Heterosexual Men versus Lesbians (Question)

[Bill of Rights]

I recently put up a post announcing that a new movie, starring Neve Campbell, is in production. This film will feature erotic lesbian scenes.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x858958

I expected to read posts from bi and lesbian-minded women, but only men bothered to respond. My question: Who enjoys sapphic scenes more, heterosexual men or lesbian women?

I, personally, cannot stand porno, but I really like mainstream movies that feature lesbian intimacy. And I think I like them more then the men do! :)

[Paragon]

1. My guess is you'd have to define "lesbian intimacy" better

I'd say 95% of "lesbian intimacy" in Hollywood product is written, directed, and shot by men for tit-illation purposes (purposeful use of the hyphen there).

Can't say I've seen much authentic lesbian intimacy...my favorite would have to be saving Willow & Tara's first on-screen kiss on Buffy the Vampire Slayer for the episode when everyone was grieving over Joyce's death. It wasn't "hot", but man, it was powerful.

[slinkerwink]

3. I really like the kisses in Better Than Chocolate

and Bound is an amazing flick for lesbian/bi women to watch ;-)

[Paragon]

4. Never saw it

But I appreciated Bound just fine as a straight man. ;-)

[slinkerwink]

5. oops, my mistake

:hi:

[CTLawGuy]

34. thats a great movie

and it has nothing to do with copious footage of the two main characters making out...


nothing at all.....

[Gman]

2. Just a guess but, .

I'd say men. Erotic scenes effect men directly and immediately. We're simple.

...sorry, I know you asked for bi and/or lesbian minded women to answer. But I'm just repeating what I hear from mainly bi women friends.

[Paragon]

6. I have Showtime On Demand...

I've been meaning to check out that new show The L Word, but I haven't got around to it yet. For some reason, it holds more appeal for me than, say...Queer As Folk.

:silly:

[Bill of Rights]

9. I have seen dozens of lesbian movies -

both mainstream and lesbian productions. I'm always on the watch for them, checking out gay websites and so on. Depictions of lesbian relationships are of great interest to me. And I really like it when the depictions become overt and actually show the physicality of love.

I can only stand so much subtext, such as the relationship between Xena and Gabrielle.

[NightTrain]

7. Ooo! Ooo-ooo! Ooo!

Mmm.... Women humping each other! :9

[Bill of Rights]

37. Elle McPherson and Kate Capshaw

created exciting moments in A Girl Thing. Ms. Capshaw was exceedingly sexy artist and was believable (here we go again) in her pursuit of a young lawyer, played by supermodel Elle. Capshaw seemed very "experienced." One of my friends commented that she was sure Capshaw had been with women, in real life, before.

If you see this video, be aware that it is the first of 4 vignettes about women in love. The other three vignettes are heterosexual, and not as interesting. :)

[CanuckAmok]

8. Isn't it a case of "same old, same old"?

I mean, regardless of gender, Hollywood always pairs up unnaturally perfect people in unobtainable situations.

The current "lesbian chic" in media is just as guilty as porn in depicting only 'beautiful people' satisfying the fantasies of the viewer.

[Bill of Rights]

10. Actually, the Monster

movie is one that shows typically unattractive women and I think it is really, really HOT. I love the roller rink scene, where the two women start off just passing time and end up making out during a slow dance. And then frantically, groping each other pressed up against a brick wall.

The women are supposedly not attractive, but I thought they were.

[CanuckAmok]

11. That's a tough one...

I haven't seen it, but I assume the two women in the scene Charlize Theron and Christina Ricci?

It's an interesting example, because even though they are made to appear conventionally unattractive, the actors in the scene are acknowledged sex symbols. So, is perhaps that part of the elements which make the scene "hot" for you? I mean, the viewers' knowledge that they are conventionally attractive beneath the 'disguise'?

Is that part of the 'sell' of the movie--the fact that Christina Ricci and Charlize Theron are going to make out in it?

