Diagnosis; Schizophrenic party personality disorder.

[Greyhound]

We hate that shrub* is destroying our liberty by shredding the parts of The Constitution that he doesn't simply ignore, yet significant numbers from our own party have no problem denying others freedom of choice on "their" issues (i.e. increased police powers, smoking, firearms, drugs, and all the rest of the "we know what's best for you" issues).

Nearly everyone agrees that we must reign in the corporations-run-amok, but The Party has lent its full, unwavering, support to every single pro-corporate, anti-worker proposal that has come along in the last 40 years (remember who cast the deciding vote in favor of NAFTA, or who brought us the H-1b/L-1 visa programs? Not to mention bankruptcy reform, welfare reform, telecommunications act, etc., etc.). Health-care for all, except when it will diminish corporate profits. Who controlled The House and/or The Senate when raygun dismantled all of the safe-guards put in place to protect The Citizens from big business/ruling families?

I, and millions of other citizens, are still waiting for some coherent plan or proposal of just how we will implement the issues proposed in the Party Platform, but I guess that's not really important, as long as they get elected. :grr:

It is time to realize that simply not being Re:puke: is not enough. We are in a crisis that really is unprecedented in our nations history, and it is time to stop the bullshit games and make a stand. We are either in favor of liberty, or we are not.

[BeFree]

1. As long as they get elected

See there, that's the problem. Our guy got elected........ but, well, we've got over it, eh?

And don't get me started on the voting machines, people here don't want to hear about the voting machines. Nope, they want to imagine that we are not like Mexico, our elections are clean as a thistle, er, whistle.

Don't worry about it, right?

[Greyhound]

2. Perfect example right there.

They expect us to, not only vote for, but to support with our time, effort, and dollars, a Party that won't even stand up to widespread, blatant, documented, election fraud.

This because, after they're elected, they're going to fix this mess, trust us. :eyes:

[omega minimo]

3. So the status quo is perpetuating the status quo?

Maybe I missed it-- where do DU or Dems reference what we DO all have in common, in general, in principle? Busy with infighting, do folks devote much time to that?

Bernie Sanders, an Independent, is one of the few in Congress pointing out the complicity with corporate rule.

And does DU ever get to where, instead of fighting over "progressive" issues, we discuss how they are relevant to Democratic success?

:hi: :bounce:

[Greyhound]

4. Quite simply we don't. We just keep talking about all of the distraction

issues, ad nauseum, while they go about the business of selling us to their corporate masters.

That's the whole strategy, and it continues to work just as it has for generations. What else can explain the steadfast refusal of The Party to pursue the blatant, widespread, documented, provable, fraud perpetrated on us in 2000 and continuing to this day?

We no longer have a republic, nor a democracy, we have a corporate oligarchy and nearly all of us are now indentured serfs.

Who can we vote for that will/can do anything about it?

[omega minimo]

5. The candidates coming from the grassroots in the hinterlands

and some (many?) of them are doing WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE (excuse me for yellin) along the lines of a Thom Hartmann "Everywo/man" approach, saying WHAT NEEDS TO BE SAID.

An excellent candidate in CA is challenging John Do-Little who is now ALL fubar'd in Abramoff law-breaking. His name is Charlie Brown. He was on Hartmann's show yesterday. Military background, against the illegal war, down-to-earth and articulate. Missed the segment but got to meet him-- seems to be the real deal. Walking a fine line of grounded outspokenness in a very Red (very White) rural/McMansioned district.

After the segment Thom said he asked (Bernie Sanders?) "what can we do about (insanity in Washington)?"!!!! and the answer was:

Find good candidates at the local level and support them.

Maybe a lot of the redundant fights DU been having depend on which side of the D.C. fishbowl yer on.

We need to find common ground or-- you're right-- it's time to learn to serf.

:grouphug:

[Greyhound]

6. Good to hear that CA has at least one.

My choice here, and I think it is fairly representative of the choice most of the nation faces, is between a piece of human waste with his head as far up shrubs ass as it will go and a real estate developer that just wants to ensure his supply of cheap labor. :eyes:

Well the developer has a 'D' after his name, so he gets my vote this time, but the utter lack of options makes me sick. :puke:

[MrBenchley]

7. In other words, the same tired libertarian blah

fails to convice most Democrats.

Geeze, if you don't want to be a Democrat, hit the bricks.

[omega minimo]

9. I reread the OP trying to see how your reply makes any sense

It doesn't

Could you reply specifically to the comments of someone who obvious cares enough about being a Democrat to make some important points? I can't say I have ever seen any actual information in your replies-- just pissing on other people's posts.

What does "Libertarian" have to do with the OP?

And if you are defensive about Democrats, could you tell us where the Democratic common ground is? I'd like to see that rather than continuous snark attacks.

:hi: Thank you.

[MrBenchley]

10. Really, who but a handful of libertarians

thinks an armed fuckwit with a drug problem represents freedom?

"I can't say I have ever seen any actual information in your replies"
I can't say I really much care....

[omega minimo]

11. I can't say

I can't say that reply makes any sense either

[applegrove]

8. If you've gone black & white on in your personal politics..Rove won

that round.

Nobody, but nobody should get everything they want in a democracy (until *..nobody did). But they should get the tools they need. Which means a variety of tools for a variety of people in the democracy.