Phoenix, Arizona is one of the worst places on earth.

[Alexander]

I moved here in early 2003 for school (I go to ASU in Tempe). I've been to four continents and countless places in my life, and although I have a fair number of complaints about each one, no place is so thoroughly wretched as this (supposedly the 5th or 6th largest city in the country). Let me explain myself, with 5 main reasons why this place so thoroughly sucks.

1) Culture. Every place has *some* culture, but Phoenix has damned little. Historical sites get torn up and replaced with apartment complexes. Museums, art galleries and artistic performances here are godawful, worse than I've seen anywhere else.

The different sections of town are cookie-cutter corporate complexes - with a Blockbusters, McDonalds, Safeway, Fry's, (insert nationwide chains here) every 5th block or so. Very little in the way of local flavor, and almost nothing here is over 50 years old.

2) Traffic. The roads here are fine. The highways are fine. But the drivers are worse here than anywhere else. People here cut you off without signalling, because they are too busy talking on the phone. They deliberately take up 2 or 3 spaces in crowded parking lots. They play "racing games" on onramps because they HAVE to be first on the highway.

That's the tamer stuff. They also swerve into your lane and try to chase you down if you dare honk at them (yes, this has happened to me, only here). I saw a cop here haul ass the wrong way down the street, without having his siren on, or even his headlights, in the middle of the night. I saw an 18-wheeler nearly tip over because the driver took a turn way too fast. When sports fans come from abroad they make a point of being even WORSE drivers.

When I bike or walk, I am literally playing with my life. Most of the time drivers don't see me, or worse, don't care. If I were less patient I'd bring a hammer to bang on their hood every time this happens.

Probably not by coincidence, there are LOTS of DUIs here.

Oh, and there's no parking *anywhere* in Tempe. Forget it. Even if the parking lot is completely empty, if you go somewhere else for a short time, they'll tow you to the nearest redneck's junkyard faster than you can say "Fucking Phoenicians".

3) Weather. Yes, in the winter it's usually nice. Nice if you like inhaling lots of bizarre pollutants all the time. Apparently going outside anywhere here for a long time is like smoking a pack of cigarettes, unless you get away from the city. It never rains, so the smog gets trapped.

Oh yes, a DUer reminded me of the filthy stuff that passes for water here. I "cleaned" my dishes with it, and it leaves a white film on them. It tastes gross, and I don't feel clean after bathing. Once last year the city advised everyone to boil their water because there was a contamination scare. Yet people look at me as some sort of snob because I don't dare imbibe this garbage.

The summer, however - is a furnace that can only be rivalled by Hell itself. "It's a dry heat", I hear. Bullshit, the humidity has increased dramatically just because of human intervention. I hear Hell is a dry heat, too.

4) Sleaze. You know Vegas? Yeah, it's like that. Minus the nice casinos and the fun entertainment. Lawyers have no shame with going on TV and telling you they can get you out of your DUI arrest. One of the main streets in Phoenix has prostitutes and strip clubs galore, along with No-Tell Motels.

Businesses here are inherently shady, as a lot of what they do here is illegal in most states. Thinly-disguised pyramid schemes are everywhere. Lots of places try to get you to put money down *first* before you go to work on whatever it is they do (don't do it).

Quacks here are everywhere, I have personally ran into no less than 3 terrible doctors. One was secretly a child molester. One was a right-wing idiot who prescribed me some bogus medicine, and I could tell even before I got a second opinion. One of them misdiagnosed my cat, telling us he was fine when he was really dying from cancer.

5) Stupid people. It's not cool here to know stuff or think about things. I try to talk about something - ANYTHING - at parties, and people butt in to tell me to shut up and get drunk.

I can't count the number of times fellow ASU students have said "There's nothing to do here but get drunk". Unfortunately, it's not limited to just the college kids. EVERYONE does it.

I talk to the conservatives, and they can't use logic and facts to save their lives. The sad thing is, neither can the liberals. Schools here are terrible, and everyone I've met who went to public schools here knows absolutely nothing.

I've had to debate English MAJORS on grammar rules that I learned in 3rd grade, which they knew nothing about. I'm Political Science, myself, but it's still sad.

I was told of this preacher who goes to campuses all across the country, and he said some of the dumbest motherfuckers on earth were on ASU's campus. I'd expand that to include the entire Phoenix area.

-Those were just the top 5 complaints. I could come up with more but I'd be here until this time next year. These problems are everywhere, but they are so bad here as to be intolerable.

God, I can't stand this place any more. I'm transferring out ASAP.

[GOPisEvil]

1. I just drove through Phoenix on my way to LA in December.

I have to say I wasn't impressed. Granted, I was there only overnight, but what I saw just didn't flip my switch. I stayed in Tempe as well, although, just inside Tempe.

On my way back, I bypassed Phoenix.

[Thtwudbeme]

4. Yep...us too.

But, I would move to Tucson in a skinny minute. I love Arizona like you wouldn't believe.

