Want to hear what happens when you combine a zero tolerance policy and a idiot elementary admin. ?

[LostInAnomie]

I work in an elementary school emotionally disabled classroom, so I am used to the emotional outbursts of my students, and the hyperbole that they use when emotional. So, I was not surprised when one of the girls in my classroom became VERY emotional over her boyfriend breaking up with her over recess. Not wanting force her to walk through the halls in an emotional fit I had the aides walk the rest of the class back to the classroom while I sat outside with her until she calmed down. After about ten minutes, the student had calmed down to the point that she was no longer in tears or screaming, and she was finally ready to talk about what was bothering her. Around that time the principle of the school walks up to where we were and listened in on our conversation. Over the course of talking to me the student muttered the words "If he dates another girl, I'll kill him." I thought nothing of it because I knew it was insincere hyperbole said for nothing but effect. I said something like "Oh, you don't mean that", and let it pass. The principle, on the other hand, threw herself into "zero tolerance" action.

The principle pushed me aside to interject her indignation about "... a threat on another student's life", and informed an already emotionally unstable girl that she would be suspended. The principle then dragged the student into her office and made her call her mother to tell her she would be suspended for three days. This, of course, threw her into another outburst where she broke a picture frame and kicked the principle, earning her another two days of suspension. So, instead of letting me handle the situation and calm the student down so she could return to class, zero tolerance pushed her into a five day suspension. :banghead:

I, personally, have never been in favor of zero tolerance policies for schools. I feel they are obtuse and inflexible mandates that obstruct effective discipline in favor of a feel good, "get tough" approach. They force educators to overlook context and individual student actions in favor of reactionary triggers and overblown responses. What happened today is a prime example of the mentality of zero tolerance, and the idiocy that drives it.

Will this shit ever change?

[dembotoz]

1. zero tolerence = zero brains

always has, always will

[otherlander]

4. Amen to that!

:toast:

[Richard Steele]

8. And it's a direct correlation: the fewer brains, the greater the fondness for "Zero Tolerance".nm

[The Inquisitive]

2. absurd

:banghead: indeed

what kind of fool escalates something so trivial?

[DarkTirade]

7. You obviously haven't met the kind of fools they leave running the schools these days...

I feel very bad for the good kids and teachers out there who have to deal with this kind of crap.

[MichiganVote]

17. Thank you. Not enough people recognize that very point.

[DarkTirade]

19. I only graduated from school in 2000, I still remember it pretty vividly.

The entire system is fucked up to the point where one good teacher can't make a difference. And I don't use curse words for vulgarity, I use them for emphasis. Screwed up wouldn't be a strong enough phrase to describe it. :P

[MichiganVote]

20. Yup. I work with some fantastic people in public schools. But the amount of work

we, the good ones, do to correct or stay on top of the dumbasses is astounding at times. The movie Idiocracy is a testament to it all. I still recommend public schools but I urge people to wear a seatbelt, it can be a bumpy ride.

[DarkTirade]

21. I sure as hell can't recommend the ones here in FL...

I truly believe that I would be better off had I taken the last two years off from school and worked instead. I would have learned more on my own, and I would have been able to save up enough money to have a much less bumpy ride when I got to college.

[MichiganVote]

23. :) I get quite a few kids up from Florida. Their special ed. plans are usually a mess.

I think if I had to do it all over again I could have wiped out an entire year of doing nothing but the subject of government had I opted to take it at an alternative.

[DarkTirade]

24. My high school was SUPPOSEDLY one of the top 200 in the nation...

but that's because they focused entirely on
A ) the average kids. If you were above or below average, or just plain different than average, you were screwed. I wasn't just forced to wade through a bunch of crap I didn't need to learn for the 7th year in a row, I was actively PREVENTED from learning anything new. Then my teachers wondered why I seemed to have no motivation. It wasn't lack of motivation, it was me being tired of going over the same lessons year after year and never getting a chance to move on and actually LEARN something.
B ) standardized tests. They taught the kids to do well on standardized tests. Then when they scored well on standardized tests, they got a better ranking as a school in general. Never mind that not a single kid actually learned a damn thing. They just wanted to be ranked higher than everyone else.
C ) Getting kids into college. They didn't actually PREPARE them for college. They just got them in. Mostly by dumbing down the honors classes so much that they were using the same curriculum as the remedial classes. (and I am not exaggerating. The classes would keep the same pace. The only difference was that the remedial classes would get 5 question quizzes when the regular classes got 10 question quizzes and the honors classes got 15 question quizzes.) There were no prerequisites to get into the honors classes. Anyone could take them. That way anybody who cared enough to sign up for them and bothered to show up and do the homework would have a nice transcript when they went off to college. Then once they got to college, the college had to teach them all the basics they should have learned back in middle or high school.

[MichiganVote]

25. I've had several friends who had kids in the so called gifted classes..

When the kids got to college they couldn't write. I went to parochial school where writing skills were paramount. However while my grammar was superior to my peers, my ability to write a cogent argument or point of view was weak. Can't have anyone thinking for themselves you know.

