I'm Starting My Own Post On The Yellow Ribbon Thing!

[ProfessorGAC]

Folks: Let's review!

The yellow ribbon that first gained it's idiotic popularity during the Iranian Hostage period (Carter administration) was based upon a hit song by Tony Orlando and Dawn (or maybe not Dawn).

In that song, the singer was getting out of prison and was asking his old girlfriend that as he bussed into town, he would look at the tree. If she forgave him for being an idiot who broke the law, got caught, and went to prison, she should tie the yellow ribbon on the tree. If she didn't forgive and didn't want him anymore, then he would ride on.

Now, let's think about the symbolism. We have troops in Iraq and Afghanistan, and people are numbly riding around in their SUV's and pickups with yellow ribbons on them.

The yellow ribbon doesn't mean that we are hoping for their safe return. It's a sign to them that ALL IS FORGIVEN AND THAT WE WANT THEM HOME DESPITE THEIR SCREW-UP!

So, putting a ribbon on the car truly means you believe that troops have made a conscious and intentional mistake, and that despite that, we are willing to let them come home!

It's not exactly a noble or sympathetic message, is it?

Think about that the next time you see one of these things.
The Professor

[mandyky]

1. I disagree with your premise

"The yellow ribbon doesn't mean that we are hoping for their safe return. It's a sign to them that ALL IS FORGIVEN AND THAT WE WANT THEM HOME DESPITE THEIR SCREW-UP!

So, putting a ribbon on the car truly means you believe that troops have made a conscious and intentional mistake, and that despite that, we are willing to let them come home!"


Just because that is what the original song was about, when used during the Iran Hostage deal as well as other POW instances, noone thought any one had screwed up. The yellow ribbons became a symbol of remembrance and of a welcome home (in hopes of).

What I object to about these yellow ribbons is that they also say support our troops when many support the war but also support king george's back door draft and cuts in veterans' benefits. In other words the yellow ribbons are phony, esp when displayed on an SUV, gas guzzlers.

[ProfessorGAC]

2. You AGREE With My Premise

You just want to contradict it. The original song was about what i said. You concurred.

The symbolism is completely inappropriate. Since you say the hostage crisis changed the meaning, you are actually agreeing that the symbolism has been incorrectly appropriated.

You disagree with the conclusion, not the premise. You basically yourself reinforced the premise.

The Professor

[liberal N proud]

3. All the ribbons disgust me. Someone making a buck off the

unsuspecting misguided souls.

[No Exit]

4. The concept which is wrong is: to identify Bush with the troops.

That's what Bush wants people to do. He knows pretty much everyone is sympathetic to the troops themselves. Sympathetic, that is, to the fact that so many of them don't want to be there, but are being forced to stay, and to the fact that apparently at least 7600 of them have died.
Not to mention the thousands of them who are maimed, either outwardly, inwardly, or both.

The emphasis should be on "Support our troops by bringing them home NOW." That clearly separates the troops from Bush--after all, the last person who deserves to be identified with them is an AWOL chickenhawk like Bush.

[ProfessorGAC]

6. I Can Buy That

It's sort of an adjunct to my point. The symbolism is wrong in the first place, and the Repubs want to imply that if you support the troops you are supporting Lil' Georgie and his policies. So, it's a doubly wrong symbolism.
The Professor

[No Exit]

16. Yes, now I know what my family member meant when he was cool to

the flag-waving right after 9/11. He has studied history, and knew jingoism when he saw it. And he knew its uses.

Here's a note I find hopeful (though you may not find it hopeful, lol): I know of a right-wing site that is advertising the ribbon/magnets with "Bring 'Em Home!" printed on them.

The paleocons and the democrats should unite to crush these neocon bastards. I know it is distasteful to most democrats to think of teaming up with such people, but I'm in favor of whatever works!

[ProfessorGAC]

18. Wow!

That is a good find.
The Professor

[No Exit]

21. Yes, and it's hilarious, on some forums, to

see Bush Kool-aid drinkers screaming "Liberal! Commie! Bleeding heart!" at some paleocon type who lampoons Bush.

Then the Bush cultists turn right around and call the same right-right wingers "racists" and "skinheads"!

Looks like the pretzeldent's little Bush wagon train is surrounded and being attacked on all sides. How richly they deserve it.

[hootinholler]

5. All I know for sure is that...

I'm really tired of seeing them. Red, White and Blue or yellow or black or any friggin color.

All those that say support our troops, how do they actually do that? Do they provide reading or A/V material to VA hospitals? Do they benefit an organization providing body armor, or even cookies to our guys in the field?

Slap a friggin ribon on yer car and be a friggin hero. It's just a pep-rally tactic.

-Hoot

[nytemare]

7. I support our troops, I was a troop the first time around in Iraq

I supported the war in Afghanistan, I thought we didn't get the job done there, namely getting Osama bin Laden.

I do not blindly support our chickenhawk President. Iraq was a screw up, no matter what false reason he puts behind it. Just like Abu Ghraib, that didn't come from our troops, it came from higher up.