That said, I would like to state that the coolest states I have ever been to in terms of people alone (not scenery, etc) are Ohio, Colorado and North Carolina.

Stephanie

[bbinacan]

57. Thank you. I'm a

NC native, but have lived all over, including Phoenix. Thank God I've settled back in Raleigh, NC.

[Ptah]

59. Tucson rocks

And a good bus system, to boot.

:thumbsup:

[LaurenG]

86. That is cool

I lived in Colorado for years prior to moving to Ohio. ;)

[mrbassman03]

2. well, that's good to know...

Glad I am up in the NW. I was considering ASU, but hadn't taken a trip down there. Glad I made the right choice. Sorry to hear that you have to put up with it now...

[HEyHEY]

3. Shut up and get drunk

[Thtwudbeme]

6. This is good advice Otter, you should take it

;)

[HEyHEY]

7. Is that quoted in the movie?

I can't remember

[Richardo]

9. "My advice to you.....is to start drinking heavily"

"You better listen to him, Flounder - he's pre-med."

[HEyHEY]

12. Ah, yes .. now I remember

[JVS]

58. Sounds like a hell of a town!

[no name no slogan]

5. My dad has lived in Scottsdale for 30 years

the "old" part of town down south, a couple blocks north of the Tempe city limits. There's a lot of rednecks there, but I don't find it any worse than any other major city. And I've been going there every couple/few years for the last 30.

If you don't like it, leave. There's no laws against moving.

[Thtwudbeme]

17. Sometimes people can't just leave

Your post hit a serious nerve with me.

I married this wonderful man that I wouldn't even consider divorcing or leaving. I adore him.

However his career took him to a place I don't like. I had to call a psychiatrist because I am so fucking miserable. I can't leave; I am freaking trapped.

This guy/girl is in college. I doubt s/he can just "pick up and move."

Stephanie

[Alexander]

20. You're absolutely right, I can't just leave any time I want.

ASU has (relatively) cheap tuition. Which is why many people go here in the first place.

I reached the point where I am now an in-state student - so while it isn't *really* cheap, it's much cheaper than it used to be, and since I'm considered an Arizonan (no longer a Connecticutian), any place else I go is going to be much more expensive, since I'll be out-of-state, even if I go back home.

If college was free, I'd have left years ago. Thank you for being understanding; I know how it feels to be trapped.

[Thtwudbeme]

24. You are welcome!

Gotta tell you; I went to Missouri for college and wigged out! Hated it! Vowed I would never be trapped again.

Now I am facing my 42 birthday, and in the same damned situation for different reasons.

Hang in there! And take a weekend trip up to Sedona, or go to Mexico and drink heavily!

;)

[no name no slogan]

28. Hey, we're all "stuck" someplace

Based on the decisions we make, we all get "stuck" certain places. Hell, I'm "stuck" in St Paul, MN-- not exactly the best place to be for six months out of the year-- but I stay here because I have a good job, lots of friends and the living is affordable-- and the psychiatric bills are covered by my health insurance.

If a place is bad enough, you WILL leave. I've had to do it before. And if things get bad enough, I will do it again.

Or post long diatribes on DU about how shitty it is.

[Alexander]

30. As I said, I really am stuck here.

Tuition here for me is a bit over $2000/semester alone.

Wow, you say. That's a DEAL. What the hell am I complaining about?

It used to be $4000/semester alone. Now I'm in-state here, so I get the cheaper rates.

And everything else, which I loathe.

So why can't I leave? Simple. As far as I know, the other schools here are more expensive and don't help with my major that much.

Anything out-of-state is inherently more expensive, PLUS I have to pay the out-of-state rate, since I'm considered an Arizonan. So it's a huge drain on the pocketbook to leave.

[no name no slogan]

31. Not trying to be unsympathetic here, but

I paid my own way through a college where tuition alone was $11,000 a year-- and I graduated 15 years ago this month, after 3.5 years. I know what it's like to pay high tuition, AND work, AND still get good grades.

Like I said, you are not "stuck" anywhere. Unless you're one of the unfortunates who were in NOLA during Katrina, you can leave any time you want. Even though you don't like Phoenix, the positives still outway the negatives, or else you'd pack up and go someplace else. It's not like there aren't a plethora of universities with excellent PoliSci departments around.

Best of luck to you in Tempe. It's not the best place to live, but you could be doing a hell of a lot worse.

[Alexander]

66. I love my cats too much. That's partly why I stay here.

My parents got me a kitten when I was 7 years old. Her name's Panda, a Norwegian Forest Cat. You can guess the colors.

She had kittens a year later. Three of them, and we named them Lewis, Spice and Alexander. I suppose now I should explain my screen name - my parents were originally going to name ME Alexander, and instead went with Gregory (an awful name, IMO, makes me sound like a Pope or something). So my mom saved the name for one of the cats. I still wish it had been my name, hence why it's my screen name. Am I bitter? No. I love the real Alex to death, and I suspect he feels the same way about me.

