FUCKING Oprah.

[spotbird]

She did more for Bush in 2K and 2004 than any other single American, with the possible exception of the Diebold CEO. Now she's all misty-eyed about "what we owe" the people of NO. She wants to know why and what's going wrong in NO?

She wouldn't dare say what needs to be said, instead there is this mystified "whine" about how she can't understand the situation.

Well Oprah babe, the people you betrayed are suffering, that's what's happening. And you don't care enough to fight for them, even still.

[qanda]

1. Huh?

[Brundle_Fly]

2. She is a millionaire

they don't really give two rats asses about the common man, even if they play it on tevee.

Imagine her tax breaks are almost as good as 30 DU's salaries

[BigYawn]

34. Wrong, she is a BILLIONAIRE...and her tax breaks = 10,000 DU bloggers

[President Jesus]

164. she's donated 16:1 for Democrats

see for yourself: http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_donations/Oprah_Winfrey.php

That evil woman! :eyes:

[crispini]

3. eh?

what did Oprah do for Bush?

[greenman3610]

6. she let him come on her show

and KISS her.
it told a million soccer moms that he was harmless.

[Orangepeel]

9. Gore was on the show, too.

the week before, IIRC

:shrug:

[spotbird]

15. The two presentations were as fair and balanced as

any night on Fox.

[T_Matamoro]

166. Oprah is just a male hating feminazi, oh and a Dhimmi too!

[leftchick]

168. feminazi?

where ever did you learn that term?

[T_Matamoro]

169. i dunno i just heard it somewhere? why?

[greenman3610]

32. so? Gore is a human being.

Bush is a monster.

[Orangepeel]

38. so, in 2000, Oprah should have not let bush come on her show

after Gore was on?

Jesus H. Christ. Of all the people to lay the blame of bush's selection on, Oprah tops the list? Uh, huh.

[spotbird]

134. She definitely should have had him on,

she just shouldn't have endorsed him through her adoration on that show.

[laheina]

11. She's also supposed to be buddies with Condi. nt

[spotbird]

14. Much worse than that

she all but endorsed him, as she did with Arnold.

If she couldn't be truthful about the harm he would cause, at very least she should have remained silent. The consequence of her tacit endorsement is enormous world wide suffering. Her current compassion parade is a ridiculous, hypocritical, charade.

[f-bush]

41. Thank you...

she's become nothing but an adminsitration whore!

[Le Taz Hot]

50. And speaking of Ahnold . . .

I noticed she never invited Grey Davis to be on her show, or Cruz Bustamante, or any other candidates for governor . . . Another fine example of Oprah and her "fair and balanced" show.

[Tulum_Moon]

124. Oprah wants to do away with the inheritance tax

She has said so on her show. Now that she is a billionaire she says she would like to keep it.:eyes:

[WinkyDink]

157. Uh...she'd be dead. Does she know this part of the tax??

Never liked her, myself. Way too fawning over celebs.
And I frickin' HATE her disgusting stories of personal thriftiness and joy at buying stuff on sale. What a phony.

[blue cat]

130. OMG say it isn't so

She endorsed Bush? I thought she stayed out of politics, and interviews both candidates for pres. I saw her pic with Hillary and I think she said that she would make a good pres. I could have remembered wrong or something.

[fujiyama]

154. She never endorsed Bush

She was arguably a little too friendly with him, and Condi, and Arnold...All have been guests at some point.

I don't believe she is a repuke. She was a strong supporter of Obama for one.

I don't really like Oprah. I find her shallow, irritating, and her cult of personality is just plain creepy, but I don't understand this sudden fixation on her. This is the second thread I've seen on her.

[graywarrior]

4. Who's fucking her?

[Solo_in_MD]

12. My eyes! My eyes!

[Patchuli]

159. I know! bad graywarrior!

Fowl torturer! :spank:

[SofaKingLiberal]

5. aha

:popcorn:

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. How did she help bush?

[otohara]

28. He Was on Her Show

and she was all kissy with him

[proud2BlibKansan]

40. Um, he is the president?

And I believe she had Clinton on too.

[spotbird]

51. The difference between her treatment of Bush

as compared to Gore made her allegiance clear. It was adoration for Bush, only blind, deaf viewers couldn't see it. If there was a defining moment which put Bush close enough to the edge to steal the election, that was it.

Lest any of us forget she knew the power her political endorsement carries, she reminded us again when she did about same thing with Arnold a few years later.

Oprah has done well for herself by pretending to do good, now,as always, she lacks the courage to do what is right. These empty shows about the suffering in the Gulf are nauseating.

[mzmolly]

62. Oprah has given 16k to dems, 1k to one female republican running for

office.

http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_donations/Oprah_Winfrey.php

[iconoclastNYC]

73. Thats like 5 cents for Oprah.

If you don't speak up against this administration you are culpable for their crimes.

"First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me."

Pastor Martin Niemöller

[mzmolly]

75. And she gave 1 cent to the R's. Also speaking about N.O. is speaking

about this administration.

[iconoclastNYC]

76. Inviting the Devil on and kissing him

And making him into a human instead of an evil force of darkness is wrong.

[mzmolly]

78. Oh my word. HE kissed her.

Did YOU vote for Bush based upon that BS appearance? I didn't.

[iconoclastNYC]

89. Wow...two examples proves that it had no effect!

If i was a member of Oprah's cult of personality and i was on the fence I probably would have been more likely to vote for him.

[mzmolly]

92. Can you explain why Gore would not have had an effect on you?

And, can you show me the polls that indicate Oprah was instrumental in Bush winning the election.

For gosh sakes, this is nuts frankly.

[iconoclastNYC]

97. You don't know much about polls.

Pollsters don't ask you what TV shows you watch.

[mzmolly]

98. Actually, that's not so.

However if one is going to assert "the polls were close" and "Oprah made the difference" one should be prepared to show proof, should they not? I thought sure with all the nutzo assertions that someone would have a link to a media related study on this?

[iconoclastNYC]

99. Show me a poltical pollster who asks

You what TV shows you watch and correlates that data -- doesn't exist, i'm sorry...you are wrong.

Anyway it's irrelevant becasue I don't have to cite statistitics (that have never been compiled) to be fault Oprah for having Bush on her hugely influential program to kiss his ring and giving a puff feel good interview.

If you doubt Ophrah's power you take a look at the New York Times best seller list and highlight her book club selections.

[mzmolly]

101. Show me the evidence. I did not say "political pollster" I said

"polls(ter)." I thought surely some University must have a study to back up your claims, I see that is not the case?

You miss the fact that Oprah had Gore on her show as well - FIRST.

[iconoclastNYC]

107. Two can play this game.

Surely some University must have a study to dispel the notion that Oprah is influential. I see that is not the case.

You make me laugh.

[mzmolly]

112. How ridiculous.

The OP claimed that Oprah had an impact on the election to GWB's advantage. I personally want to see "evidence."

Media influence is studied in numerous ways:

http://www.umich.edu/~urecord/9596/Dec05_95/artcl13.htm

I found an article about Gore's appearance here:

http://archives.cnn.com/2000/ALLPOLITICS/stories/09/11/campaign.wrap/

Given the fact that Oprah interviewed both men and asked reasonable questions, I haven't an issue with her having * on her show. I also don't hold her responsible for the outcome of the elections in 00/04.

You are entitled to your opinion, but I remain unconvinced. I think the notion that Oprah pushed Bush is absurd.

[Telly Savalas]

149. If Oprah kissing the guy is enough to convince a voter to pick Bush

the blame falls entirely on the shoulders on the voter for being a fucking moron.

[spotbird]

82. Hardly, there will

be choirs of "enough blame to go around" and "no use in pointing fingers" as if the state or locals could do a thing at this point.

