A business owner just told me $10 per hour is too much to pay an employee.

[graywarrior]

Can you believe that?

[KitchenWitch]

1. did you ask him if he could live on $10 an hour?

[billyskank]

2. Yeah, and $10 million a year is too much to pay a CEO

But THAT doesn't seem to bother them.

[Connonym]

10. I've got a theory about that

and why Americans tolerate the huge gap that separates the classes (that we say we don't even have). First, I think Americans are raised to believe that we deserve perfection and "we're" all on Prozac because our expectations are far higher than the vast majority will every achieve. Secondly, I think that we compound this by allowing the rich in America a free ride because we all secretly believe that some day we'll be the rich one. Sprinkle on top lots of propaganda in the form of TV and media celebrating the wealthy and depicting everyone on TV as beautiful and living in unrealistically nice houses/apartments.

[raccoon]

18. Great post.

About the propaganda--you're so right. There is a lot more emphasis on wealth, and depiction of it in TV/movies, than there was several decades ago.

I doubt "Sanford and Son" would make it on TV if somebody tried to sell that idea today.

"I think Americans are raised to believe that we deserve perfection "

I think too that many Americans expect too much. Me too, I guess.

[Xipe Totec]

38. Amazingly similar to the propaganda behind the iron curtain

It's funny, we made fun of the Soviet Worker's Paradise and here we are, enjoying the same benefits.

[Orsino]

41. Same benefits, minus the health care and retirement. n/t

[Liberal Lassie]

52. It's somewhere in a spinning phone booth with a guy in a cape

with an ugly T shirt with a big red "S" on it. Wears really awful glasses and likes to undress in public. Oh! Never mind, that was just some lunatic liberal. They all look alike to me.

[graywarrior]

3. Temp agencies in Florida can only get the worker $9 per hour

Plus, there are no jobs, so you only work 3 to 4 days per week. I'm just about done.

[billyskank]

4. Get the fuck out of there, gray.

[graywarrior]

5. I can't afford it.

I'm stuck in a revolving door of near poverty.

[billyskank]

6. Dammit

those bastards have you right where they want you.

That is no place for sensitive freaks like us.

[graywarrior]

7. No, it isn't.

And I just had to cancel my gym membership. I'm sliding into a dark hole.

[Wcross]

11. Come on up to Tennessee.

Even temp jobs pay 10-15 an hour. Plus it is cheaper to live here!

[graywarrior]

12. I may have to.

I have three options here, none of them good. One of them I already ruled out unless I hear back from the person and it sounds reasonable to pull off.

The other involves staying put and working temp at $8.50 per hour for 6 weeks which brings me to the end of my lease and I must leave here because the seasonal people take over the rental. Or, I move to a sub-standard rental at a lower rate and try to find a job in Sarasota, stay put til March and hopefully make enough to get my ass up to Ma or NH.

Seriously, I'm ready to take the gas pipe.

[Skittles]

51. hang in there graywarrior

I hear you but we must try to keep going, keep trying........you have friends here who would miss you. I do understand the feeling, I used to like my job but it seems to get worse by the week; I find it very depressing.

[graywarrior]

53. I wonder how many people off themselves over a job.

[flvegan]

13. What do you do temp wise?

[graywarrior]

22. Stuff I don't want to do.

Front office crap. I hate it.

[guitar man]

8. then tell him

to get off his ass and do it himself :mad:

[redqueen]

9. Yes I certainly can. No trouble at all believing that.

Greed is a disease, and it's been an epidemic for a while now... I think we've actually reached plague-like numbers, because even the rats running in the rat race are infected, and refuse to even consider any other way.

It's fucking tragic, really.

[billyskank]

14. I just realised

you're living in a Dickens novel.

[mvccd1000]

15. For what kind of work? I wouldn't pay someone $10/hr to...

... put stamps on envelopes, but I also wouldn't expect to hire a flash programmer for $10/hr.

FWIW, I started as a mechanic in 1997 at $10/hr, and bought my house in 2000 making $13/hr. I had to have a roommate for the first couple of years, but I did it. :)

[philosophie_en_rose]

16. Damn. That's barely above minimum wage.

:(

[HughBeaumont]

17. Then he should get out of business.

The minimum wage should be $10 an hour, end of sentence. There should also be a maximum wage. Life shouldn't be Major League Baseball.

[azmouse]

19. I earned more than that 20 yrs ago working in a factory.

And the job came with health insurance.

Isn't it odd how businesses could survive back then paying their employees a decent wage and they can't now?

[NewWaveChick1981]

20. Sheesh...

:grr: I don't know anyone who can survive on less than $10/hr. I'd like to see HIM try. :mad:

[caty]

21. A lot of people

don't realize how important unions were to everyone. They set a standard that non union businesses had to at least try to match in order to keep their employees from leaving for union jobs. But, now that the unions have been weakened, non union employers place little value on their employees. Employers know that their workers have no place else to go that will be better.