Cutest cats you'll ever see (if I can find a way to post pictures of them), friendly and smart to boot. Two of them won awards at cat shows, although I loved them too much to let my parents sell them.

My parents divorced, and inexplicably moved to opposite ends of the same city. My mom lives in Scottsdale, my dad in Surprise (town motto: Surprise! The average age here is 65!), and the cats now live with my mom.

I'm 22 now, meaning that Panda is almost 16, and the others are going on 15. They don't have a whole lot of years left. One already died of cancer last year - his name was Lewis. He was 30 pounds of perhaps the most lovable cat anyone has ever known, and the biggest cat I've ever known.

He was also completely black, save for a tiny white patch of fur on his neck. He died at 13. It's almost enough to make me superstitious.

Spice now limps slightly when she walks - she has arthritis, and pulled a tendon. The only way to correct it is through surgery, but at her age I don't have the heart to do a thing like that to her.

You're right - I'm not "stuck" here. But although I spent lots of time with all my cats, I wish I had spent more with Lewis. So now I'm making up for it by giving the rest of them a lot more love and attention than they'd ever receive if I transferred.

[Patiod]

89. "Carefree man shot in robbery"

Heard that headline on the radio. Some of the town names are funny - Surprise, Carefree

[huskerlaw]

8. My parents used to live there...

for about 5 minutes. They freaking hated it.

However my other set of parents (ain't divorce wonderful?) spend the winters just outside of Tempe. They love it. Of course, their alternative is the horrifying cold hell that is Nebraska, so it's all relative.

[tallahasseedem]

10. My Mom lives in Scottsdale...

I moved away over a decade ago. Sometimes I hate going back for visits for the very reasons you mentioned.

[Richardo]

11. I want to meet the preacher who uses the term 'motherfucker'

Is that the Church of What's Happening Now, or what.

[HEyHEY]

13. "Father Surly"

[Alexander]

16. "Brother Jed" Smock.

He has a book out, and is on campus frequently. I can't remember if that was a quote or just paraphrasing, but I thought a preacher would be more...say...understanding, than to categorize an entire campus as a bunch of idiots.

Then again, anyone who is familiar with Brother Jed will know otherwise.

[fishwax]

50. I know Brother Jed, and I'm guessing it's paraphrased

:rofl:

ah, bro jed :rofl:

[annofark]

18. Phoenician

It isn't that bad if you NEVER leave the Phoenician Resort. Ha
I got heat stroke in Phoenix. It was awful.

[Sequoia]

26. Welcome to DU

[EstimatedProphet]

14. I used to live in AZ, for about a year

I used to call it "the sun's anvil". I remember one day it got to be 132°. Seriously. At least though I was close to Vegas, which wasn't bad if you like purple neon. Only went to Phoenix when I left-I was driving through.

[ET Awful]

15. You left out water quality . . . Phoenix has the worst tap water of any

city in the US that I've ever been to. The nasty part is the restaraunts use that water for their ice makers, so anywhere you buy a drink with ice in it, it takes on the flavor of that extra nasty water. Picture the taste of swimming pool water with some extra cholorine added for flavor.

[Oeditpus Rex]

19. The greater Phoenix area has at least one thing going for it

Baseball in March. :woohoo: :bounce:

[Alexander]

21. Don't get me wrong, some parts of Arizona are beautiful.

At the risk of replying to my own post, I must say that I like other parts of Arizona much more than Phoenix, something I didn't mention in my first post.

Flagstaff is nice, Sedona is beautiful, and the Grand Canyon breathtaking. Some of the places where I've camped are places that I feel blessed to have seen, and there's a lot of great scenery outside this sprawling blob of a city.

But Phoenix....I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy. I saw Casablanca again last night, and it kind of hit a nerve - it's out in the desert, everyone goes to clubs and bars to drown out their troubles, and just about everyone wants to leave (but many can't). The people who do stay are there to make a buck off the naive travellers who come wandering into town.

[Burma Jones]

22. You ever been to Houston? or Tulsa?

Of course you did say one of the worst.....

[grace0418]

32. I apologize in advance to any Tulsans here but

that was one depressing place last time I was there. I have a very dear friend from college who grew up there. He moved back a few years ago because he wanted to open a restaurant and figured he could get his feet wet back home. It was a lot more affordable than trying to open one in San Diego where he was living.

The restaurant is doing well but he is soooooooooo sick of living there. We've been down to visit and I could not believe how depressing it was. There is a really pretty section with old houses and such but the majority of it is either totally run-down/abandoned or super generic/strip mall. My friend laughs because people think he's SUCH an avant garde chef if he does anything even slightly out of the ordinary. Being an incredible chef who can do amazing things with food, he is going crazy down there.

Additionally, he's gay and he's a total liberal, so he is REALLY unhappy most of the time. He's been trying to move up here to Chicago and I hope he does soon before he loses it. Not to mention I just wish he lived here because he rocks.