In 12 years of school I only liked two years, Kindergarten and 2nd grade. The rest was a waste of time. In HS I had C/D grades. I went to college and made the Dean's List first semester. Why? It wasn't as boring as HS.

[DarkTirade]

26. Yeah, that was me too.

I barely passed high school, yet my SAT score was high enough to get me right into college. :)

[MichiganVote]

3. Enter Manifestation Determination....

[DarkTirade]

5. I know someone who got expelled from school because of the zero tolerance policy.

His crime? Not knowing he was required to inform the school about any prescription meds he was taking and leave them in the front office.

Which is more than just a bit ridiculous... if someone has a health problem that might kick in IMMEDIATELY and be a danger, there might not be time to run across the entire frikkin' school to get his medication.

[SeattleGirl]

6. That totally sucks!

YOU know this student, YOU understood the excessive reaction she was having, and YOU were handling it just fine.

F'ing principle should have kept her nose, and the damned zero tolerance policy, out of it!

She did a lot more harm than good by butting in.

:banghead:

[AwakeAtLast]

9. Didn't the principal just supercede an IEP?

I thought that wasn't kosher. :shrug:

Whatever the case, it sounds like this pricipal does not go by "Do what is best for the student"

There are still administrators who still abide by that. Here's hoping more can be found.

:hug:

[carly denise pt deux]

10. they did overreact.............but.....

if this kid went off on that other kid and something happened, the principal would be sued becasue nothing was done. The educators have to be this way because of the violence in the schools, and the suits that follow. The principal had to cover him/herself. I know it's not a smart approach, but it's all they have left, thanks to these kids who come to school and hurt others over the past few years.
Carly

[Bennyboy]

11. I have to agree.....

Imagine if the kid does do something. Not a murder but even a fight, grafitti,TPing whatever and the principal said nothing. He would be liable, as well as the district, for not doing anything after a verbal threat.

Now imagine what would have happened to you in that case?

I have two friends that are High School teachers in California, and they tell me of attorneys more often than not, attending parent/teacher conferences in behalf of the child.

[troubleinwinter]

12. What we are teaching children:

A girl in my area who was a straight 'A' student and had the finest reputation with all of the teachers and students was suspended for weeks for bringing a weapon to school.

She had been camping over the weekend with her family. Monday morning she discovered a camping (Swiss army) knife in the bottom of her backpack, not having realized it was still there from the vacation. She immediately took the knife to the teacher to turn it in. Per 'zero tolerance policy', Admin suspended her for weeks... during finals.

The community was outraged, but "policy is policy".

So we are teaching children that:

• Building an excellent reputation for yourself counts for nothing.
  
• Working hard and getting excellent grades counts for nothing.
  
• Honesty counts for nothing.
  
• Adults never need to develop or use good judgment.

[DarkTirade]

22. Makes perfect sense to me...

sounds pretty much like any average big business the kids gonna be stuck working for when they finally graduate, since small businesses seem to be going the way of the dodo bird.

[PRETZEL]

13. no it won't ever change

at least anytime soon anyway.

Zero tolerance has allowed judgement and discretion to be removed from the classroom. Teachers and administrators don't have to make decisions as to motive and relevant actions. It's a win - win for them. They can blindly abide by school board policies.

[cobalt1999]

14. I also blame some parents that will file a lawsuit for anything..

Some of the liability issues force schools to do things they would have never done in the past.

[PRETZEL]

15. That, unfortunately, is the rub

I'd bet anything that 90% of the parents with school aged kids would love to see teachers and administrators taking back control of their schools. I'd bet that most teachers would like to do the same. I don't think any teacher wants to give up on any kid.

But by the same token, they don't want to have to continually look behind their backs to see if there's a lawyer lurking.

Me, I'm part of the 90%.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

16. That principal suffers from a mental disease I call "punishism."

People afflicted with it are only able to get their kicks from making people's lives miserable.

[gmoney]

18. Zero tolerance (orthodoxy) is an excuse to stop thinking.

Well, at least the suspension is longer than the waiting period to buy a handgun... or over the weekend so she can stop by the gun show. :sarcasm:

[madeline_con]

27. Is your principal always such a dufus?

Or is this unusual behavior?

I'm glad I have a nice principal.

[spacelady]

28. School "zero tolerance" just like employee "random drug tests"

Are what I call "lazy management."

[Lydia Leftcoast]

29. I call them "ACAs," ass-covering administrators

They're the types who suspend students for sharing Midol with a friend who has cramps.

They had them in my day, too.

ACAs and ACTs.

Back when I was in eighth grade, one of my classmates was caught passing a note in class. The teacher read the note, scowled, and said, "That's not a decent thing for a young girl to write." He gave her detention for "indecency."

We all gasped. After class, we asked the bewildered girl what she had written. She said that she had written about wearing her blouse out instead of tucked in because the skirt she was wearing was a hand-me-down from her older sister, too big around the waist, and therefore she wanted to hide the fact that the skirt was practically sliding halfway down her butt.

I guess he objected to her writing the word "butt." :shrug: