Trio of (authoritarian GOP/NRA) gun bills aimed for passage (FL) - but open carry is no more!

[jpak]

http://www.pnj.com/article/20110428/NEWS01/104280330/Trio-gun-bills-aimed-passage?odyssey=tab%7Ctopnews%7Ctext%7CFRONTPAGE

he National Rifle Association's full legislative agenda is poised for final passage today in the Senate and the likely signature of Gov. Rick Scott.

The bills include proposals fining local governments who dare pass gun-regulating ordinances, changes to the open-carry law and limiting physicians' questions about patients' gun ownership.

Since 1987, local governments have been prohibited from making gun policy outside of strictly proscribed areas. Now, with a bill sponsored by Sen. Joe Negron, R (edit:moran)-Stuart, and Rep. Matt Gaetz, a Fort Walton Beach (edit:moran)Republican, the state will have enforcement powers.

"We had every reason to assume that our friends in local government would not ignore the law and would follow the law," Negron said, noting that the NRA and citizens have filed suit around the state to void prohibited local ordinances like a ban on guns in Lee County parks or a South Miami trigger-lock requirement. "All this bill does is put some teeth in the law."

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Modified gun bills poised for passage

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20110427/ARTICLE/110429489/2055/NEWS?Title=Modified-gun-bills-poised-for-passage

Following a national trend, Florida is poised to adopt three new laws pushed by gun rights advocates. But the most controversial measure — allowing people to carry guns openly in public — was significantly watered down Wednesday.

Groups ranging from the tourism industry, to retailers and law enforcement had fought the open carry law but dropped their opposition after Sen. Ellyn Bogdanoff, R(edit:moran)-Fort Lauderdale, introduced a compromise.

The amended bill protects people with concealed weapons permits who "inadvertently" flash their weapon in public in an nonthreatening manner, but still prohibits the open display of firearms.

Some lawmakers continued to criticize the bill as a precursor to a full-blown open carry right, but Bogdanoff called the amended version a reasonable measure that should pass the Senate on final reading today.

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[Sadena Meti]

1. Physicians' questions

"limiting physicians' questions about patients' gun ownership"

Why would a physician ask you if you owned a gun?

[lawodevolution]

2. So he can look down at you between his glasses and nose like a superior life form and inform you

That he knows more about gun safety than you even though he's never fired a gun nor seen a gun safe in person. Some may try to tell their patients to get rid of their guns. Most are pediatricians.

Meanwhile the 700,000 Docs kill about 44,000 to 94,000 people per year in gross negligence (not simple mistakes)
270 million guns are used to kill 30,000 per year.

Rather than focusing on their own problem with killin people they'd rather focus on gun owners. Most doctors aren't like this but the few who are need to understand that patient privacy extends to the home.

[Hoyt]

3. God forbid a doctor reminds parents to keep their guns locked up. Like a child doesn't get shot

every dang day by some gun owner being careless.

Doctors are encouraged to ask about seat belts, medications, stairways, etc. Why not friggin guns?

[beevul]

18. Its not a doctors place to do such a thing.

"Doctors are encouraged to ask about seat belts, medications, stairways, etc. Why not friggin guns?"


Medications? Fine.


Outside the medical field?


Leave it alone.

[Hoyt]

22. You are wrong. Physicians -- particularly pediatricians and geriatricians - should talk about this.

If it's OK to have guns lying around kids and parents essentially endorsing gun usage, then why should you care that a physician tries to provide a more rational perspective on such things. Or, do you really know that what they are asking is a legitimate concern, that you just don't want to have to face too often. And when grandpa is getting close to needing Aricept, it's time to have someone take the guns away -- grown up kids take notice.

[Logical]

5. My doctor asked us about Trampolines. That bother you also? n-t

[rl6214]

4. Looks to me like they got what they wanted

"The amended bill protects people with concealed weapons permits who "inadvertently" flash their weapon in public in an nonthreatening manner"

[spin]

16. Accidentally flashing my concealed weapon was a concern ...

as one time in a Walmart parking lot the wind caught my jacket. Fortunately all the people around me had cell phones glued to their ears and didn't notice my revolver in an inside the waistband holster.

I have no desire to walk around proudly displaying a handgun. It bothers some people and makes them uncomfortable.

[Logical]

6. All doctors should ask about poisons, pools, guns, etc. Anyone against asking about Guns....

I would consider an extreme right gun owner. The doctor asking you a damn question dowse not hurt anything.

[X_Digger]

7. Unless it leads to things like this..

http://www.ocala.com/article/20100723/NEWS/100729867/1402/NEWS

It was a question Amber Ullman least expected Wednesday from her children's pediatrician.

Do you keep a gun in the house?

When the 26-year-old Summerfield woman refused the answer, the Ocala doctor finished her child's examination and told her she had 30 days to find a new pediatrician and that she wasn't welcome at Children's Health of Ocala anymore.

[Logical]

8. if this was an emergency room deal it would be horrible......

but a normal doctor visit i have no issue with it. if the patient does not like the doctor they are welcome to knave the practice also. why force a doctor to take a patient they are not comfortable with?
I left a doctor who was bitching about liberals, was that om with you?