[fishwax]

51. the only fun thing about tulsa is spelling it backwards

at least, that's what I heard from many an aquaintance who grew up there ...

then again, I have friends who swear by it, so who knows. It's never done much for me.

[Sequoia]

23. I'd like to share this email with you

from my friend in Phoenix who said I should move there because the housing is cheap. I feel bad you have to live through that, do get out then! Here's the joke:

Dear Mom
>>
>> May 30th
>> Just moved to Phoenix. Now this is a city that knows how to live !
>> Beautiful sunny days and warm balmy evenings, what a place! I watched
>> the sunset from a park lying on a blanket. It was beautiful. I've
>> finally found my home. I love it here. June 14th
>> Really heating up, Got to 100 today. Not a problem. Live in an
>> air-conditioned home. .Drive an air-conditioned car... What a pleasure
>> to see the sun everyday like this. I'm turning into a sun worshiper.
>> June 30th
>> Had the backyard landscaped with western plants. Lots of cactus and
>> rocks, what a breeze to maintain. No more mowing lawn for me. Another
>> scorcher today,
>> But I love it here.
>> July 10th
>> The temperature hasn't been below 100 all week. How do people get used
>> to this kind of heat? At least it's kind of windy today. But getting
>> used to the heat and humidity is taking longer than expected.
>> July 15th
>> Fell asleep by the pool. Got 3rd degree burns over 60% of my body.
>> Missed 3 days of work, what a dumb to do, I learned my lesson though.
>> Got to respect the ol'sun in a climate like this.
>> July 20th
>> I missed Tubbie (our cat) sneaking into the car when I left this
>> morning. By the time I got to the hot car for lunch, Morgan had died
>> and swollen up to size of a shopping bag and stank up the $2,000
>> leather upholstery. I told the kids that she ran away. The car now
>> smells like Kibbles and shits. I learned my lesson though.
>> No more pets in this heat.
>> July 25th
>> The wind sucks. It feels like a giant freaking blow dryer!! And it's
>> hot as hell. The home air-conditioner is on the fritz and the AC
>> repairman charged $200 just to drive by and tell me he needed to order
>> parts.
>> July30th
>> Been sleeping outside by the pool for 3 nights now, $1,500 in damn
>> house payments and we can't even go inside. Why did I ever come here?
>> Aug 4th
>> Its 115 degrees. Finally got the air-conditioner fixed today. It cost
>> $900 and gets the temperature down to 85, but this freaking humidity
>> makes the house feel like it's about 95. Stupid repairman, I hate this
>> stupid city.
>> Aug 8th
>> If another wiseass cracks, "Hot enough for you today?" I'm going to
>> strangle him. Damn heat. By the time I get to work the radiator is
>> boiling over, my clothes are soaking wet, and I smell like baked cat.
>> Aug 9th
>> Tried to run some errands after work, wore shorts and sat on the black
>> seats in the ol'car. I thought my ass was on fire. I lost 2 layers
>> of flesh and all the hair on the back of my legs and ass. Now my car
>> smell like burnt hair, fried ass and baked cat.
>> Aug 10th
>> The weather report might as well be a damn recording. "Hot and sunny"
>> "Hot and sunny" "Hot and sunny" It's been too hot for 2 damn months
>> and the weatherman says it might warm up next week. Doesn't it ever
>> rain in this damn desert? Water rationing will be next, so my $1,700
>> worth of cactus just might dry up and blow into the damn pool. Even
>> the cactus can't live in this heat!
>> Aug14th
>> Welcome to HELL ! Temperature got to 115 today. Forgot to crack the
>> window and blew the windshield out of the car. The installer came to
>> fix it and said,
>> '' Hot enough for you today?'' My wife had to spend the $1,500 house
>> payment to bail me out of jail. Freaking Arizona! What kind of a sick
>> demented idiot would want to live here?
>>

[SammyWinstonJack]

63. !

:spray: :rofl:

[bbinacan]

64. You've got that right. A dry heat

my ass. When I lived there we hit 117. Dry or not, it's still fucking hot. Give me the 90s with humidity in NC.

[Sequoia]

90. I'm from Western N.C.

Miss those Smokey Mountains and the Blue Ridge Parkway sometimes.

[politicat]

25. Oh, man I feel your pain!!!

We moved to AZ when I was eight - lived out at Williams while it was shutting down (that being what my father did), then to Yuma to do something similar with the Marines for four bloody awful years, then he finally retired, we moved to tiny Mormonville (not it's name) where being not Mormon meant obviously we were evil and whoring... then, just as I got out, got a scholarship to a university in California (and got half a year out of the way) my parents split, the finances went tits up, and I had to transfer back to Mesa because I couldn't afford out of state rates anymore....