[mzmolly]

94. You sound like you watch often for someone so appauled?

:shrug:

I don't expect Oprah to be openly partisan.

[spotbird]

120. It's been over a year

just don't have time or interest. I never watched unless the guest was someone interesting.

No, she won't be overtly political, that's certain. Either is Fox news or the Washington Times.

[proud2BlibKansan]

147. Well I think her shows about the Gulf are important

because of the audience she has. My cell phone rang three times around 4:00 today (the time Oprah is on here). Friends were calling me to tell me to be sure to watch Oprah. They knew I was interested in the Katrina relief efforts and they knew I didn't normally watch Oprah.

Just think of how many people she educated today.

[otohara]

58. Um, Thanks In Part

to Oprah.

[Javaman]

8. You know what I find amazing about the riches ambivalence about NO?

I just finished reading a book about the great San Francisco Earthquake and fire. Harriman of the weathly Harriman Train magnet family, the same Harriman who has a state park named after him in NY state. He donated that land to be preserved.

He lent his railroad to bring in supplies, tents and food to the people of that city free of charge. He also allowed the people to ride his train to leave the city free of charge. All of this expense he absorbed.

He said this is something I should do. This country has been very good to me and I want to give back.

Do we hear of such generosity today???? The silence is deafening.

[spotbird]

16. She begs her viewers to contribute

they can afford it after all.

[RazzleDazzle]

21. YOU may not have heard about it

but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

generosity on the part of celebrities after Katrina. Oprah lined up a bunch of her celebrity friends, including John Travolta who filled up his 747, and a number of others -- Kirstie Alley, etc.

THEN Oprah -- thru her foundation, I think -- bought some land and built some houses and invited her viewers to help furnish them. I think they're getting inhabitants/owners this week.

Yours and others' resentment of Oprah is ill-informed, misguided and unattractive.

[spotbird]

52. Oprah can give away all she owns,

and that would be just super of her, and appreciated no doubt. But point the only way she can make a difference is to speak the truth. She needs to scream it, and soon. It's her audience that if awakened will fear for their children. She helped put them to sleep, she needs to let them know what happened during their nap.

As to your point of celebrity generosity, none gave so much that it had an impact on their lives, just their consciences.

[rinsd]

85. Oh please....

Celebrity A is evil unless they carry the water for my favorite cause.

Oh all the targets in the world, we're now going to move on to "colloborators because of silence".

Yeah let's piss on the only person doing Katrina stories right now.

And for what? Because of a grudge you hold against her going back 5 years?

[spotbird]

88. That's not what I said, so you'll need to find someone else

to defend that position. If it helps, I didn't argue the point you're making because it doesn't make sense.

[rinsd]

109. You're right...

...your later articulated position is even more ridiculous.

[spotbird]

121. Do you even know what my point is?

You certainly can't restate it.

[rinsd]

139. You don't have a point....

...all you're doing is bitching about someone who has and is doing more good than every single person on DU combined. I may not consider Oprah to be a hero or whatever but for her to shit on is ridiculous.

Who else is doing ANY follow up on Katrina?

Who else is CONTINUING to organize relief efforts?

Your issue is that she isn't using her stage, HER stage, to blast your talking points therefore she is wasting her influence and is therefore helping Bush.

Sorry political purity tests sicken me which is why my reaction is not as polite as it should be.

[druidity33]

145. lotsa folk...

are continuing to help and "follow up" on Katrina. They're just not asking to be recognized for it. I've been contributing to a Rainbow family kitchen that's been there since a couple of days after the storm... they have a website and work with dozens of relief organisations that i've never heard of. You don't know who they are because the big, bureaucratic names have been ineffective.... Red Cross, FEMA, State and Nat'l orgs, etc.

As for Oprah, i think the point can be summed in the old "teach a man to fish..." adage. Is she really helping by just "giving out the fish"? Or maybe by speaking the truth (by the way, truth is apolitical) on her MSM show she can "teach them to fish". If she turned on her jets and started really going at the Katrina "problem" by doing some research into the causes and solutions, then maybe i'd respect her more.

[Javaman]

63. And the question that needs to be asked...

Is she still helping these people?

Harriman, helped the city at a huge personal expense long after everyone left.

Do you honestly see anyone giving to that level today?

No one would ever extend themselves that way in today's "grab all you can, while you can" climate.

I didn't once down play oprah's contribution, but I just made a comparison as to what is done now and what really can be done to help people by people that are ultra wealthy.

We now live in a nation that has more millionaires and billionaires than ever before in our history. How many of them have given till it hurts? Or how many have given only the amount that their accountants told them would be good for their taxes????

We live in the flavor of the month lifestyle now.

[girl gone mad]

138. I think Oprah is giving responsibly.

Sure, she could give away every last penny next week, but I doubt it would do more good than what she is doing now. She is investing her money wisely, establishing charitable foundations and keeping a close eye on where the money is going. Oprah does give big, and she encourages other celebrities to do the same. I believe that when she dies, everything she has will go to the needy.

I do think Oprah is a hypocrite, particularly with regards to her celebrity worship and materialism. Now she's doing shows on credit card debt and she acts shocked that people want to live like celebrities and buy things they can't afford. She's as much a part of that problem as anyone. But to blame her for Bush's election or his subsequent misdeeds? That's just ridiculous.

[sandnsea]

42. Well they did ALL the rebuilding

Or almost all of it. If we had a redo of San Francisco, the major corporations would swoop into New Orleans, take charge, and do it exactly the way they wanted. Alot of Chinese were displaced after the earthquake and there wasn't anybody to really speak up for them. What you're advocating is the thing we're trying to avoid in New Orleans, a complete restructuring of New Orleans by and for the wealthy.

And don't forget how Wal-mart and other companies were the ones to get into the Gulf in the days after the hurricane, when the government couldn't. Republicans WANT you to admire and feel beholden to corporations and churches, NOT government. Because the Constitution gives you the right to control government, but not corporations and churches. Don't ever forget it.

[Javaman]

65. What the doc, "the corporation", one upon a time...

People in this country did things for the good of the country. Now corporations, under the guise of doing good for the country, only do things that are good for them.

I'm not talking about the corps or the gov't, I'm talking about wealthy people. A lot more can be and should be done.

The corps do things for their shareholders and politicians do it for public appeal, but it appears as if the wealthy people who could do it for altruistic reasons (and not just as a tax deduction) are few and far between.

Al Gore, in this vein, impressed me.

They made there money from the opportunities this country allowed them. They have quickly forgotten that in our "have-more" society.

[Sperk]

10. If she really cared about our country she'd put Mark Crispin Miller's

book, "Fooled Again" on her reading list. That would be a huge help. I think she cares more about herself though. I know she does a lot of good but "Angel Network" just isn't enough anymore. It's sooooo pre 2000.

[RazzleDazzle]

23. I don't like it either, but the simple truth is that Oprah is NOT politica

I wish she were -- with the soapbox and viewership she has, she'd be one helluva formiddable force.

But she's not. There are many, many other things she does which ALSO need doing. She's built a school in South Africa and education young girls and women to become leaders. Wait until THAT crop gets harvested. Oh my!

She's got her Angel Foundation, as you point out. Angel Lane is the name of the street where the furnished houses for Katrina victims open this week.

She's doing a lot to catch child molesters -- in coordination with law enforcement (FBI), she's shown and published on her web the photos and other info for a number of child molesters who've not been caught and several have already been brought in. She's giving $100,000 awards FROM HER OWN MONEY (not the foundation's) to those who are responsible for reporting these creeps.

She's just started a new program, every Friday, putting America on a "Debt Diet." For more details, tune in this coming Friday.

And today she had a show, I only caught part of it, but there were a number of women who were telling about how their lives changed DRAMATICALLY as a result of things they saw on the Oprah show, and decisions they made. One of them has been the female star of Phantom of the Opera on broadway for what sounded like forever (didn't catch her name). Oprah served as a role model for her and so many others.

Oprah does just fine by her responsibilities as a human being and one of influence and wealth and power. Of course, for those who resent powerful, wealthy, influential women, there'll always be something to criticize, but that doesn't mean the criticisms are apt or fair or even valid.

[medeak]

84. She had on Jon Stewart and drooled all over him

and put him in magazine as well

[rinsd]

141. Doesn;t matter....

By the tone of the OP, its likely they consider Jon to be a sellout. After all he doesn't rip the head off of every Republican he has on his show and he occasionally makes fun of Democrats.

[JustDoIt]

13. What are you talking about

She's one of the biggest Democratic Party donors...

[zulchzulu]

17. Agreed...

http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_donations/Oprah_Winfrey.php

Oprah Winfrey , 52 (bio)
talk show host, actress
$1,000 Republican
$16,000* Democrat
total: $17,000


* includes soft-money donations
Contributor Candidate or PAC Amount Date
WINFREY, OPRAH
CHICAGO, IL 60600
HARPO PRODUCTIONS
DNC SERVICES CORPORATION/DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE (D) $5,000
primary 11/28/97
WINFREY, OPRAH
CHICAGO, IL 60603
DSCC NON-FEDERAL INDIVIDUALS (soft-money donation) $10,000
primary 10/25/96
WINFREY, OPRAH
CHICAGO, IL 60610
HARPO STUDIOS BRAUN, CAROL MOSELEY (D)
Senate - IL
CAROL MOSELEY-BRAUN FOR US SENATE 1998 INC $1,000
general 08/04/92
WINFREY, OPRAH
CHICAGO, IL 60601
HARPO INC ENGELEITER, SUSAN S (R)
Senate - WI
ENGELEITER FOR SENATE COMMITTEE $1,000
general 09/15/88

[Doctor_J]

20. If this is a complete list, she stopped giving to Dems 10 years ago

so the previous poster's claim that "She is one of the biggest Dem donors" is false.

I agree with the poster above, that her tax break would feed a medium-sized rust belt town. Why wouldn't she endorse Dumbass

[JustDoIt]

22. SHE DIDNT Endorse bush

Could you please learn the facts before getting all jiggidy?

She had both Gore and Bush on her show.

She has given 90%+ of her contributions to Democrats.

[mdmc]

46. Welcome to DU

I think that Oprah could writer her won political ticket. She could run for any seat, and win...

[spotbird]

54. Those are the talking points

You are correct that she didn't say, "vote for the man I've been slobbering all over for the past hour," she didn't have to, some things are unspoken. You obviously didn't watch both shows or you couldn't make that assertion.

Her political contributions are old and tokenism, meaningless.

[demgrrrll]

56. I think I remember Chris Rock giving her a little jab about that too.

I think he said something to the effect of "you helped him because after he was on your show people said "well maybe he isn't retarded" or something like that. I am trying to remember the exact quote. At any rate he was kidding on the square. He thought she helped him.

[spotbird]

53. $17,000 is lunch money

to Oprah.

Oprah's loving support of a candidate is priceless.

[RoyGBiv]

18. Once more into the breach ...

I am torn between popping some popcorn and tossing aside the bowl and jumping in. Since I'm here, I guess I'll jump into the water and let myself get scalded.

First, thanks for expressing the phrase that runs through my head every time I see, hear, or think about her. I loathe Oprah and always have, or let's say I loathe the Oprah image and her incarnation as a media mogul. She's probably a fine person in whatever constitutes her other life, but as a media personality I have always considered her more insidious and damaging than the talking heads on Fox.

An explanation:

Most people don't seem to remember the talk-show war between Oprah and Phil Donahue, the one that eventually resulted in her being named the monarch of daytime talk and put Phil out to pasture. It's not so much a problem that this happened but rather how it happened. Put briefly, she painted Phil as, well, weird. She was a normal person dealing with normal people's issues. She had a kind heart and an understanding ear. She wasn't in-your-face about anything. She was your friend. This was great for a person trying to draw viewers. It created a whole new focus for talk shows, one based on polar opposites. You're either "normal" or you're "weird." To compete, the weird got really weird while the normal got boring. Donahue, after Cronkite, was once deemed one of the most trusted people in America. He was a non-apologetic beacon for a wide range of progressive issues, and he pulled no punches, never truly tried to play the "fair and balanced bullshit" card. (He often acted as devil's advocate in order to give people the opportunity to make points they weren't able to make in other forums, but that's what it was, a tactic to let the message get out there in millions of living rooms. Oprah made that seem weird. Controversy of that variety wasn't good. Those aren't normal people. What's more, how is it a white guy with silver hair gets to be the spokesperson for women's issues? Oprah ran with that concept and used it to her advantage to get ratings. Once she'd won the war, once Phil had been reduced to being only the slightly saner version of The Jerry Springer Show or the smart version of Geraldo, she let that slide. Oh, she still talks the talk, but we rarely see her doing any walking except on non-controversial issues. When it comes to politics, her public face in recent years has either hidden itself or been on the wrong side every time. She made Gore seem like one of those "weird" people. She allowed Bush to further his tactic of casting himself as the "normal" person, your friend, the guy who is your friend and neighbor. Donahue may well have asked both people on his show, but he wouldn't have let Bush kiss him, even if he were a woman, and he definitely wouldn't have let him get away with his facade. Arnold? I dare say Donahue would have had Arnold crying, or at the very least exposed fully as the true idiot he is.

Harpo is responsible for a lot of what is bland in media today, imho.

[RazzleDazzle]

26. What unmitigated crap

What absolute, TOTAL, unmitigated crap.

What's more, how is it a white guy with silver hair gets to be the spokesperson for women's issues? Oprah ran with that concept and used it to her advantage to get ratings. Once she'd won the war, once Phil had been reduced to being only the slightly saner version of The Jerry Springer Show or the smart version of Geraldo, she let that slide. Oh, she still talks the talk, but we rarely see her doing any walking except on non-controversial issues.

There was no reason there couldn't have been more than one talk show host. There was PLENTY of room for both of them and I watched Oprah from the beginning and remember watching both shows, on at different times.

You write that as if Oprah set out to defeat Donahue one-on-one, and wasn't satisfied until she'd done her dirty deeds of stealing subject matter from him until he was left lying on the floor, a mere shell of his former self, defeated utterly, and driven off the air by her unfair tactics and shenanigans. Sorry, there wasn't anything sinister about it, nothing PERSONAL about it in any way. It just wasn't a match-up in the way you suggest and I don't recall that they EVER were scheduled on at the same time. Hell, there is apparently enough room in TV land for 2 (count 'em), TWO, late night comedy shows, no reason there couldn't have been two daytime talk shows. There are many more than that now.

As for not doing controversial issues, what exactly do you think she should tackle that she's not tackling? She doesn't and never has purported to be a POLITICAL show (and isn't particularly political herself), so what do you want her to do that she doesn't?

Harpo is responsible for a lot of what is bland in media today, imho.

That's so over the top it's actually hilarious. Harpo responsible for the decline (or whatever) of all the other media.

Did Oprah also give you acne when you were a kid? If you're unahppy with your job or love life, is that Oprah's fault too? How about global warming?

Sheesh.

[RoyGBiv]

33. Well, hello to you too ...

You write that as if Oprah set out to defeat Donahue one-on-one...