What would you say if it were, say, Kathy Bates and Rosie O'Donnell in the same scene? Not that they're unattractive, per se, but they aren't conventional 'sex symbols'.

I'm not 'calling you out', I'm just throwing some ideas out there. Plus, please keep in mind I haven't seen Monster, so my statement may make no sense to someone who has seen the film.

[Bill of Rights]

12. Christina Ricci looked like a stereotypical baby-dyke

In the film, we first meet her as she is trying to get up the nerve to make a pass at other women. She is so awkward-looking and uncomfortable. Her character's personality is immature. In fact, Ricci said, "I've never played such a weak, repressed character." Even though it was painful to look at her, she played a real type of person and not a caricature. Charlize's character was the most REAL of all women I have seen in film for the last couple of years. I found myself responding to both actresses more in these roles than in their other ones.

I highly recommend Monster. It was like I was watching a life.

As far as the hotness was concerned, would it be the same with Kathy Bates and Rosie O'Donnell? If they played believable characters and like they are not faking it, I hope I would like them, too.

It all boils down to, does this seem real?

[Bill of Rights]

13. I just want to add that I thought GIA

had some incredibly hot, believable-looking scenes. Angelina Jolie became totally immersed in her role as the lesbian supermodel. Charlize Theron allowed Aileen Wuornos to get under her skin.

If a woman can "channel" a lesbian I love it. I don't like any half-assed tries.

[CanuckAmok]

16. I think that's why I picked "Rosie" as an example...

because she IS a lesbian, and would be more comfortable/believable in a lesbian love scene.

Of course, that's arguable, because it's acting, and any chemistry between the two actors isn't necessarily triggered by gender preference. Everyone on screen is 'faking it' to one degree or another.

[JohnKleeb]

14. Isnt Monster about Eileen Wuornos

Sorry to butt in being a hetero guy. I admit I am sorta turned on by two girls going at it.

[Zorra]

15. Lesbians 6, Heterosexual Men 5 (OT)

Sorry, I hadda do it.

[foreigncorrespondent]

17. I think men do.

Most men fantasize about watching two women getting it off.

[CanuckAmok]

18. Do you remember that SNL sketch with the Genie in the lamp?

These frat boys find a Genie and get a wish. They ask for a "hot lesbian performance", and these two very bull-dykish women appear, with an accousic guitar and wearing layers of fleece and wool garments. One of them starts playing/singing "Kumbaya" while the other one complains about how warm it is in the dorm.

Perfect illustration of "lesbian fantasy" versus (one) reality.

[Bill of Rights]

21. I'll tell ya, years ago

I had a fling with a woman who kind reminded me of Charlize Theron playing Aileen Wuornos. The woman was a falling down drunk mess. I didn't think it would be possible, but I started having it really, really bad for her. She was not a typical beauty, but I had it for her in the worst way. More than for anyone in my entire life!!!!!

[noiretextatique]

22. i think you're right on, canuckamok

plus in real life, the last thing two lesbians would fantasize about is having some man gawking at them.

[noiretextatique]

23. i find intimacy much more interesting

though the sex scene in "bound" was hot.
my favorite intimate scene is in "when night is falling," when camille and petra kiss for the first time...much hotter than the actual sex scene, imho.

[Bill of Rights]

24. I liked When Night Is Falling, too.

Especially when one of them was dying in the ice patch. If I remember right, the kiss scene took place in a stairwell, or right inside a door. It was very nicely done!

[CanuckAmok]

25. "Henry and June" had some steamy scenes in it, as I recall...

...but it's been years since I saw it, so maybe my rose-coloured hindsight goggles are on.

[noiretextatique]

27. no...there were some good scenes in that movie too

also..."the hunger" with susan sarandon and catherine deneuve.

[CanuckAmok]

28. Except they were both body-doubled.

Actually, I'm not sure about Susan Sarandon, but all of Catherine Deneuve's 'closed set' scenes were shot with a body double. Kind of disappointing.