So I went to ASU, too. Spent 1 semester living in Manzanita (before it went smoke and alcohol free), 2 semesters in the Honors dorm, and the rest of my time in a tiny little rat trap over behind the mosque. Once I had my Master's, I was gone. (ASU covered my tuition better.)

I left almost ten years ago, and I can't go back. I've been there a couple times and the pollution makes me so sick I cough for weeks after I come home. The heat kills me now, and I'm a fair skinned redhead - I never should have lived in a desert in my life, but damn if my folks thought of that.... (They could have left me with my mother's mother (with whom I lived off and on for much of my first eight years) and grandparents in Indiana and Florida, but no....)

My mom still lives there and wouldn't leave at gunpoint. I hate it - it's such a walled city. There are no open spaces (and I think this contributes to the crappy attitudes, bad driving and general stupid-psychosis). It's all about chain stores and tract houses. No one realizes how important deserts are and everybody thinks that because it's flat and not green that paving over it is just fine!! And they use so much bloody water and power - I really pity those who can't get out, but the ones who stay there and don't think... I won't be very kind when energy rationing starts.

U of A or NAU are better - transfer if you can. NAU is actually a very nice university (I did some summer work there) and far more student oriented than ASU is.

[azmouse]

27. I'm sorry you feel that way.

I live in Glendale. I moved here in 1990 but had to leave for 3yrs to live in the Bay area of CA. THAT was hell on earth for me. I hated it there and couldn't wait to get back here to AZ.
Most of our drivers are either elderly or newly from out of state.
Glendale has won awards for water quality. I drink it from the tap... no problem.
I don't go to clubs or bars so I can't comment on that.
I avoid the Tempe area like the plague. It's the worst part of town as far as I'm concerned.
I'm not stupid nor is my husband... he has a master's degree from Cornell.
I was born and raised in PA and no amount of money would make me go back. You want to talk about boring.
I like the weather here including the inferno in the summer.

[Patiod]

34. And I LOVE living in Pennsylvania

90 minutes from the beach, 90 minutes from the mountains, not too far from New York, Baltimore or DC. Great heavily wooded state parks. City that's easy to get in and out of, friends I've had for 35 years, and a very strong sense of "rootedness" -- my church is 300 years old, but still vital. my theater group is 100 years old, and I meet former members all the time. People still join clubs and volunteer (we have the most people participating in the MLK Day of Service)

Arizona is my favorite place to visit, but the whole "gated community" thing and the idea of houses with walls<\i> around the yard freaks me out. And as the OP pointed out, not much there there in the "downtown" (although it doesn't suck to stay in Scottsdale on expense account)

[azmouse]

38. I was raised waaaay out in the PA country.... boring!

Surrounded by cornfields and cows! There really was nothing to do unless you got in the car and drove to Reading, about 25 mi away. In the winter you always have to plan around the weather - the ice and snow. I felt stifled by the age of the area. My family has lived in Berks Co since around 1750. I needed to move and see new things. I like the freshness of the southwest. Everyone is from somewhere else.
I like having my backyard walled in. I have privacy in my pool and don't have to worry about my neighbors dogs in my yard. I'm fortunate to live in an older neighborhood (for the Phx area) and have a full acre, no 'gated community', and a large house.
I truly could not imagine living anywhere else.

And I'll add that this is something that makes America great. If someone looks around long enough s/he will find an area of the country that appeals to them in a way that no other does. Some like the cold and snow, some want nightlife or community activities, some want heat and sunshine. But it's all available. Just take a look.

[Patiod]

40. We eastern snobs call the famland center "Pennsyltucky"

The conservative center of the state (apologies to Kentucky) does sound awfully dull. Whenever my city-born, city-school-educated SO sees anything on TV mentioning Penn State (where I happily went to school), he moos.

There's an oft-repeated James Carville quote that Pennsylvania is Philadelphia and Pittsburgh with Alabama in between.

My college roommate LOVES living in Goodyear and loves Phoneix.

I do enjoy visiting though!!

[azmouse]

42. That's funny!

If I had been raised in a city or even a town I'd probably feel differently. I was raised about 5 mi west of Boyertown, a town of only 5000 people. My parents didn't go anywhere at night and all my neighbors were relatives! I kid you not! Grandparents, uncles, cousins... even my great-grandmother! I told you my family lived in the area a looooong time!

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

36. I like Pennsylvania too...we fair skinned/hair people do poorly in AZ

Had to go to Phoenix area for business retreats...that dry, hot, climate sucked my hair and skin dry. Felt like I'd been mummified. And this was in the late springtime.

More power to you for living there but it wasn't for me.

[azmouse]

39. I'm fair skinned and used to be blonde (now redheaded)

I'm 44 but get mistaken for being 10 yrs younger. Moisterizer is a life saver but the dry winter air in PA took it's toll too. I can't take the humidity any more when I visit relatives in PA. I wilt.

[WildEyedLiberal]

29. Hey, on the bright side....

... there's always the Suns!

