Is today the day we've been waiting for?

[XemaSab]

:shrug: :popcorn:

[Skink]

1. I got my internet turned on finally.

:headbang:

[fascisthunter]

2. XemaSab.... I Hope Not (nt)

[tachyon]

3. End of global warming?

I don't get your point...

[NickB79]

6. More like the beginning of the end for us

It's officially spring, and the longer days are going to send Arctic sea ice plummeting.

[tachyon]

7. Well, according to that graph, there's more right now than there was this time last year.

Not sure what I'm supposed to infer from that.

[Systematic Chaos]

10. See post #9, below. Area doesn't define thickness.

n/t

[tachyon]

12. Of course...that's why the graph is mostly meaningless.

Just sayin'

[skids]

18. Not meaningless...

...it's the trenches where the meaning lies, is all. And the rate of freeze/melt on the hill sides. The peak says next to nothing.

[XemaSab]

21. If you want the smoking gun (in graph form) this is it:

[NickB79]

17. It would help to read this thread as well

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=115x139391

That graph showing the decline of the older, thicker pack ice scares the hell out of me.

[lapfog_1]

4. Hint... it's not the area, it's the thickness

and the content (current replacement sea ice has a high salt content).

Write again next September.

[XemaSab]

5. I think you're missing my point here:

I think we're at the apex of the ice roller-coaster, and it's a LONG WAY DOWN.

[tachyon]

8. This spring's apex is higher than last years was. Is there more to this graph than

can be seen with a computer monitor?

(I'm a committed believer in global climate change, I just don't see how this particular graph is evidence of anything)

[Systematic Chaos]

9. What the graph DOESN'T show...

...is that this time around the ice that formed is going to be extremely thin and high in salt content. Add those two together and you have plenty of paper-thin ice which will disappear, leaving only the last of the old, thick ice behind. It will then be that much easier to lose yet more of the older ice.

It's a vicious cycle which likely won't end until the Arctic is completely ice free during the summer. Expect to see that before much longer. Maybe not this year but very soon.

[XemaSab]

11. First of all, last year's apex has been cut off because melt started earlier

and the graph only shows the last year. The graph isn't "evidence" of anything beyond the fact that the ice may be beginning to melt for the spring.

This is the site for a LOT of info:

http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/

You can also watch the ice melt basically in real time with some of the images on this site. It's updated daily, and last year provided quite the show.

[tachyon]

13. I'm not at all disagreeing with the premise, just saying that -particular_ graph

doesn't provide any useful evidence. What I mean is...those of who understand the ongoing climatological problem don't NEED it and those who don't get or believe it get nothing from that graph to become educated. That's all I'm saying.

[Systematic Chaos]

14. And what you are saying is logical enough.

Just go to the site link above and look at some of the other data plots, like the ones for the past 20 years or more. Or the one which shows the ice coverage for the past century by season. There's an undeniable plunge in the numbers over the past 15 years. It's definitely not a fluke, but it sure as hell is scary.

[tachyon]

15. I actually get to 70 deg. North a few times a year...

Deadhorse...I see what is happening. My job isn't really DU/politically-correct but it's what I do and it doesn't keep
me from being a liberal Democrat.

[Shoelace]

16. Wapo had a must read on this - "arctic sea ice thinner, newer"

I keep a close eye on that ice so it worth noting that this is very thin, new ice now forming as you said (thanks for posting that link, it's always a great one to see the big picture). The skeptics are having a field day with the "new ice" on other forums about global warming. Here's a quote from Wapo's article of March 19th:

Arctic sea ice always grows and shrinks, ranging from an average minimum in September of 2.5 million square miles to an average winter maximum in March of 5.9 million square miles. Instruments on NASA's Aqua satellite, as well as Defense Department satellites, showed that the maximum sea ice extent in March increased by 3.9 percent over that of the previous three years because of the winter.

Nonetheless, the total ice coverage was still 2.2 percent below the long-term average. And the very old ice, which remains in the Arctic for at least six years, made up more than 20 percent of the Arctic in the mid- to late 1980s, but by this winter it had decreased to 6 percent.

Flying over the Arctic, one might perceive the sea ice cover as broad, Meier said, but that apparent breadth hides the fact that the ice is so thin. "It's a facade, like a Hollywood set," he said. "There's no building behind it."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/18/AR2008031802903.html?hpid%3Dmoreheadlines%E2%8A%82=AR

[hunter]

19. Civilization as we know it...

Bowling + Rollercoaster

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uQrC_C6SexI

[XemaSab]

20. Not to mention...

Pack ice as we know it, agricultural productivity as we know it, oil supply as we know it....

That video kicks ass... :D

[Systematic Chaos]

22. 3/25 kick - The Other White Meat (tm)!!

:kick:

[skids]

23. safe to call peak now I'd say

...been a bumpy ride this year, but that's a trend.

:kick:

[Systematic Chaos]

24. And down she goes!

Where she stops, nobody knows.