The naivety of some people I've been coming across on DU lately is beginning to astonish me. Do you truly believe anything is ever put on the air in direct competition with another program without the intent of its producers of crushing the competition? This is exactly what she and the media company she created was trying to do. Newspapers wrote about, trade magazines published extensively on it. It was quite clearly a media war, and Oprah chose as her style "warmth" over substance. This was the media story, especially in and around Chicago, for many years. Oprah is a brilliant business woman. She knew and knows exactly what she is doing.

If you can find it, read this article : Bayles, Martha, Oprah vs. Phil : Warmth Wins Out, _The Wall Street Journal_ (New York), Jan 26, 1987. You can get it through ILL if your library doesn't have a microfiche version.

Certainly her show is not, overtly, a political show, but it competed directly with a show that dealt in politics by subduing politics to coffee-table conversation meant to find consensus at the expense of truth or anything that smacked of controversy.

[RazzleDazzle]

37. Nope, sorry.

What some "reporter" writes as analysis doesn't cut it unless it's quoting the people running her show (producers, etc.) or Oprah herself.

It's like most of the analysis on politics these days: everything is considered to be a political calculation and partisanship, and it's NOT all partisanship calcuations. Some of it -- a good bit -- is honest-to-god policy and other differences, not merely Dems trying to take partisan political advantage. Analysis that goes to the horse race and partisanship as motivation on everything starts out mostly wrong and has no hope of improving from there. Same with the kind of outside-looking-in bogus analysis you're coughing up.

[RoyGBiv]

39. My analysis ...

...as opposed to what, the insightful word-smithing of one who coughs up such incredible phrases as "unmitigated crap"?

So, let me get this straight. If Oprah didn't say, on record, that she and the producers of her early show were trying to win a ratings game against Donahue, then that's not what she was doing. Is it also true that if George Bush doesn't say, on record, that he intentionally lied to start a war with Iraq, this also is not true?

Color me unimpressed by the logic. Also colour me unimpressed with the far too common tactic of repudiating the messenger rather than the message, i.e. claiming a newspaper reporter can't provide a valid analysis of an issue or event without acquiring direct admissions from the people involved.

Anyway, enjoy Oprah if you like. I stand by my opinion. All you've really done is insult and yell at me, and I'm not sure what you hope to accomplish with that. If you'd like to have a reasonable discussion, please let me know. Otherwise, have a nice day.

[sandnsea]

43. Not exactly

Phil Donahue did do weird, and he admitted he did weird. He said it's what got the ratings, that's what HE said way back in 1979. Oprah hit a time that just wasn't all that interesting politically, we weren't trying to figure out the globe like we were in the 60's & 70's, we were trying to figure out ourselves. We were having relationships and families and dealing with personal issues. That's why she became popular, along with Sally Jesse Raphael and a few others. Phil Donahue got too preachy and self-righteous, there was no room to move forward and deal with issues in the real world. There's a difference between dealing with an unknown transvestite in New York City and a transvestite who is your kid's father. Donahue didn't make the transition, Oprah did. She also had political guests on, but we got to hear them talk about, gasp, their moral and family values. Judge their character. It does matter. Every time Santorum says some crazy ass thing about religion or gays, we're judging his moral values. The shows have a different purpose. People who want daytime political teevee have CNN, MSNBC and Fox to choose from, and alot of Donahue's viewers are watching that insead of Oprah and Ellen.

Or posting on DU. :)

[calimary]

95. I'm old enough to remember that. I remember when Donahue was

the only game in town. My dad watched him all the time. There were many serious discussions, long, pensive interviews, and Phil running around the audience with a microphone. Some of it was fairly plodding and ponderous, but it was usually respectable.

Then came Oprah. Perhaps it was an attempt to carve a niche, or to set herself apart from the professorial Phil - who seemed to be born in a tweed blazer with suede elbow patches - was predictable and didn't rattle many cages. Then Oprah got a talk show and went after him - MAINLY BECAUSE HE WAS, BASICALLY, THE ONLY GAME IN TOWN. If you went into afternoon talk, at that time, Phil Donahue was the one against whom you were measured and it was his standards you lived by or defied - because he was the one setting them, and if you were gonna make it in that field, he was the one you had to knock off.

So Oprah did her slightly-different thing, touchie-feelie, hug the audience members, talk about women stuff and do topics like "Lesbian Nuns" to make noise and push the envelope and get people talking and draw attention (TO her show and AWAY FROM Phil's). You NEVER would have had Phil Donahue feeling compelled to do a show dressed in a skirt until Oprah started sensationalizing talk show fare. For better or worse, in my opinion anyway, that's what happened. And she did it for reasons that any competitive person would - to do something different, to stand out from the pack, to beat the competition, to amp it up. And while there WERE other talk shows on, Phil's was the ONLY one to have that then-unprecedented schtick where the host runs around in the audience with an open mike, letting many of them ask a question or make a comment. I mean, the closest before that was Johnny Carson's occasional "Stump the Band" bit. NO OTHER TALK SHOWS on the air at that time or leading up to that time, whether it was Merv Griffin or Dinah Shore or Mike Douglas or Tom Snyder or ANYBODY did that. Only Phil Donahue did that. Until Oprah took that page from his book and set up her own show that way, too. Then there were two. Now, what used to be singular about Phil Donahue's show - you can see on ANY talk show on the tube. They ALL do that now. In Phil's heyday, only HE did that. Then, with the arrival of Oprah, and right there in Phil's town, Chicago, no less, there were suddenly two shows doing that. Now it's pretty much everybody.

I have a girlfriend who lives and dies by Oprah - her entire world comes to a screeching halt every weekday afternoon so she can settle in with her Oprah hour. Which is fine. It's not for me, but she swears by it. Millions of other women do, too. So when I have trouble coming to terms with Oprah-the-phenomenon, I consult her frequently. She points out that Oprah DOES do a lot of good. There's empowerment, new focus on reading, and dream shopping sprees. People get cars on Oprah, almost as though it were a talk show Monty Hall or something. And that's nice, especially in this increasingly dreary world.

And I'm glad Oprah does so much in terms of philanthropy - those who have much, are obligated much - and it pleases me to see Oprah taking a lead in that. I'm mightily impressed at these things.

BUT...

In my opinion, Oprah has a HUGE karmic debt to pay, for the way she's influenced TV talk - and sometimes not for the better. Oprah is the symbolic mother of Jerry Springer, limbaugh, michael savage, Jenny Jones, and all those raucous, lowest-common-denominator titillation-for-the-sake-of-ratings shows. As they say of Barbara Walters - in relation to other women now succeeding handsomely in/on television news - Oprah built the ladder that others climbed up on.

I find myself cringing at the memory of her interview with then-candidate george w. bush. She DID INDEED make him look harmless and nice and fun and folksy and approachable. And that message WAS telegraphed to millions of viewers - AW, WHAT a nice guy! Let's take a chance on him, then, 'eh? And she DID help him win votes - enough to get close enough to steal the election.

I'm glad she comes out and does helpful shows. I'm glad she focuses on empowerment. I'm glad she does shows on dieting and self-image. I'm glad she started her book club that signals to many of her fans that BOOKS ARE GOOD THINGS. I'm glad. I'm glad she spends lavishly on her staff and that her quick solution to many poorer people's woes is one helluva shopping spree (that they otherwise would never be able even to dream of enjoying). I'm glad. And I appreciate Oprah for these things, since you certainly don't see a lot of that on such a grand scale from too many others who can afford to do those things. Dessert is good. It's my favorite part of the meal. But you can't build a life's nutrition on almost nothing but 24/7 dessert.