*ba dum ching*

[Patiod]

33. And you forgot Valley Fever

Valley fever is another name for the sometimes deadly systemic fungal infection coccidioidomycosis. It is called valley fever because the organism that causes it is commonly found in the soil of San Joaquin Valley of Arizona and California. An infectious disease doctor told me that most people who have lived in Phoenix for any amount of time have it in their body, and it usually only hurts the immunocompromised, although that's not always the case.

Plus you're expected to WORSHIP John McCain.

On the positive side, you have In-and-Out-Burger, Cowboy Ciao, and Los Dos Molinos.

And the best Humane Society in the entire US, which was awarded that distinction officially last year at the big Madison Square Garden AKC show.

And, as you said, some of the most gorgeous camping in the world

[Whoa_Nelly]

41. Um...the San Joaquin Valley is CA only

Phoenix is part of the Sonoran Desert.

...just sayin' :popcorn:

http://www.vfce.arizona.edu/
Valley Fever Center for Excellence

<snip>
Valley Fever (Coccidioidomycosis) is primarily a disease of the lungs that is common in the southwestern United States and northwestern Mexico. It is caused by the fungus Coccidioides sp., which grows in soils in areas of low rainfall, high summer temperatures, and moderate winter temperatures. These fungal spores become airborne when the soil is disturbed by winds, construction, farming and other activities.

Valley Fever infections are more likely to occur during certain seasons. In Arizona, the highest prevalence of infections occurs June through July and from October through November. In California, the risk of infection is highest from June through November, without the late summer break.

[Patiod]

44. Geologically, though, the "San Joaquin Valley" runs through AZ

at least that's what more than one infectious disease doctor has told me. The soil is the same from California though New Mexico in sort of a strip, and it contains coccidiodes.

[Frank Cannon]

45. Coccidioidomycosis IS known as San Joaquin Valley Fever

It may be a misnomer, but there you have it anyway. Maybe that's where the confusion about the name of the actual valley comes from.

And it is TERRIBLE in Phoenix. A relative recently contracted it, and she has it to thank for congestive heart failure now.

[erinlough]

35. I know just what you mean.....

I went to visit my son in June last year. He moved to Phoenix to go to a motorcycle maintenence school that only has two campuses where he can get the training he wants. I was shocked.....June and 116, so dry your skin hurts and the whole area is just ugly.

I haven't quit worrying about him driving his motorcycle there since I drove there, and last week one of the guys was killed by a driver turning into his lane from the right. I can't wait until he gets out which will be the end of July. The only problem is I have to go there for his graduation and I can't imagine how hot it will be.

It isn't a place I would move, but if I had grown up there I am sure I would feel differently. By the way I am from MI and I really missed the color green.

[ucmike]

37. i went to asu for 2 years.

it's definitely "unique". being from new jersey, i wasn't so used to living in a gun culture. that was a huge shock. my first day at my first job, we stopped at a subway for lunch and the guy in line in front of me was wearing a chromed (i think) .44 mag on an open holster on his hip. i was there when they made the whole tempe downtown a "gun free zone" because of shootings.

i agree about the education levels of the people there too. seems that the phoenix/tempe area schools are lacking. i was struck by how the didn't really understand sarcasm. i told a guy i worked with to be careful with a drill he borrowed cause i paid "like a grand" for it. he immediately went into fits of laughter at my expense and told me that drill only cost $150 in arizona, then proceeded to tell the other guys in the shop how the stupid guy from jersey paid $1000 for a drill. that kind of stuff happened all the time.

and the heat...it got so hot that my car wouldn't run, it would just stop and i'd have to push it out of the way. i took it to several garages and never figured it out. i remember sitting in traffic and seeing the wheels on other cars messing up the asphalt because the surface of the streets had gotten gummy in the sun. dry heat my ass, it's 120deg out there. it's too hot when your oven has a temp setting for the temp outside.

a few things i did like: getting out of town. once you left city limits it feels like one of the freest places in the world.

and i have to say that the phoenix metro area is a 24 hour town. it seemed like everything was open all night, which was convienient in the summer when we just wanted to lock ourselves in with the air on.

[wackadoo wabbit]

80. A 24-hour town? Are you kidding?

We go down to the Phoenix area about once a week, and we've yet to find a decent place to eat that's open after 9 p.m. (10 p.m. on Fridays and Saturdays). Even tiny, out-in-the-middle-of-nowhere Amarillo, Texas, has a Thai place that's open until 2 a.m. on weekdays. But, except for the ubiquitous Bertos, there's no place in Phoenix or its surrounds to eat after 9.

It's probably due to the influence of the numerous retirees in the area, for whom the idea of a late dinner means eating after the early-bird special has ended.

(For those unfamiliar with Phoenix, a quick note about Bertos: It seems as if just about every 24-hour Mexican take-out place in Phoenix ends with the suffix "berto." There's Raliberto, Filiberto, Isberto, Roberto, Eriberto, Rolberto, and others I'm sure; I'm just not familiar with them yet.)

