or economics whiz, just wanting to learn.
What good news is out there to make the DOW run up so high lately?

Unless,

There is no good news and the market is being gamed by those in the position to do it.
Or, the USD has tanked so badly that the money that was in the commodities market is now in the stock market to try to preserve some of its capital.
Or, "irrational exuberance" is running rampant.

In constant dollars, what is 11,000 in the DOW today worth, say, 10 years ago? 8,000? I don't know.
Thanks for any information you can share on this subject.

[TheWatcher]

89. You're wasting your time hamerfan

He has no information to share with you because he's not here to do that. He doesn't like this thread or the people who post in it, because they do not share his rose-colored, Propaganda soaked views on the mythical "recovery" or the economy, so when there is a big up day, at least recently, he comes here to taunt and mock the people who post here.

The current devaluation going on in the Dollar doesn't mean anything to people like him, nor will he address anything in your post with any relevant information you might seek to make sense of what is really going on.

What can you expect to learn from someone who thinks Bubbles are a "normal and recurring" event that is all part of "natural market activity."

High Frequency Trading, Monetization by the Fed, out of control Monetary Policy and Infinite Printing? All conspiracy, doesn't exist.

You might as well ask Kramer or Kudlow this question on CNBC.

You'd get about as useful a response.

The fact is the Dow and the equities Markets are in another Bubble, just like '99, just like 2003, and just like 2002, and 2008, the Bubble will burst, and the fallout and consequences will be even greater than they were for the previous two Bubbles.

I imagine him and his ilk will either be silent as mice when that occurs, or they'll be screaming at the top of their lungs for the thugs and Criminals to "Save them" with more "Thank God It Passed!!!!!11111111111" type "solutions" that function as only temporary band aids, and delay the inevitable.

The system is broken, and those in control of it cannot fix it.

Even Helo Ben himself finally came out and told the truth the other day and admitted he and The Fed have been completely full of shit, in well, not so many words:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=114x82686

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard

It's interesting to note that people like the one you asked don't have much of anything to say at all when even the people they worship and follow as saviors admit that things are not as they have told us.

It's best to ignore people like that.

Perception is their reality. Anything outside of it doesn't exist and must be shouted down, bullied, mocked, marginalized and demonized at every turn, and cannot be allowed to stand.

There are plenty of knowledgeable, objective people that post here and in the Economic Forum every day, who actually are interested in dialogue and information sharing from BOTH points of view.

Stick to them, and you'll learn something.

Follow the Rose-Colored Regiment Of Recovery Management, and you'll be as blind as a bat.

It's that simple. :)

[hamerfan]

90. Thank you, Watcher.

For taking the time to post a reply. I read your posts here and have a lot of respect for your knowledge.
hamerfan