Reality Time: The Only Credible Alternative to Hillary is Barack Obama. The Rest Should Drop Out.

[David Zephyr]

We are now just months away from the first contests. Those who are looking to have an alternative voice to the Clintons should begin dealing with reality...as much as it may hurt. The reality?

The reality is that, aside from a last moment declaration by Al Gore to seek the Democratic nomination, there's only one candidate who has the what is needed to overcome Hillary Clinton's "inevitability": Senator Barack Obama.

John Edwards, now flipping to opt for matching funds, is on the ropes in both money and enthusiasm as his campaign flirts with single digits in his McCain-like dive in the polls. Edwards' lead in Iowa has clearly petered out with Hillary and Barack now poised to win. Voting for Edwards will only assist the Clintons now.

Dennis Kucinich, clearly the finest candidate of them all in my opinion, is not going to pull off a surprise win and does not have the money that it will take to win the primaries. Voting for Dennis instead of Barack will only help the Clintons at this point.

Joe Biden today opened his mouth and blamed Al Gore and John Kerry for losing their elections and pontificated (as he loves to do) about how he would have done it better in 2000 and 2004. Memo to Joe Biden: Shut up already and drop out. Voting for Joe Biden can only help Hillary against "the clean" black man, as Biden referred to Barack.

And then there is Chris Dodd, Bill Richardson and Mike Gravel and, for pete's sake, what in the hell are they still even running to prove at this point. They have no money, no organization and no chance of ever winning even a single primary. Supporting them also only helps Hillary.

There are two candidates now: Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama.

We had a far better crop of candidates than the GOP did this time, but it's time for the rest to drop out and let the race focus between the two front-runners.

[yourout]

1. Excuse me if I vote for the person of my choice.

Edwards is far from dead.

[dickbearton]

30. And Edwards would make a better president.

[Clark2008]

79. No he wouldn't...

He would completely re-invent his first term with an "oops, I'm sorry" moment.

[Taverner]

2. Relax. Anything can happen still...

And I do mean anything...

[Amerigo Vespucci]

4. It always does...

"Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans"

- John Lennon

[calteacherguy]

25. And yet there is a difference between the possible and the probable. nt

[Taverner]

75. It is still probable that Obama, Edwards or another can win the nomination

Gary Hart was a shoe-in in 88
LBJ was a shoe-in in 68
GHWB was a shoe-in in 92

Anything can happen during a campaign. At this point, all the candidates, Dem and GOP are getting tired. It's been a long several months without sleep. This campaign started earlier than any other. Now is when it starts getting interesting.

[NC_Nurse]

3. Fuck that.

That is all.

[robinlynne]

59. yep.

[AtomicKitten]

5. Obama is becoming Hillary' s only viable opposition.

It is what it is. And it would be a damn shame if we can't come to terms on a candidate that isn't Hillary.

[David Zephyr]

39. It is what it is indeed.

Thanks for your post.

[Exultant Democracy]

6. I swear it is like no one has seen a primary before. Anyone who thinks that Clinton

is even close to locking this up is deluded. This goes for both her supporters and the doom and gloomers that thing she is going to win.

[dugggy]

63. Hillary has it locked up! Did you see the money rolling in?

She is breaking records! Smart money already knows she
will be the next POTUS.

[Exultant Democracy]

72. All things being even in a static world then sure, but 4 months is 4 years in politics

anyone who thinks that it is locked up hasn't payed attention to a primary before.

[poverlay]

7. I voted Dean last time because he was "electable" and "credible". Look at how great that turned out

to be...

I will proudly vote for Dennis Kucinich for President because he is the candidate whose thinking and policy positions most closely mirror my own. That is what I believe and I will remain true to myself this time.

[Adelante]

8. This is just wrong

People should be able to vote for their candidates unless they drop out, but it's not for anybody here to say when that is.

[Inspired]

9. Huh? There's still 3 months until the Iowa caucus.

I think I'll hang in there until then.

[David Zephyr]

40. Iowa may move up to December now.

That's two months.

[monmouth]

10. I'd like to see Edwards drop out and move Biden up....n/t

[cascadiance]

33. Yup, could see how you and the DLC would like that!

Those who want progressive alternatives don't even feel that the doors closed for new entries yet though. As Gore notes, he doesn't have to play by the 600 day campaign rule that some here are trying to force on him.

