Update: LR Man Defends Wife, Wounds Would-Be Robber

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

According to the police report, a husband and wife were unloading groceries into their Jeep when a man wearing a wig and cap allegedly confronted them, pointing a gun. At that point, the report says the suspect said "'This is a robbery'" and went after the woman's purse.

Police say the suspect allegedly hit the woman and ripped the bag from the woman's arm. Police say that's when her husband took action.

Sgt. Cassandra Davis says the husband fired at Jonathan Terry, hitting him in the rear end.

"The husband than retrieved his own personal weapon. He did ask the suspect to release his wife and the purse. The suspect refused," says Sgt. Davis.

Police say Terry jumped into a waiting car and his friends, Sherry Battle and Tequila Rice drove him to UAMS. "They were at the hospital and our officers took those individuals into custody also," explains Sgt. Davis.



http://www.todaysthv.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=82213&catid=2

[flvegan]

1. Shot him in the ass?

Not what I'd aim for. I guess you go after what you can. Still a successful action against a crim in the act.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

3. He may let go of the purse next time.

[flvegan]

4. Better yet, he may not even consider trying next time.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

5. Better yet, maybe he'll be in prison and not be able to try it.

[flvegan]

7. I don't think

he'll be in prison long enough. And if memory serves, all too often prison makes/breeds a more "efficient" crim. Hope it's not so in this case.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

8. They can probably pile up some time on him.

Armed robbery, assault with a deadly weapon. If he's on parole he's screwed.

David

[Rabrrrrrr]

2. 1) Good for the husband! Concealed carry is essential. 2) Journalist needs to learn English.

Seriously, what kind of shit writing is that?

Any journalist of any legitimate merit would be embarrassed to have written something so grammatically and syntactically lower class.

Whatever school passed this pile of shit ought to have the accreditation taken away, assuming they even have one.

Maybe he's a product of Oral Roberts University or the Jerry Falwell Tech School for the Terminally Ignorant.


However, one has to admit to one giant truth: pathetically ignorant though this person's writing is, it is miles and years ahead of the shit-drivel spouted on the J

[1]

6. "Seriously, what kind of shit writing is that?"

you might want to reference this other thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5345559

where a dude at knifepoint "rifled" through a drawer to collect his "pistol" and shoot the bad guy.

great writing is out there, you just have to look for it...

[Rabrrrrrr]

11. Wow - that's pretty shitty writing, too.

The level of literacy is getting goddamn sad in this country.

[1]

22. come on! dude "rifled" for a "pistol"? you don't appreciate the bon mot in that shit right there?

where is your head at?

[Rabrrrrrr]

70. Well, all right, I give the guy props for the rifling bit.

But seriously, that's awful writing.

[petronius]

23. I was very impressed with how the husband shot the guy and then retrieved

his weapon. Are you telling me this is just bad writing, and the husband isn't some kind of gun-toting magician? :shrug:

[Rabrrrrrr]

71. sadly, yes, I think this is bad writing, and not a magical husband.

x(

Which is too bad.

It would be way better if it were truly as written, like some kind of armory bank of the cosmos. "I need some bullets right now, but I don't have my gun - I promise, if you let me fire now, I'll get my gun as soon as possible and balance everything out."

[imdjh]

77. Someone at Gannett told me that it isn't usually the author

I complained about the writing in a local paper, specifically that articles often included unsupported pronouns and references to characters who had not been introduced.

Something like this:

>"Police officers at the scene found evidence that crop circles were made by aliens, " Brown said.< when the article has never introduced "Brown" and we have no idea who he is. The Gannett guy told me that editors often slice and dice articles for space without regard for such things. They will cut a sentence or paragraph even though a later sentence or paragraph is built on the material being cut.

[depakid]

9. You can post all the scare stories that you like but it doesn't change the FACT that having guns

in the household makes that holusehold's members many times more likely to be either perpetrate a violent crime- be the victim of a violent crime, or suffer a tragedy from either a firearms accident (both by children and adults) or suicide.

And on a broader level- even after controlling for poverty and urbanization, for every age group, people in states with many guns have elevated rates of homicide, particularly firearm homicide.

Simply put, having a gun in your house increases yours and your familie' or household members'risk of harm- and the more guns in your area, the greater that risk.

[1]

12. so say your "biased" statistics and your own "scare stories" ...

go ahead and believe that "propaganda." i won't...

yay! citizens standing up for themselves!

[depakid]

14. Epidemiological studies and rational risk assessment is hardly propaganda

Fear appeals on the other hand....

