Religion under a secular assault

[RedEarth]

Religion under a secular assault
By Julia Duin
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
Published April 13, 2005


WASHINGTON -- --Special Report: First of three parts.

Oral arguments were to begin before the U.S. Supreme Court on one of the most litigated questions in American law: Should the Ten Commandments be displayed on government property?

Outside, protesters sang hymns and held up signs proclaiming "The 10 Commandments: The way to live your life." A few feet away, a larger group clustered around Ellen Birch, a member of American Atheists, who describes herself as a descendant of Thomas Jefferson.

"A favorite claim of fundamentalists," she told anyone listening, is that America is "indebted to the Bible and Christianity for our laws."

Not so, Miss Birch says. "State support of a religion leads to corruption within both government and religion," she says, adding that Jefferson himself said, "The wall of separation between church and state was absolutely essential in a free society." The clash of cultures, between spiritual and secular America, was on full public display.

Secularists such as Miss Birch cite Jefferson's wall in their fight to exclude God from public life, proposing to ban creches at city hall, Christmas carols in public schools, graduation prayers at colleges and grace over meals at military academies -- as well as the more than 4,000 stone and concrete testaments to the Ten Commandments across the country.

http://www.wpherald.com/storyview.php?StoryID=20050413-092903-8091r

[Roland99]

1. A Clash of Fundamentalisms - Tariq Ali

A good book.

And, re: our own Fund-A-Mentals, I think Carlin said it best:

Keep Thy Religion to Thyself.


The world would be SUCH a better place!

[Eloriel]

10. I am with Carlin 100% -- and in fact, am infuriated by the headline

of the article:

Religion under a secular assault

Oh, puhleez. Most of us secularists are perfectly happy, never thinking about religion, until religionists (and usually the falsely pious) go waving it in front of our noses, trying to force it on us.

Can't you talk about your religion in public? In a word: Please, NO! Only with those who you already know are interested. (It used to be that religion and politics were verboten for discussions in polite society. AFAIC, it still is. They're both too personal and too volatile and you rarely change anyone's mind but that's what everyone wants to do, as a rule.) This is a secular society and there's NO room in public discourse for religious discussion except among consenting adults.

So the headline is bogus. The ONLY thing that might be under secular assault is religionists' penchant for imposing their will on others.

[Roland99]

11. I agree totally with...

"Most of us secularists are perfectly happy, never thinking about religion, until religionists (and usually the falsely pious) go waving it in front of our noses, trying to force it on us. "


:thumbsup:

[InternalDialogue]

2. The fact that they're doing this:

>> Outside, protesters sang hymns and held up signs
>> proclaiming "The 10 Commandments: The way to live your life."

...should be ample evidence that their right to practice religion exists in this country.

You want the ten commandments displayed in public? Feel free to write 'em down and parade them around on your own.

[fertilizeonarbusto]

5. They are SO hot on the Ten Commandments

which are the old Testament, but could not care less about the Beatitudes, which are the New Testament.

[Tux]

9. 10 Commandments

Allow for hate and the Beatitudes don't. Without the 10 Commandments, Evangelicals couldn't hate gays, non-Christians, freethinkers, intelligent people, professors, colleges, education, science, "worldly" knowledge (stuff exists outside of church), and anything else they hate.

[davidinalameda]

3. what garbage

let's blame the ACLU for everything that's wrong in this country

[htuttle]

4. So they try to remake our nation as the 'Kingdom of Christ'...

...and when it turns out all of us aren't that excited about it, and would rather church and state stay separate, suddenly, 'religion is under assault'.

Dumbasses.

In the immortal words of John Rambo, "They drew first blood, not me!"

[Freedom_from_Chains]

6. Good, maybe we can get the court to finally take a stand

And then run these freaks out of every public place.

[punpirate]

7. The headline of the story...

... is quite revealing of the attitude of Mr. Moon's newspaper. Religion, per se, is not under assault. Its intrusion into the government, however, is, and should be questioned.

The word "God" does not appear in the Constitution. The word "religion" does--in the First Amendment, prohibiting law from instituting religion in government in any way. So, the Washington Times describes this as an assault on religion.... :grr:

[BOSSHOG]

8. Washington Times as a Source?

I have to chuckle. Wow, a three parter to incite the lemmings.

The fascists are not under attack.

No one in this country is trying to prevent them from practicing their religion; however, there is a concerted effort to keep them from forcing their religion on the rest of the country, thank God!

[followthemoney]

12. Religious people came to this country for freedom...

They weren't allowed to burn witches back in England. So frustrating when you can't practice your faith.

[Hollowkatt]

13. Are Witches allowed to burn Fundies??

That would be fair play right?

[followthemoney]

14. Fundies are closet Witches...

Who could suspect them of being witches while organizing witch hunts as they do? Only those who know their ways, I suppose.

[Fovea]

15. hey now...

As a witch, I take that sort of thing personally...

[followthemoney]

17. You aren't in the closet nor are you being burned...

What have you got to complain about?

[atommom]

16. No, I think the secular world is under a *religious* assault.

Look at how much press religion is getting these days. Look at how bold the Religious Right has become, pushing through gay marriage bans, the teaching of creationism in public schools, and abstinence-only sex education. This is a relatively small group of extremists, pushing their beliefs on the rest of society.