The primaries are still MONTHS from STARTING!

Why don't all of the unfavored horses for the Kentucky derby except for the top 2 quit before the race even starts. They usually don't have much of a chance! :sarcasm:

[cobalt1999]

11. Actually, I'd say it is a toss up between the top three at this point

Way too early and the public is extremely fickle. The person leading now may be a pariah in 2 months. Obviously, it's better to be in the lead than be sitting at 2%, but all that gives any candidate is name recognition and fund raising.

It's still an open race for the top 3-4 candidates.

[Connie_Corleone]

12. Can we at least wait until Iowa has its caucus first before telling candidates to drop out?

[Yukari Yakumo]

20. Because by that time, it may be way too late {nt}

uguu

[Lydia Leftcoast]

22. Too late for what?

:eyes:

[quinnox]

13. Too bad for Obama but he will have to beat Hillary without help

The other candidates will likely stay in too long for Obama to get any help. He will have to beat Hillary by himself, a nearly impossible task for someone with Obama's political skills. Stick a fork in Barak, better luck next time.

[jenmito]

14. You're funny...

Obama is doing just fine and he has the money to go the entire distance, unlike anyone but Hillary. Keep dreaming, though! :hi:

[quinnox]

19. Maybe he has the money to go all the way

but does he have the support? I don't think so. What will all you Obama supporters do if and when he drops out and endorses Hillary I wonder.

[jenmito]

24. Are you kidding?

Of COURSE he has the support! He has more donors than Hillary and once Edwards (who doesn't have the support or funds to continue) and the others eventually drop out, Obama's support will increase as Edwards' positions are closer to Obama's than Hillay's.

[citizen53]

15. Your reality is not mine...

not to mention it's presumptuous.

[David Zephyr]

41. Welcome to the DU.

:)

[Dawgs]

16. This is the wrong approach. Edwards and Obama are both great candidates.

We need to work together to bring defeat Hillary. We shouldn't divide our support.

[high density]

17. WTF??? Tell that to John Kerry in October 2003. NM

[David Dunham]

18. Richardson will be Hillary's VP

[jmp]

21. Obama is not exactly an alternative.

There isn't much difference between the two of them.

I will say this though ... the Dems are running the risk of exhausting their donor base with all this fund raising for the primary.

[David Zephyr]

45. Bingo! The fund raising that we will need against the GOP is divided too much.

I'm glad you made that point, jmp, because this is exactly what my companion said this weekend as the build up by the media was drumming in about how much money everyone would have raised. He told me quietly, "It's a shame that all of our precious Democratic money is so divided when we will need it against the GOP."

You write: "the Dems are running the risk of exhausting their donor base with all this fund raising for the primary."

I will tell him this evening that someone else feels the same way and is concerned about it.

[ginchinchili]

23. The world's most difficult job at one of our nation's most challenging times

No matter how much you like Obama--I like the guy too--he's simply not ready to tackle this job. You just can't get around, "Let's try him out and see how he does," because we can't afford that risk. It would also leave the Democrats extremely vulnerable because the Republicans would repeat over and over and over again some variation of: lacks experience vs terrorist/nuclear threats. If you know the political landscape of this country, you know how that argue will resonate. Democrats can't take the chance, and shouldn't. He really isn't experienced enough. Very smart, but not experienced enough. Joe Biden really is the most qualified person running, like him or not. We should put our nation's best interests first rather than what seems like a cool thing to try out.

[jenmito]

28. Yes he is...

Hillary, on the other hand, clearly has not learned from her mistakes. Obama was intelligent enough to know exactly what would happen if we invaded Iraq, even five years ago when he was LESS experienced. He's been working in the govt. for over 20 years...hardly inexperienced. He has the judgement, experience, and intelligence to be president in '08.

[ginchinchili]

37. He hasn't been working on the big stage but for 2 years

I knew what would happen if we invaded Iraq. Does that make me presidential material? He also admitted that he isn't sure how he would have voted had he been in office at the time to the war authorization. He has the judgment. He has the intelligence and the judgment, but not the experience, no matter how much you want to claim otherwise. Arguing that he was on the city council may impress you, but it won't carry much weigh in a general election.