Many of the Dem leaders in Congress and in the Senate served in the military, and I am glad they returned home safely. It is the chickenhawks who have no concept of what war is like and the damage they cause by blindly sending our troops to war, as in the case of Iraq that ticks me off.

Many of these folks are in National Guard units, and many enlisted after 9-11.

I learned many lessons in my deployment to Iraq in '91. One of them was that you have to judge people on your own, not based on another's preconceptions or prejudices. Many of the Kurds in Northern Iraq were very generous. They would offer us bread despite their poor living conditions. They were not the "zealot ragheads" I was told they were.

The message that I send with my yellow ribbon is from experience. It is to our troops, not to our Chickenhawk in Chief.

[KharmaTrain]

8. I Put Tony Orlando On My Car...

Or I keep trying...I still don't forgive that bastard for that awful song.

Several months ago some moron was trying to sell those things at the local gas station. Of course he was waiving the flag and "support the troops" and "god bless george w. bunnypants" and so on. He comes up to me and I ask him when was the last time he was at a Veterans hospital. He looked dumbfounded. I then asked if he got a tax break...and he said he did...and I asked how it felt taking money from our schools and veterans. I could see he was ready to forget I existed.

Finally I pointed to the man at the counter of the gas station...a man from Pakistan. I said, do you know who this man is? According to your god, is he your brother or your enemy? I figured I'd done enough damage for the day. The benefit was the next time I came in, the gas station manager shook my hand and thanked me for saying "nice things". I said "I speak truth...it's sad it's so rare to hear these days"...

[ET Awful]

9. Actually, the yellow ribbon for a soldier predates that song

by a good margin.

It dates back to at least the late 40's when the movie "She Wore a Yellow Ribbon" starring John Wayne came out.

The theme song to that movie became a hit at the time and the lyrics went:

Around her neck she wore a yellow ribbon
She wore it in the spring time, in the early month of May
And if you asked her why the heck she wore it
She'd say she wore it for her soldier who was far, far away
Far away
Far away
She wore it for her soldier who was far, far away.

The song has been copyrighted in one form or another since 1917. The earliest version was copyrighted in 1917 as "Round Her Neck She Wears a Yeller Ribbon (For her Lover Who Is Fur, Fur Away)."

So while I would state that the vast majority of those sporting ribbons on their vehicles do so more out of some kind of groupthink mindset than any real desire to support anyone, I think your argument is flawed.

[ProfessorGAC]

10. That's A Good Call, ET

I forgot about that movie. But, i would bet dollars to donuts that people think of that song, not the movie. The song itself may have violated the original premise of the yellow ribbon, but the song from the 70's is what prompted that symbol.

Remember during the hostage crisis when people puts ribbons in trees, they used to SING the song while they were doing it. So, they didn't get the symbolism now, and i would suggest, that while you're right, my argument isn't as flawed as you think.
The Professor

[ET Awful]

11. Anyone that has done Army basic training will likely think of the song

from that movie, as it is commonly used as a marching cadence.

:)

Not picking nits, just pointing out personal experience :)

[ProfessorGAC]

12. I'm Not Arguing At All

You caught a fish i missed. But, what are the odds that everyone with a magenetic ribbon spent any time in basic training. Probably a low fraction, no? I'm not picking nits either, and i'm not being defensive. You definitely got me on the background, but i doubt many people think of the movie first, and song later.

The singing while hanging the ribbons during Iran Hostage is what got me thinking this way.
The Professor

[ET Awful]

14. Well if you wanna talk about all the people with their little magnets

I don't think they have any freakin' clue where the idea came from. They're used to seeing ribbons for everything, AIDS ribbons are red, breast cancer ribbons are pink, POW ribbons are black, etc. I'd venture a guess that if you asked people why the ribbon was yellow, the majority wouldn't have a clue :).

[ProfessorGAC]

15. That's Probably True - Which I Guess Is My Whole Point

The Professor

[No Exit]

17. Interesting! Do you know a WWI-era song called

"I Didn't Raise My Boy To Be A Soldier"?

I often wonder if my grandparents ever heard it and, if so, what they thought--especially after their own son later died in WWII.

[Bethany Rockafella]

13. I remember that song, but I don't remember what the point was.

Thanks for letting me know. But you know the right wingers that do have those yellow magnets, won't accept that notion.

[high density]

19. Today the troops are just doing what they were ordered to do.

They have not "screwed up." Bush is the one doing the screwing up with his nutzo foreign policy.

[ProfessorGAC]

20. That's My Whole Point!

Read it again, this time more carefully. The nature of the song is asking forgiveness for screwing up! If they want to support the troops, they shouldn't be accusing them of being screwups.

Reading for comprehension is a skill.
The Professor

[WillowTree]

22. Not that it matters...

....but tahe revival of the yellow ribbon thing and the Tony Orlando song pre-date the Iran hostage incident by about six years. The record was released in 1973 and the use of the yellow ribbons was adopted to display hope for the sfe return of the Viet Nam POWs.