National Debt increasing exponentially- can't go on much longer

[philb]

The National Debt on January 1st 1791 was just $75 million dollars. Today, it rises by that amount every hour or so.
The following graph shows how the National Debt has grown year by year since 1940 in actual dollar amounts, uncorrected for inflation: (1980 less than 1 trillion; 2005 over $8 trillion and growing rapidly)


http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/faq.html



This data was gathered from the U.S. Treasury department's web site

The average person's share of national debt is $27,000. A family of 4 has their share of interest on nat. debt = over $5,000/year

the first $5 thousand of a family's taxes goes simply to interest on national debt. Buys no gov't services or payments for
gov't expenses such as the huge and growing Iraq war cost- $500 billion plus.

[daydreamer]

1. Let's have another 8 years of Reagan and 8 years of Bush

and see how many freepers are left after that.

[philb]

5. Reagan was worst Pres. in history, fiancially speaking, by a lot

but Bush I was even worse; and Bush II has new records.

[philb]

15. National Debt has increased an average of$ 2.83 billion per day since Sep

U.S. NATIONAL DEBT CLOCK
The Outstanding Public Debt as of 24 Oct 2005 at 1:00 PM GMT is:
$ 8,146,391,338,795 (over $ 8 trillion)
The estimated population of the United States is 297,977,000 so each citizen's share of this debt is $27,339.

For the average family of 4 the share is $108,000.
The average family’s annual interest on national debt is $5,300.
The National Debt has continued to increase an average of$ 2.83 billion per day since September 30, 2005!

[philb]

18. My family's share of national debt is more than our house mortgage

which is our biggest debt other than our share of the national debt.

[swag]

2. Ah, the magic of compound interest, with interest rates rising.

Go, Republicans.

What the fuck did you shitheads learn at business school, anyway?

[Warpy]

4. They learned that employees are scum

and that anybody who gets sick needs to be fired and replaced with a healthy young trainee so the premiums won't rise and they learned that the bottom line is everything and they can shave safety measures to cut costs and all they have to do is budget for a few lawsuits to be settled out of court when people get hurt or killed because of their greed.

They don't learn about debt and interest and all that boring stuff. They hire people to think about that stuff.

[Selatius]

10. Get rich for yourself and ditch the rest.

The "rest" constitutes us and everything that represents us. Anything to maximize profits. That's one side you would find in the school of business. Another side says that if you treat workers well and act responsibly, you will survive in the long-run. That's not the case with companies like Wal-Mart. I believe they won't last in the long-run. Their methods, although profitable in the short-run, will have massive consequences in the long-run.

[barb162]

23. yes, that's what's happenng

[LSK]

26. shit! i didnt think about interest rates and the debt

We are more fucked then I thought.

[oregonindy]

3. probably has something to do with bush borrowing more than all 42

presidents combined.

nah......

[Telly Savalas]

6. "Uncorrected for inflation"

Let's keep proper perpsective here. Bush is a disaster as far as being a steward of the economy goes.

However, I believe debt/GDP ratios have been worse at a few points in our history. It's a bad situation, but nothing so awful that a 2-term Democratic presidency can't undo.

[salvorhardin]

9. It's still alarming when corrected for inflation

At least if this guy's numbers are correct. I haven't checked. What this graph is really showing is that for about 40 years the debt was rather steady until Reagan got in office. Then, aside from Clinton, it's been going like a rocket ever since. Let's hope whomever is the next President will do something to reverse the trend again.

[deadparrot]

13. Three cheers for fiscal conservatism.

:puke:

[Vinnie From Indy]

7. They asked Einstein what the most powerful force in the universe was and

he replied "compound interest". The rapidity with which Americans have allowed the radical right wing to decimate their future is breathtaking.

[Vinnie From Indy]

8. Dupe

[dweller]

11. debt? you want to see debt?

According to the most recent Flow of Funds report from the Federal Reserve, total credit market debt expanded $799 billion in the third quarter of 2005. At this
rate, debt growth for a single year is $3 trillion, or 50% greater than total U.S. industrial production." Hahahaha! $3 trillion a year in more debt! More than a quarter
of GDP! In one lousy year! We're freaking doomed!