[noiretextatique]

30. i didn't know that...and she's so beautiful

but the scenes were quite intense. i saw it several years ago, but i still remember THAT :7

[CanuckAmok]

32. Stupid studio-level decision.

According to Deneuve, she was willing to do the scenes, but the studio deemed she was 'too old'.

Of course, that's hearsay...

[noiretextatique]

33. hmmm...that certainly strengthens your argument, doesn't it?

as you mentioned, i doubt rosie o'donnell and kathy bates in bed would be as interesting to men as neve campbell and jennifer tilly in bed :7

[noiretextatique]

29. "sotto sotto" is a good one

i haven't seen in years...but i recall some really passionate scenes.

[noiretextatique]

26. yes...it was in the hallway of camille's house

she asked petra in, then she kissed her very passionately.
i love that scene because it's her first step towards awakening from her repressed, unfulfilled existence in that drab town...the drab college, and that drab relationship. it always touches me more than the sex scenes.

[foreigncorrespondent]

39. ROFLMAO!

Oh nooooooooooooooo! I really don't want men gawking at me. Bloody hell that would be worse than having a bucket of water thrown on ya. Real mood breaker.

[foreigncorrespondent]

38. Oh I wish I had of seen it.

Unfortunately we only get SNL down here on cable, and I don't currently have cable.

[Bill of Rights]

19. Yes, men do, but do they like it more than

lesbian-minded women? Could they possibly? It seems like they might.

[JohnKleeb]

20. yeah I guess to you guys(by you guys I mean lesbians)

look at it how heteros view watching a couple go at it. Not sure, no one said I was a leader in understanding sexuality. I do think that is true that most men do get off by it.

[noiretextatique]

31. "entre nous" has no sex scenes

but it's a great story (and true) love story.

[Bill of Rights]

36. Entre Nous

Was great. The "lesbian" scene was a touch of one hand.

I've been trying to think of other good scenes. I liked the love scene in Mulholland Drive between Naomi Watts and that winner of Mrs. South America contest(or something like that). I think there was a good Nancy Drew mystery build-up between the two characters, and was disappointed when their relationship came crashing down in reality. Just when I thought, "Hey this is getting good," it was over.

[CTLawGuy]

35. very little turns hetero men on more...

than attractive lesbians having sex.

[Bridget Burke]

40. Have you ever heard of Slash fanfiction?

It started out in long ago "zines" with stories featuring Kirk/Spock (hence the /)--taking their friendship to new levels.

Mostly written by and for het women, the genre has grown considerably with the help of the internet. You can find all sorts of pairings (or multiples) featuring good-looking male characters going at it--Aragorn/Legolas, anyone? Most of it is crap but there are a few good writers out there.

It's good that lesbian or bi women have some hot movie scenes they can enjoy--but, of course, lots of men do, too. Most straight women aren't bothered--I'm certainly not. But guy on guy scenes would supposedly send the straight men screaming from the theatres. It's not fair!

[Az]

41. It has to do with social expectations

Men are socially expected to be the aggressors. Women the caring passionate nuturers. Of course there is no reason that a persons internal wiring need comply to this but social expectations lend these assumptions. Thus two men acting aggressive to each other and fighting is within the boundaries of expectation. Two women fighting violates this expectation. Even more so does the image of a man attacking a woman violate these expectations.

The case of intimacy is the same. Two men acting intimate violates the expectation of aggression. But two women acting intimate confirms the expectation of caring and passionate. In fact it may actually heighten the sense of intimacy in viewers. Much like two men struggling with each other is seen as spectator sport two women in the throws of passion stimulate at the other end of the extreme.

[Bertha Venation]

42. this lesbian's opinion is

:shrug: I won't see the film because I don't care to see sex in movies. If I'm going to watch sex in a movie, I'll make it porn performed by real lesbians.