I think Oprah is missing the boat. My Oprah-fan friend says this is not a problem because Oprah is not trying to be political. Maybe my friend is correct. But it seems to me Oprah is UNIQUELY POSITIONED to start getting the truth out. She is UNIQUELY POSITIONED to speak to, and to educate, many millions of people who are politically naive, may drink the Kool-aid because their favorite preacher tells them to, or they're too busy just struggling to make ends meet to pay close attention to what all those bozos in Washington are up to - a pox on both their houses. She could be a FEROCIOUSLY HUGE force for enlightenment and change. What she did with James Frey, point-blank excoriating him because he lied to her (and using those words) she could EASILY begin doing, even in a low-key, velvet-clothed way, with the whole bush machinery. She could be an absolutely explosive force here. Why could she not make just the smallest leap and point out that people a lot higher up than James Frey, whom we trust to keep us safe, are LYING, TOO... If Oprah took the lead and started speaking truth to power, rather than just to some schmuck author with a bad beard, the fire that would be lit under MILLIONS of her devotees would be enough to shake the planet. And FAR FEWER people would keep being fooled. IF ONLY they could hear this from someone like Oprah...

She could do that in her special Oprah way and help lead MILLIONS of viewers into the light. She has that kind of currency with them. And in my opinion she is not making use of it. She could be a force for good, a force for change, a force for ending the madness, a force for The Great Awakening, that would educate and arm the masses against being lulled, sweet-talked, fooled, and scared stupid by the bad guys. She could do lots of shows about the government trying to scare people. Hell, she could do ONE. ONE show would start people thinking. If Oprah questioned it, maybe it's a good thing to start questioning... She could lead the way and be a primary force for healing in this country. Not just the healing that comes from a one-time shopping spree that solves your bill-paying problems for one month. How 'bout solving our problems over a few years? And not just by developing the next Dr. Phil, either.

I just think Oprah could be doing SO MUCH MORE with her bully pulpit, her absolutely unique positioning, and the fact that she's utterly bullet-proof. Michael Moore once took Katie Couric to task for not using HER position of power and influence and popularity with the masses - to tell the truth and blow the whistle on bush. As he put it - "you're KATIE COURIC! For heaven's sakes, you're one of three people in the whole country who can't be fired! You of all people could do this!" Katie demurred, saying "someday, I will." One of those other three people is Oprah. She's virtually untouchable. She could do SO much to help rescue this entire country - and therefore also, the world, by opening people's eyes, and helping them WAKE THE FUCK UP.

And in my opinion, she's not doing so. Dear God, I wish she would!!! NOBODY could slay this dragon like Oprah could. DAMN I wish she'd at least consider it...

on edit - shit, I did it again, sorry this is so long.

[Lars39]

106. Great post, calimary!

Yes,Oprah has a gilded pulpit and is neglecting to use it...playing it safe.
That has been my frustration with her, and you put it so well. :yourock:

[calimary]

111. Thanks. I guess I have one of those love/hate relationships with Oprah.

I don't watch her a lot. That time of day is pretty busy for me anyway. I admire what she does in a lot of ways, and I sure respect her for what she's built. ANYBODY who can boot up like she did and turn herself into such a force to be reckoned with deserves admiration and respect. And clearly she recognizes that addage about - those who are greatly blessed are greatly obligated. But she only gets about a third of the way across that bridge IMO. I wish she'd go the rest of the way and enlighten the many multitudes who watch her faithfully and so desperately need to be AWAKENED.

[Lars39]

115. Oh, I agree!

And it's so very frustrating to see how things could be changed.
I wonder if a letter writing campaign would help?

[Jacobin]

152. Oh how I wish Oprah could read your post

Mind boggling passion, reason, and common sense, Cali.

Thank you very much for that post.

I don't watch her and have only seen a few clips of things she's done.

[calimary]

161. Whoa - thanks!

I appreciate your posts as well.

:toast:

[RoyGBiv]

158. Excellent post ...

Simply excellent. You said it much, much better than I did.

[calimary]

162. Cheers!

Thanks - and don't underestimate yourself, either. Your points are also well-made. :hi:

[earth mom]

160. I agree-Thanks for the great post!

I've replied to a couple of these Oprah threads and could not say what you just said any better.

:applause:

[calimary]

163. I'm glad you waded through it!

I suspect I'd get the Hurricane Award (or would that be the Golden Gasbag?) for windiest replies! :P

[madrchsod]

19. oprah?

well here`s what some others think of her and it`s not pretty
http://www.blackcommentator.com/127/127_oprah.html
The Black Commentator - The Full Blown "Oprah Effect" - Issue 127
http://www.blackcommentator.com/169/169_bruces_beat.html
The Black Commentator - Bruce's Beat

[RazzleDazzle]

30. I watch Oprah nearly every day, and have for many years

Though there have been periods of time when I wasn't able to watch quite so often.

The first article you quote has some good points but is in the main unfair, I think. This is the nub of the criticism of Oprah:

The fact that some blacks now lead powerful mainstream institutions offers evidence to whites that racial barriers have been eliminated; the issue now is individual effort.” The “odd black family on the block or the Oprah effect – examples of stratospheric black success – feed,” Cashin observes, “these misperceptions, even as relatively few whites live among and interact daily with blacks of their own standing.”

It’s a carefully cultivated perception. With her army of disproportionately Caucasian counselors, personal trainers, fitness consultants, personal chefs, massage therapists, interior designers, and New Age healers, Oprah has taken an “inner journey” toward primarily personal healing and accountability and away from the collective struggle for racial equality and social justice. “The other kids were all into black power,” Oprah told the Tribune in the mid-1980s. But “I wasn’t a dashiki kind of woman … Excellence was the best deterrent to racism and that became my philosophy.” As her programming became ever more racially “sanitized” during the 1990s, Elaine Brown notes (in her excellent book The Condemnation of Little B ), Oprah’s emphasis focused on “providing …comfort to what became her core audience of white women, in the form of ‘lifestyle’ and glamour ‘makeovers,’ diets, and New Age self-healing readings and practices and endless self-deprecating discourse over her own weight and ‘nappy’ hair.” “Winfrey carefully avoided using her unparalleled power and voice on behalf of black women,” Brown bitterly observes, “even as the political agenda pounded poor black women and their children ever deeper into poverty and degradation.”

Today, while American inequalities of class and color are worsened by racist imperial adventure in the Middle East, Oprah trumpets and exemplifies narcissistic personal obsession, egoistic wealth accumulation, and the narrow pursuit of individual “excellence” amidst permanent, unchallenged, and brutal social injustice. In Oprah’s world, it’s all about how to “Change Your Life,” a slogan that does not mean engaging with fellow African Americans, other people of color, and white allies in the difficult and often dirty struggle to challenge hierarchy and democratize society.

-------

I can understand the criticism, and even see that some of it is warranted. But as someone who watches frequently, I know that racism is a subject that gets tackled every now and then, that she herself speaks about it periodically on other shows, etc. So Iwould ask of the author and those who agree with the author, just how much of one's professional life does one "owe" one's race? Is it not permissible to become famous and even wealthy unless one devotes oneself to issues of race and collective struggle?

There are times I get a little annoyed with what I perceive to be superficialities that get covered on her show, some of which are named in this commentary. But then I back up and think to myself how many women get drawn into the show perhaps largely because of those kinds of shows (esp. with the celebrities), and they stay and get some real substance in other shows, including some of the celebrity shows. Oprah has changed and continues to change lives by the thousands and hundreds of thousands. You can't say that to the same extent about any other black woman -- or black man -- in the history of the country. Personally, I think that's more than enough. My bet is that she's fulfilling her contract as a human on the earth at this time.

--

The 2nd link is just mostly mean-spirited. Oprahs' involvement with James Frey wasn't her finest moment, and I actually truly despised her follow-up interview with him, but I don't think her involvement warrants quite all the attention it's gotten, and this criticism is a little on the vicious, snarky side.