[jenmito]

44. The "big stage"??? Like I said,

he's been working in the govt. for over 20 years...hardly inexperienced. He did much more than belong to the city council. He has the judgement, experience, and intelligence to be president in '08. He not only knew what would happen, he was in the govt. in IL and spoke out against it even though it was popular at the time. Why didn't HILLARY know what would happen? He said what he said before the '04 election because he was the keynote speaker for two guys who voted for the war. Hillary voted for the war and now sounds eerily similar to Bush, saying you shouldn't say what you think, you shouldn't promise to meet with world leaders we don't agree with, she won't disclose past donations, she voted for the Lieberman/Kyl resolution, etc. Sorry, I don't want her kind of "experience."

[ginchinchili]

48. Either do I, but Obama still doesn't have enough experience to run this country

Bush didn't either, and I don't like the results. We need someone with a lot of foreign policy experience so we can start repairing the damage Bush has done to our prestige, our credibility, and our international relationships. We're at war. A regional war could easily break out. He's not up to this right now. We need more than a personable goodwill ambassador.

Look, he'll still be young in 4 - 8 years. Why does he have to be president now? In fact, I was quite surprised when he chose to run in this election and I thought it revealed a weakness in his judgment. We really can't afford that now. Be patient. He'll have his day, when he's ready.

[jenmito]

50. He has more than enough...

Why do you think Zbigniew Brzezinski endorsed him? Do you trust someone with his foreign policy experience to endorse someone who's not ready? What experience does Hillary have that makes her better than Obama? Her choices on the important issues have been wrong and continue to be wrong. Maybe you should vote for McCain! :shrug:

[ginchinchili]

53. No, I plan to vote for Joe Biden.

He's smart, he's pragmatic, and he has the necessary experience. He can go toe to toe with any of the Republican candidates and handily put them in their place, because none of them have the understanding that he has on the most pressing issues that are now facing our country. Good lord, his son will be deployed to Iraq next year. Biden won't be just another policy wonk saying whatever he thinks will help him politically. He's got a personal stake in this, so he can really relate to other Americans who do as well. I'd really like to see Biden win the nomination and make Obama his running mate--not out of the question. That would be an unbeatable team and it would give Obama the necessary experience to prepare him for the presidency in 8 years.

But just saying Obama has the necessary experience doesn't make it so. He's got plenty of time in the future, and he's going to have to be prepared for some ugly campaign crap as the first really serious black contender for the presidency. He'll be ready for that in 4 - 8 years, but he isn't now. They will use disguised racism to instill fear in our less education voters, and on top of that, remind all of America everyday that Barak Obama has very little foreign policy experience during a time of war. He would lose the election and we'd never get out of Iraq. Many more people will die. Give him another term or 2, he'll be ready to play hardball with the best, and worst, of them.

[jenmito]

57. So what's with all the Hillary talk then?

Why do you think Obama's not ready but will be in 4-8 years? His whole life has prepared him for this. Yes Biden is VERY experienced but he won't win. Sadly, money talks louder than one's positions, and the only ones who have the money needed to run are Obama and Hillary.

Saying Obama doesn't have the necessary experience doesn't make it so. He's been Black all his life. He's been very successful and I'm sure he WILL be able to deal with whatever's thrown at him.

[ginchinchili]

66. LOL...I hope he's been black all his life.

I don't know what you're referring to regarding the Hillary stuff. I don't want Hillary as the nominee.

But what you're saying is that this isn't a race about who's the best candidate or who has the best ideas, it's about who can raise the most money? Sorry, but I don't buy that. I should support Obama because of all the money he raised? I don't think so. We might as well be backing Mitt Romney if that's the standard. And do you mind telling me about Obama's foreign policy experience. I've missed that one.

[jenmito]

76. My point was...

he's used to dealing with adversity all his life. He was the first Black president of Harvard Law Review. He grew up with a White mother back in the days when that was really frowned upon (if you had a Black father).

Sorry-I confused you with another poster about the Hillary comment.