I know a lot of people hate unions. But, they should stop and consider all the benefits that unions encouraged every employer to give to their employees. The unions have been forced to back off on some of these benefits, and now non union employers have free reign to treat their employees poorly. The government has done a lot to take away from the worker and give it to the already rich business owners, CEOs, and top executives. Forget the little guy---take care of the rich.

Of course, I know that a lot of small businesses cannot stay in business if they pay more or give benefits. These are the businesses that should only hire part time employees who are just working for extra money---not trying to live on low hourly pay.

[graywarrior]

23. The only jobs available in Florida are service jobs.

Seniors collecting social security set the base pay here. They don't want to make more than $7 or 8 per hour so it doesn't affect their monthly gov'ment checks. And there's millions of them here. Can't compete with that.

An HR person told me this week that 900 people applied for one receptionist job at the company I temped with. One person hired--a retired senior who didn't mind working for cheap.

[LeftyFingerPop]

24. Let's do the math...

Since $10 an hour is GROSS, the effective take home rate of pay is probably closer to $7 per hour after FICA and taxes.

On a monthly basis...

$7 x 160 hours = $1,120 take home pay per month.

Rent.........................$500
Heat and or Electric.........$150
Groceries....................$280
Incidentals..................$100
Subtotal Expenses............$1,030

Amount left over after subtotal expenses......$90

This $90 will NOT cover....medical insurance, car payment, car insurance, car repair, savings, any food other than "survival food", etc.

So, the answer is...you can indeed survive on $10 per hour, only not for very long. You will not have health insurance, you will not be able to afford a car, and you will just have your shelter needs met. Any illness or unexpected expenses, and you will be screwn.

[SoCalDem]

43. If they can eat on $2.88 a month

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x468622

A single mom with one child can live easily on $10 an hour

Posted by SoCalDem in General Discussion
Wed Mar 21st 2007, 05:09 PM

IF they can both eat on $2.88 a month and no one gets sick...or the car does not break down..and she drives with no car insurance..and the kid never outgrows clothing or shoes




............................

More math:


SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts)

Fri Apr-15-05 06:27 AM


You make $12k a year, rent a crappy apartment, drive a clunker,



and yet our "media" would have us believe that "your" main concerns are :

1. selection of judges

2. whether a woman you never met has a feeding tube re-inserted

3. making sure that only "super-rich" people can still file bankruptcy

4. making sure that super-rich people can hold their family "booty" untaxed for generation after generation

5. making sure that public schools get little, if any federal funding

6. making sure that only rich people can use the judicial system when they are injured or defrauded

7. making sure that no woman has any reproductive choice

8. making sure that your employer has easy access to off-shoring YOUR job if he cannot get you to work for less

9. making sure that insurance companies are "well taken care of", even if it means that YOU cannot afford medical insurance

10. making sure that oil wells go into the Arctic reserve, even though it's a "drop in the bucket" that will probably end up in Japan..TEN years from now.

11. pushing for private accounts for social security, even though ALL reliable experts say this is a recipe for DISASTER

12. making sure that God is EVERYWHERE..in courthouses, schools, TV, radio..

13. making sure that gay people can never marry

14. making sure that "our borders" are "mexican-free zones"

It simply amazes me how such uneducated people are "experts" on tort reform, and energy and taxes, and social security, by virtue of regurgitating talking points.

I have to hope that in their day-to-day lives, these people are really thinking about.. :

1. How much Kraft mac 'n cheese will $5 food stamps buy?

2. How can I pay $125 a week daycare on a take home check of $220

3. Why does my crappy apartment cost so damned much?

4. How will I pay a $400 repair bill on a car that's worth $800?

5. Just how high of a fever does the baby have to have, before I break the budget and take him to a doctor?

6. At $2.75 a gallon, how many days will I have to hitch a ride to work?

7. How many part-time jobs are "enough"..2? 3?..

8. When you work 2-3 jobs, and pay for childcare, when do you have "family-time"?

9. How can MY values be instilled in my kids when they never see me?

10. How can a marriage survive when both parents work all the time, and never have any quality time together or with the family?

11. How can Grandma afford to stay in her paid-for home, since the nursing home wants to confiscate it for grandpa's care?

I think these are the REAL problems that most people grapple with...not the esoteric policy issues that so many on call-in shows claim to "worry" about.

It annoys me every time I hear the talking points come out of the mouths of people who haven't a CLUE what they are talking about..

It's all a game..My side-your side.. These people are not even thinking about the consequences of these draconian policies..on their lives or the lives of their peers..

They are merely parroting what they are brainwashed to believe :(

[tjwmason]

25. That's below the minimum wage in the U.K.

£5.52, which is about $11.50.

[LeftyMom]

26. Sadly, the federal minimum here is $5.50/hr. Some states are higher.

In California it's $7.50/hr, which isn't enough to starve on considering the cost of living here.

[tjwmason]

39. $5.50?

:wtf:

I earned more than that as a Saturday boy filing records at an opticians when I was 16, and that's in nominal terms over 10 years ago.