[FreedomAngel82]

24. Quite sad

[Demi_Babe]

25. I've seen a lot of stupid post here

but this one just might be tops. For one, Oprah is a billionaire...get your facts straight and two, she is a democrat who does more good than any other top dem celebrity that I know. What is with this place lately?

[RazzleDazzle]

27. Don't look now

but Post #18 is, if you can believe it, even stupider.

[Binka]

45. Delete

[mtnsnake]

29. She was gonna give each one of us at DU a new car, but now you ruined it!

:evilgrin:

[hopeisaplace]

31. I like Oprah

She's one of the few "billionaires" I can say "I wanna have beer with".

[seabeyond]

35. i stopped watching oprah a couple years ago. after watching for

more than a decade. the arnie interviews are what did me in. she betrayed everything she had worked on, spirituality, womans empowerment, when she had arnie on and didnt challenge him. made me sick. and i jsut have not turned her on since. i watched her since the 80's

[RazzleDazzle]

36. I was heartbroken about that too

But I'll tell you, you've missed some good stuff since then.

What can I say? She just doesn't know politics. And there's a LOT to know right now. It takes me too many hours each day to "know" what I know. (Of course, it'd take me less time if I didn't also participate and went back to lurking like I used to do -- but even that took hours each day.)

[sandnsea]

44. I had my fill at least 10 years ago

I got tired of being terrified by every new danger around the corner. Hide your kids, the boogieman of the day is gonna' get 'em. It was just incessant. If I wanted somebody to badger me about everything I could possibly do to screw up my kids, I'd just call my mother. :)

[calimary]

148. LOL! Man does THAT ever peg it!

"If I wanted somebody to badger me about everything I could possibly do to screw up my kids, I'd just call my mother. "

GOOD one! :D

[Connie_Corleone]

47. Oprah is great. nt

[winston61]

48. look, Oprah is all about Oprah

She's a business, and herself is what she sells. Is she narcissistic? An ego maniac? A control freak? You bet, all that and more. Do I understand the worship she receives? No. She pledged $10,000,000 to rebuild LA housing. Any way to follow up?

[babylonsister]

57. The shows she does exposing what's going on is a follow-up.

She is trying to inform.

[Timefortruth]

60. She will not say what needs to be said to save the country

or the Gulf coast for that matter. She'll do her little, "Aw, this isn't right, we shouldn't allow this" routine. But she won't demand unbridled outrage at the power structure, she won't remind people that unless they are as wealthy as she is they are just as screwed should a major disaster hit them. She won't let them know that America is a very different place than it was five years ago, and that reality has nothing to do with terrorism.

She might find a few families and help them, but it won't be any more than a single spit in the bucket.

[spotbird]

66. $10,000,000 is a lot of money

to most people, but not Oprah. It won't even be a start toward what's needed, only the government has the resources necessary to fix this, but they don't want to. Shit, the government won't even give mobile homes, which it fabricated for this disaster and which will otherwise go to waste, to first responders down there.

$10 million is nice of her,it looks good, but it won't be much help. She needs to talk about why the federal government is not planning to rebuild New Orleans. Why the disaster wasn't in August but it is today. She should speak clearly, and with the righteous indignation this outrage deserves. She should blame the president specifically. It's time for her to work to correct her wrong.

It's also time people understood this is about them.

[Deja Q]

142. Bingo.

[xchrom]

49. oprah = mediocrity gone wild.

she's tame stuff -- kinda bland -- not my cup o' tea,

[myrna minx]

55. Oprah is not political in the way that we are.

Oprah's mentor is Maya Angelou. You know, that evil right wing freeper Maya Angelou. :sarcasm: You know the former poet laureate Maya Angelou?:
http://eserver.org/poetry/angelou.html

Inaugural Poem
Maya Angelou
20 January 1993
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Rock, A River, A Tree
Hosts to species long since departed,
Marked the mastodon.
The dinosaur, who left dry tokens
Of their sojourn here
On our planet floor,
Any broad alarm of their hastening doom
Is lost in the gloom of dust and ages.

But today, the Rock cries out to us, clearly, forcefully,
Come, you may stand upon my
Back and face your distant destiny,
But seek no haven in my shadow.

I will give you no more hiding place down here.

You, created only a little lower than
The angels, have crouched too long in
The bruising darkness,
Have lain too long
Face down in ignorance.

Your mouths spilling words
Armed for slaughter.

The Rock cries out today, you may stand on me,
But do not hide your face.

Across the wall of the world,
A River sings a beautiful song,
Come rest here by my side.

Each of you a bordered country,
Delicate and strangely made proud,
Yet thrusting perpetually under siege.

Your armed struggles for profit
Have left collars of waste upon
My shore, currents of debris upon my breast.

Yet, today I call you to my riverside,
If you will study war no more. Come,

Clad in peace and I will sing the songs
The Creator gave to me when I and the
Tree and the stone were one.

Before cynicism was a bloody sear across your
Brow and when you yet knew you still
Knew nothing.

The River sings and sings on.

There is a true yearning to respond to
The singing River and the wise Rock.

So say the Asian, the Hispanic, the Jew
The African and Native American, the Sioux,
The Catholic, the Muslim, the French, the Greek
The Irish, the Rabbi, the Priest, the Sheikh,
The Gay, the Straight, the Preacher,
The privileged, the homeless, the Teacher.
They hear. They all hear
The speaking of the Tree.

Today, the first and last of every Tree
Speaks to humankind. Come to me, here beside the River.

Plant yourself beside me, here beside the River.

Each of you, descendant of some passed
On traveller, has been paid for.

You, who gave me my first name, you
Pawnee, Apache and Seneca, you
Cherokee Nation, who rested with me, then
Forced on bloody feet, left me to the employment of
Other seekers--desperate for gain,
Starving for gold.

You, the Turk, the Swede, the German, the Scot ...
You the Ashanti, the Yoruba, the Kru, bought
Sold, stolen, arriving on a nightmare
Praying for a dream.

Here, root yourselves beside me.

I am the Tree planted by the River,
Which will not be moved.

I, the Rock, I the River, I the Tree
I am yours--your Passages have been paid.

Lift up your faces, you have a piercing need
For this bright morning dawning for you.

History, despite its wrenching pain,
Cannot be unlived, and if faced
With courage, need not be lived again.

Lift up your eyes upon
The day breaking for you.

Give birth again
To the dream.

Women, children, men,
Take it into the palms of your hands.

Mold it into the shape of your most
Private need. Sculpt it into
The image of your most public self.
Lift up your hearts
Each new hour holds new chances
For new beginnings.

Do not be wedded forever
To fear, yoked eternally
To brutishness.

The horizon leans forward,
Offering you space to place new steps of change.
Here, on the pulse of this fine day
You may have the courage
To look up and out upon me, the
Rock, the River, the Tree, your country.

No less to Midas than the mendicant.

No less to you now than the mastodon then.

Here on the pulse of this new day
You may have the grace to look up and out
And into your sister's eyes, into
Your brother's face, your country
And say simply
Very simply
With hope
Good morning.


Yeah-Oprah the freeper. A woman who builds schools in South Africa and spends her life trying to bring attention to the AIDS epidemic in Africa. Um, yeah. I guess all of our billionaires should be more like Dick Cheney, right? God. This is so stupid.

[spotbird]

64. You characterized her as a freeper,

which is a position you'd have to defend. Since it's not what I said or believe there is no point in addressing the claim.

Oprah is seduced by influence and power. Like the rest of them she knows that should she speak truth to power her access would evaporate. The difference between her and the rest is she should remember, but doesn't.