[ucmike]

88. that's what i thought when i lived there

we lived in tempe, about 4 blocks from the university. there were tons of late night bars and places to eat, live music, activities on campus, etc. maybe it's changed, but i remember working some nights and thinking that it was very active. i remember during finals week that some of the bars would be open and serving drinks at 7am.

it might also be perception, where i come from it is hard to find a 24hour gas station and buying a six pack of beer after 9pm was out of the question.

[NMDemDist2]

43. after living here for 9 years I have agree with all your statements

and I'm getting outa here ASAP too

I like the weather (even the summers) so I probably stay in Arizona or New Mexico. the only complaint I have with desert living is the god awful dust that looks an inch thick 20 minutes after you finish cleaning.

But one of the main things I'll look for in my new rural home is water, so I may end up giving up some weather in return for water rights somewhere the wind doesn't blow constantly (read the Colorado River)

[Arkham House]

46. Doesn't it also have a blatantly fascist sheriff--

Whom everyone is afraid to cross?

[Alexander]

68. Yes, Sheriff Joe Arpaio.

Nobody likes the guy, but somehow he got himself re-elected.

He's got a "Tent City" out in the desert where he keeps prisoners. Given the summers here, I'd say that violates the Eighth Amendment to the Constitution. If I ever become a lawyer...

[SiobhanClancy]

69. My sister lives in Fountain Hills..

and Arpaio is a neighbor of hers. Fountain Hills is a very pristine little place next to Scottsdale. I loathe the place...all the houses are beige to blend into the desert. Everything tidy and new,neat little shopping strips,golf course,etc. It's a far cry from where Arpaio does his "work".

[Ptah]

72. Yes, he is a prick

My son has been his guest.

Pink uniforms, underwear and handcuffs.

And pink balogna.

The excessive phycological beatdown is outrageous.

:nuke: :scared: :thumbsdown:

[Zomby Woof]

47. You are EXACTLY right!!!!!

I HATE Phoenix for all of the reasons you described. Perfectly.

It is a freeper hell on earth. With summers to match.

[leftofthedial]

48. only the desert, the weather (I LOVE heat) and spring training

make Phoenix slightly better than Houston TX, which IS the worst place on earth.

[flamingyouth]

49. The drivers can't be worse than Seattle's.

I'm sorry, but that's just not possible. :D

[Zomby Woof]

55. They are FAR WORSE than Seattle's

I had to go to PHX often when I lived in Flagstaff, and experienced the phallic, crazy-asshole drivers of the greater PHX metro area.

Not even L.A.'s drivers are as bad.

Seattle drivers are passive-aggressive, which makes them slightly more preferable to PHX's just plain aggressive.

L.A. drivers are a combo of mildly aggressive and just stupid, lol.

I would rank L.A. above Seattle, just because the traffic MOVES even when heavy here. I can't tell you how much I don't miss an I-5 tie-up near the Mercer exit in Seattle. :D

In L.A. just avoid I-405 north of I-110 all the way to Santa Monica, and everything is okay. That stretch is worse than the I-405 on the eastside of Seattle. But overall, it moves much faster. Luckily for me, I drive the easy and light stretch near Long Beach. I only have a 20 minute commute each way. :bounce:

[flamingyouth]

56. Seattle drivers are paleolithic meanderers

Like mastodons looking for a long-lost watering hole...

[The empressof all]

67. I thought that was you riding my tale on the 520 bridge

I was gonna stop and say Hi but thought the folks behind you might not like it. :hi:

[Zomby Woof]

73. LOL

Yeah!

I remember how Almost Live made fun of Ballard drivers... driving around with their seatbelts hanging out of the car. :D

[NMDemDist2]

61. sorry, they are. I drive a lot and see about 4 near misses a day

and at least two actual accidents. for kicks just listen to AAR on KXXT1010AM and check out our traffic reports

we have at least two rollovers every morning I kid you not, and in the summer you hear about "carBq's" every day too

they are the worst.

I've driven in all the metro areas of California, in Seattle, Portland, Spokane, Miami FL, Atlanta, Dallas, Houston, NOLA and NOTHING rivals PHX for assholes (usually with a "W" sticker or a yellow ribbon) behind the wheel

[Ptah]

52. Phoenix is like a borg-claw. WE in Baja Arizona will NOT be assimilated..

Does the University of Arizona in Tucson offer your degree?

Does Northern Arizona University offer your degree?

AS you can see, Phoienix is on the northern edge of the Sonoran Desert.




There is exciting science happening in Southern Arizona.



There is a wonderful permutation of biology in Southern Arizona.



Please don't come here. We're full.


The next time you move, check out the climate:

Here's Great Falls, Montana:











Here's Kalispell, Montana, less than two hundred miles away:




jus sayin

[bikebloke]

53. Nice to hear

When I was looking for an escape from Seattle, I looked into Phoenix. A few things didn't quite feel right about the place so I gave it a pass. Glad to know my sixth sense was working fine.