No, what I said was, "Sadly, money talks louder than one's positions, and the only ones who have the money needed to run are Obama and Hillary. I'm just telling you what you already know. But I'm not saying you should support Obama because of all the money he raised (since I could just as easily tell you you should support Hillary who has about the same amount of money). I'm saying the REALITY is that those with the most money to get their messages out will be the only viable candidates. And I believe Obama is the best viable candidate. I admire all the work he has done, the fact that he doesn't take PAC money or lobbyists' money, and above all, that he had the world experience, just due to his life experience of living in different countries and learning about different cultures, to have the good judgement to know exactly what would happen if we invaded Iraq. And he will still have that same judgement when it comes to the NEXT situation that comes along, which is why I believe Zbigniew Brzezinski endorsed him.

[ginchinchili]

90. Sorry. That still amounts to zero foreign policy experience at a time of war.

That won't fly with the American public, nor should it.

"he's used to dealing with adversity all his life. He was the first Black president of Harvard Law Review." Man, how could life be any tougher than that? By this standard, I should be king of the universe.

[jenmito]

91. A time of war that may not have been going on if Biden, Hillary, Edwards, etc. hadn't voted for it

Judgement is VERY important. He was the first Black president of Harvard Law Review. That's an accomplishment. He has several other accomplishments from the over 20 years he was in govt. His life experience gave him the judgement needed to make smart decisions regarding foreign policy as shown by his speech BEFORE the war.

[ginchinchili]

93. Even he admited that he doesn't know how he would have voted authorizing war

You can talk all you want about his good judgment, but he's still wet behind the ears when it comes to foreign policy, and we are currently at war. Never mind if his judgment is good enough to handle it, he'd never be able to convince a majority of this country to put him in charge while the country is at war and the entire Middle East could explode into a regional conflict at any moment, and Obama not having a lick of foreign policy experience. I appreciate your passion for Obama, but you obviously are having a hard time being objective about how you read the political landscape in this country. They're still quite conservative out there, even though they've been disappointed by Bush. Obama needs to wait an election or 2 when he has some more experience on the national and international level.

[jenmito]

94. That's not what he did. He was just about to give the keynote speech at the DNC convention

and he was asked about it. The reason he answered that way was because he was speaking for two guys who voted FOR the war and he wanted to give them "cover." That's ok that you disagree with me. Many people don't, though, as seen by his contributors and his crowds.

[w4rma]

26. Why? Because Obama has spent hoards of money and is still only ~5% ahead of John Edwards? (nt)

[FrenchieCat]

52. And Edwards has been running Forever.....and is still behind

Obama.......

[UpInArms]

27. David, normally I would agree with most of your posts

this one,

I just cannot.

stop

being

so

dramatic.

Take

a

breath.

Exhale.

Let the world think about it.

Just for a moment.

Thanks.

[David Zephyr]

43. Exhaling just for you.

But it's how I see it at this late point and with Iowa possibly moving up to December.

I want to win in 2008.

[zulchzulu]

29. I wholeheartedly, fullthroatingly disagree

It's still three months before the first votes are cast, ferchrissakes... democracy takes a while to simmer to a boil before it's ready.

If anything, it's time for people to back their candidate by logging off the computer sometime and getting out in the streets to show their passion in REAL life.

[mmonk]

31. It's stuff like this that makes me go back to GD.

[ruggerson]

42. Grab me a cookie while you're up

n/t

[calteacherguy]

32. I do agree, but ego and inertia will get in the way. nt

[David Zephyr]

46. As it always does, huh?

I would like to once for the Democrats to get their act together early on. Thinning the herd down to two or, for goodness sakes, at least three, would be a good thing for our party.

But as you say, ego and inertia get in the way.

[Myrina]

34. Time to go shoot myself in the head.

With a choice between those two ... and the morons the GOP is running ... OMG.

I can't believe with all the intelligence and talent and creativity this country has to offer, this is what we're facing.

This country is fucked. :hurts:

[David Zephyr]

47. No, we need your head.

:hi:

[riqster]

35. If the only purpose of a primary was to select a nominee, yeah, maybe...

...but primaries are also a chance for the rank-and-file to have a voice in the platform. For that reason, I am voting for Kucinich in the primary. With enough support, we can nudge the platform left a bit.

Of course, in the general, I will back our nominee.