[myrna minx]

68. I was being sarcastic and hyperbolic considering that you

charged her with being the biggest reason bu$h was in office besides diebold. C'mon. How do you know what she knows? Her access to Tracy Gold and soccer moms would evaporate? Rant and rant on, but this thread is foolish to me. Oprah may throughly love her power and influence, but she does a hell of a lot for people. If you don't think that she does enough, then that's your opinion. She could just do makeover shows and keep every penny that she makes. She chooses not to sit on her vast piles of money. She inspires people to give more of themselves. I suppose because she doesn't do what you want her to do, she deserves an angry thread here. OK, her love fest with Arnie was :puke: to me, but she has brought the level of "do onto others..." to a broad group of people who may never be exposed to the joys of giving. We'll have to disagree, spotbird. I don't think she deserves this rage, but that is my opinion.

[NativeTexan]

59. As a Texan who watched the Cokehead Village Idiot.....

....for YEARS, I remember the stupidist thing that I had heard the idiot say up to that point was on Oprah.

She asked, "What is the most misunderstood thing about you?". And his reply? "That I am running on my fathers name". And she let that GO!

[mzmolly]

61. Uhm, Oprah had Gore on her show first and complained openly

that Bush refused? What did she do for * in 04?

[samhsarah]

67. WAAAAHHHHH!!!

HE is why New Orleans got fucked Oprah.

[spotbird]

69. That sums up the show

People who say this wasn't an impact just don't understand how much influence she had and how close the election was. It made all the difference.

She must know her influence because she went on to support Arnold and she is mushy about Condi.

[mzmolly]

72. Yes, and these pics sum up her mentality nicely as well.

C'mon people she gave both men an opportunity to speak and DISSED Bush for being afraid to appear on her show initially. Did YOU vote for Bush based upon his lame Oprah appearance? Oprah is not Chris Matthews, she's not going to play hardball with her political guests.

[spotbird]

74. You obviously didn't watch both shows

if you had you'd know.

However, you do make a good point that photographs can misrepresent what happened.

[mzmolly]

77. Actually, I watched both shows with interest. Bush is a schmooze, a used

car salesman, Gore is an intellectual to the point of being intimidating to some. I refuse to hold Oprah responsible for the election based upon how these men did on her show. :eyes:

[Pirate Smile]

79. I agree. This is ridiculous.

[mzmolly]

83. Thanks.

I find it unsettling to the point of being loony frankly. :crazy:

[Pirate Smile]

90. Me too. We have lots of problems. Oprah isn't one of them.

:crazy:

[myrna minx]

103. I know! Did you see her interview with Barak Obama?

All of this Oprah hating is so bizarre!

://www2.oprah.com/omagazine/200411/omag_200411_ocut.jhtml

OPRAH'S CUT WITH BARACK OBAMA

He electrified the 2004 Democratic National Convention. He's prompted cries of "first black president". He's Barack Obama, the United States Senator from Illinois. Surrounded by his wife, Michelle, and their two daughters, he takes a rare break from his 16-hour workday to sit down with Oprah at his Chicago home. Listen in.

"I don't consider myself political and I seldom interview politicians. So when I decided to talk with you , people around me were like, 'What's happened to you?' I said, 'I think this is beyond and above politics.' It feels like something new." — Oprah

[spotbird]

86. If the host didn't matter the questions would be

read from a teleprompter. Your suggestion that the guest is solely responsible for the slant of a broadcast denies all of Fox news.

[mzmolly]

96. Do you have transcripts from both guests?

I'd like to see an example of the bias you speak of. Additionally, Fox news would not have given Gore a voice.

[prolesunited]

116. Yes, the appropriate response

would have been to push him and then slap him in the face.

[noonwitch]

70. I don't see how anyone can consider Oprah to be on Bush's side

Oprah's show is not exactly "60 Minutes". It's a talk show, mostly geared for women. I saw her interviews with politicians during election seasons, and I really have never thought she was taking sides.

I will watch today's show if I can. Her coverage of the aftermath of Katrina was horrifying, but excellent. Anderson Cooper had some good coverage, too.

[spotbird]

80. Please. She only had Arnie on in CA,

but she didn't take a side? So she doesn't use words to make her endorsements.

She cares about her perception, she may regret the endorsement so she downplays it, who can blame her? It could even be that she conducted herself well in later interviews, I wouldn't know. However, I did see her with Condi and couldn't eat for two days it was so disgusting.

What I do know is that in 2000 she gave her support to Bush and it mattered. He hung her autographed picture in the visitor's section of the WH immediately after he took office, for crying out loud. He know what her support meant and framed it proudly.

[rinsd]

87. I hope that hyperbole...

"However, I did see her with Condi and couldn't eat for two days it was so disgusting."

Because if you feel that strongly about Oprah, I suggest you seek professional help.

[Maven]

71. Oprah is a total PHONY. She sucks.

I'll never understand why people think Oprah is so "genuine." She pretends to care about painful issues but really she can barely contain her glee at feeding off of other people's problems to boost her ratings. If you think Oprah is sincere, you're not a very good judge of character.

This whole NO thing is just one more example.

[medeak]

81. O refusted to go to Afghanistan despite Bush's request

to do his propaganda on how much better women are off now that the Taliban was defeated.

[prolesunited]

117. Well, that doesn't count

She's Bush's evil minion, I tell you.

[Czolgosz]

91. I will never forgive Oprah for giving Dr. Phil a national platform.

[noonwitch]

100. Now there's a legitimate reason to hate Oprah!

I will never trust a diet plan sold by a fat man.

[in_cog_ni_to]

102. She's also put Ahhhhhnold in the CA. Governor's House.

:grr:

[Beaverhausen]

105. No, a majority of voters in CA did that

Oprah is just not that powerful, people!

[in_cog_ni_to]

108. BUT she had a MAJOR part in his getting there! She is one powerful

woman whose show is seen all over and watched by MILLIONS. She is complicit in his being where he is.

HOWEVER, I appreciate everything Ope is doing in the Gulf Coast region. They need all the help they can get!

[Beaverhausen]

110. Arnold is a big movie star and would have been elected anyway

Because there are a lot of dumb voters here in CA. Oprah had nothing to do with it.

edit- her show today is about "The Katrina stories no on is telling."

http://www2.oprah.com/index.jhtml

[in_cog_ni_to]

113. I saw her show this morning. It broke my heart.

:cry:

She had Ahhhhnold on her show because her good friend Maria asked her to. She had a hand in getting him elected. Whether he would have won anyway is beside the point. She helped him when she didn't have to.

[rinsd]

118. I think she may have been a slight factor but a major part?

Did Ahnuld's numbers change after his appearance? His numbers with women? Is it your claim that his appearance blunted any effect of the allegations of fondling?
I'm curious.

I think Ahnuld won for several reasons.

The biggest one in my mind is the car license fee tripling. I know "everyone" argued that this was necessary(in fact triggered by law) and all the while screaming at the rich for bitching about it, but this absolutely destroyed whatever chance Davis had at staying in the job. Bustamante tried to make a compromise by shifting the rising tax to other sources (sin & wealth) but that message didn't come across as strongly as Ahnuld's no to the car tax message. Even people here on DU didn't understand how stark this tax was and how it impacted the working class, this was also coming a few years after the DMV scam to end all scams. The CA DMV used to charge you $300 for bringing a car not manufactured in CA to the state. Not a requirement for upgrading (though you had to pass smog testing), not a voucher saying your car meets the standards. Just a check that went into the general fund. Well DMV got their ass handed to them in court and had to hand out refunds. That was still relatively fresh in people's minds when the car license fee happened.

[Czolgosz]

128. NOT A MAJORITY! A mere plurality of California voters fucked up. If there

had been a runoff between the two highest vote-getters in the recall election, I doubt Arnold would have won.

[rinsd]

140. Based on what?

If there was a runoff between the two highest vote getters Ahnuld still would have won. The next higest candidate's vote after Ahnuld and Bustamante was McClintock. Even if Bustamante grabbed 20% of the McClintock vote(unlikely) and every other vote, he would still lose.