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

19. Are you willing to post some links to those studies? Not the VPC.

[depakid]

27. There are quite a few

This one's nice because it's the full article (free) and it references (and links to) abstracts of other studies.

http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/160/10/929#KWH309C20

There are also a bunch of related risk and injury studies summarized here:

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/firearms-research/

(toolbar on the left)

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

29. I wonder if they added suicides into those stats?

[depakid]

42. They're in separate categories

both involve significantly elevated risks (and of course, firearms suicides are successful FAR more often than other common methods at hand)/

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

45. Do you think suicide should be illegal?

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

31. At least Harvard admitted to adjusting the data.

After controlling for poverty and urbanization. Now what does that mean exactly?

David

[depakid]

46. Statistical controls adjust for all sorts of deals:"greater numbers" or proportions, etc.

Age adjustment is the classic (and probably easiest) way to understand how these methods work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_adjustment

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

47. How would urbanization and poverty affect the statistics?

[depakid]

55. More ways than I might count

Higher population density, age distribution, socioeconomic status, ethnic or religious populations, etc.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

60. Why would they have to adjust the numbers for those things?

[depakid]

63. To make accurate comparisons

The general concept behind the methodologies is illustrated at the link in the previous post:

For example, in 2004/5, two Australian health surveys investigated rates of long-term circulatory system health problems (e.g. heart disease) for the general Australian population, and specifically for the Indigenous Australian population. In each age category over age 24, Indigenous Australians had markedly higher rates of circulatory disease than for the general population: 5% vs 2% in age group 25-34, 12% vs 4% in age group 35-44, 22% vs 14% in age group 45-54, and 42% vs 33% in age group 55+.<1>

However, overall, these surveys estimated that 12% of all Indigenous Australians had long-term circulatory problems<1>compared to 18% of the overall Australian population<2>.

To understand this apparent contradiction, note that the Indigenous population is comparatively young (median age 21 years, compared to 37 for non-Indigenous) due to relatively high birth and death rates.<3> Because of this, Indigenous figures are dominated by the younger age groups, which have lower rates of circulatory disease; this masks the fact that their risk is still higher than for non-Indigenous peers of the same age.

In order to get a more informative comparison between the two populations, we use a weighting approach. Older groups in the Indigenous population are weighted more heavily (to match their importance in the 'reference population', i.e. the overall Australian population) and younger groups less heavily. This gives an 'age-adjusted' morbidity rate approximately 30% higher than that for the general population, representing the fact that Indigenous Australians do have a higher risk of circulatory disease.

To adjust for age under this direct method of standardization, age-specific rates in each group must be known, as well as the age structure in a standard population.

Age adjustment is commonly used when comparing prevalences in different populations; it is also used for characteristics such as life expectancy, average income, and other properties that are not directly linked to the total population size.

Age adjustment is not appropriate when attempting to compare population totals (for instance, if we wanted to know the total number of hospital beds required for patients with circulatory diseases).

[imdjh]

76. Gun control is a belief system. You are beating your head against a wall.

[imdjh]

75. OK, here's where I stopped reading that article

"The risk of dying from a suicide in the home was greater for males in homes with guns than for males without guns in the home "

Are we supposed to take seriously an article that leads with the quoted sentence? Does the author mean "the risk of dying from a suicide ATTEMPT" or "the propensity to commit suicide"?

I'm not arguing this with you anymore. It's a constitutional right, and that's it. I have a constitutional right to keep and bear arms, a constitutional right to keep at hand the means to defend myself. The beauty of the right is that if you don't want to exercise it, then you have that right. What you don't have is the right to take that right away from me. So knock off the attempt.

[paulsby]

83. there is no causal factor established

yes, houses with guns are more likely to have X happen within them.

again, people who actually understand statistics, logic, causality, and science have debunked the CAUSAL claim.

[Rabrrrrrr]

13. You know where almost all railroad accidents take place? Near railroads.

Amazing, isn't it?

Ban the fucking railroads!!!!

The majority of car accidents take place in locations where this is a car, too.

And sporting injuries? Happen far more often to people involved in playing sports.

[depakid]

16. Precisely- so if you want to reduce your risk of harm, then don't keep a gun in the house

That's the take home message.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

20. Accidental deaths have decreased as gun ownership has increased.

[depakid]

25. Oh good grief, they have not

:eyes:

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

26. The CDC says you are dead ass wrong, here are the numbers.

Unintentional Gun Deaths All Races, Both Sexes, All Age Groups

1981-1985 8,632
1986-1990 7,298
1991-1995 6,952
1996-2000 4,581
2001-2005 3,732


Source: http://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/

[depakid]

40. Don't see that data anywhere on the site

Perhaps you might link directly to it.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

44. You have to search the fatal injury reports, being the wonderful guy I am I did it for you.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

33. Feel free to eat that crow.

[depakid]

51. If I'm wrong, I always admit it- why wouldn't one? No one wants to stay ignorant

that doesn't necessarily mean that your initial claim is true re: increasing ownership = decreasing accidents.