[X_Digger]

9. And if a doctor refused to treat you because you refused to tell him who you voted for?

How would that sit with you?

[Logical]

10. Who I voted for has no health consequences....

and you know the difference. Doctors ask about Pools, Trampolines, what drugs I am taking, etc. If I said I will not answer then he/she has the right to decide they do not think my honesty will allow them to treat me. guess what, then I find another doctor.

When we over react to EVERY damn gun issue we look like biased idiots. Which hurts the cause in the long run.

This place at times is either "with us or against us" which defeats the purpose.

[X_Digger]

12. If the situation above had ended with..

the doctor saying something like, "Well, if you do have guns, make sure they're secured." -- I doubt this law would have been proposed.

They're free to give any health advice they like, but predicating care on whether or not someone's willing to divulge which rights they exercise is frankly repugnant to me.

[Logical]

13. So if I refused to tell him which illegal drugs I took, and he decided not to treat....

me, you would think that was wrong also. No one is forcing the patient to go to the doctor and no one should force the doctor to treat a patient who is not wanting to be honest to the doctor. if you are so open to "rights" then you should respect the right of the doctor not to treat a patient that they do not think will be honest with them.

Would a poison question bother you? I usually like your posts but I think this is only bothering you because of the GUN factor.

[X_Digger]

14. I have family who work in the medical field..

They're all appalled at the lengths some doctors (and pharmacists, and nurses) will go to try to impose their own religion | politics | morality on their patients. Perhaps they take their respective oaths a bit more seriously than the doctor in the above article.

[Logical]

15. Ok, religion and morals are different than safety. But we are going nowhere with this so we can....

Agree to disagree. Thanks for the chat!

[Hoyt]

23. They sound a bit right wing to me.

[X_Digger]

25. You couldn't be more wrong.

They're appalled at pharmacists refusing to dispense the day after pill, or doctors refusing to serve obama voters, or fundie nurses refusing to treat muslims.

Perhaps you should educate yourself about who is being refused care on what grounds before you open your mouth again and expose your ignorance.

[Hoyt]

27. You are just pissed because a doc asked parents about guns around their little kids. Good for Doc.

The dang question needs to be asked and parents need to be reminded. How many threads do we read about some stupid, law-abiding gun owner leaving a gun around a little kid or being a gun toting model for a teenager.

As to the day after pill and such -- I'd tell the Pharmacist to fuck themselves and go down the street.

But, guns are like any other "anticipatory/preventive guidance" that physicians -- particularly pediatricians -- do and should do. Even if the doc is packing, he/she should remind the parents the few times a year he sees them and has their attention.

You guys dang sure ain't gonna say anything that might disrupt your access to more weapons and more lethal ones.

[X_Digger]

28. So.. reading comprehension isn't your strong suit?

See my post #12-

If the situation above had ended with..

the doctor saying something like, "Well, if you do have guns, make sure they're secured." -- I doubt this law would have been proposed.

They're free to give any health advice they like, but predicating care on whether or not someone's willing to divulge which rights they exercise is frankly repugnant to me.

It wasn't about "anticipatory/preventative guidance".

Read more, expose your incomprehension less.

[beevul]

19. Im forced to disagree.

"All doctors should ask about poisons, pools, guns, etc."


All doctors should stick to medicine/medical, and mind their own business outside that area.


Sorry if you think thats "extreme right".

[Logical]

20. The guns worry you, nothing else would!

[jeepnstein]

11. My Doctor asks all the time.

Mostly he wants to know if I have anything new or anything I'm thinking about selling. He also gives a mean lecture on wearing hearing protection. Nice guy, and a fine doctor.

If you really want to have fun ask him about the state of the medical insurance industry.

[spin]

17. These were all reasonable bills and I'm glad to see that they passed.

While I can see value in a pediatrician cautioning parents about properly storing firearms in their homes, this can be accomplished by a pamphlet or merely by saying that if they do have firearms, there are many excellent methods of child proofing them. There is no reason for a pediatrician to refuse service to a family that legally owns firearms or to harass them because they chose to own a legal firearm.

The state of Florida has a list of places where you can't carry a concealed firearm. The law is supposed to apply state wide. Some county and city officials who oppose concealed carry have put their own restrictions in place in order to harass those with concealed carry permits. Although this is against the state wide concealed carry law the officials faced no fines for creating such ordinances. If allowed to continue, the state would have so many local laws concerning concealed carry that a licensed citizen would have no idea if he was carrying legally or not when he left the immediate area of the state he lived in. This accomplishes little as licensed citizens are not a problem but criminals are and they don't obey laws by definition.

Most of the people I know have no desire to carry openly. They also don't want to be arrested because they inadvertently flashed their concealed weapon while getting out of a car or when the wind catches their jacket while walking through a parking lot or when they reach up to get an item in a store on a high shelf.

[provis99]

21. cool. can I open carry in Disneyworld?

Never know when Goofy is going to go berserk and attack.

[ManiacJoe]

24. Legally, yes; but owner/management says no.

Pesky private property rules....

[ileus]

26. Why are they so afraid of?