[Redstone]

54. Way, WAY too many people in a place where God obviously did not

intend for so many people to live.

What struck me the most about Phoenix, when I used to travel for business, was how you could look down from an airplane and see so many swimming pools (about one for every three houses) in the middle of the goddamn desert.

Something very wrong with that picture.

Redstone

[Karenina]

60. If the Salt River is running

DON'T DRIVE THROUGH ANY PUDDLES!!!!
Spent 6 months there. H-A-T-E-D IT.

[bbinacan]

62. Your analysis of Phoenix is

right on target. Even when I lived there in 1980 and was a 16 year old, I saw the place as culturally bankrupt. I went to Moon Valley High. It sucked. I took advanced classes and was an outcast. My saving grace was that I lettered in cross country. A letter jacket was more important than an education at this school. At the small town I grew up in(Sanford, NC)one was more popular if they succeeded intellectually. I considered ASU and U of A and finally talked my parents into letting me move back to NC so I could go to UNC-Chapel Hill. I lived with my grandmother my senior year in high school and got accepted to UNC on early admittance. What a fun year that was. BTW, Phoenix sucks.

[Ladyhawk]

65. I have to agree. I've been through there and thought it sucked ass. n/t

[Coventina]

70. I'm trapped here as well. I feel your pain.

I'm married to a man I love, and won't leave. And he won't leave.

So there it is. I've made my choice. But I hate this place.

I grew up in Seattle. That's where my heart truly is.

[begin_within]

71. If you think Phoenix is bad, try spending one day in Gila Bend, Arizona

The absolute armpit of the United States. (Sorry if anyone reading this lives there or is from there. But why would anyone ever choose to live there?)

[Ptah]

74. Because tourists don't stay long.

:shrug:

[Alexander]

75. At least the 1700 people are friendly.

A lot of the people here seem to go out of their way to be jerks to everyone else.

[LaPera]

76. No Indian Casino's? Like everywhere in CA.

Republicans don't ever want to spend money on schools...

Does anyone recycle...can't keep throwing away shit without...well, republicans don't feel like they have to recycle.

Drivers who aren't polite...like the ego crazed, ones in a such hurry, the selfish cell phone drivers, seniors who aren't sure what century their in...

Ugh!

[begin_within]

77. I lived in Phoenix from 1977 to 1980 and it was a lot quieter and smaller,

but I still wouldn't want to live there again. The heat is the killing factor for me. I don't know how I took it then, except that I was a lot younger.

[Zinfandel]

78. At least the wonderful progressive Meria Heller's vibes are there....

Check it out!!!

http://www.meria.net/

[Lorien]

79. My grandparents tried it there years ago. Couldn't leave fast enough

and they throughly agreed with you on the traffic situation. Said that they had never seen anything like it!

[Robeson]

81. Yeah, but you've got the Cardinals......

....:rofl: :rofl:

[Starbucks Anarchist]

82. I had my own brief Arizona experience.

I drove from Texas to Los Angeles a few years ago, and a good chunk of the trip took me through Arizona.

I have no idea what it was, but there was this godawful stench throughout the duration I was in there. And I knew it was in Arizona, because I didn't smell it in New Mexico and it went away once I reached California.

[ForrestGump]

83. There are two US cities I've visisted so far that immediately just felt

wrong: Chicago and Phoenix. Not saying nthat there aren't worse cities in this country, but bot of these places hit me on an elemental level as soon as I entered them...they felt as wrong as places like Joshua Tree and the high plains of New Mexico (to name just a couple) felt so perfectly right. I know lots of people here on DU love Chicago, whether they live there or not, but all I'm saying is that that ttown felt so overwhelmingly wrong to me and for me...Phoenix may have hit me in an even stronger way.

I haven't stopped in Phoenix since the late '80s, but my impression then (apart from that gut feeling that the place was somehow 'off') is that it was an increasingly polluted, sick place with a lot of violent crime and desperation. And heat. But heat's not the real story -- I'd lived in the desert even before I came to Vegas and what is wrong with Phoenix is not a function of heat. The rest of Arizona, for the most part, is great...I could easily live in or near Tucson or Flagstaff, for example, or in a smaller town in Arizona. But Phoenix has always felt, to me, kinda evil.

[wackadoo wabbit]

84. One of the things that bothers me most

is all the friggin' green lawns down there. Don't those people know that they're living in a desert?

Not to mention the fact that we're in the middle of a drought.

Water rationing in the Valley of the Sun is long overdue, but I suspect we won't see it until the area actually runs out of water.

[KitchenWitch]

85. Did Arizona ever get the Martin Luther King holiday?

[ellie]

87. DH and I drove

through there on a trip. It was hot, but not unbearably so, until we got to Phoenix and then it felt like a blast from a furnace. I literally felt like I was going to lose my mind from the heat, and we had been camping in the desert prior to this. It was awful.