Accidental shootings have surely been studied in academia, which might shed some light on tht might be. On the other hand I'm not certain about how they're getting the data- and whether it's complete. As you'll note on other areas of the site- there's are major limitations on what and how information is collected and compiled.

e.g. The National Violent Death Reporting System (NVDRS)

"The data in this report are from 16 states, and these states or the data from them were not analyzed or chosen to provide a representative sample of the United States population. Therefore, these data cannot be generalized to the entire U.S. population. Any changes or fluctuations in rates could be as a result of different demographic or socioeconomic fluctuations in these 16 states as compared to the entire U.S. population."

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

57. Gun ownership has increased while accidental deaths from firearms have decreased.

I don't know where you get your equal sign or what it's supposed to mean.

David

[depakid]

61. Assuming the data is complete, there are likely other factors going on

over time that have nothing to do with increased ownership that account for accident reduction.

That said- the numbers are still pretty high- and in many and probaly most of those cases, had a gun not been in the household, the accidental death would not have occurred.

Note of course, the data doesn't include injuries- and it's reasonable to assume that many of the accidental deaths from the 1980's are now injuries (and not reported) due to improvements in medical care, trauma systems and transportation times to the ER.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

62. I never said that one caused the other, why do you keep trying to say I did?

You are the one that has said the mere presence of firearms endangers people.

David

[depakid]

64. Perhaps I misunderstood- but the fact remains, the presence of firearms DOES endanger people

and having them in the house for fear of a very unlikely (though scary) event makes the members of the household many time more likely to be involved in a tragedy (or a crime, as the case may be) -than the risk of someone breaking in.

Simply a matter of accurate risk assessment. People are afraid of snakes for example- and if you ask a room full of people (or a classroom) what they're likely to be harmed by a snake bite or a lightening strike- watch the hands fly up for the snake bite! Happens every time (even though the lightening strike is FAR more likely).

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

68. I wouldn't know.

A have a wide variety of weapons for a wide variety of different things. Fear isn't among them. While home invasions have been on the rise in my community, I suspect my large dogs, corner lot and three cars would deter most criminals with any sense. More people were killed by accidental falls in 2005 than all the people that were accidentally killed by firearms from 1989-2005. As a society ladder safety seems like more of a priority.


David

[depakid]

69. Dogs are a LOT better way to deter intruders or attackers- and have other health benefits as well

depending of course on the breed...

:hide:

[imdjh]

78. They are also more expensive, raise your insurance rates, and don't like being kept in a drawer

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

65. Injuries appear to be on the decline too.

In 2000 there were 23,237 Non Fatal Unintentional Injuries from Firearms All Races, Both Sexes, All Age Groups compared to 15,968 in 2007.

[Rabrrrrrr]

72. And don't have cars, keep kids away from trains, and for God's sake, don't be at home!!

Home is where ALL home accidents happen!!!!!!!

EVERY FUCKING ONE OF THEM!!!!!!

[paulsby]

84. false

it is not the take home message

you still don't understand the concept of causality, being different than correlation.

[imdjh]

17. Oh please. Where did you get this stuff?

You can post all the scare stories that you like but it doesn't change the FACT that having guns
in the household makes that holusehold's members many times more likely to be either perpetrate a violent crime- be the victim of a violent crime, or suffer a tragedy from either a firearms accident (both by children and adults) or suicide.

You're credibility just flew out the window, across the street, and in the back of the ice cream truck.

1- My having a gun does not increase my likelihood of perpetrating a violent crime.
2- My having a gun does not increase the likelihood of me being the victim of a violent crime, my being a senior citizen who looks like he has a few bucks increases my likelihood of being a victim of a violent crime, it also increases my likelihood of owning a gun.
3- My owning a gun does not increase my likelihood of committing suicide unless I bought a gun to commit suicide with. And for the record, your "statistic" would list me as being a suicide and owning a gun even if I committed suicide by lethal injection, which is the only way I would ever consider doing it.

And on a broader level- even after controlling for poverty and urbanization, for every age group, people in states with many guns have elevated rates of homicide, particularly firearm homicide.

Then Finland ought to have the highest homicide rate in the world. Or is it Switzerland? Doesn't matter, cause they don't.