[girl gone mad]

93. Of course. Blame a woman for the failures of men.

And a black woman at that. How convenient.

:eyes:

[spotbird]

122. Yep, this is just another "high tech lynching"

Play the race card and whatever she does is fine. Perhaps for you, but I favor personal responsibility over racist diversions.

[T Town Jake]

129. Every further post you make on this topic only makes you look sillier...

...why don't you quit while you're behind?

[spotbird]

133. Do you know the originator of the phrase "high tech lynching?"

It looks doubtful that you do.

[girl gone mad]

135. So Oprah is personally responsible for Bush's failings?

That's an interesting idea of personal responsibility.

[spotbird]

136. Watch today's show

she, as I predicted, used the phrase, "there is enough blame to go around." She telling the story of today in the Gulf, but can't bring herself to place blame where it belongs. Tomorrow's show will be a feel-good piece on people who have benefited from her charity, all is well that ends well.

Assuming when she supported him, she just thought a Bush presidency would be harmless enough for most Americans and very good for people like her when, she must know otherwise by now. Despite that she just can't bring herself to correct her mistake, so she does stories like these which won't change a thing.

[Beaverhausen]

104. I think the Supreme Court is more responsible for Bush getting to...

... the White House than Oprah. Don't forget...Gore won the election in 2000.

[clitzpah queen]

114. What we have here is a failure to REALLY educate.

Oprah has promoted a culture of token philanthropy over Real information. If the info she put out was More than Cosmetic, she would get to not only change peoples' Individual lives, but the system at large -- that has everyone dancing. Not her agenda.
Oprah Always stresses the individual and denies the Movements that have created change. That individual worship has served her well. I don't think it's benign and neutral that she had such a love-fest on her show for Dubya and Ahrnold. At this point, with 99% corporate hegemony over all media, news, etc. --Oprah Not allowing Other Politically Excluded Voices a platform on her show declares her partnership (as in I will NOT represent any real challenge to your power grab)with the Bush regime/culture at large.

[Throd]

119. UP AGAINST THE WALL, TRAITOR!!!

I just wanted to be the first to say it.

This is one of the weirder threads I've seen. C'mon, it is a ratings driven show, not where you go for hard hitting in-depth political analysis.

[Generator]

123. Oprah is a new age, pop psych queen

That's her bag. She believes helping the individual far outweighs anything political. I would guess she's the anti-Du'er for that opinion. She DOES help people. But even with the Africa thing-she's helped many people there-but isn't a bandaid effect? Until you address the real social economic ills of each country the solution isn't happening.

She adores the Marriane Willamson type. The "course in miracles" stuff. She thinks if you believe enough the whole world changes. There is some truth in that for the individual but there is also truth that if you don't face the real evil in your midst nothing changes. I've done the new age thing. I've found some truth and a lot of hypocrisy. And I think that's what irks people-her billions. Yes, she gives a lot away. But if one was truly as spiritual as she AIMS to be-along the MLK, Jesus route-wouldn't they give it ALL away? Wouldn't they do more to address wrongs than have a TV show? I don't know. She does good. But she is the status quo. She doesn't address war and all the money that goes into war which goddamn it all-is the reason people are poor in the first place. How much money have we put into just this Iraq thing? How many New Orleans and schools and nations could we have saved for that?

Oh don't ask that question-just give away some stuff to a few-that's the answer. Anyway-she's not a hero. Just a woman who does more good than bad. She could have endorsed Kerry-sure-would that have changed anything? I don't necessarily think so. But she sure as hell can talk about the real COST of war.

[Turn CO Blue]

125. Dupe. Slow computer or something. n/t

[Turn CO Blue]

126. BEST POST IN THE WHOLE THREAD!!!!!! n/t

[Carni]

127. She pisses me off...all that hoopla about "a million little pieces"

But not one damned word about how she shouldn't have given bushit her stamp of approval on national TV in 2000.

I would appreciate an apology from her for fawning all over his ass -- I don't care about some guy writing a fictional book and calling it autobiographical.

You know I read the Amityville Horror, I bought the book and tapes that claimed Elvis was Alive (and I got suckered by the Blair Witch project too!) but I GOT OVER IT!

Bush I cannot seem to get over!

Where are you Oprah to question the liar in the oval office?

She needs to get her priorities straight IMO

[slybacon9]

131. THANKS.

That is what i was going to say. After the james frey thing i am over her for good.

[rinsd]

143. self delete -

[AX10]

132. And she did the same thing for Arnold in 2003 too.

[KingFlorez]

137. What did she do for Bush?

Nothing at all. Let's not get paranoid and start accusing everyone of supporting Bush. Oprah jumped into action and showed the mess in New Orleans. She's helping the people, not Bush.

[Cha]

144. You're not even close..

If you watched Oprah in 2004..you would have seen her "Voting Party" hour where, Drew Barrymore, Cameron Diaz, Jake Gyllenhal, Christina Aguilera, P Diddy, et al were urging people to vote..and Ophra left no doubt as to whom she was for. It wasn't the village idiot.

You're not even backing up your accusations with any facts.

[spotbird]

146. They were to vote for Arnold? nt

[SoulDrift]

150. People of New Orleans..

Most of the victims in N.O. lament the lack of attention this gets nationally, and feel forgotten by the rest of their country. Even if her show wasn't an effective use of the airtime (I didn't see so I won't comment) they'd be happy just to know their plight is getting some exposure.

[Hippo_Tron]

151. Oprah's viewers need to learn to think for themselves n/t

[mitchum]

153. Why does anyone listen to her about anything? She's just an...

entertainer who can't even sing, dance or juggle.

[PBass]

156. Oprah is the biggest single media figure in America

more or less.

It's like saying someone 20 times more popular than Bill OReilly has no influence on an election. Of course she has an influence. She definitely can and does have an effect, the only debate is over how much.

The photo of Dumbya kissing Oprah speaks volumes.

This crap about Oprah having Gore and Dumbya on (the fair and balanced crap) is a red herring. The idea that both sides of any issue are equally valid is total bullshit.

Do I think it made a difference in the 2000 election, sure it did.

[Maraya1969]

155. Here is a search engine for political contributions. Winfrey gave most to

Dems/

EDIT: only goes up to 1997. I can't find a delete button.

http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_donations/Oprah_Winfrey.php

[Marie26]

165. Oprah is a Democrat!

Not quite sure what she's done to justify that tirade. Yeah, she's had Republican guests; she's had Democratic guests. She's rich, but donates a lot to charity. Most importantly, she isn't a journalist. It's not her responsiblity to present the news about the Bush Ad. to us. The real media sellouts are the news corporations.

[Dem2theMax]

167. Yep, lets hate her because she does what SHE wants to do,

not what WE (not me here) want her to do. How DARE she use her own brain and her own money!
I mean, what is she thinking - building houses for people who were left homeless after Katrina.
They should be forced to wait for FEMA. The gall of that woman! It was shameless of her to go to Africa (on more than one occasion) and build schools for children and then give their teachers supplies to teach the kids. Ooops! She gave the kids books to read, toys to play with, clothes to wear, shoes so they can walk to school and run and play and feel sort of special for all of one day in their lives. She has even done the evil deed of getting the word out on how all of us can help.

What a horrible human being.

I can only imagine what other things she has done out in the world but kept it quiet so we couldn't rip her apart even more for helping others less fortunate.

Yep, what this world needs is Oprah hate. We don't have nearly enough hate in the world.
And hating people who do good is the best hate of all.

Heaven forbid she doesn't do EXACTLY what WE want her to do EXACTLY when WE want her to do it.

Now may I :puke: ?