[jillan]

36. Who died and put you in charge?

[Jed Dilligan]

38. I feel just the opposite.

The behavior of Dems in DC over the past couple of weeks has made me decide to vote conscientiously rather than strategically in the primary.

"Not Clinton" is an even worse criterion for voting than "Not GOP." I want to register my dissatisfaction with the party leadership. Would you rather have me do it now, or in November? I haven't seen Obama say a single thing to distance himself from her agenda.

[saltpoint]

49. I'm on the old-fashioned side. I vote for whom I want to from the

"informed farmer/citizen" matrix envisioned by Madison and Jefferson.

Likely one of our 8 announced candidates, and possibly a couple other unannounced ones, will be the next president. The trends are good.

Your post is reductionist crap, which is to say that the same sort of assertion could have been made about John Kerry and John Edwards in Iowa as late as November of 2003. Dick Gephardt and Howard Dean held the stronger positions -- by far -- and an equally inaccurate assertion then might have held that all the other candidates should drop out, except for the working of all the possible variables to completely reverse the field. Which is to say it would have been a crap argument then even as it's a crap argument now.

Dean finished a disappointing third and Gephardt was buried alive. Kerry and Edwards placed first and second, respectively.

[PurityOfEssence]

51. Rasmussen has Edwards slipping a little today, but holding pretty steady.

Where are you getting this?

[MadHound]

54. Oh geez, not this shit

Hell, I'm used to hearing this kind of meme from the Hillary supporters, "A vote for third party is a vote for the 'Pugs," and similar variations. Now we're getting the Democratic version here, "A vote for anybody but Obama is a vote for Hillary." Both statements are fallacies and farcical on their face, and such reasoning is neither logical nor meaningful.

First, it is a long way out still before the first primary, and a lot can happen between now and then. You admit that Kucinich is the best candidate out there, gee, what happens if everybody who thinks that way actually votes their conscience rather than overanalyzing and trying to be pragmatic. Guess what, Kucinich wins. In addition, who knows what will be turned up between now and then, what personal secrets of Obama's will be brought to light, what gaffe will he do that will bring him down as quick as Howard Dean? Still a long time out, and there's many a slip between the cup and the lip.

Second, this is still, at least nominally, a democracy, where we are free to vote for who we believe is the the right choice for us. Screw the polls, screw the pundits, when it comes down to the voting booth, it is just you, your beliefs and ethics, and your conscience in that booth, and you should vote accordingly.

Third, these kind of posts, and this kind of thinking are usually counterproductive, persuading people to dig in their heels rather than doing what you want them to do. Offering up this farce of political thought isn't going to win either you or Obama any friends or influence people. Contrariwise, it will most likely persuade the various partisans to tell you and Obama to shove off, and make your job that much more difficult.

Sadly though, it is this sort of fear mongering mindset that is becoming increasingly pervasive in this party. It is no longer so much a question of laying out a candidate's positions and policies, and extolling those virtues in order to persuade people. No, it is more fear-mongering and threats, trying to scare people into voting a certain way. Sadly, this very mode of thought is just another symptom of the party's ills, and another reason that people are leaving it in droves. Frankly, if this sort of mindset continues to pervade the party, then the Democratic party isn't long for this world and will go the way of the Whigs.

[nadinbrzezinski]

56. Given that the social conservatives *snort*

are about to commit suicide, perhaps it is for the best that BOTH parties go the way of the whigs... if you catch me drift

[nadinbrzezinski]

55. Replace Dean for Clinton

and Kerry for Edwards

Not saying that Edwards will put a last second come back

But son you are way, and I mean WAAAYYYY too early in this pronoucement

Until the final poll is taken aka the vote, this is far from over.

If anything should have been learned by people in 2004 is that these declarations will be wrong

Oh and it should have been learned in 2000 (for the republicans it was McCain)

It should have been learned for them in 1996

By the way... you do know Clnton was not even a blip in the radar at this stage in 1992

Carry on

[TroubleMan]

58. Et tu, Brute? We get enough of this crap from the MSM,

and now a DUer has hitched his wagon to this idea?

I am very, very strongly opposed to Hillary Clinton as the Dem nominee....very opposed....it's almost a deal breaker for me. However, saying that all the candidates should drop out except for two (before even one vote has been cast) is bullshit.