You my friend have been reading old propaganda. Now if you are twenty five or under, then you are forgiven. I bought into all that BS when I was younger, mostly because I didn't care and had no interest in guns. That was before I had been mugged, robbed, burgled, and threatened repeatedly. You're right about one thing, if I had had a gun on two occasions I would have shot the piece of shit in front of me- but since I can't tell you what happened to those people after that period of time, then I have no idea whether I would have done society a favor or deprived it of its next great rocket scientist, but my money is on the former.

[depakid]

67. Read the science- and here's a hint: it's not all about YOU

it's about population wide risks- relative risks of having a gun in the house vs. NOT having a gun in the house.

btw: through all you describe- you're still here- not in prison and not dead. If you had a gun on those occassions- who knows?

[imdjh]

74. Here's a hint- it's a constitutional right and you can craft all the statistics you like.

it's about population wide risks

No, it isn't. It's about crafting statistics to suit your purposes.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

18. Got a single cite for those falsehoods?

[paulsby]

82. false

and already been debunked a trillion times.

of course, if you don't understand the difference between correlation and causation, you might buy such claptrap.

[imdjh]

10. Tequila Rice - LOL! Who the hell names a kid Tequila?

[XemaSab]

48. Note well the other friend is named Sherry

:eyes:

[The_Casual_Observer]

15. The wild west

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

21. I never considered Little Rock as West.

[The_Casual_Observer]

30. shoot'em up, partner

Have gun will travel

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

35. Be careful it's not legal in all states.

[The_Casual_Observer]

36. It wouldn't be too hard to guess where it might be legal.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

37. Like Vermont right.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

43. Only 2 states where it's illegal, so your odds are good.

[The_Casual_Observer]

54. Defensive are we?

Trigger happy too?

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

58. No, I don't carry a firearm.

[blogslut]

24. Cumberland County Man Accidentally Shot By Son While Hunting

FAYETTEVILLE, N.C. — A Cumberland County man is in fair condition after he was accidentally shot by his 15-year old son while the two were squirrel hunting.

Elvis Bryant's son apparently tripped and fell, causing his shotgun to go off. Bryant was hit in the stomach...

link: http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/103836/

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

28. In January of 2003, that's desperate.

[blogslut]

32. Not desperate

It's a simple variation on a keyword search. On the first thread I responded to, I used the search words: "Father accidentally shoots son"

Then I did a search for: "Father accidentally shoots daughter"

Then: "Wife Accidentally shoots husband"

Then: "Husband Accidentally shoots wife"

There are hundreds and hundreds of these stories and many variations on the theme.

Now, let me ask you,

What is to prevent a burglar from breaking into your home while you're gone, only to shoot you with your own weapon upon your return?

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

34. My house?

Seven large dogs. Next question.

David

[blogslut]

38. What's to stop a gun-toting robber from shooting your dogs?

The fact is, most people don't have the presence of mind to shoot straight when someone invades their home.

Look, enjoy your guns. I'm sure they make you look handsome. Just don't expect me to buy into your happy home defender tales.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

39. Do you have a single statistic to back up your "fact" or is it just your opinion?

[blogslut]

49. Let me tell you another true story

One night, I was in my apartment - an upstairs apartment. All of a sudden, I hear a loud bang coming from below in the area just above my sleeping baby's room. I check on my daughter. She is fine.

Within minutes, I hear sirens and commotion outside.

I go outside and downstairs. The police have my downstairs neighbor in handcuffs and in his underwear. My other neighbor then explains what had happen.

This gun happy idiot was cleaning his happy little gun when it accidentally went off and the bullet lodged in his ceiling. The ceiling that is the floor below my baby's bedroom. Fortunately the ceiling/floor was thick enough that the bullet did not come through the floor.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

50. Nice story, hope you moved.

[blogslut]

52. I didn't have to

He went to jail. In his underwear.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

53. He never came back?

[blogslut]

56. Nope

It seems he wasn't supposed to have an external penis gun while on parole.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

59. So your daughter was almost injured by an illegally possessed firearm, got it.

[imdjh]

80. Which is why I oppose the right to keep and bear Kassam missiles

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

41. Seems like a big risk, shoot 7 dogs while they are barking like hell and think no one will notice.

[imdjh]

79. If he's gun toting, then it blows your argument n/t

[1]

66. blogslut has to google back 6 years to present her compelling argument...

that is some weak ass shit right there...

[shadowknows69]

73. The guy showed more restraint than I would have

In similar circumstances if you threatened my family and I had the drop on you? You're leaving feet first.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

81. I assure you I didn't alert on this thread to be moved.

Must be another of those wily "censorship lovers" that creep around, huh?