Another bit of jarring recent news is that in October, paradoxically, consumer installment debt went DOWN by $7.2 (although seasonally adjusted) billion dollars. In
one month! It is a collapse in consumer spending that is (and here I am quoting the Wall Street Journal), the "biggest dollar amount on record," according to the
Federal Reserve! The biggest on record! I have redacted the original transcript of my actual utterance upon learning this, so that now the officially record reads that
I said, "Yipes!" and the humorously quaint, "Run for the hills, boys!" Those who know me are probably thinking to themselves, "Hmmm! That certainly doesn't sound
like The Mogambo at all!" And they would be right, because, in reality, it was mostly me screaming in mortal dread and outrage, over and over, that we are freaking
doomed, we're freaking doomed, we're freaking doomed, over and over and over, as the implications of it started to sink into my tiny little Mogambo brain (TLMB).

So this means that the 70% of the entire Gross Domestic Product of the USA that is attributed to consumers, meaning 70% of all the goods and services produced
in the whole country in a whole damned year, took a big whack to the wallet? The HUGE part of the economy that makes its money by catering to the consumer
who was buying all this stuff, took, in total, as a group, a whack to the corporate wallet that was the biggest whack to the corporate wallet that THEY have ever
had, too? Again, in the official transcript, it shows me responding, "Yipes," and "Run for the hills!" and, again, that would be a lie to sugar-coat the loud, and mostly
obscenity-laden, truth.

http://worldnewstrust.org/modules/AMS/article.php?storyid=1858

dp

[philb]

17. Additionally U.S. trade deficit was over $500 billion last year & new reco

records this year.

Additionally the U.S. annual trade deficit for 2004 was over $500, 000,000,000 ($500 billion)
The major factor in this is the growing U.S. imports of energy(oil, coal, natural gas) and the price increases for these. This represents a massive outflow of capital from the U.S. economy,
making us collectively poorer, and according to the International Monetary Fund(IMF) threatening collapse of the world economy.

[Stephanie]

12. Did you see CBS News tonight about the pension funds?

Companies like Delta go bankrupt, the executives escape with tens of millions in golden parachutes, they default on the pilots' pensions, and they FEDERAL GOVT has to pick up the tab, thanks to an obscure agency similar to the FDIC that insures pension funds. So all of these companies are going to start defaulting on their agreements and the taxpayers will have to pay for it. They said it might be bigger than the S&L swindle. Also brought to you by the Bushes, in part. This country is going to go bankrupt.

[Selatius]

14. Why can't the government turn around and sue these execs?

Instead of these bastards passing the tab on to taxpayers, why not have the government turn around and pass the tab back to the execs who ran the company into the ground for their own greed and profit? Make them pay back all the money they pilfered from everybody.

[philb]

16. The real problem is the Gov't; more than the execs

There has been an obvious connection between the Execs and those in charge of the Gov't these days
Like Cheney's energy policy meeting friends


The huge tax rebates to the rich whose campaign contributions fund those currently in power
are the biggest part of the huge debt increase; and represent a transfer of wealth from
the poor and middle classes in the U.S. to the rich elites. The split between rich and poor
is growing at unprecedented rate in the U.S. currently, making us more like a third world
country as in Central and south America of the 1980s.

[barb162]

21. I think that is not how it will turn out.

The guv will close up the pension board and all the shleps who are owed pensions will be left standing there with nothing. It's a game that all the companies are trying to play right now. GM, Ford, the airlines, etc. The government can't finance it all. The companies aren't financing the pensions but they are financing the millions in salaries for the assholes who are fucking EVERYONE.

[barb162]

22. Yes, and it;'s been going on for a while

It's horrible. These corporate officers should be jailed. They have enough money for the huge salaries but not the pensions. The government is letting them get away with this.

[bullwinkle428]

19. Ah have a secret plan for the "National Debit"...

...it's called "PRINT MORE MONEY"...

[Lars39]

20. Did you catch this thread?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=5602012

[philb]

25. Has Greenspan made any statements about this? (n/t)

[LSK]

27. inflation - that is not a solution

[flaminbats]

24. Reagan turned tax and spend into treason..

Before Reagan, deficit spending was seen as nothing less(whoops) than a violation of an officeholder's oath of office.."I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

Deficit spending was considered an impeachable offense by the public, but members of Congress could be considered just as guilty as the President. Congress can't impeach the President without blaming every House and Senate member who voted in favor of a budget signed by the President. Deficit spending is now just another joke, but never a violation of any officeholder's oath of office!

But who cares, screw those big government, antibusiness, antiAmerican, tax and spend liberals!? Why should we pay for this war in Iraq, for the failure to stop 9/11, or for the financial support we gave to Saddam and Bin Laden during the Cold War? We may have to obey the law, but we don't have to pay for its enforcement! We may want to support our troops with bumper stickers, but we don't have to pay them! We may want a strong defense, but the hell with the IRS! :crazy: