Obama to do gospel tour with radical right singer who crusades against "the curse of homosexuality"

[Silence Dogood]

Saturday, October 20, 2007

http://www.americablog.com/2007/10/obama-to-do-gospel-tour-with-radical.html

As religious conservatives gather in Washington this weekend for the “Values Voters Summit,” Senator Barack Obama’s campaign announced its latest effort to attract people of faith to the campaign: a gospel concert tour.

All three of the dates of the “Embrace the Change” tour are in South Carolina, where Mr. Obama is locked in battle with Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton for black voters.

Gospel acts including Mary Mary, Donnie McClurkin and Hezekiah Walker, Byron Cage and the Mighty Clouds of Joy are scheduled to appear.

“This is another example of how Barack Obama is defying conventional wisdom about how politics is done and giving new meaning to meeting people at the grassroots level,” Joshua DuBois, the campaign’s religious affairs director, said in a release.

Yes, sucking up to anti-gay bigots and joining them on stage - no, giving them a stage - is certainly defying conventional wisdom as to how a Democrat becomes president. Oh, and McClurkin also believes that gays can, and need to, be "cured."

[Lars39]

1. If true, this is unacceptable.

[madeline_con]

27. He mentioned his ties to religious groups last week on Leno.

He's trying to get votes, which is understandable. but he's shaking the wrong hands this time, IMO.

John Edwards for President, BTW. :hi:

I found a transcript

JAY LENO: You talked about speaking in front of groups sometimes not always in your favor like the auto makers. I know you reached out on evangelicals as well.

SENATOR BARACK OBAMA: We had a wonderful event. Rick Warren has a terrific church down in Orange County,

Saddleback Church, huge mega church, but he's real serious about AIDS. And he invited me, and folks gave him a hard
time a little bit in sort of the evangelical camp about it. But when you talk to people in an honest, sincere way about solving
problems like AIDS, even if they disagree with you on some things, it turns out that people will respond.

I think one of the mistakes the Democratic party has made in the past is we just assume sometimes that folks

aren't going to listen to us, so we don't go to rural communities or we don't go to evangelical communities, and my attitude is
that if I show up and I'm listening to people and telling them what I really think, I may not get all their votes, but at least I will
earn their respect because they know that I want to be the President of all the people of the United States, not just the Democrats.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2007/10/sweet_blog_column_extra_obama_1.html

[rufus dog]

78. so for a bit of perspective

In 2004 Warren sent out an email basically guiding people to vote for Bush. In 2006 there was no email.

Last month he took a mild jab at Liberals to start a sermon, then spent 20 minutes comparing conservative leaders to Pharisees, (those in direct conflict with Jesus) and told those in attendance that these type of people were the worst possible. So someones message is getting through to Warren, Bono spends some time with him, Kerry visited him for a day, as did Obama. Appears to be progress!

[Ethelk2044]

85. The man is against homosexuals because he was raped as a child

When you start talking about a topic make damn sure you know what you are talking about.

[dsc]

87. so if I were to be mugged by a black man

and then become a racist that would be acceptable?

[Ethelk2044]

95. donnie is not against homosexuals. He believes what is in the bible.

so what you are saying is everyone who believes in the bible is against homosexuals. They do not believe in their views, but they respect the people there is a difference. Therefore get your facts straight with your smears. It just proves to me you do not know what the hell you are talking about.

[dsc]

111. Point to one, just one single solitary word from Jesus

you do know who he is I presume, that states homosexuality is a sin. Point to one, just one single solitary case of someone in the Bible who is cured of homosexuality. Get your facts straight before you call me a lying smear artist.

[Solon]

113. Using a religion to disguise your bigotry is no excuse...

Not all Christians, or people who "believe in the Bible" follow the book word for word. If they did, we'd still have slavery. The fact of the matter is that people have always used the Bible as an excuse for their bigotry, they still do, actually. Ever heard of the "Curse of Ham"?

[Ethelk2044]

119. First of all I did not say I was against gays. What I stated was People who

believe in the Bible tend not to believe in the Gay issue. My best friend is gay. I have no problem with their perference. They have to answer to God on their own. It is not for me to judge. It is up to God. I am not God.

[Solon]

120. "Gay issue", "preference"...

Well, let me just say that I now know what your ACTUAL opinion is now. I don't have time to debate a homophobe.

[Baby Snooks]

128. As do you...

"They have to answer to God on their own."

As do you. Obviously you do believe they are "less than" since you believe they have to "answer to God on their own." What do you have to "answer to God" on your own for? Christians seem to have this really smarmy way of "tolerating" people different from themselves in a most "intolerant" way.

I personally am sick of this "mean old man in the sky" myth and have begun to avoid Christians along with Republicans. What has Christianity brought to civilization in 2,000 years? Nothing but one genocide after another. All in the name of God.

Christians love to point fingers for some reason. Most should stand in front of a mirror when doing so.

[fudge stripe cookays]

151. Aaaah...

the old "some of my best friends are gays" argument. Anyone who calls it the "gay issue" doth protest too much.

Your poor "friend". Having to tolerate someone who can't stand the fact that they exist.

[JerseygirlCT]

169. What is the "Gay issue"?

Children?

A magazine?

People are either gay or not, or somewhere in-between. In any case, they are as God made them, and loved as God made them.

[Toasterlad]

270. Does Your Best Friend Know You Secretly Hate Them?

What a strange, strange friendship yours must be.

[Name removed]

156. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ronnykmarshall]

164. Nothing against "Homo"?

Why Mr. Phelps, so nice of you to join us.

[dsc]

178. wow just wow

such bigotry is just amazing.

[MonkeyFunk]

182. Surfermaw

did you really just call another member "Homo"?

[JerseygirlCT]

168. The idea that "the Bible" condemns homosexuality

is not really persuasive, either.

Most of the "clobber" phrases used to support homophobia are really bad interpretations. Conveniently bad, I might say.

If we are to believe the Gospels, Jesus himself never said one word about it. Though he did have a few words to say about divorce, for example.

I hate the idea that anyone subscribing to Christianity must be painted with the same bigoted brush. It's just not so. Those who do cling to an anti-gay interpretation do so for their own reasons, IMO, not religious ones.

[Solon]

179. Oh, I agree, most of that chapter dealt with pagan temple practices...

which included temple prostitution and ritual sex, the verse condemning Homosexuality(actually Male gay sex) should be taken within that context.

Besides that, I don't get why people think any God would be a voyeur, personally, if I were a God, I could think of a dozen better uses for my time.

[JerseygirlCT]

192. I think the test is probably far easier than we think:

does doing something harm you or another person?

In this context, monogamous, committed homosexual relationships simply don't meet the test.

Besides which, of course, those verses used are attributed to Paul. He's just another person, like the rest of us, and shouldn't be taken to speak for God. He had his own agenda here, and sex wasn't part of it -- he really thought the end was near -- like in tomorrow near -- and the idea of spending time or energy on sex was just not something he thought important.

So I always have a tough time with people so ready to jump on homosexuality, but not say, pride or a lack of charity... which is harmful?

[JerseygirlCT]

167. I'm confused by your post.

Who is "they" in "they do not believe in their views"?

And who said that anyone who believes in the Bible is against homosexuals?

[Mass]

181. The Bible says slavery is OK. Would you accept somebody who believes that it is OK because the

bible says so?

:shrug:

[Bluebear]

222. :crickets:

[aquart]

242. "They do not believe in their views..."

Could I get the English translation, please?

[aquart]

243. I'm sorry, but you are talking about the Torah.

The comments about "homosexuality" are from the Old Testament and anyone with an actual education knows it's a reference to so-called "dog priests." The Old Testament banned anything to do with other religions.

The New Testament is mightily silent about homosexuality. No comment about what I think Paul's inclinations were.

I get REALLY annoyed when Christians quote the Old Testament like they know WTF they are talking about.

[Elidor]

274. You just said "The man is against homosexuals"

Now you say the opposite. "It just proves to me you do not know what the hell you are talking about."

Indeed.

[Silence Dogood]

105. actually, what he's saying is religion cured him of being gay.

Is this what Obama believes as well?

[beaconess]

230. Obama has been very clear in his beliefs

And has said that, while he is a Christian and believes Jesus Christ it the Savior, his religion also teaches him that he is not infallible and, thus, he does not judge other people's beliefs.

I think we could all learn a little something from that. There's nothing wrong with reaching out to and working with others who have beliefs that are different from our own - especially if we're working toward common goals that we share.

[Lars39]

145. Makes no difference...he's working to deny a segment of the population

their basic rights. That is totally unacceptable.

[libnnc]

152. Here's a little kernel of wisdom for you...

His childhood experience did not make him gay. He was the victim of a pedophile, not a homosexual. Those are two totally different concepts.

His experience did not make him gay, no more than my experience with a male abuser made me straight.

Understood?

[NMMNG]

276. Then he's an idiot as well as a bigot

The man who raped him was a pedophile, not gay. And regardless, hating gays because of a rape is as stupid as hating blacks because you were raped by a black person, or Hispanics for the same reason. It's a cheap, senseless excuses for hatred.

And that "It says so in the Bible" crap is bull too. It says in the Bible that shellfish is an abomination and I don't see anybody screeching for bans against seafood restaurants or preaching for people to abstain from the sin of eating shellfish. Yet people continue to justify their bigotry toward GLBT people with the Bible because that way they can be bigots and seem righteous while doing so.

[Mojambo]

2. REALLY unfortunate.

I hope he does the right thing and gets out of this.

[spirit of wine]

3. Why would Obama tarnish his own campaign like this?

Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

[Ethelk2044]

130. Why did Clinton let him Sing and why was it OK.

[Cameron27]

137. It was a performance at the Democratic National Convention,

which was before before he got involved in the ex-gay movement and before he wrote his book.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9400E7DD...


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3629081&mesg_id=3629193

[maximusveritas]

4. Where's the evidence that he's "radical right"?

The headline to this post is very misleading.

[niceypoo]

7. This is a hint...

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. That's Not Cool

DSB

[niceypoo]

14. Oh? and why is that?

I see stuff like that posted all the time in Clinton threads....
Since when is Obama sacrosanct?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. I Like Hillary A Lot

But it does a disservice to her to post a photoshopped picture of Ann Coulter and Barack Obama... I have a policy that I wish other folks who like Hillary Clinton would follow... I don't start threads to bash her opponents... I don't interrupt positve threads on her opponents unless there's a contingent attack on Ms. Clinton in that thread...But if someone disses her and I have the time and inclination I'll fight like Hell...

[niceypoo]

24. Ah, so its OK to post such stuff about Hillary, but not Obama...

The double standard is so glaring here. It's anything goes when it comes to Clinton, but the world comes to a screeching halt when the tide is turned.

[niceypoo]

33. Actually I prefer Kucinich myself...

I am making a point.

[guruoo]

63. And here's the Dali Lama holding hands with Sen Craig

from the same page
http://www.dudehisattva.com


And another:


:spank:

[dugggy]

77. OMG....Barack looks intoxicated by Ann Coulter

:hurts: :puke:

[Ethelk2044]

86. You are one sad person. Obama is a dem who is religious. You need to get a grip

because you do not know what the hell you are talking about. There are many dems who are religious and appreciate candidates who are not afraid to let the right wing highjack religion.

[ThomCat]

254. You keep accusing other people of not knowing what they are

talking about. Have you looked inward yet? It seems to me that your prejudices are on display here today.

[maximusveritas]

17. Also, is Obama responsible for the political views of anyone who sings at his events?

It's not like Obama is endorsing his views just because he's sings a song there.

The guy is a Grammy-award winning singer. Most people here have probably never even heard of him, much less his political views.

[ruggerson]

23. In a word, yes

n/t

[Ethelk2044]

88. Your post is bullshit. Then you are responsible for someone killing a child if you are with him

then with your logic.

[AZ Criminal JD]

196. If you are in control of that child

and know someone is going to kill them, then yes you are responsible if you do nothing about it.

[Name removed]

269. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[goclark]

49. I am fine with this ~ he has never said he wasn't Christian

and to my knowledge, he respects all religions.

I am Christian and I see no problem.

Last I checked, this is a free country.

He is not putting down anyone at all.

[JerseygirlCT]

170. Yes, I think so.

Do you really think every aspect of an appearance isn't thought about?

I'm sorry, but who you ask to represent you represents you. This is quite unfortunate.

[AZ Criminal JD]

194. Yes

[dflprincess]

5. If this is true and if he goes through with it

it will, in the long run, cost him as many votes - probably more - in other states than it gains him in South Carolina.

[Ethelk2044]

89. It will not cost him any votes. There are many Dem's and others who will vote for him

because of his policies and views. They are not naive or narrow minded to believe because a person is religious he is a right wing.

[dflprincess]

199. There are religious people who are just fed up with the cynical

pandering politicians of all types do to religious groups. Many religious people believe in the separation of church and state as well as supporting the Constitutional mandate that there be no religious test for holding public office.

[Toasterlad]

268. Homophobic People ARE, By Definition, Narrow-Minded. So, You're Wrong.

Let's tally this up:

McClurkin = Homophobe.
Obama = Homophobe.
Ethelk2044 = Homophobe.

[ruggerson]

6. If true, this is not a wise choice

let's hope he reconsiders.

[terrya]

8. Well, we GLBT Democrats are being thrown under the bus...

again. How predictable.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

10. I Will Wait For Confirmation

But if it is true that's unbelievably messed up...

[KittyWampus]

21. how is Obama throwing GLBT Democrats under the bus by appearing at a gospel concert?

should he only appear at venues cleansed of those you and HE disagrees with on an issue?

[terrya]

When Obama is standing on the same stage....

as someone who espouses a belief that homosexuality is a "curse" and presumably knows about the beliefs of that person and does NOT disavow those beliefs...yes, that's called being thrown under the bus. Senator Obama doesn't support same-sex marriage equality...yes, the same positions that Hillary Rodham Clinton and John Edwards have. And as a gay Democrat, I suppose I have to reconcile myself to that. But this...is a little goddamned much, you know?

[alteredstate]

36. He won't be on the same stage with the guy

[KittyWampus]

70. So you'd have to equally condemn EVERY Democratic candidate who appears at a black church

Cause let me tell you, many black Americans are pretty homophobic.

I didn't believe it either. It defies logic.

But Catwoman pointed me to a bunch of links showing the awful truth.

So if Obama and every Democratic candidate was going to not appear where there are Democrats who also happen to not be enlightened when it comes to gender issues-

they are going to be ignoring a huge part of our constituency.

People who agree with a lot of other things. A lot of issues.

I'd say it's important for Dem candidates to work on getting the point across that supporting gay rights is working for social justice just as working to ensure that blacks can vote.

[Toasterlad]

266. Has Every Black Church-Goer Written a Book About the "Curse of Homosexuality"?

Call me when that happens, and then we can discuss your extremely fucked-up analogy.

Obama INVITED this guy to OBAMA'S concert. Obama is not crashing this clown's homophobic sing-a-long. Obama is HOSTING the homophobic sing-a-long. If you can't understand why gay people would have a problem with that, then you're pretty damn dense. But no offense meant, just like Obama means none, right?

[rufus dog]

79. Refer to response 27 and then 78

Obama created a mild uprising by appearing at Saddleback Church last year. Brownback took a shot at Obama that was immediately returned, see below: So having opposing points of view on stage can be offset by a true leader. You can stay divided and fight, or damn it you can get on stage with them and try to make them understand. Barrack seems to be succeeding in an Orange County Evangelical Church! To be it seems to be a way to find comman ground and move forward.

Brownback turned to Obama and said, "Welcome to my house." The audience of evangelicals howled with laughter. But when Obama had the chance to speak a few minutes later, he returned to what Brownback had said: "There is one thing I've got to say, Sam: This is my house, too. This is God's house."

Everyone laughed again -- neither Brownback's opening nor Obama's comeback were offered with the rancor that a cold retelling of them probably suggests -- but the point had been made anyway. In Obama's eyes, at least, the Republican Party can no longer claim ownership of all things evangelical.

[Bluebear]

73. Yes, blame the GLBT Democrats & shift the onerous motives to THEM.

Big surprise.

[sniffa]

203. i'm shocked i teLL ya

to see bigots with such free reign here. i Love DUers.

[NMMNG]

104. He's touring with an open homophobe

That's how he's throwing GLBT dems under the bus.

If he were touring with a member of the KKK or the Skinheads do you think black people would like it a great deal? Should they?

[closeupready]

253. Oh, come off it. Skinheads just have a different point of view.

That's all. What are you, intolerant of differing points of view? Shame on you. :sarcasm:

[NMMNG]

273. You're right. Silly me.

I think I'll invite some over for dinner so I can learn about their delightful organization. :thumbsup:

[mzmolly]

154. My thoughts as well.

:shrug:

[closeupready]

252. Does this mean you agree with McClurkin's viewpoints on homosexuality?

??

[alteredstate]

44. Last week I attended a faith forum hosted by Obama for President

Representatives from the GLBT community attended the forum and took an active part in the discussions.

[ruggerson]

46. All of us?

n/t

[alteredstate]

47. What's your point?

[ruggerson]

62. just joshin' ya

n/t

[goclark]

52. That's wonderful to know and what I would expect of Obama

He is not in the business of putting down anyone, he wants to lift people up.

We have been living under the thumb of an EVIL MAN and now we can't trust anyone.

[alteredstate]

65. I'm not a "religious" person

and I've never attended a "faith forum". It was wonderful. The members of my discussion group --- Black, White, Hispanic; Jewish, Southern Baptist, Catholic, Buddhist, Quaker, Atheist, Agnostic ---- we all came out of it with the knowledge that we all shared the same basic values, and we all want the same basic things --- peace and tolerance.

[Smarmie Doofus]

277. This is called "Ethical Culture" where I live:

The members of my discussion group --- Black, White, Hispanic; Jewish, Southern Baptist, Catholic, Buddhist, Quaker, Atheist, Agnostic ---- we all came out of it with the knowledge that we all shared the same basic values, and we all want the same basic things --- peace and tolerance.

I trust "homosexuality is a curse"
was not one of those shared values.

[Ethelk2044]

96. This is a lie. Try smearing but this will not work. Everyone knows what the bible states

and what Obama believes.

[ldf]

141. well, excuse me...

but i don't give a flying fuck WHAT the bible states.

and i sure as hell don't want my president to use it as his "guiding light".

:grr:

[Tellurian]

148. yep, exactly!

Obama is currying favor for the Evangelical vote by aligning himself with this mans values. This is not a good thing if Obama considers himself a democrat. He might as well jump into the GOP camp while he's at it!

[dbackjon]

163. No Doubt

Screw ANYONE THAT defends Obama or this idiot he is appearing with.

Anyone that is not for FULL RIGHTS for Gays TODAY is no better than the worst Republican.

[Radical Activist]

176. Except that Obama's support for gay rights hasn't changed.

Does someone have to agree with Obama on 100% of the issues before they can publicly support him for President?

[beaconess]

231. Don't you see - apparently some folks think we can win people over by ignoring them . . .

If we just pretend that people like Warren don't exist, they will eventually change their minds and think like us!


The only way to teach people and help bring them over to our side is to reach out to them. Talking to them - or even sharing the stage with them - doesn't mean we're turning our backs on our own views and principles.

[JackBeck]

235. Great idea.

Obama at a KKK rally. Can't wait to see the pictures.

[sniffa]

246. ooh, that's hot

ever see the chapeLLe skit on the bLind, bLack, kkk member?

[beaconess]

249. The fact that you don't understand the difference between the two situations speaks volumes.

[sniffa]

255. your own posts speak voLumes

ow, those tire marks hurt.

[JackBeck]

272. But I thought this was all about building bridges.

You know, reaching out to those with whom we disagree.

Care to explain the difference?

[Toasterlad]

267. You Are Correct. Obama NEVER Supported Gay Rights.

Therefore, hiring a homophobic gospel singer is right in step with his beliefs.

[Grandrose]

9. Why do you care?

Apparently you would not support Obama anyway. Your sarcastic remarks suggest you just needed to post something petty and negative?:eyes:

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. I'll Wait For Confirmation

I hope and pray it's not true...

[Grandrose]

28. Whatever.....

Can't please all of the people...all of the time! Litmus tests as to who can or cannot support a candidate is ridiculous. I could understand if he was the only one on the tour....give me a break!:argh:

[DemocratSinceBirth]

41. It's An Old Tactic Of "The Man" To Get Non -Majority Groups Fighting Against One Another

So They Can't Be United In The Fight Against Him...

It's the reason the populist movement of the nineteenth century fell apart at the crucial moment because broke ass whites would rather throw in their lot with wealthy whites than bond with African Americans with whom they had more in common...

It's why George Bush* got sixteen percent of the African American vote in Ohio and the presidency because the Republican party put an anti gay-marriage amendment on the ballot to split the African American vote...

Oh, somebody in this thread that most African American folks are homophobic... I don't think they are any more homophobic than anybody else...

[Goblinmonger]

56. OK, for just a second

pretend it was Bush hosting this event. What would DU, and you, be saying about it? I'm sure you'd be giving Bush a break on thig one.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

58. In Fairness If It Was Bush We Would Give A Shrug Because That's His Base

eom

[Goblinmonger]

59. Yeah, that's right

there would be no outrage.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

80. I Don't Get Your Point

Homophobic evangelicals are part of Bush*'s base. If a homophobic , evangelical gospel singer sang at a George Bush*' event it would be a "dog bites man" story.

[Bluebear]

74. ******** ****PETTY***** ***************?????????

[sniffa]

256. *chirp* *chirp*

stop being so whiny BB. :eyes:

[Evergreen Emerald]

11. here is some information on McClurkin and the "gay curse"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42982-2004Aug28.html

Donnie McClurkin, Ready to Sing Out Against Gay 'Curse'

Gospel singer Donnie McClurkin, who has detailed his struggle with gay tendencies and vowed to battle "the curse of homosexuality," said yesterday he'll perform as scheduled at the Republican National Convention on Thursday, despite controversy over his view that sexuality can be changed by religious intervention.
"I can't let off. I didn't call myself -- God called me to do what I do," McClurkin told The Post's Hamil R. Harris. The Grammy winner declared, "If this is a war, we are willing to fight. Not a war of violence, but a war of purpose."

[monktonman]

15. Sometimes its helpful to make peace with our enemies.

How else are we gonna get to talk to them long enough
to convince them to change their minds?
Obviously these people are stupid wrong and down right fucked up in their beliefs.
We can all agree on that. But if we bust into a room, screaming at the top of our lungs how they're
wrong and we're right, they are immediately going to be turned off and run the other way.
Alot of these people who are gonna be in the audience are dumb and have been told for years that the Dems are devils and should not be trusted. Maybe when they get a chance to see Obama is not satan some of them will soften up and begin to see things our way.
If he can manage to turn only a couple of those fundies to a different way of thinking, hes doing the whole country a favor.

Now, he's gonna go in there, and he's gonna sway a little bit and hit them with the voodoo eyes and cast a spell they wont be able to resist.
The following morning, some of them are gonna wake up and say "ya'know Ma, maybe those demmy-crats arent so bad afterall. That Obama fella sure was nice."
Who knows, maybe after they poke around long enough, some of them will even vote for Hillary!
One can only hope.

[Toasterlad]

264. Can I Have a Hit of What You're Smoking? It's Got to Be MIGHTY Chronic.

[KittyWampus]

16. So Obama shouldn't speak at a gospel concert because ONE of the performers has a view

at odds with many Democrats?

BTW, a large number of blacks are pretty homophobic.

Yeah, you'd think blacks would see it as a matter of civil rights. But facts and statistics speak louder.

Obama isn't going to be giving into the anti-gay crusade any time soon.

But I have no problem with him reaching out to the gospel community.

Preach to the choir gets you nowheres except division.

[Cameron27]

29. It's not a different opinion,

it's a lie, and is no different than lies spread about any other group.

[alteredstate]

32. Obama won't be at the concerts. n/t

[Goblinmonger]

55. Speak is kinda disingenuous.

He is HOSTING the event. Some of the money goes to him. Let's call bullshit on people when it is deserved. This is one of those times.

[alteredstate]

60. Soory, but I was responding to those who are saying that Obama will "be on the stage" .

He won't.

[Toasterlad]

263. It's OBAMA'S CONCERT. He INVITED This Self-Loathing Asshole.

So because a large number of blacks are pretty homophobic, it's okay for a presidential candidate to tacitly endorses homophobia by inviting a well-known homophobic singer to perform AT HIS OWN CONCERT?

Are you kidding me with this shit? "Reaching out to gospel community"??? By picking a gospel singer who calls homosexuality a "curse"? Are you telling me that there's not ONE gospel singer in the whole of America who ISN'T a raging homophobe? Apparently not. It had to be THIS GUY.

Do you honestly believe what you wrote makes ANY SENSE AT ALL?

[papau]

18. Donnie McClurkin was raped at 8 and "confused" until 28 - he doesn't understand what happen to him,

but "anti-gay" may just be "anti-gay" for himself.

His idea that there is choice of "lifestyle" forgets that at age 8 he really did not make any such choice - it was a rape.

In any case he is known for his music - I doubt that Obama will suffer much from including him in his tour.

[terrya]

22. That's what therapy is for.

That's horrible. But you don't slander an entire community, millions of Americans, in reaction to such a terrible thing.

[Cameron27]

26. Exactly. He needs therapy,

instead he's on an ugly crusade against homosexuality.

[papau]

48. I agree - I doubt he means any slander - just how he sees his own life - but better therapy needed

[NMMNG]

110. Bull****

Millions of women are raped by men but don't go around calling heterosexuality a "curse" or try to "eradicate" it. They don't try to harm straight men just because straight men harmed them.

This man is a bigot, plain and simple. He's hiding behind a BS excuse and/or his religious beliefs to cause harm to gay people. It's wrong and he needs to be called on it, as do others like him.

[papau]

212. I agree hi's a bigot and should stop with hurtful "lifestyle choice" nonsense - but there does seem

to be a past that would suggest our reaction should be something less than the reaction we have to Silent Majority attackers that lack even the small excuse this fellow has.

I am sure Obama sees him as a popular Gospel singer - and nothing else.

But I agree, it was a mistake to include him in the Obama show.

[NMMNG]

237. Correct me if I'm mistaken,

But don't you argue that people shouldn't hate Christians/Christianity just because they may have been harmed by them in the past?

So why should this guy get even the slightest break because of his past. And anyway, being raped by an adult male has nothing to do with homosexuality, it has to do with pedophilia. So he's been barking up the wrong tree all this time.

[libnnc]

153. His childhood trauma did not make him gay

If that were the case, I'd be straight.

[papau]

213. True - and he is acting straight since reaching age 28 - but it did cause confusion that seems

to still exist based on his comments about life style choice,

[Smarmie Doofus]

278. Alas... about this part you are probably right:

>>In any case he is known for his music - I doubt that Obama will suffer much from including him in his tour.>>


Sad... *tragic* really; but probably true. Might even do him some ( political) good.

[YareweinIraq]

20. Maybe Obama feels that Mrs. Clinton...

has traction. And he feels like he has to take non-conventional methods attract voters. The tent is big. A vote is but a mark on a piece of paper (or a mark in cyber-space).

Once he has their vote in the ballot box, he doesn't have to really listen to them, does he? He could say he is listening, but in the end do nothing towards them.

[ruggerson]

38. Well hell

let's invite a singing Klu Klux Klan group then, with that rationale.

They can perform excerpts from Der Ring des Nibelungen and reach that ever important Nascar southern white male target market.

[madrchsod]

25. there`s another post about this....

donnie is a very confused person who seems he never dealt with some horrific that happened to him as a child. instead of confronting his demons he gave them to the lord and was cured. i`m a christian and know the lord certainly is`t going to cure me...that is up to me. there are undiscussed issues within the family of gospel singers-homosexuality and aids.many know what the truth is but fear the people who are just as conservative the white churches.

i`m not going to judge obama one way or another because i have no idea if he even knows that donnie thinks this way. hell i listen and follow gospel music(shout`n methodist) and i never knew he hated himself. we will see if obama makes a statement about this issue...

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/is_10_56/ai_76770627
How Donnie McClurkin Overcame Rape, Sexual Abuse And Leukemia Scare To Become A Gospel Music Star Ebony - Find Articles

[Clintonista2]

30. K&R. Sad but not surprising. nt.

[alteredstate]

35. Yeah, and Hillary will be hanging out with the Monsanto lobbyists

at the "rural" event.....

[alteredstate]

31. Obama won't be at the concerts. n/t

[Cameron27]

37. Do you have a link?

I'd like to know exactly what Obama's planning to do on this Gospel tour.

[alteredstate]

42. Here's the link

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/scembrace

[Cameron27]

45. He's hosting it.

"Senator Barack Obama is committed to brining people of all faiths together to put their faith into action to change this country for the better. With the help of many talented, spirit-filled supporters, Barack Obama's campaign is hosting Gospel concerts throughout Palmetto State on October 26, 27, and 28 to bring South Carolinians together for a few evenings of song and praise.

Tickets are just $10 and support Barack's historic, grassroots campaign for the Presidency.

To purchase a ticket, select which performance you'd like to attend below and fill out the form on the page. All tickets purchased online will be available for pick-up at the Will Call window at the concert venue."

It doesn't mention whether he'll be at any one of the concerts or not, but doesn't hosting imply approval for all the entertainers?

/spelling errors in press release, not my mistake.

[alteredstate]

57. It's a gospel concert.

I'm simply responding to the suggestions that Barack Obama will share the stage with the performers at the concert. He won't be at the concerts. Yes, the Obama campaign is hosting the concert. I'm not a religious person, and I don't know much about gospel music, but I'm working as a volunteer for one of the events. I doubt anyone involved with the campaign would have willfully hired a performer who is homophobic.

[Cameron27]

61. I hope not,

but he has the message now, so let's see how he responds.

[Bluebear]

75. Good, then you think they will be disinviting the homophobic singer?

[terrya]

124. Well, I expect Senator Obama will know soon,

So, how about disinviting the homophobe? I would hate to have to think that Obama would countenance bigotry...of any kind.

[Catherine Vincent]

34. Maybe O'Bama doesn't know this guy is homophobic.

And the other poster is correct....a lot of religious blacks are anti-gay.

[ruggerson]

39. Let's hope - and let's hope when he finds out he does the right thing

I have to believe he will

[Cameron27]

54. If he doesn't, I think this may be it for me.

After Wes Clark, he was my favorite, but I'm very wary of anyone injecting personal religious beliefs into their platform for any reason, and now hosting a concert that includes a very disturbed homophobic entertainer is over the top. It may come down to Biden or Clinton if he doesn't do the right thing on this.

[Ethelk2044]

98. You were never an Obama Supporter in the First place. Everyone can see your posts on this board

Give me a break.

[Cameron27]

131. Ethel you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

[Goblinmonger]

51. Oh, well then THAT makes it OK.

Obama is stupid and blacks hate gays. Are you SERIOUS?

[illinoisprogressive]

40. Obama is someone willing to give a person a chance before passing judgment.

[Goblinmonger]

53. Holy Christ,.

If Bush was having this asshat sing at an event Bush was sponsoring, DU would be going batshitcrazy. We need to call out our guys when they are being dumbfucks, too.

[Clintonista2]

72. No, if it was a Hillary event DU would implode

Don't you just love Illinoisprogressive's excuses? We all know what she would be saying if it were Hillary in Obama's situation right now.

[Bluebear]

76. Would that include inviting a KKK member? You know, to "give him a chance"?

What utter apologist bullshit.

[ruggerson]

122. ***crickets***

[Lucinda]

43. The website says the Obama campaign is hosting the concert series

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/scembrace

[Goblinmonger]

50. Let me just take this moment

to pat myself on the back for being against Obama's religious pandering a week ago when it "wasn't popular."

[Dawgs]

108. You're proud being against something that doesn't exist?

[Greyskye]

251. doesn't exist?

In 2006, Obama said:

"It is doubtful that children reciting the Pledge of Allegiance feel oppressed or brainwashed as a consequence of muttering the phrase `under God.'"

This was at an evangelical event that he was speaking at. This quite particularly pissed me off, as I did feel oppressed by children and teachers when I refused as an 8 year old to say "under God" during the pledge. I wrote to Obama, and never heard a word from either him or his staff.

Nope, no pandering going on here. :sarcasm:

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

64. I have no doubt Obama will disentangle himself from this

Probably just whoever organized the fund-raisers not being ideally keyed into things. I doubt Obama sought out an anti-gay crusader.

It will be resolved. It's not really an option. It would be pretty damaging for someone so dependent on internet supporters (probably a more pro-GLBT demo than average Dems, and the sort of folks who would certainly hear about it on blogs)

For the record, candidates are always politically responsible for their fund-raising efforts. Rudy probably had nothing to do with the $9.11 fund-raising drive (no money in it!) but he paid the publicity price.

[Colobo]

66. Obama's probably not aware about what this guy believes.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

67. This Is A Club Obama's Detractors Will Use To Hit Him Over The Head With

Though the pain on the part of some gay DUers is quite real...

Oh, the Zobgy poll was something to hit Clinton over the head with...

This board is so predictable...

I wish I would have went to bed a couple of hours ago...

[JerseygirlCT]

171. I hope so. A strong and completely unambiguous statement

in support of gay rights might be good right about now.

Better if that's for real, and includes support for gay marriage rights...

[shenmue]

68. McClurkin is from the "ex-gay" movement

:scared:

He's one of those people who so feared his own identity that he turned on others. Disgusting.

This is a serious flaw if Obama wants to bring everybody together. He's talked about being inclusive. It's one thing to want to bring in the crowds because these are some popular performers. It's another to not pay attention to a serious issue and throw gay people to the dogs like the right has done.

He could have picked plenty of other musicians.

[Colobo]

69. Do you really think he knows what this guy stands for?

I don't even know who the f..k he is.

[Ethelk2044]

91. Donnie was raped by a guy when he was a kid. Donnie is well known in the

African American community. It will not cost Obama votes. African Americans believe and respect Donnie. It is just the people on this board trying to smear him, when they do not know what the hell they are talking about.

[FreeState]

159. Thats a pedophile not homosexual - not the same thing N./T

[Maven]

185. If he claims to be "ex-gay," he's a delusional moron and a charlatan.

I don't care how much "respect" some people have for him.

Is that clear enough for you?

[Book Lover]

248. Clearly it *will* cost Obama votes

GLBT votes. Why aren't you counting those votes and those voters?

[sniffa]

257. because it's inconvenient

and we need to just shut the fuck up.. again.

[Sapphocrat]

189. That's another point which further erodes my confidence in Obama.

It is his business to know "what this guy stands for" -- and what every other guy stands for -- before considering any implied endorsement by, or of, anyone connected with his campaign.

The defense that Obama may just be ignorant of McClurkin's rabid, activist homophobia does nothing to seed my confidence in him as a potential president.

... Especially as this is not the first time he has aligned himself with the Radical Right -- or engaged in fundraising activities with the most questionable sort of "supporters."

[killbotfactory]

71. Never heard of the guy.

[William769]

81. Truly sad.

And whats even sadder is some people here trying to defend it.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

82. Here is a crazy idea o.O

Wait and see how he behaves at the gospel tour before throwing rocks

I know it might be a weird idea but unless i'm wrong the purpose of the tour is to bring people of all faiths into action to change this country for the better, which includes strengthening LGBT rights.

[William769]

84. I have been a Homosexual my whole life. Theres is nothing to be cured.

And until people understand that their is nothing to cure, they are just as ignorant as those thinking African Americans are 2nd class citizens. They don't even deserve to be heard.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

90. This says all i need to hear i think from your reply

"They don't even deserve to be heard."

and i agree that its not something thats need curing(even tho some believe it is)

One of the goals of the tour tho is helping strengthen LGBT rights, as such if he behaves properly, his personal view aside he will have helped do a lot of good(and thats a chance i'm willing to give him)

[DemocratSinceBirth]

93. I Don't Want To Hijack This Thread Or Join The Obama Bashathon

But I'll be more than happy to debate the proposition that homosexuality is a "curse" or that it can be cured in another thread...I'm willing to listen to somebody who has that belief and tell him why and how it is wrong...

[Bodhi BloodWave]

102. I don't believe it is a curse, nor that it needs curing

so nothing to debate really, i'm sure we will get a chance to do it tho in another thread(as i love debating), after all how likely is it we will agree on all things

[DemocratSinceBirth]

116. You're Relatively New Here...Let Me Say Hello

You will notice a dynamic here...When negative information comes out about a candidate some folks here will embrace the negative news because then they have another club to hit the candidate they don't like over the head with ...And some times it's genuine...You need to be aware of that...

In this instance I don't think the anger and disappointment of gay DUers is feigned...

[William769]

94. You can praise the hateful son of a bitch all you want. I never will

[Bodhi BloodWave]

100. where do i praise him?

I simply am of the view nobody deserves to be silenced, and i'm willing to wait until he actually does something at the event before critizizing him or Obama for such

[William769]

101. He has done plenty. For starters trying to cure Homosexuality.

Is that so hard to understand?

[Bodhi BloodWave]

107. I will take your and others word for that as i don't know him at all

But a lot are condemning him for what he might do at the event, i want to let him actually do something at said event before criticizing him for the event

I'll admit its likely i'm willing to give him an chance since i know nothing about him personally(which makes it rare for me to comment on something usually) but that has often been one of my 'flaws'that i'm to nice/trusting for my own good

but with me replying it was not so much about the person as him being teared down for something he might do but had not yet

[Ethelk2044]

117. Because the guy does not like that life does not make him a hate monger

If he chose not to be gay and live a straight life so be it. Now you are saying because he decided to go straight he is a hate monger.

[ruggerson]

123. ****ALERT ALERT EVERYBODY READ WHAT THIS WOMAN JUST WROTE****

Because the guy does not like that life does not make him a hate monger

[William769]

125. That pretty much says it all.

Hitler didn't like Jewish people either, I guess he wasn't a hate monger either.

[terrya]

126. The guy says that homosexuality is a "curse"

Jesus Christ, do some people need to have an anvil dropped on their heads? If likening being gay, being who you are, to a "curse" isn't hatemongering, I sure as hell don't know what is.

[Toasterlad]

262. I Did. I Am Gathering the Pieces of My Head (Which Exploded) as We Speak.

I haven't heard such backward ass, ignorant bullshit since my last foray into Freeperland. Might I suggest, Miss Ethel, that you'd be more comfortable over there than here at DU? You'd like it over there, Miss Ethel. The people there are all just like you! They all believe that homosexuality is a choice (an EVIL choice), and that godless homos just have to accept Jesus to fall madly in love with tits and be decent people again. They would agree with you that it's no big deal for Obama to have an ex-gay hate monger appearing with him (although, you might want to play down the fact that you're into Obama for the first month or two you're there. They're not too keen about the black folk either, ya see. But don't worry; pretty soon you'll come around to thinking just like them, and you'll fit in just fine).

[ronnykmarshall]

133. You don't "chose" not to be gay or "go straight"

What a crock of shit.

[William769]

142. Can't you just hear redd Foxx now?

[ronnykmarshall]

147. Well I can hear the homophobe protesters ...

The LA AIDS walk is going on outside our place, down Santa Monica BLVD and like clock work the cockroach "Christian" protesters are out speading their hate.

How ironic, huh?

[Sapphocrat]

191. When did you decide to choose not to be gay and live a straight life? n/t

[NMMNG]

195. The man claims that being gay is a "curse"

and that he wants to "cure" it, e.g. that he wants to eradicate homosexuality--wipe out gay people. That is hatred, and he is a hate monger.

[JackBeck]

200. Self-loathing ex-gays are the worst.

Not only do they hate themselves, they feel the need to take that hate out on an entire community.

Do you actually believe what you write?

And do you actually call yourself a progressive with such a dirty mouth?

[Name removed]

207. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Sandaasu]

261. Yes, it does.

[Name removed]

92. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[William769]

99. So then you agree that Homosexuality needs to be cured?

You opened you mouth, now put up or shut up.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

103. I Really Don't Want To Touch This Debate...

I was baptized in a Baptist church at fourteen years old... Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior...That being said, none of us are perfect... We're not perfect till we get to Heaven...If God doesn't like this or like that I will leave it up to him to determine it...

On this Earth we are all equal and entitled to respect...

[Name removed]

114. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

115. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

118. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MonkeyFunk]

136. LOL

"You shut the hell up! I am religious."


Two of the most incongruous sentences in juxtaposition I've ever seen.

[William769]

143. Just follow her posts, she'll keep you entertained!

[ileus]

83. The great anti-hillary hope is dashed....he'll be lucky to make VP now.

[Ethelk2044]

97. He will be President. She will be in the Senate

[William769]

106. Why don't you answer post #99?

[Ethelk2044]

129. Why are you supporting Clinton when she had him to sing for her?

[William769]

132. And when did this happen?

[Dawgs]

109. Wow!! I that the OP was dumb.

[sampsonblk]

112. So basically all christians are bad? Shun them all!

This is getting way out of hand. Obama is black. The black church has always been an important place for black politicians. Obama is doing the right thing.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

121. I'm Trying To Stay Out Of This Conversation

I was baptized in a Southern Baptist Church when I was fourteen...I know all the do's and don'ts by heart...I also know we're not perfect till we get to Heaven...If God doesn't like this or that I'll let him sort it out...

On this Earth we're all equal and entitled to respect...

It's kind of disturbing though that several folks have said Africian Americans are homophobic or don't like gays... The truth is a bit more complex...I suspect like any other group, education and social class has more to do with certain attitudes than color...

[sampsonblk]

138. Yep

I agree with your points. But I will do like you and not get involved in this topic. People get more emotional over this than they do over innocent kids being maimed and killed in Iraq.

[Solon]

127. We attack on bigot who uses his religion and personal experience to excuse it...

and you conflate it to include all fucking Christians? Can we say strawman? My mother, a Catholic, would take offense at that, she's at least enlightened enough to not believe the things this bigot believes.

[sampsonblk]

134. Not a strawman at all

One of them said something you don't like. But virtually all of them believe it. Church is not a place you often find pro-gay speech. Ever wonder why?

What you consider bigotry is part of the christian faith.

[Solon]

140. Who here is generalizing again?

But virtually all of them believe it.

Uhm, no they don't, for example the United Church of Christ doesn't have this as a part of their faith, many congregations of the Society of friends hold similar beliefs, and many other denominations are split or splitting over this issue, such as the Presbyterian Church(USA), United Methodist Church, and the Episcopal Church, USA. The fact is that YOU are the one who is generalizing here, not me. The fact of the matter is that being a bigot does NOT have to be a part of the Christian faith, unless you believe none of these Churches, or factions within these churches are Christian.

[sampsonblk]

144. Uhm, yes they do.

You are naming a small number of church organizations. Those are companies. Businesses.

Go to a few of your local churches and run the idea of homosexual behavior by them and see what kind of response you get. Tell them - any of them - that you'd like to come to bible study night and explain the virtues of monogamous gay relationships.

When you finally get one positive response, then you came come tell me I am making it all up.

[Solon]

146. Like it would matter to you, apparently the only "real" churches for you are homophobic ones...

I guess Churches such as the the Metropolitan Community Church of Greater St. Louis, or Pilgrim Congregational Church, UCC, both of which perform same-sex ceremonies, are just "businesses" to you. Look, if you are homophobic, and think that the only "true" Christians are those who believe just like you, then that's your belief, I can do nothing to change such a belief, however, the fact of the matter is that you don't belong here with THAT attitude.

[sampsonblk]

149. Whatever

That's a silly misrepresentation of what I said. Lose your emotion and use your brain instead. Then I may talk to you again.

Until then, I repeat my original point: One guy may have said something you didn't like. But virtually all of the people on stage with Obama will be people who believe the same stuff - whether they say it or not. So if you want to condemn, you will have to condemn the group. Its not about one evil guy.

[Solon]

150. Silly Misrepresentation my ass, you were the one who said "ALL Christians"!

and if everyone else on the stage believes as McAsshole does, they are homophobic assholes to and should be condemned as such. I do NOT tolerate evil such as this, period.

[Bill McBlueState]

161. many of the churches in my area have rainbow flags out front

I could go in and "run the idea of homosexual behavior by them," but I think I'd be wasting everyone's time by telling them about something they're already familiar with.

You may need to work on your understanding of the diversity that exists within American Christianity.

[Toasterlad]

260. Well Done. You've Set Christianity Back 200 Years.

And it was already damn far back.

You and people like you are everything that is wrong with organized religion. You sound extremely proud of the fact that Christianity is inherently homophobic - as are you, apparently.

Slavery is also endorsed by the bible. I wonder if the majority of black churches are cool with THAT concept?

[Sparkly]

135. I'd need a whole lot more information to come close to bashing Obama for this...

I think if we're going to leap to conclusions everytime somebody's in proximity to somebody "bad," I doubt any will escape that criticism.

[Cameron27]

139. That's true Sparkly,

but Obama's hosting the concert not just in proximity to the bigot. If he wasn't aware of it, he should know by now and should make a change.

[mzmolly]

162. Indeed. This place is far to reactionary at times.

We need to stop taking this kind of bait.

[surfermaw]

155. I'm for Edwards...but nothing wrong with B.O. idea

African American,are very devoted to their churches and religion, I think back when they were slaves that was about all they had to hang on to, in order to stay sain. This is a very good idea in reaching African American, and is something that has been used for a long time, or my life time and I am gettin really old.

[Cameron27]

160. You do understand

that this goes beyond churches and religion right? People are objecting to the fact that Obama's hosting a Gospel tour and an 'ex-gay' bigot was invited to perform.

[killbotfactory]

173. He was invited because he is a popular gospel singer.

not because he thinks there is a cure for "gay" and it's name is Jesus.

If there is no gay-bashing in his lyrics, I doubt anyone who put this together were aware of his views.

[Cameron27]

188. This story is being picked up in enough places

that if Obama didn't know this guy was a disturbed bigot at the time he was invited, he should be aware of it now.

Huffington:

"Obama Should Repudiate and Cancel His Gay Bash Tour, and Do It Now"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/earl-ofari-hutchinson/obama-should-repudiate-an_b_69244.html

[Ninja Jordan]

157. Smart move by Obama

[Maven]

186. ???

Why?

Do you agree with the delusional self-hating bigot he's sharing a stage with?

[NMMNG]

206. Because he's proven to be very hostile to gay people

His posts have shown it over and over again. He no doubt would love any candidate who came out against GLBT individuals.

[Ninja Jordan]

209. Example?

[Cameron27]

216. How about you

explain how this was a smart move by Obama.

[JackBeck]

228. Well, there's you insistence that the LGBT rights movement

can't compare to the Black civil rights movement, even when presented with many Black community leaders who disagree with you.

[NMMNG]

239. You know very well

Don't feign ignorance.

[sniffa]

232. yes, and that's why he's ignored

don't need to read his hatefuL tripe.

[knitter4democracy]

158. He needs to go with a different group.

DC Talk? Are they still around? Veggie Tales? One of the good groups and not the homophobes who need to get over themselves.

[ronnykmarshall]

165. Well there goes the Jasmine Guy endorsement!

[MasonJar]

166. I do NOT think that it is legitimate to state that those who believe

in the Bible do not support gays. The Episcopal Church has stood tall and strong against bigotry against gays, as exemplified by our gay bishop and our stand against those minority of Anglicans who tend to disapprove of gays. The most honorable and the most energetic members of my church here in Louisville are our very dedicated Christian gay parishoners. Our bishop of Kentucky has come out with a written committment to our gay community of faith. Please do not lump all Christians with those who use the Bible to admonish and despise any group. The one clear lesson of Jesus Christ was the lesson of tolerance. The war-mongers and the greedy are the ones who have to fear at the hands of God, along with those who defile the earth we live on.

[JerseygirlCT]

172. Yes. Thank you and well said from another

Episcopalian!

[Radical Activist]

174. Gasp! We might win a few votes away from Republicans that way! The horror!

We'll be safe from winning over any religious voters in the South with Hillary. We should just keep letting the Republicans paint us as the anti-God party, right?

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

175. Good point. When we become the bigot party we will be more competative in the south

[Radical Activist]

177. Are you saying Obama is a bigot? He hasn't changed his position for gay rights.

Becoming a bigot isn't the only way to appeal to religious voters. I'm glad Obama understands that even if you don't.

[Solon]

180. Obama may not be a bigot, but apparently most of his supporters are. n/t

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

183. No, but you are saying Obama should be a bigot.

You snarked off about how having bigoted views represented at a Dem's fundraiser is a really clever way to win southern votes.

Your post did not cite any less bigoted ways to appeal to religious voters. You merely cited one bigoted approach and applauded Obama's cleverness in adopting it.

You're on ignore.

[Radical Activist]

187. Oh no!

I'm on ignore! lol

Having a tour of gospel singers and speaking about how religious values can lead one to progressive positions on issues are good ways. Obama has done that. Those aren't bigoted approaches.

[Clintonista2]

197. Yes, I do believe he is a bigot

Keep in mind, these aren't "religious voters" these are STRAIGHT UP fundamentalists. Obama is willing to forsake and alienate the GLBT for what? A few votes?

[closeupready]

234. I agree. Even if not explicitly, then by giving tacit support to homophobes.

n/t

[Radical Activist]

241. Forsake how? By standing up for gay rights?

By suggesting there are religious values someone can base their vote on other than hate for gays?

Why communicate and try to change attitudes of Christian voters when you can hate them from a distance? I guess that works for you.

[Toasterlad]

259. Yes, Because Obama's Going to DEBATE This Guy.

Are you really so clueless as to think it's okay for Obama to have this guy appear at a fundraiser because that way he can "communicate" with him about gay issues? Obama is not there to educate this misguided, unfortunate jackass. He is there to pander to religious nutcases for votes. And the fact that he is insulting the GLBT community by bringing this man onstage with him worries him not at all. Nor you, apparently. Would you be as accepting if he were sharing the stage with Fred Phelps? How about David Duke?

Obama is NOT for gay rights, or he would be pro-gay marriage. You would not expect me to ask you to settle for second-class citizenship, so I'm not sure where you get the balls to expect ME to. Your candidate is a bigoted panderer.

[ruggerson]

184. To those of you who say there are no homophobes at DU, this thread is a must read

pretty damn astounding

[terrya]

190. Yep.

And pretty damn sad. I know that homophobia isn't limited to right wingers, but it still saddens me seeing it here.

[JerseygirlCT]

193. I'm very surprised, I have to say. Sadly so. nt

[Cameron27]

198. I've seen this sentiment expressed too many times

to be all that astounded. But it's disgusting nevertheless.

[zulchzulu]

201. Will we have a statement from the Clinton campaign about Donnie McClurkin performing for Bill?

Of course, if we want to make this an issue, then obviously there needs to be a statement of apology from Bill Clinton for having Donnie McClurkin at various events.

Where is the outrage?

http://thinkonthesethings.wordpress.com/2007/10/20/before-yall-start-blasting-obama-for-having-donnie-mcclurkin-sing/

[JackBeck]

202. You should really read an entire thread before responding.

If you did, you wouldn't look like a complete ass right now.

[Tellurian]

205. Except, McClurkin hadn't declared religion "cured" him until 2002

If your referring to the Clinton Inauguration gig...held in the 90's. He hadn't declared anything except his abusive childhood.

As some would say..."A swing and a miss!" STRIKE!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42982-2004Aug28.html

[Ethelk2044]

210. Yet,, Clinton recently attended an event where Donnie was in attendance

If Clinton Felt it was wrong he should have asked them to uninvite Donnie. He did not, There is a picture with him standing on stage with. Where was the outrage?

[Tellurian]

220. Someone's birthday party? laughable!

is this the best you can do to smear the Clintons?

[JackBeck]

204. Donnie McClurkin is an embarrassment to his community elders.

Martin Luther King, Jr. must be rolling over in his grave.

[Catherine Vincent]

208. The responses on this thread is an eye opener. n/t

[DemocratSinceBirth]

211. I'm Beginning To Get Alienated From This Place

Not because of this instance but because of the general tenor of the board...

I'm going to PM my friends here and take a long sabbatical...

[Bullet1987]

214. This won't hurt Obama AT ALL...

and here's why. Because the average American is religious/spiritual anyway. This has nothing to do with being anti-gay or right-wing. I could see if there were no Christians amoung Democrats, but there are a lot of them. This only hurts him with the anti-religion/atheist types, and thankfully...they don't have large prepresentation amoung the Dems. I like all of those singers that'll be with Barack, and he's really reaching out to the Black community by appearing with folks they love.

[Cameron27]

215. "This only hurts him with the anti-religion/atheist types,

and thankfully...they don't have large prepresentation amoung the Dems." If he doesn't respond to the opposition of this homophobe, it will hurt him among those of us who hate bigotry in any form.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

217. Are homosexuals all anti-religion/atheist types? Very nice...

This only hurts him with the __________ (insert group here), and thankfully they don't have large representation among the Dems.

Thankfully? As in "Thank goodness we don't have very many __________ in the party."

Let's see... we've got "the anti-religion/atheist types,"

And of course the gays... this does hurt him with them, right?

And then there are the people who value their gay friends and family members.

And the Democratic Christians who despise their religion being used to divide and wound people...

And the Democrats who loathe bigotry in general...



But thankfully there's no many of those types in the party.

[More Than A Feeling]

219. I'm confused...are you saying that only anti-religion/atheist types

are against religious hatred of gays? And where do you get the idea that atheists don't have a large representation among Democrats? You think most atheists are Republicans?

[Bluebear]

221. "This only hurts him with the anti-religion/atheist types" - well, smell you!

Too bad the gays are upset about it, but after all, who cares about them? You "Christian types". :eyes:

[Goblinmonger]

245. Wow

The stunning bigotry of that post and your ability to just toss "us" under the bus is amazing. So you have no problem with Barack running on this bullshit platform, because if you think that those fundies that vote for him won't want some payback in the future, I have some land to sell you.

If one of the Republican candidates did this, DU would be all over them like stink on shit. We need to do the same when one of ours makes a mistake or we are hypocrits.

[Zenlitened]

247. Thank you for summing up so concisely...

... exactly what's going to make this election season such a nauseating experience:

If one believes strongly in the importance of civil rights for GLBT Americans... and if one prefers secular, reason-based thinking over religionism... well, it's gonna be rough.

:(

[NMMNG]

271. You're so deluded you don't even know how deluded you are

It's sad, really.

[Cameron27]

218. I wish you wouldn't DSB

you've been one of the best antidotes to the lunacy that pops up here.

[ProSense]

223. Guess who is not surprised:

me!

[GOPNotForMe]

229. It's like the Twilight Zone. nt

[La Lioness Priyanka]

224. ugh! if the excuse is that he didnt know, well then i still dont want him president

if you cant do you home work you dont belong in the white house.

[Clintonista2]

265. Obama not only doesn't do home work, he doesn't show up for class either

Remember all the missed senate votes? Remember how his excuse for missing the iran vote was "I didn't know about it."

[xultar]

225. Richardson lost me with his "people choose homosexualtiy BS & now Obama..

loses me as well.

It is sad you' think Obama would know better. Instead of pandering he should have DECLINED.

SAD SAD SAD SHIT. You can't blame your campaign staff for this one.

[Skip Intro]

226. Well that did it. ABO.

anybody but Obama

[Cobalt Violet]

227. Always knew he was a panderer.

Ever since the Hatch-Obama tithing bill.

What a fucking loser!

[beaconess]

233. I LIKE the idea that Democrats aren't like Bush - who only appears with and in front of people

who agree with him 100%.

Part of being an effective candidate - and a strong leader - is reaching out to people who view things differently than they do and trying to show them that there's a better way to approach things.

It's easy, but ineffective, to only hang around people who think just like we do - but that's called preaching to the choir.

[Solon]

236. There is a difference between associating with those you just disagree with...

And associating with an outright hatemonger. This goes far beyond just disagreement, and into hate and intolerance. Some people's viewpoints are just not worth reaching out to.

[closeupready]

250. Is Obama indeed trying to change McClurkins homophobic views??

Well, is he? Because if you don't know the answer, then the presumption on my part would have to be, no, he isn't, and he won't try to. And that is NOT ACCEPTABLE.

[sakabatou]

238. Why, Obama? WHYYYY?!

[aquart]

240. Hoping to get the bigots who won't vote for Giuliani?

I would think he ought to wait for the nomination to try this stunt. Someone is giving him dreadful advice.

[Totally Committed]

244. This is just WRONG. Period.

I don't care WHY he's doing it. I think it's wrong and a HUGE mistake.

TC

[RebelSansCause]

258. this is disgusting...

as to those people who asked if we should just ignore the far right evangelical group, then the answer is undoubtedly yes, yes, yes. anyone who promotes bigotry or thinks certain groups of people are worse for things that they had no choice about, should definitely be ignored. the "tent" is already too big with the DLC, no way we let them in too. that a democratic candidate who promotes peace and love would agree to this kind of thing disgusts me, it is pure pandering. obama is making very, very uncomfortable with all of his religious rhetoric, I DONT WANT TO HEAR IT, i want a president who is solely motivated by reason. a robot even. i dont care, your faith and my country do not go together. as an ally of the GLBT community, i feel your pain, that you can be so oppressed. kind of like us atheists.

[Elidor]

275. This is simply incredible

Incredible that he would associate his campaign with this person. Incredible that he would not see how this is going to go over. Incredible that he is not already on TV saying what a mistake this was. And he will appear on TV saying it was a mistake at some point, but every hour that he delays that apology, my estimate of his political intelligence will be going down. Obama is really looking like a loser from where I sit, in several different meanings of the word.