[Forkboy]

60. I like you, so this is a majorly disappointing post to see.

[David Zephyr]

78. Maybe it wasn't my best day, Forkboy.

What's gnawing at me is that:

our candidates are carping away at each other giving fuel to be fired against us in '08,

our candidates are raising money from a poorer constituency than the GOP to fight among themselves,

and I want to win the White House back so very, very much that I guess I'll mortgage the farm for party unity.

My sister keeps telling me she hates it when our candidates fight. My companion tells me that our donor base is not as big as that of the GOP and we are wasting it.

I live in a bubble where all of my friends are liberals, not just Democrats. So my "perspective" is probably not as good as it once was.

I just want to win back our government and that was the motivation of my OP. Probably not my best day. And...I still hold out hope that Al Gore might still run.

[More Than A Feeling]

89. Put me down as another you've failed to unify.

Your OP is the equivalent of doing a touchdown dance while you are on your opponents 40 yard line. Yeah, you've gotten into their territory, but you aren't in the endzone yet.

If you are sincere in wanting to convince people of party unity, change your approach from "Surrender, Dorothy!" to something else.

[Skittles]

61. WTF?

hoo boy the media crap really, really does work

[dugggy]

62. Obama...wants to attack Pakistan unilaterally, wants to

disarm our nukes unilaterally, would not withdraw
troops from Iraq immediately,,,,NO THANKS!

GO HRC, GO BIDEN!

[AtomicKitten]

68. your, um, take on this is fascinating

you got everything wrong

[dugggy]

81. I am going by what I hear in the MSM, you may have

inside track to Obama campaign, which I don't.

But above all that, I loved the Bill Clinton era so I am
for HRC and I concurr with Biden's proposals on Iraq, so
he is my 2nd choice. Obama is just a greenhorn, not yet
ready for prime time.

[nolabels]

69. Oh, and them other two PROVEN liars have better plans?

The entire lot are politicians and that should tell anybody anything they ever wanted to know :shrug:

[shireen]

64. Reality Time: let the people decide

Doesn't matter that Hillary and Obama have the most money. Just read in Freakonomics that candidates with the most money don't necessarily win.

Doesn't matter what polls say. Most people haven't figured out who they really want, so when pollsters call, they toss out the big names making news.

Oh, and maybe you need to be reminded: this is a democracy.

[Eurobabe]

65. Pardon me, I thought we lived in a Democracy

How's bout letting the people vote first, K dude? :wtf:

[sniffa]

67. hiLLary shouLd drop out

hopefuLLy she wiLL after eating her hat in the first few states.

[Evergreen Emerald]

70. I disagree

I think Edwards and Dodd would both be better presidents than Obama.

[dionysus]

71. you know, I don't like it when the hillary people do this...

it is just as bad when a supporter for someone else does it.

[Bake]

73. Has even ONE single vote been cast yet?

A little early for this, dontcha think?

Bake

[michaelwb]

74. Must be right

How can I argue with that?

After all when has an anonymous internet poster on a discussion board ever been wrong about future events.

[flvegan]

77. Thank you, CNN for choosing my candidate(s) for me.

Yes, the money is the issue. I look forward to having Citigroup as my next president.

[Hippo_Tron]

80. I'm pretty sure that Kerry was polling in single digits at this time in 2003

That said, Gobama!

[dugggy]

82. It is nice to have a dream

that Obama will suddenly emerge the victor after primaries.
Well,,,,,keep some tranquilizers handy on primary nights.

[belborlon]

83. One again, the retarded, mis-informed American voter

will probably elect another retarded president.
very sad. You reap what you sow.

[AlCzervik]

84. Dude don't talk about your mom like that.

[Beaverhausen]

85. Thats twice today you've made me...

:spray:

[AlCzervik]

87. i try, i'd rather being laughing (at someone) than crying.

:toast:

[otherlander]

86. So who *do* you think would make a good president?

[AlCzervik]

88. i bet he won't say his mom.

[LWolf]

92. That would be a real shame,

since I'm not voting for Obama for any office.

It is more than a shame to urge better candidates to drop out and leave the race to the two most objectionable.

How about if HRC and Obama drop out, and leave the race wide open for better candidates?