Good to see the people can still be completely screwed in the interests of "efficiency" and corporate personhood - afterall what's more important, a business or a human?

[billyskank]

31. And it applies to everyone over age 21.

I learned while in America that the minimum wage does not even apply to everyone. Waiters and waitresses, for example, are exempt. Restaurant owners pay them next to nothing, so they are almost totally dependent on tips for their income. So you have to pay their wages, not that I noticed the food being any cheaper for it. Effectively the food in a restaurant in America costs about 20% more than it says it does.

[cemaphonic]

37. Here in Washington, waiters make at least minimum wage

(which is also higher than the federal minimum) And yet restaurants still manage to miraculously stay afloat.

It is a screwy system, and I wish that it worked the way it does in Europe.

[krispos42]

27. Depends on the job, but...

It's one thing for a part-time "extra" job, but if you're trying to live alone on that... ouch.

Come, greywarrior, come to Minnesota...

[ContraBass Black]

28. An employee located where and doing what?

[Sadie4629]

29. Is it a job a high school student could do?

What hourly wage are similar businesses paying in your area?

Depending on the circumstances, I don't have a problem with this. An employer should not have to assume that anyone who would take a job at his business has a family of four depending on his/her income to survive. Frankly, it isn't his responsibility.

[rockyandmax]

30. What sort of job are you talking about here?

What is your educational level?

[graywarrior]

32. Four combined years of college

No degree. Three years at a non-credited art school followed by a year of credited courses. But I've done mostly entrepreneurial type things: promoted concerts, started an entertainment newspaper, managed inns and B&B's, etc. Hard to fit me into one slot. Either I am over qualified, or under qualified.

[One_Life_To_Give]

33. Depends on what the job is.

If an hours work means given $10 of stuff you turn it in $15 for sale. Then the owner is right.
If the hour means given $100 of stuff you turn it into $350 for sale. Then you have a point.

[graywarrior]

34. The lower paying the job is, the more they want you to do.

I've been paid $25 per hour for proofreading and never broke a sweat.

And then I've done reception work at $9 and been expected to answer four lines, transfer calls, figure out who won't take calls, get yelled at for transferring a call when the idiot never told me he never takes his calls without a fucking announcment first, handle all incoming and outgoing mail, make thousands of copies, fix the copy machine, file folders in another room down the hall but don't ever leave the desk and why aren't these filed?, put orientation and benefits folders together--have 20 ready by tomorrow while trying to figure out the sequence, blah blah blah blah $9 fucking dollars per hour, and oh by the way, we don't need you Friday--32 hours for the week, 40 miles round trip to get there.

[One_Life_To_Give]

35. Difference is

In the case of a book. Proofreading comes between the upfront cost outlay and actually being able to start the presses and make money. In terms of the total value at sales $25/hr vs $Millions.

Receptionists are often viewed more like a necessary evil. Somebody has to do it to keep the clients/customers happy but it doesn't produce any revenue.

And I suspect finding a good proofreader is a whole lot more difficult than you are giving yourself credit for.

[graywarrior]

36. You have no idea how much you just helped me.

You kicked something into gear for me by just writing those three little paragraphs. Thanks.

[Crazy Dave]

40. I'm sure employee health insurance also costs too much

I know several assholes like that. They're also the most demanding of their employees too :grr:

[graywarrior]

42. Not many businesses in Florida offer health insurance

[SoCalDem]

45. ESPECIALLY $10 and under an hr jobs..

Those folks are unlikely to get ANY benefits

[Orrex]

44. Ask him if he draws a paycheck from the business

If so, then $10/hr is too much for him, too.

[graywarrior]

46. My take on this is business owners despise hourly workers because

they consider them not creative enough to have their own business.

[China_cat]

47. I had a very small business...1 employee

and I paid $10/hour...11 years ago.

Edited to add that I couldn't afford health insurance even then for her but the American Express business card carried $50,000 accident insurance on cardholders so I put her on the business account. Cost me $35/year and gave her at least some protection.

[graywarrior]

49. What a great idea!

[bridgit]

48. we have a friend who's dad manufactures in China and feels that .85Cts/hr...

is too much :wow: over Thanksgiving turkey a couple years back, hubby told him he'd be willing to work for .85Ct's/hr if shoes cost .10Ct's a pair...I've seldom seen so confused a look on a grown man's face as our friend's dad, like aliens had just walked off a spaceship, and were now sitting at his T-Day table

So yep, I can believe it, the depths of human greed will not be plumbed any time soon imo

[graywarrior]

50. I'm always amazed at what supermarkets pay their employees.

Everthing they sell has a 150% markup but they pay their workers $8-9 an hour and limit their hours.

[midlife_mo_Jo]

54. My opinion on the minimum wage

is that the wage should be set so that TWO workers can support a household on it.

With government funded childcare and healthcare, two workers should be able to support a household of four, for instance.

I just don't think it's realistic to expect that someone working in a coffeeshop should be able to support a family. Two people. Yes. One person. No. Single parents should be getting help from the other parent and/or help from the government.